From veensl at btinternet.com  Thu May  1 08:50:06 2008
From: veensl at btinternet.com (Lester Veenstra M0YCM)
Date: Thu May  1 08:51:29 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] Radio Shack Parts
In-Reply-To: <dcb501c8ab37$bb5c04a0$6401a8c0@PRUITT1>
References: <bd4.2dd6fe37.3547de7e@aol.com><AC3D3230-7268-454B-831E-0072077167EF@dls.net>
	<dcb501c8ab37$bb5c04a0$6401a8c0@PRUITT1>
Message-ID: <021301c8ab89$e7cd2670$0997420a@acct04.us.lmco.com>

In the beginning, Tandy Bought Radio Shack, which was a free standing
company in Boston, with a just developing series of retail consumer stores
in the North East. Allied was a competitor.

In the beginning, before Tandy, RS was a well respected industrilal, jobber,
level parts source. This is where we hams went to buy oue 2E36s ans 6146s.

Lester B Veenstra  M0YCM K1YCM
 
US Postal Address:       
PSC 45 Box 781
APO AE 09468 USA
 
UK Postal Address:       
Dawn Cottage
Norwood, Harrogate
HG3, 1SD  UK
 
Telephones:  
Office    +44-(0)1423-846-385
Home:     +44-(0)1943-880-963              
UK Cell   +44-(0)7716-298-224 
US Cell   +1-240-425-7335
Jamaica   +1-876-352-7504













-----Original Message-----
From: greenkeys-bounces@mailman.qth.net
[mailto:greenkeys-bounces@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Jim Pruitt
Sent: Thursday, May 01, 2008 4:02 AM
To: greenkeys@mailman.qth.net
Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] Radio Shack Parts

Don,

don't forget that Tandy also bought out Tech America about 8 years ago.  It
looked like Tandy bought it for its distribution chain as TechAmreica's
inventory showed up when going to Tandy online.  Now Tech America company is
gone and the inventory must be gone as well since you can go online to
Tandy's online page but can find very very few electronic parts to even
consider ordering.


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Don Robert House" <k9tty@dls.net>
To: <til128@aol.com>
Cc: <greenkeys@mailman.qth.net>
Sent: Wednesday, April 30, 2008 6:55 PM
Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] Radio Shack Parts


> Remember that Radio Shack was formerly Allied Radio.  Allied's retail
> stores and mail order division went out of business due to Japanese
> imported electronics.
> The mother company that bought the retail business and stores from
> Allied was Tandy Corporation.

_______________________________________________
GreenKeys mailing list
GreenKeys@mailman.qth.net
http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys


From gblock at sbcglobal.net  Thu May  1 13:20:41 2008
From: gblock at sbcglobal.net (Gerry Block)
Date: Thu May  1 13:23:00 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] Parts, etc.
In-Reply-To: <cf5.298a19ba.35490bfc@aol.com>
References: <cf5.298a19ba.35490bfc@aol.com>
Message-ID: <000101c8abaf$af26ef10$ce03000a@Kitchen>

Or how about "Bring back Cortlandt St."

Gerry
AD6MC

-----Original Message-----
From: greenkeys-bounces@mailman.qth.net
[mailto:greenkeys-bounces@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Til128@aol.com
Sent: Tuesday, April 29, 2008 4:41 PM
To: greenkeys@mailman.qth.net
Subject: [GreenKeys] Parts, etc.

Bring back Canal St., NYC!

73,
DE Tom  Tillson
All things electromechanical.
ITTY
HeavyMetal
LL  TTY
NNNN


Does anyone know of an old-fashioned radio store in  the
Kansas City, MO, area? I have found "Electronics Distributors"  which
has a lot of stuff (they're an industrial/commercial distributor),  but
I'm looking for the kind of place that has that unforgettable  "aroma"...

73, Jack WA2HWJ/0

NNNN  




**************Need a new ride? Check out the largest site for U.S. used car 
listings at AOL Autos.      
(http://autos.aol.com/used?NCID=aolcmp00300000002851)
_______________________________________________
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http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys

From k9tty at dls.net  Thu May  1 18:00:04 2008
From: k9tty at dls.net (Don Robert House)
Date: Thu May  1 18:01:08 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] Columbia Electronics
In-Reply-To: <PJEIJMACDLDGMJEOEFANIECFICAA.boatanchor@martasystems.com>
References: <PJEIJMACDLDGMJEOEFANIECFICAA.boatanchor@martasystems.com>
Message-ID: <9D330A92-A34D-4932-A563-A6556C4BA86C@dls.net>

I have purchased most of the components for my AN/URC-35B from Paul  
Keys, President of Columbia Electronics.
He does not have much listed on his site and has even fewer items on  
eBay.
Paul tends to be a bit expensive but the components I have received  
are in good to excellent condition.

He writes that he wants to turn over his business to his daughter.   
For my last purchase of a not complete
CU-937/UR antenna coupler was for $550.00 including shipping via  
PayPal.  The packing was excellent.

I have been able to obtain the missing parts for the coupler from a  
good friend in the east.

His initial request for payment was to send a $500. postal money order  
to his daughter.  This request bothered me.
I paid him the $50. extra for the use of PayPal which protects me as  
well as him.

While I have been pleased with the items, I still feel a bit unsure  
about Columbia Electronics.
My recommendation would be to deal with him at his location in person  
or on the phone rather than via email.

Don K9TTY


On 30 Apr 2008, at 11:21 AM, <boatanchor@martasystems.com> <boatanchor@martasystems.com 
 > wrote:

No surplus list would be complete without mentioning Columbia  
Electronics in
Somis, CA. See his website at http://www.columbiaelectronics.com -  
Paul also
maintains an Ebay store that contains a tiny sampling of his warehouse
stock.

Columbia specializes in 50's-60's-70's boatanchor mil radios, manuals  
and
accessories, mostly NOS in sealed boxes. I found connectors,  
microphones,
speakers, antennas, cables and manuals for my GRC-46 set when I  
visited last
week. I noticed a pile of USN T.U.s on a shelf.

john WB6AZP

_______________________________________________
GreenKeys mailing list
GreenKeys@mailman.qth.net
http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys

From ddillman at igc.org  Thu May  1 22:45:58 2008
From: ddillman at igc.org (Richard Dillman)
Date: Thu May  1 22:47:01 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] KSM Crypto Broadcast 3 May
Message-ID: <18747350.1209696358796.JavaMail.root@mswamui-blood.atl.sa.earthlink.net>


Sr. Transmitter Engineer Steve Hawes has recovered enough from his bout with the flu (thanks for the get well messages) to travel to the KSM transmitting station and lay his hand upon the throttles of the RTTY transmitters.  Thus we will be able to carry out the crypto broadcast as planned on Saturday, 3 May.  Here's the information:

--------

KSM will broadcast messages encrypted with the military M-209 crypto 
machine via RTTY on 3 May.

The idea for the broadcast came up in conversations between myself and Dave Ross as a way for the MRHS to support the Military Radio Collectors Group meet taking place in San Luis Obispo, CA on 2-3 May.  We thought it would be fun  to give the attendees something to copy on their vintage military RTTY gear and  then exercise their M-209 skills by decoding the message.  But we thought other listeners may enjoy trying their hand at decoding the message as well, thus this announcement (see below for information about a M-209 emulator in case you don't have access to the genuine article).

MRHS transmitter engineer Steve Hawes, who manages our RTTY broadcasts, was keen for the idea and Dave provided the text so all the pieces are in place.  Here are the details:

Date: 3 May

Times: Approximately 1200pdt and 1400pdt (gmt -7)

Modes: RTTY and FEC. Baudot transmissions are at 170cps shift, 45 baud. FEC transmissions are at 170cps shift, 100 baud

Frequencies: 8433.0kc, 12631.0kc

Text: Dave's text will start with a plaintext preamble and will include the 
settings for the M-209 as well as the key.  That will be followed by the encrypted text in five letter groups.

Additional information:

MRCG:

http://syzen.com/milradio/

M-209 emulator for those who wish to participate but don't have a M-
209:

http://users.telenet.be/d.rijmenants/en/m209sim.htm

MRHS: 

http://www.radiomarine.org

If you are not a member of the MRHS email list and would like to be, just send an email message to this address to join: 

radiomarine-subscribe@yahoogroups.com 

Reminder: K6KPH will guard our usual frequencies:

7050kc, 14050kc, 21050kc (3550kc on request)

Since these frequencies are in the scan with the ship calling frequencies the best bet is to use commercial calling procedure: repeat "K6KPH" (within the limits of FCC identification requirements of course) until the K6KPH operator responds with "DE", then send your call and traffic.

QSL information - KSM and K6KPH reception reports may be sent to the QSL Mistress at:

Denice Stoops
PO Box 381
Bolinas, California 94926
USA

VY 73,

RD 


=================================
Richard Dillman, W6AWO
Chief Operator, Coast Station KSM
Maritime Radio Historical Society
http://www.radiomarine.org
=================================
From larryradio at worldnet.att.net  Fri May  2 19:11:53 2008
From: larryradio at worldnet.att.net (Larry Tighe)
Date: Fri May  2 19:11:34 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] Model 14
Message-ID: <001e01c8aca9$eb4e3200$0200a8c0@LARRYTIGHE>

Howdy Folks,
I have the Model 14 perforator all lubed and ready to go BUT,
the label sez, 130 volts and max of 1 ampere.

This is solenoid driven.  When you press a key, a 2 coil solenoid slams a 
plunger into the pins that cut the holes in the paper tape....1936 vintage 
machine....no motor...just a solenoid.

Am I correct in assuming it is requiring 130 volts DC?  If so, where did 
they get that voltage in those days (assuming it wasn't Edison's DC in NYC) 
Was it one of the old rectifiers?  The coils measure 150 ohms across the 
power supply line.

Thanks for any input
lar

Larry
www.antiquetelephone.com 

From larryradio at worldnet.att.net  Fri May  2 20:07:45 2008
From: larryradio at worldnet.att.net (Larry Tighe)
Date: Fri May  2 20:07:24 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] Not a Model 14
References: <001e01c8aca9$eb4e3200$0200a8c0@LARRYTIGHE>
	<46C8597C-5553-48F3-A1B7-612A7EBEA2F1@dls.net>
Message-ID: <005201c8acb1$ba9d02a0$0200a8c0@LARRYTIGHE>

Hi Don,

Thanks for the offer....I do have a copy coming from Tom.

This is a "UA Model 14 Keyboard Perforator" made by Teletype 
Corp.....(1936).

When you press a key, a comb arranges for the correct pins to ram a hole 
into the paper...every key operates contacts that cause the solenoid to slam 
the appropriate pins while a key is held down.

It also has a rachet that counts the letters and turns on a lite under the 
KB ! !   I suspect that the 130 VDC might take up to a 1 ampere draw to move 
this solenoid.

Rice sez the Model 19 used a similar perforator and a large P.S. to supply 
the 130 VDC.

I'm going to build a transformer driven bridge to supply the 130 VDC.

lar
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Don Robert House" <k9tty@dls.net>
To: "Larry Tighe" <larryradio@worldnet.att.net>
Cc: "Jim Swanberg" <riceguy@peoplepc.com>; "George Hutchison" 
<w7tty@readysetsurf.com>; "Jack Hart" <wa2hwj@worldnet.att.net>; "Jim 
Haynes" <jhhaynes@earthlink.net>
Sent: Friday, May 02, 2008 19:45
Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] Not a Model 14


> Larry,
>
> It is not a Model 14.
>
> I have the manuals for it.  I will try to scan them tonight.  It has  it's 
> own Model designation in the Bell System of "Special Perforator  15M."  It 
> is also known as the "Iron Horse"
> The regular model (not for the Bell System) is just called a "Five  Unit 
> Perforator."  I also have a matching solenoid operated reader if  you want 
> it, it is yours.
> Most Teletype equipment is designed to work on -130vdc on a 62.5  milliamp 
> loop.
>
> I have an extra 130 volt WECO supply for you.  You need a 1000 Ohm 
> ceramic resistor in series with a 2500 Ohm Rheostat to adjust for the 
> 62.5 mils.
>
> I can help you with that as well.  I would need some funds for  shipping. 
> The supply is very heavy.
>
> Don
>
>
> On 2 May 2008, at 6:11 PM, Larry Tighe wrote:
>
> Howdy Folks,
> I have the Model 14 perforator all lubed and ready to go BUT,
> the label sez, 130 volts and max of 1 ampere.
>
> This is solenoid driven.  When you press a key, a 2 coil solenoid  slams a 
> plunger into the pins that cut the holes in the paper tape.... 1936 
> vintage machine....no motor...just a solenoid.
>
> Am I correct in assuming it is requiring 130 volts DC?  If so, where  did 
> they get that voltage in those days (assuming it wasn't Edison's  DC in 
> NYC) Was it one of the old rectifiers?  The coils measure 150  ohms across 
> the power supply line.
>
> Thanks for any input
> lar
>
> Larry
> www.antiquetelephone.com
> _______________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> GreenKeys@mailman.qth.net
> http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> 

From larryradio at worldnet.att.net  Fri May  2 20:12:36 2008
From: larryradio at worldnet.att.net (Larry Tighe)
Date: Fri May  2 20:12:12 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] VINTAGE TELETYPE MACHINE TYPE UA 14 KEYBOARD PERFORATOR
	- eBay (item 370044604028 end time Apr-27-08 15:20:36 PDT)
Message-ID: <005a01c8acb2$67133f90$0200a8c0@LARRYTIGHE>

This is the Model 14 Keyboard Perforator

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=370044604028&ssPageName=STRK:MEWN:IT&ih=024 

From 1gdm3 at charter.net  Fri May  2 20:25:31 2008
From: 1gdm3 at charter.net (GDM)
Date: Fri May  2 20:26:53 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] Identifying Lenkurt Equipment
Message-ID: <481BB0FB.6040803@charter.net>

Greetings: This is a tad OT, but you guys know more about telephony and 
wire communictions then I ever will, especially history.  I acquired two 
  aluminum boxes (19x7x7 inches) which caught my eye as potential 
project enclosures.  They consist of an aluminum base plate with a slip 
on cover that has rather unique latches on each end of the top.  Inside 
are a number of filters, af xformers and large mike bathtub caps.  Top 
is labeled "Lenkurt 23 #10 Terminal".  What have I got and what was it 
used for?  Any particular current use for the internal components?

73, Gary  W9OAK
            ----

From jhhaynes at earthlink.net  Fri May  2 21:18:19 2008
From: jhhaynes at earthlink.net (Jim Haynes)
Date: Fri May  2 21:19:34 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] VINTAGE TELETYPE MACHINE TYPE UA 14 KEYBOARD
	PERFORATOR - eBay (item 370044604028 end time Apr-27-08 15:20:36 PDT)
In-Reply-To: <005a01c8acb2$67133f90$0200a8c0@LARRYTIGHE>
References: <005a01c8acb2$67133f90$0200a8c0@LARRYTIGHE>
Message-ID: <alpine.LFD.1.10.0805022012590.9238@Frances>

The Teletype code for the thing is GPE, and it was in the Model 14 section
of the catalog although it has nothing in common with Model 14 - probably
dates to the Model 12.  Yep, it takes DC, probably 600 ma or more.  In
early days if they didn't have DC commercial power they used a motor-
generator set.  Later used rectifiers - the same large one used in the
Model 19.  (You could of course measure the key-down resistance and
calculate the current draw.)

The other Teletype perforator is the rarely-seen DPE, which is just a
Model 19 keyboard with the keyboard signal generator left off.  Also
magnet driven.



From k9tty at dls.net  Fri May  2 22:15:47 2008
From: k9tty at dls.net (Don Robert House)
Date: Fri May  2 22:16:56 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] VINTAGE TELETYPE MACHINE TYPE UA KEYBOARD PERFORATOR
	- eBay (item 370044604028 end time Apr-27-08 15:20:36 PDT)
In-Reply-To: <005a01c8acb2$67133f90$0200a8c0@LARRYTIGHE>
References: <005a01c8acb2$67133f90$0200a8c0@LARRYTIGHE>
Message-ID: <5E90E866-0D20-469E-B419-D2B8E88BD2EC@dls.net>

That is the Iron Horse alright.  We have two of them at the museum.   
Even more rare than the punch is the cover with copy holder.  We have  
one of those also.
However, it is not a Model 14.  I have the documentation to prove it.   
I am also told that there was a version with a few more electrical  
parts that you could plug in to 120 volts AC or DC.

Don - K9TTY



On 2 May 2008, at 7:12 PM, Larry Tighe wrote:

This is the Model 14 Keyboard Perforator

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=370044604028&ssPageName=STRK:MEWN:IT&ih=024
_______________________________________________
GreenKeys mailing list
GreenKeys@mailman.qth.net
http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys

From k9tty at dls.net  Fri May  2 22:20:39 2008
From: k9tty at dls.net (Don Robert House)
Date: Fri May  2 22:21:48 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] Identifying Lenkurt Equipment
In-Reply-To: <481BB0FB.6040803@charter.net>
References: <481BB0FB.6040803@charter.net>
Message-ID: <3A9FA2C2-7197-48C3-8D10-31EC0032EFB8@dls.net>

That is a subscriber carrier terminal used to feed a Teletype  
machine.  It works with a similar unit in the central office.  It is a  
loop carrier system.  These units were used to supply machines that  
were a long ways away from the C.O. so that the normal 130 volt loop  
could not reach the machine within the voltage and current  
limitations.  Lenkurt was typically used by independent telephone  
companies.  The Bell System used Weco 43A carrier and 130 Sub Sets for  
the same purpose.

Don K9TTY
Former Bell Teletype Installer Repairman


On 2 May 2008, at 7:25 PM, GDM wrote:

Greetings: This is a tad OT, but you guys know more about telephony  
and wire communictions then I ever will, especially history.  I  
acquired two  aluminum boxes (19x7x7 inches) which caught my eye as  
potential project enclosures.  They consist of an aluminum base plate  
with a slip on cover that has rather unique latches on each end of the  
top.  Inside are a number of filters, af xformers and large mike  
bathtub caps.  Top is labeled "Lenkurt 23 #10 Terminal".  What have I  
got and what was it used for?  Any particular current use for the  
internal components?

73, Gary  W9OAK
           ----

_______________________________________________
GreenKeys mailing list
GreenKeys@mailman.qth.net
http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys

From k9tty at dls.net  Fri May  2 22:21:32 2008
From: k9tty at dls.net (Don Robert House)
Date: Fri May  2 22:22:40 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] VINTAGE TELETYPE MACHINE TYPE UA 14 KEYBOARD
	PERFORATOR - eBay (item 370044604028 end time Apr-27-08 15:20:36 PDT)
In-Reply-To: <alpine.LFD.1.10.0805022012590.9238@Frances>
References: <005a01c8acb2$67133f90$0200a8c0@LARRYTIGHE>
	<alpine.LFD.1.10.0805022012590.9238@Frances>
Message-ID: <F6C7F50F-44A0-406B-90A0-1FA431EF514B@dls.net>

Amen.

Don - K9TTY


On 2 May 2008, at 8:18 PM, Jim Haynes wrote:

The Teletype code for the thing is GPE, and it was in the Model 14  
section
of the catalog although it has nothing in common with Model 14 -  
probably
dates to the Model 12.  Yep, it takes DC, probably 600 ma or more.  In
early days if they didn't have DC commercial power they used a motor-
generator set.  Later used rectifiers - the same large one used in the
Model 19.  (You could of course measure the key-down resistance and
calculate the current draw.)

The other Teletype perforator is the rarely-seen DPE, which is just a
Model 19 keyboard with the keyboard signal generator left off.  Also
magnet driven.



_______________________________________________
GreenKeys mailing list
GreenKeys@mailman.qth.net
http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys

From k9tty at dls.net  Fri May  2 23:56:42 2008
From: k9tty at dls.net (Don Robert House)
Date: Fri May  2 23:57:56 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] New Extra Class Study Materials are now available
Message-ID: <C91870B2-58BA-43E5-AF84-44E3C8E60542@dls.net>

Friends,

I received in the mail today the Extra Class study materials authored  
by Gordon West, WB6NOA.  This is the new set made up with the new  
question pool that will become effective on 1 July 2008.
I placed a back order about a week or two ago and was surprised to get  
it today, one day after the publishing date.

If you want to order this package which includes the text book, the  
six (6) audio CDs, and the latest copy of the FCC Rules you can call  
W5YI sales at  at (800) 669-9594. Or you can order the package on   
their website at: <http://www.w5yi.org/catalog.php?sort=4>

On this same page the Technician and General Courses are also  
available for purchase.  As you may know there is no more Morse Code  
exam for any license.  All of the courses, however, encourage the  
student to eventually learn the code.

73,
Don - K9TTY
From chrise at pobox.com  Fri May  2 15:12:12 2008
From: chrise at pobox.com (Chris Elmquist)
Date: Sat May  3 10:47:38 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] TTY paper and ribbon sources?
Message-ID: <20080502191212.GD16250@n0jcf.net>

Hey Gang,

Just obtained a M33 from an estate which I intend to use mostly
with vintage computer equipment.  I feel pretty lucky since the unit
appears to be fully functional albeit really dirty and full of cobwebs.
I'm carefully cleaning and bringing it back from the dead.

I need a source for paper and ribbons though.  Where are you guys finding
decent paper and ribbons for these units?

I've seen a few sources on eBay but the paper is often described as
"thermal" or not well described at all.  I know what thermal paper is,
because I need that for my Silent 700 collection ;-)

Any leads greatly appreciated...

73,  Chris  N0JCF

-- 
Chris Elmquist
mailto:chrise@pobox.com
From lobasa at bellsouth.net  Sat May  3 17:41:05 2008
From: lobasa at bellsouth.net (lobasa)
Date: Sat May  3 17:50:11 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] Looking for a Mite Teleprinter
Message-ID: <001b01c8ad66$642ded20$6101a8c0@JamesTanton>

Hello Everybody,
   I am still looking for a TGC-14 Mite Teleprinter.  If anyone
has one they want to unload, let me know.  The Mite was what
I used at my last duty station.  Looking for the Maintainence
Manual also.
   Any help would be appreciated.
                                    Thanks in advance,
                                     James Tanton
                                  
From chrise at pobox.com  Sun May  4 10:42:41 2008
From: chrise at pobox.com (Chris Elmquist)
Date: Sun May  4 10:51:50 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] Re: TTY paper and ribbon sources?
In-Reply-To: <20080502191212.GD16250@n0jcf.net>
References: <20080502191212.GD16250@n0jcf.net>
Message-ID: <20080504144241.GM20510@n0jcf.net>

Thank you to all who responded on this topic.  Of course I was too impatient
to wait for all the replies and went through the archives for this list
and found several hints.  In the end, I chose paper from here:

http://www.thenerds.net/ACCUFAX_PAPER_MFR.PM_Perfection_Teletype_Rolls.06210.html

and ribbons from here:

http://www.neximaging.com/product.asp?id=7388

the prices and shipping weren't bad from either outfit so I'm not out too
much if they don't work.

It appears that the ribbons do have the eyelets already installed and
earlier postings seemed to indicate that the Teletype model numbers
always listed with this brand and make of ribbon are incorrect since
they are models nobody has ever heard of :-)

73, Chris N0JCF

-- 
Chris Elmquist
mailto:chrise@pobox.com
From k9tty at dls.net  Sun May  4 13:52:50 2008
From: k9tty at dls.net (Don Robert House)
Date: Sun May  4 13:52:47 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] Model 15 RO complete.  Waiting for a new home.
Message-ID: <D36A67E8-27B1-4010-BAF4-1764058811B8@dls.net>

15ROs are somewhat scarce these days.  This one looks pretty good.

I hope one of you will give it a new home.

Don - K9TTY

<http://washingtondc.craigslist.org/nva/for/664784775.html>


From k9tty at dls.net  Sun May  4 23:17:57 2008
From: k9tty at dls.net (Don Robert House)
Date: Sun May  4 23:18:00 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] Telephone and Telegraph... Your Life's Work 1946
Message-ID: <DEFDF074-D9F9-446E-843C-04077E12737F@dls.net>

Some very interesting scenes.  Too bad stable employment is gone  
forever...

Don K9TTY

<http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rEEr8il78i0>
From larryradio at worldnet.att.net  Mon May  5 09:59:15 2008
From: larryradio at worldnet.att.net (Larry Tighe)
Date: Mon May  5 09:59:16 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] Telephone and Telegraph... Your Life's Work 1946
References: <DEFDF074-D9F9-446E-843C-04077E12737F@dls.net>
Message-ID: <075c01c8aeb8$349ab9f0$2000a8c0@ljt>

We can thank the unions for the loss of "stable employment" and the 
inventions to replace the too-expensive employee.

lar

===========================
Telephone and Telegraph... Your Life's Work 1946


"Too bad stable employment is gone forever..."

 Don K9TTY

> <http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rEEr8il78i0>

From k8ary at yahoo.com  Mon May  5 19:37:21 2008
From: k8ary at yahoo.com (Jim Plummer)
Date: Mon May  5 19:37:24 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] M28 ASR
Message-ID: <743480.28926.qm@web53709.mail.re2.yahoo.com>

I have just begun the process?of refurbishing a M28 ASR.? I think this is a Western Union?machine... it's not military.? I have not worked on one of these since January of 1969 when I was discharged from the Air Force.? I occurred to me that I may have forgotten a few things since then.?I do have the manuals and some parts.? Is there any words of wisdom from the group as I begin this project???
de Jim - K8ARY

Jim Plummer, P.E.
(Cell) 704.860.6589?(Best Way)
(Home) 704.263.5870, k8ary@yahoo.com
(Work) 704.834.2809, plummerj@gmh.org
114 Medallion Ct., Gastonia, NC 28056



      ____________________________________________________________________________________
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know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile.  Try it now.  http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ
From w5jv at hotmail.com  Tue May  6 19:43:57 2008
From: w5jv at hotmail.com (John Hensley)
Date: Tue May  6 19:44:07 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] RE: California list members
In-Reply-To: <20080430080227.3E2B6859DB9@mailman.qth.net>
References: <20080430080227.3E2B6859DB9@mailman.qth.net>
Message-ID: <BAY109-W9ED7E85C964466E77744291D60@phx.gbl>


Is anyone on the list from Los Angeles?  

If so, qsl via private email.  Tnx.

John
_________________________________________________________________
Make Windows Vista more reliable and secure with Windows Vista Service Pack 1.
http://www.windowsvista.com/SP1?WT.mc_id=hotmailvistasp1banner
From k9tty at dls.net  Tue May  6 21:12:28 2008
From: k9tty at dls.net (Don Robert House)
Date: Tue May  6 21:12:41 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] RE: California list members
In-Reply-To: <BAY109-W9ED7E85C964466E77744291D60@phx.gbl>
References: <20080430080227.3E2B6859DB9@mailman.qth.net>
	<BAY109-W9ED7E85C964466E77744291D60@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <AF4024DA-BEA0-4A41-B7FA-119860334A2D@dls.net>

City of, or County of, or close by?

VISTA is a poor operating system.


On 6 May 2008, at 6:43 PM, John Hensley wrote:

Is anyone on the list from Los Angeles?

If so, qsl via private email.  Tnx.

John
From w5jv at hotmail.com  Wed May  7 11:14:15 2008
From: w5jv at hotmail.com (John Hensley)
Date: Wed May  7 11:14:30 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] Is anyone from Los Angeles area going to Dayton ?
In-Reply-To: <20080507080200.ED763859D3D@mailman.qth.net>
References: <20080507080200.ED763859D3D@mailman.qth.net>
Message-ID: <BAY109-W1DF2EE9455A13A2FD1CF191D10@phx.gbl>


Thanks to members who have responded.  Here's the rub:

Is anyone in the Los Angeles area going to Dayton ?  I need assistance getting a rig moved from LA and would like to meet you before you get to Dayton to pick up.  

Thanks in advance for any responses,

John

_________________________________________________________________
Make Windows Vista more reliable and secure with Windows Vista Service Pack 1.
http://www.windowsvista.com/SP1?WT.mc_id=hotmailvistasp1banner
From kf6pqt at gmail.com  Wed May  7 13:37:01 2008
From: kf6pqt at gmail.com (kf6pqt)
Date: Wed May  7 13:37:17 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] RE: California list members
Message-ID: <a9c11e690805071037y227de1cfkeab3aef8ae836b85@mail.gmail.com>

Burbank!

"Los Angeles" denotes a pretty large swath of the map, whats up?

73,
Jason kf6pqt

-- 
--... ...-- -.. . -.- ..-. -.... .--. --.- -
AMI #1625 SKCC #3768
http://kf6pqt.net
From jdkopke at cablespeed.com  Thu May  8 13:25:16 2008
From: jdkopke at cablespeed.com (jdkopke@cablespeed.com)
Date: Thu May  8 17:15:44 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] Northern Radio Type 153 model 2 fsk keyer
Message-ID: <D9.25.03664.C7733284@mxo4.broadbandsupport.net>


   
 


   

   Hello  I,m  looking for the frequency determining plug -in modules for
   thi   only option T   


   


   
   
From k9tty at dls.net  Thu May  8 17:19:24 2008
From: k9tty at dls.net (Don Robert House)
Date: Thu May  8 17:28:29 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] Old stories of Teletype and Data Communications...
Message-ID: <C2270705-DE54-4515-98B3-FFBB3B0BB87D@dls.net>

Hi Wallace,

Nice story.  Thanks for sharing...

I remember the electrowriters!  I also remember the TWX at
Hallicrafters that was attached to dial tone through a steel box with
an interface to a KW-7 crypto unit.  They kept telling me that the 28
ASR would not send.  Two times I proved that the KW-7 was not giving
the tD a ground.  They still did not believe me so I had two of them
"watch carefully"  while I put a screwdriver on the battery lead and
let the shaft touch the frame...  BIG SPARK and the reader started.
One of them fell back on his buttocks.  I never had to go back there
again.  Tee hee.

Don


On 8 May 2008, at 2:51 PM, MURRAY, WALLACE W (ATTASIAIT) wrote:

Great Story Don.

Similar stories come out of the Ford Rouge plant.  In the old days,
the telephone company really did nothing inside the plant.  The
telephone company pulled up to the gate handed the electricians at
Ford's the cable and phones and Ford electricians did the rest.  Old
man Henry Ford cut a deal with the president of Michigan Bell.  This
arrangement did not change until registration and divestiture, when
the telephone company said we would meet them in the telephone room in
one building.  Very quickly, separate conduit runs and manholes were
established just for telephone cables.

Ford tended to run everything in the same conduit runs.  So you could
go into one of their manholes and find 130 KV electric power, high
pressure super heated steam, and steam rated telephone cables.  Well,
as you might expect, every now and then they had a power fault causing
the manhole to explode.  It literally destroyed everything in the
manhole and often shot the manhole frame and cover one hundred feet in
the air.

Not sure if I ever told you about the teletype machines installed at
Great Lakes steel on the hot strip mill.

Anyway, they were having an electrowriter problem which was traced to
our local building cables.  As the young grunt, who was expected to
drive the car, get coffee and then find the problem, I went along in
search of the bad cable.  Not sure if you ever were in a hot strip
rolling mill, but at the end of the line there is a large area where
they let the steel that gets out of control pile up.  This is also the
point where they needed a model 28 RO so they could identify the coil
of steel they just made.  Everything worked fine until the first time
the steel being rolled started to dance and jumped off the strip
mill.  You guessed it, it piled up right into the 28 RO going about 40
miles an hour.  The TTY wound up being about one inch thick.  After
one or two more failures, the folks at the mill put their heads
together and made this shroud out of one inch thick steel plate.
There was a hole in it just big enough so you could reach in and tear
off the copy on the TTY.

I of course was very interested in the arrangement and asked them how
they serviced the machine or even changed paper.  They pointed out the
big lifting ring on the top of the shroud and the overhead crane.
When service was needed, the crane operator lifted the shroud off,
work was performed and the shroud replaced.  More important, every one
was happy.

From: Don Robert House [mailto:k9tty@dls.net]
Sent: Wednesday, May 07, 2008 7:11 PM
To: MURRAY, WALLACE W (ATTASIAIT)
Subject: Re: India's communications

This wiring mess reminds me of the (lack of) the wiring plan at the
Motorola Tube Plant in Franklin Park, Illinois.  We could not get the
covers on the cross-connect boxes.  Motorola wanted each and every new
kind of circuit and service we could provide them from data
communications, to Teletype, to picture-phone intercom service. But
they would never let us take any service out and would never let us do
any clean up of the wiring.    Motorola's 756 PBX rivaled some
villages and towns' central offices.  They had Chief Operators for the
PBX and for the Teletype pool.  They even had an Executive Operator
and Traffic Manager.  Those were the days our foreman had to come out
and stop the fighting between the different departments for our repair
and installation priorities.  Things changed 200 % when Panasonic took
over the plant.  Almost everything was removed.

Memories,  some of the good old days were not so good.

Don

Former Teltype repairman, data communication serviceman, SSB Circuit
Designer, CPC trainer, Transmission Engineer, Regional transmission
product selection manager
Now suffering retiree and tax payer...  Where did all those benefits
go anyway?
From jones at cs.uiowa.edu  Thu May  8 10:35:40 2008
From: jones at cs.uiowa.edu (Douglas W. Jones)
Date: Thu May  8 18:09:30 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] Old vacuum tubes
Message-ID: <E41D861F-7B74-45A6-98DE-057D5DAD3528@cs.uiowa.edu>

My father -- an old ham -- has been trying to clean up his basement.
Knowing that he has many vacuum tubes, I told him that he should
inventory them.  He has done so.  If anyone's interested in an
inventory of 260 tubes, of all sorts from common to rare, he sent
me a spreadsheet.  He's trying to figure out what to do with them.

		Doug Jones
		jones@cs.uiowa.edu
From odaymg at yahoo.com  Fri May  9 14:13:58 2008
From: odaymg at yahoo.com (Michael O'Day)
Date: Fri May  9 14:23:05 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] Old stories of Teletype and Data Communications...
In-Reply-To: <C2270705-DE54-4515-98B3-FFBB3B0BB87D@dls.net>
Message-ID: <409173.37794.qm@web50004.mail.re2.yahoo.com>

Hi Don, 

Likewise, yours were great stories. I came into the
datacomm arena a little later that you (1980) with
Burroughs Corp in Chicago. I used to maintain several
sites (banks and one railroad)which were "on-line" via
dedicated sync/async phone lines and modems that ran
at 700, 1200 or 1800 baud. Our boss got a call one day
from the railroad complaining that one of his
operators was picking up the modem (about the size of
a shoebox) and was repeatedly droping in on the desk
to make it work because that was what the night
operator had told him to do. Turned out the FE on call
was familiar with the ongoing problem with one
circuit, and had asked the night op to pick up one end
of the modem about an inch and drop it to reseat the
boards inside (which worked, a common problem). So the
operator put up a note advising the day shift to "drop
the modem onto the desktop in case of problem". Since
he didn't specify a distance, the day op was bouncing
it from about 2 feet up. Needless to say, the modem in
Baltimore was replaces post haste.

Mike - N9ODM


--- Don Robert House <k9tty@dls.net> wrote:

> Hi Wallace,
> 
> Nice story.  Thanks for sharing...
> 
> I remember the electrowriters!  I also remember the
> TWX at
> Hallicrafters that was attached to dial tone through
> a steel box with
> an interface to a KW-7 crypto unit.  They kept
> telling me that the 28
> ASR would not send.  Two times I proved that the
> KW-7 was not giving
> the tD a ground.  They still did not believe me so I
> had two of them
> "watch carefully"  while I put a screwdriver on the
> battery lead and
> let the shaft touch the frame...  BIG SPARK and the
> reader started.
> One of them fell back on his buttocks.  I never had
> to go back there
> again.  Tee hee.
> 
> Don
> 
> 
> On 8 May 2008, at 2:51 PM, MURRAY, WALLACE W
> (ATTASIAIT) wrote:
> 
> Great Story Don.
> 
> Similar stories come out of the Ford Rouge plant. 
> In the old days,
> the telephone company really did nothing inside the
> plant.  The
> telephone company pulled up to the gate handed the
> electricians at
> Ford's the cable and phones and Ford electricians
> did the rest.  Old
> man Henry Ford cut a deal with the president of
> Michigan Bell.  This
> arrangement did not change until registration and
> divestiture, when
> the telephone company said we would meet them in the
> telephone room in
> one building.  Very quickly, separate conduit runs
> and manholes were
> established just for telephone cables.
> 
> Ford tended to run everything in the same conduit
> runs.  So you could
> go into one of their manholes and find 130 KV
> electric power, high
> pressure super heated steam, and steam rated
> telephone cables.  Well,
> as you might expect, every now and then they had a
> power fault causing
> the manhole to explode.  It literally destroyed
> everything in the
> manhole and often shot the manhole frame and cover
> one hundred feet in
> the air.
> 
> Not sure if I ever told you about the teletype
> machines installed at
> Great Lakes steel on the hot strip mill.
> 
> Anyway, they were having an electrowriter problem
> which was traced to
> our local building cables.  As the young grunt, who
> was expected to
> drive the car, get coffee and then find the problem,
> I went along in
> search of the bad cable.  Not sure if you ever were
> in a hot strip
> rolling mill, but at the end of the line there is a
> large area where
> they let the steel that gets out of control pile up.
>  This is also the
> point where they needed a model 28 RO so they could
> identify the coil
> of steel they just made.  Everything worked fine
> until the first time
> the steel being rolled started to dance and jumped
> off the strip
> mill.  You guessed it, it piled up right into the 28
> RO going about 40
> miles an hour.  The TTY wound up being about one
> inch thick.  After
> one or two more failures, the folks at the mill put
> their heads
> together and made this shroud out of one inch thick
> steel plate.
> There was a hole in it just big enough so you could
> reach in and tear
> off the copy on the TTY.
> 
> I of course was very interested in the arrangement
> and asked them how
> they serviced the machine or even changed paper. 
> They pointed out the
> big lifting ring on the top of the shroud and the
> overhead crane.
> When service was needed, the crane operator lifted
> the shroud off,
> work was performed and the shroud replaced.  More
> important, every one
> was happy.
> 
> From: Don Robert House [mailto:k9tty@dls.net]
> Sent: Wednesday, May 07, 2008 7:11 PM
> To: MURRAY, WALLACE W (ATTASIAIT)
> Subject: Re: India's communications
> 
> This wiring mess reminds me of the (lack of) the
> wiring plan at the
> Motorola Tube Plant in Franklin Park, Illinois.  We
> could not get the
> covers on the cross-connect boxes.  Motorola wanted
> each and every new
> kind of circuit and service we could provide them
> from data
> communications, to Teletype, to picture-phone
> intercom service. But
> they would never let us take any service out and
> would never let us do
> any clean up of the wiring.    Motorola's 756 PBX
> rivaled some
> villages and towns' central offices.  They had Chief
> Operators for the
> PBX and for the Teletype pool.  They even had an
> Executive Operator
> and Traffic Manager.  Those were the days our
> foreman had to come out
> and stop the fighting between the different
> departments for our repair
> and installation priorities.  Things changed 200 %
> when Panasonic took
> over the plant.  Almost everything was removed.
> 
> Memories,  some of the good old days were not so
> good.
> 
> Don
> 
> Former Teltype repairman, data communication
> serviceman, SSB Circuit
> Designer, CPC trainer, Transmission Engineer,
> Regional transmission
> product selection manager
> Now suffering retiree and tax payer...  Where did
> all those benefits
> go anyway?
> _______________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> GreenKeys@mailman.qth.net
> http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> 



      ____________________________________________________________________________________
Be a better friend, newshound, and 
know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile.  Try it now.  http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ
From wb0cte at netscape.net  Fri May  9 18:28:38 2008
From: wb0cte at netscape.net (wb0cte@netscape.net)
Date: Fri May  9 18:37:55 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] (no subject)
Message-ID: <8CA803B29247407-6DC-10ED@webmail-nf16.sim.aol.com>

I just sent this using the wrong email address and think it bounced, 
will try again.

Does anyone know if George is gone off someplace?

ITTY has been running the same articles since last Sunday and wont 
accept anything new.
I had emailed him a couple days ago and got no response.
Wayne  wb0cte

From larryradio at worldnet.att.net  Fri May  9 18:43:36 2008
From: larryradio at worldnet.att.net (Larry Tighe)
Date: Fri May  9 18:55:07 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] UNIVERSAL M 7000 Communications Terminal - eBay (item
	260238574466 end time May-15-08 14:29:18 PDT)
Message-ID: <000201c8b226$21426580$0200a8c0@LARRYTIGHE>

I think this is supposed to be the Cat's Meow.  Dunno but thought someone 
mite wanna know of it.

lar
http://cgi.ebay.com/UNIVERSAL-M-7000-Communications-Terminal_W0QQitemZ260238574466QQihZ016QQcategoryZ15051QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem 

From hunybuny at eskimo.com  Fri May  9 20:14:05 2008
From: hunybuny at eskimo.com (hunybuny@eskimo.com)
Date: Fri May  9 20:23:22 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] UNIVERSAL M 7000 Communications Terminal - eBay (item
	260238574466 end time May-15-08 14:29:18 PDT)
In-Reply-To: <000201c8b226$21426580$0200a8c0@LARRYTIGHE>
References: <000201c8b226$21426580$0200a8c0@LARRYTIGHE>
Message-ID: <4824E8CD.4060701@eskimo.com>

That's a pretty neat unit - but I don't think anything beats out
one of those Hoka units. The specs on those are amazing as well
is the price.  :-)

I'd still give some serious money to be able to decode that 850Hz
traffic that does weird things with the bits.

UE,
W6ESE - tony
NNNNZCZC

Larry Tighe wrote:
> I think this is supposed to be the Cat's Meow.  Dunno but thought 
> someone mite wanna know of it.
> 
> lar

-- 
Tony J. Podrasky | Never tell a young person that something cannot be done.
                  | God may have been waiting for centuries for somebody
                  | ignorant enough of the impossible to do that very thing.
                  |                                      -John Andrew Holmes
From rkolarik at neb.rr.com  Fri May  9 22:09:14 2008
From: rkolarik at neb.rr.com (Ron Kolarik)
Date: Fri May  9 22:18:41 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] UNIVERSAL M 7000 Communications Terminal
References: <000201c8b226$21426580$0200a8c0@LARRYTIGHE>
	<4824E8CD.4060701@eskimo.com>
Message-ID: <01f201c8b242$e34d9fc0$1000a8c0@inet>

Try this for a software solution:
http://multipsk.eqth.info/index.html
The interface is somewhat "busy" but it does it all and
trnasmits too.......dunno about the 850 shift wierd bit thingy.

Ron  K0IDT


----- Original Message ----- 
From: <hunybuny@eskimo.com>
Cc: <greenKeys@mailman.qth.net>
Sent: Friday, May 09, 2008 7:14 PM
Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] UNIVERSAL M 7000 Communications Terminal - eBay
(item260238574466 end time May-15-08 14:29:18 PDT)


> That's a pretty neat unit - but I don't think anything beats out
> one of those Hoka units. The specs on those are amazing as well
> is the price.  :-)
>
> I'd still give some serious money to be able to decode that 850Hz
> traffic that does weird things with the bits.
>
> UE,
> W6ESE - tony
> NNNNZCZC
>
> Larry Tighe wrote:
> > I think this is supposed to be the Cat's Meow.  Dunno but thought
> > someone mite wanna know of it.
> >
> > lar

From k9tty at dls.net  Fri May  9 22:22:33 2008
From: k9tty at dls.net (k9tty@dls.net)
Date: Fri May  9 22:31:43 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] UNIVERSAL M 7000 Communications Terminal - eBay
	(item	260238574466 end time May-15-08 14:29:18 PDT)
Message-ID: <60314.1210386153@dls.net>

I have the M-6000 which I like but not as much as my Dovetron.  $400. is a lot of money.
The problem with either of these units is that they will key a loop but they do not provide a loop.

My opinions,
Don K9TTY


On Fri  9/05/08  5:43 PM , "Larry Tighe" larryradio@worldnet.att.net sent:
> I think this is supposed to be the Cat's Meow.  Dunno but thought someone
> mite wanna know of it.
> 
> lar
> http://cgi.ebay.com/UNIVERSAL-M-7000-Communications-Terminal_W0
> QQitemZ260238574466QQihZ016QQcategoryZ15051QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZVie
> wItem 
> _______________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Gre
> enKeys@mailman.qth.nethttp://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> 
> 



From k9tty at dls.net  Fri May  9 22:58:47 2008
From: k9tty at dls.net (k9tty@dls.net)
Date: Fri May  9 23:07:58 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] Old stories of Teletype and Data Communications...
Message-ID: <60524.1210388327@dls.net>

Thanks for sharing Michael,

Those older DATA-PHONES and DATA-SETS were state of the art analog technology from approximately 1953 to 1973.

I installed two experimental dataphones.  Each was accompanied by an engineer from Bell Labs.
The first one was small and known as the X-401E.  It used a set of parallel tones to act as telemetry for a power company substation.
I kept getting called out when the telemetry failed.  I noticed that every time it rained the modem failed.  HMMMMM

So I asked the chief tester to have someone from construction to check the cable entrance for the substation.
Gophers had eaten right through the lead casing exposing the copper conductors just enough so that they shorted only when it rained.

The other experimental set was huge.  It was the X-203.  An analog modem that had a data rate switch.  Depending on the private line circuit it was 
connected to, and the like set at the other end, it would send and receive 19.2 kilobits per second in full duplex.  If too many errors occurred you 
selected 9600 baud.  In addition to the modem which was about the size of a two drawer filing cabinet, it came with a look alike module of the same 
size, which was the error control unit.  It took four of us to move the darn thing.  I installed it in Mt. Prospect, Illinois at Addressograph Multigraph Corp.  
They used it to send high resolution facsimiles of their manufacturing blue-prints.  The darn thing actually worked at 19.2 kb without a single case of 
trouble.  Mind you that this was 1970.  In 1970 2400 baud was considered fast and 4800 was very fast.

The 203A (dialup) and 203B (private line) actually made it into production at about half the size and weight, only requiring one man with a hand truck.  
But it did not last long as DataPhone Digital Service (DDS) made its entrance in 1977 making analog technology old fashioned.

I also remember the toll technician in the Libertyville, Illinois Central Office telling me that "This digital carrier (T1) is a poor substitute for analog 
frequency division multiplex systems, and it will never last!"

I should also write about my experiences with Type 4 Dataspeed with error detection and correction.  A real blaster of a reader and punch that would 
operate at 2400 baud in school and 2000 in the field.  I wish I had taken a movie of the system.  You would have a hard time running to keep up with the 
punch.  Then watch with amazement when an error was introduced.  The reader would back the tape up and so would the punch, then the punch would 
over punch all of the errored word and start the reader again to re-punch the word.  

And then there was the Dataspeed printer aka Inktronic.  It could print at 2400 baud by spraying ink through a set of gates that formed all 40 characters 
across the page at the same time.  The inkjets were so powerful you could sent the purple ink across the room.  It also had the weirdest circuit boards I 
have ever seen.  Shaped like the letter U.  

At the same time of these technical marvels we were still maintaining 600 Teletype machines, analog carrier transporting telegraph circuits (43A) and the 
test center was testing data-phones across the USA and Canada.

I guess I should write a collection of short stories some day before I go to that data test center in the sky...

Old Don
Tracer of open circuits and lost causes...
K9TTY


On Fri  9/05/08  1:13 PM , Michael O'Day odaymg@yahoo.com sent:
> Hi Don, 
> 
> Likewise, yours were great stories. I came into the
> datacomm arena a little later that you (1980) with
> Burroughs Corp in Chicago. I used to maintain several
> sites (banks and one railroad)which were "on-line" via
> dedicated sync/async phone lines and modems that ran
> at 700, 1200 or 1800 baud. Our boss got a call one day
> from the railroad complaining that one of his
> operators was picking up the modem (about the size of
> a shoebox) and was repeatedly droping in on the desk
> to make it work because that was what the night
> operator had told him to do. Turned out the FE on call
> was familiar with the ongoing problem with one
> circuit, and had asked the night op to pick up one end
> of the modem about an inch and drop it to reseat the
> boards inside (which worked, a common problem). So the
> operator put up a note advising the day shift to "drop
> the modem onto the desktop in case of problem". Since
> he didn't specify a distance, the day op was bouncing
> it from about 2 feet up. Needless to say, the modem in
> Baltimore was replaces post haste.
> 
> Mike - N9ODM
> 
> 
> --- Don Robert House k9tty@dls.net> wrote:
> > Hi Wallace,
> > 
> > Nice story.  Thanks for sharing...
> > 
> > I remember the electrowriters!  I also remember
> the> TWX at
> > Hallicrafters that was attached to dial tone
> through> a steel box with
> > an interface to a KW-7 crypto unit.  They
> kept> telling me that the 28
> > ASR would not send.  Two times I proved that
> the> KW-7 was not giving
> > the tD a ground.  They still did not believe me so
> I> had two of them
> > "watch carefully"  while I put a screwdriver on
> the> battery lead and
> > let the shaft touch the frame...  BIG SPARK and
> the> reader started.
> > One of them fell back on his buttocks.  I never
> had> to go back there
> > again.  Tee hee.
> > 
> > Don
> > 
> > 
> > On 8 May 2008, at 2:51 PM, MURRAY, WALLACE W
> > (ATTASIAIT) wrote:
> > 
> > Great Story Don.
> > 
> > Similar stories come out of the Ford Rouge plant.
> > In the old days,
> > the telephone company really did nothing inside
> the> plant.  The
> > telephone company pulled up to the gate handed
> the> electricians at
> > Ford's the cable and phones and Ford
> electricians> did the rest.  Old
> > man Henry Ford cut a deal with the president
> of> Michigan Bell.  This
> > arrangement did not change until registration
> and> divestiture, when
> > the telephone company said we would meet them in
> the> telephone room in
> > one building.  Very quickly, separate conduit
> runs> and manholes were
> > established just for telephone cables.
> > 
> > Ford tended to run everything in the same
> conduit> runs.  So you could
> > go into one of their manholes and find 130
> KV> electric power, high
> > pressure super heated steam, and steam rated
> > telephone cables.  Well,
> > as you might expect, every now and then they had
> a> power fault causing
> > the manhole to explode.  It literally
> destroyed> everything in the
> > manhole and often shot the manhole frame and
> cover> one hundred feet in
> > the air.
> > 
> > Not sure if I ever told you about the
> teletype> machines installed at
> > Great Lakes steel on the hot strip mill.
> > 
> > Anyway, they were having an electrowriter
> problem> which was traced to
> > our local building cables.  As the young grunt,
> who> was expected to
> > drive the car, get coffee and then find the
> problem,> I went along in
> > search of the bad cable.  Not sure if you ever
> were> in a hot strip
> > rolling mill, but at the end of the line there is
> a> large area where
> > they let the steel that gets out of control pile
> up.>  This is also the
> > point where they needed a model 28 RO so they
> could> identify the coil
> > of steel they just made.  Everything worked
> fine> until the first time
> > the steel being rolled started to dance and
> jumped> off the strip
> > mill.  You guessed it, it piled up right into the
> 28> RO going about 40
> > miles an hour.  The TTY wound up being about
> one> inch thick.  After
> > one or two more failures, the folks at the mill
> put> their heads
> > together and made this shroud out of one inch
> thick> steel plate.
> > There was a hole in it just big enough so you
> could> reach in and tear
> > off the copy on the TTY.
> > 
> > I of course was very interested in the
> arrangement> and asked them how
> > they serviced the machine or even changed paper.
> > They pointed out the
> > big lifting ring on the top of the shroud and
> the> overhead crane.
> > When service was needed, the crane operator
> lifted> the shroud off,
> > work was performed and the shroud replaced. 
> More> important, every one
> > was happy.
> > 
> > From: Don Robert House [k9tty@dls.net]> Sent: Wednesday, May 07, 2008 7:11 PM
> > To: MURRAY, WALLACE W (ATTASIAIT)
> > Subject: Re: India's communications
> > 
> > This wiring mess reminds me of the (lack of)
> the> wiring plan at the
> > Motorola Tube Plant in Franklin Park, Illinois. 
> We> could not get the
> > covers on the cross-connect boxes.  Motorola
> wanted> each and every new
> > kind of circuit and service we could provide
> them> from data
> > communications, to Teletype, to
> picture-phone> intercom service. But
> > they would never let us take any service out
> and> would never let us do
> > any clean up of the wiring.    Motorola's 756
> PBX> rivaled some
> > villages and towns' central offices.  They had
> Chief> Operators for the
> > PBX and for the Teletype pool.  They even had
> an> Executive Operator
> > and Traffic Manager.  Those were the days
> our> foreman had to come out
> > and stop the fighting between the different
> > departments for our repair
> > and installation priorities.  Things changed 200
> %> when Panasonic took
> > over the plant.  Almost everything was
> removed.> 
> > Memories,  some of the good old days were not
> so> good.
> > 
> > Don
> > 
> > Former Teltype repairman, data communication
> > serviceman, SSB Circuit
> > Designer, CPC trainer, Transmission
> Engineer,> Regional transmission
> > product selection manager
> > Now suffering retiree and tax payer...  Where
> did> all those benefits
> > go anyway?
> >
> _______________________________________________> GreenKeys mailing list
> > Gre
> enKeys@mailman.qth.net> http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys> 
> 
> 
> 
> ___________________________________________________________________________
> _________Be a better friend, newshound, and 
> know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile.  Try it now.  
http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ_______________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Gre
> enKeys@mailman.qth.nethttp://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> 
> 



From hunybuny at eskimo.com  Sat May 10 11:52:40 2008
From: hunybuny at eskimo.com (hunybuny@eskimo.com)
Date: Sat May 10 12:02:05 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] UNIVERSAL M 7000 Communications Terminal - eBay
	(item260238574466 end time May-15-08 14:29:18 PDT)
In-Reply-To: <001401c8b237$315af890$317ecd80@eshop1>
References: <000201c8b226$21426580$0200a8c0@LARRYTIGHE>
	<4824E8CD.4060701@eskimo.com>
	<001401c8b237$315af890$317ecd80@eshop1>
Message-ID: <4825C4C8.5020901@eskimo.com>

Hey Jim;

What is an RF-5254C?

UE,
W6ESE - tony
NNNNZCZC

James M. Walker wrote:
> You would need an RF-5254C for that!
> Jim
> WB2FCN
> 
> ----- Original Message ----- From: <hunybuny@eskimo.com>
> Cc: <greenKeys@mailman.qth.net>
> Sent: Friday, May 09, 2008 8:14 PM
> Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] UNIVERSAL M 7000 Communications Terminal - eBay 
> (item260238574466 end time May-15-08 14:29:18 PDT)
> 
> 
>> That's a pretty neat unit - but I don't think anything beats out
>> one of those Hoka units. The specs on those are amazing as well
>> is the price.  :-)
>>
>> I'd still give some serious money to be able to decode that 850Hz
>> traffic that does weird things with the bits.
>>
>> UE,
>> W6ESE - tony
>> NNNNZCZC
-- 
Tony J. Podrasky | On two occasions I have been asked [by members of
                  | Parliament!], "Pray, Mr. Babbage - if you put into the
                  | machine WRONG FIGURES, will the RIGHT ANSWERS come out?"
                  | I am not able rightly to apprehend the kind of confusion
                  | of ideas that could provoke such a question.
                  | Charles Babbage - inventor of the analog engine (1st CPU)
From ham at cq.nu  Sat May 10 12:29:19 2008
From: ham at cq.nu (Bob Camp)
Date: Sat May 10 12:38:35 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] UNIVERSAL M 7000 Communications Terminal - eBay
	(item260238574466 end time May-15-08 14:29:18 PDT)
In-Reply-To: <4825C4C8.5020901@eskimo.com>
References: <000201c8b226$21426580$0200a8c0@LARRYTIGHE>
	<4824E8CD.4060701@eskimo.com>
	<001401c8b237$315af890$317ecd80@eshop1>
	<4825C4C8.5020901@eskimo.com>
Message-ID: <321A59C7-0108-4DDE-A81F-188DB9470631@cq.nu>

Hi

The RF-5245 is an RF-550 sized box with a multi protocol FSK modem in  
it. You see them from time to time on eBay. Often they show up with  
cards missing.

Bob


On May 10, 2008, at 11:52 AM, hunybuny@eskimo.com wrote:

> Hey Jim;
>
> What is an RF-5254C?
>
> UE,
> W6ESE - tony
> NNNNZCZC
>
> James M. Walker wrote:
>> You would need an RF-5254C for that!
>> Jim
>> WB2FCN
>> ----- Original Message ----- From: <hunybuny@eskimo.com>
>> Cc: <greenKeys@mailman.qth.net>
>> Sent: Friday, May 09, 2008 8:14 PM
>> Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] UNIVERSAL M 7000 Communications Terminal -  
>> eBay (item260238574466 end time May-15-08 14:29:18 PDT)
>>> That's a pretty neat unit - but I don't think anything beats out
>>> one of those Hoka units. The specs on those are amazing as well
>>> is the price.  :-)
>>>
>>> I'd still give some serious money to be able to decode that 850Hz
>>> traffic that does weird things with the bits.
>>>
>>> UE,
>>> W6ESE - tony
>>> NNNNZCZC
> -- 
> Tony J. Podrasky | On two occasions I have been asked [by members of
>                 | Parliament!], "Pray, Mr. Babbage - if you put into  
> the
>                 | machine WRONG FIGURES, will the RIGHT ANSWERS come  
> out?"
>                 | I am not able rightly to apprehend the kind of  
> confusion
>                 | of ideas that could provoke such a question.
>                 | Charles Babbage - inventor of the analog engine  
> (1st CPU)
> _______________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> GreenKeys@mailman.qth.net
> http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
>

From f_george at sbcglobal.net  Fri May  9 07:30:53 2008
From: f_george at sbcglobal.net (f george)
Date: Sat May 10 12:58:56 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] Model 28 KSR and ASR 33
Message-ID: <004801c8b1c8$24c9f550$4001a8c0@yourg4lzvxou0c>

I have a Model 28 KSR in good condition, with manual and parts list.

It is available for a very reasonable price, pick up only.

I am about 35 miles SW of Chicago.

 

If anyone is interested please contact me via email

 

I have an ASR 33 also available.

 

F. George

 

From letourneau at wiktel.com  Fri May  9 18:15:26 2008
From: letourneau at wiktel.com (Wayne Letourneau)
Date: Sat May 10 12:58:56 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] itty
Message-ID: <4824CCFE.000003.03576@CHANDRALAND>

Does anyone know if George is gone somewhere?  ITTY has been running the
same articles since last Sunday and will not run anything new submitted to
it.
Wayne  wb0cte
From chejmw at acsu.buffalo.edu  Fri May  9 20:45:49 2008
From: chejmw at acsu.buffalo.edu (James M. Walker)
Date: Sat May 10 12:58:57 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] UNIVERSAL M 7000 Communications Terminal - eBay
	(item260238574466 end time May-15-08 14:29:18 PDT)
References: <000201c8b226$21426580$0200a8c0@LARRYTIGHE>
	<4824E8CD.4060701@eskimo.com>
Message-ID: <001401c8b237$315af890$317ecd80@eshop1>

You would need an RF-5254C for that!
Jim
WB2FCN

----- Original Message ----- 
From: <hunybuny@eskimo.com>
Cc: <greenKeys@mailman.qth.net>
Sent: Friday, May 09, 2008 8:14 PM
Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] UNIVERSAL M 7000 Communications Terminal - eBay 
(item260238574466 end time May-15-08 14:29:18 PDT)


> That's a pretty neat unit - but I don't think anything beats out
> one of those Hoka units. The specs on those are amazing as well
> is the price.  :-)
>
> I'd still give some serious money to be able to decode that 850Hz
> traffic that does weird things with the bits.
>
> UE,
> W6ESE - tony
> NNNNZCZC
>
> Larry Tighe wrote:
>> I think this is supposed to be the Cat's Meow.  Dunno but thought someone 
>> mite wanna know of it.
>>
>> lar
>
> -- 
> Tony J. Podrasky | Never tell a young person that something cannot be 
> done.
>                  | God may have been waiting for centuries for somebody
>                  | ignorant enough of the impossible to do that very 
> thing.
>                  |                                      -John Andrew 
> Holmes
> _______________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> GreenKeys@mailman.qth.net
> http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
>
>
> 


From TTILLSON at poughkee.gannett.com  Fri May  9 23:05:00 2008
From: TTILLSON at poughkee.gannett.com (Tillson, Tom)
Date: Sat May 10 12:58:57 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] (no subject)
Message-ID: <D56FEBE6782AAD47B0CD441BE6423C63A510994E41@ENT-MOCEXMB08.us.ad.gannett.com>

Wayne & all:

   I e-mailed him last week and did not get a response either.

    Sure hope all is OK.

     Thomas Tillson







I just sent this using the wrong email address and think it bounced,

will try again.



Does anyone know if George is gone off someplace?



ITTY has been running the same articles since last Sunday and wont

accept anything new.

I had emailed him a couple days ago and got no response.

Wayne  wb0cte

From w7tty at readysetsurf.com  Sat May 10 16:21:47 2008
From: w7tty at readysetsurf.com (George B. Hutchison)
Date: Sat May 10 16:31:01 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] Where I Are
Message-ID: <001101c8b2db$79399d20$0200a8c0@MAINCOMP>

GreenKeyers - - -

About a month ago I got a call from Rockwell-Collins asking whether 
or not I would be willing to come out of retirement for a time and 
work on the legacy antenna couplers, which was my job before 
retirement.

I said yes, and so now I work in Kent, Washngton and migrate home to 
Sequim on weekends.

I know that ITTY has been screwed up, and the trouble appears to be 
with the ISP's e-mail system. There is a trouble ticket in place to 
get it corrected, but as of the time of this e-mail I have heard 
nothing.

Am working on getting Remote Desktop set up and working over the 
internet. I have all three computers working over the LAN, but 
nothing yet as far as the web. I will work on that more this evening.

Happy Mother's Day to all, and more when I get the chance.

George - W7TTY


From blairgr at ctcn.net  Sat May 10 23:15:16 2008
From: blairgr at ctcn.net (Gerald)
Date: Sat May 10 23:24:27 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] ASR 33 Teletype Question
Message-ID: <002501c8b315$3c7dc660$657ba8c0@dell24>

Hi Folks
Could you take a look at the photos on my website and let me know what the 
box in the second photo down on the back of this ASR 33 is and what it is 
for? This machine was working when I got it but that was about 3 or 4 years 
ago and once again I do not remember how it was hook up. 
http://www.projectgm.com/html/asr_33.html  I might have ask this question 
before but just don't remember.
Thanks in advance.
Gerald
KD8ENK 

From richardschumann at comcast.net  Sat May 10 23:24:08 2008
From: richardschumann at comcast.net (Richard Schumann)
Date: Sat May 10 23:33:32 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] ASR 33 Teletype Question
References: <002501c8b315$3c7dc660$657ba8c0@dell24>
Message-ID: <006f01c8b316$7cde1240$6601a8c0@Brian80gig>

Hi Gerald,

Can you give us a close-up picture of the little tag on the back or tell us 
what it says?  Sure looks like some kind of power (loop?) supply.

Richard kn7sfz


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Gerald" <blairgr@ctcn.net>
To: "GreenKeys" <greenkeys@mailman.qth.net>
Sent: Saturday, May 10, 2008 8:15 PM
Subject: [GreenKeys] ASR 33 Teletype Question


> Hi Folks
> Could you take a look at the photos on my website and let me know what the 
> box in the second photo down on the back of this ASR 33 is and what it is 
> for? This machine was working when I got it but that was about 3 or 4 
> years ago and once again I do not remember how it was hook up. 
> http://www.projectgm.com/html/asr_33.html  I might have ask this question 
> before but just don't remember.
> Thanks in advance.
> Gerald
> KD8ENK
> _______________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> GreenKeys@mailman.qth.net
> http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> 

From w7tty at readysetsurf.com  Sat May 10 23:29:04 2008
From: w7tty at readysetsurf.com (George B. Hutchison)
Date: Sat May 10 23:38:21 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] ASR 33 Teletype Question
References: <002501c8b315$3c7dc660$657ba8c0@dell24>
Message-ID: <000801c8b317$2a7b6a10$0200a8c0@MAINCOMP>

Gerald - - -

The assembly in question appears to be the reader power pack.

This device supplies DC power (about 120VDC) to the tape advance 
magnet in the machine, via a large contact which is actuated by an 
insulated finger-like lever driven by the the main shaft.

A real word of caution - The Reader Power Pack is somewhat akin to an 
old-fashioned AC-DC radio, in that it directly rectifies line voltage 
without the benefit of an isolation or power transformer. Mishandled 
you can get a nasty shock.

The power pack is generally mounted on the lip of the pedestal of the 
machine by a couple of slip-type clips that hold it in place.  The 
power pack can easily be dislodged from its mount by jarring, or an 
inadvertent sweep of the hand, elbow, or just rough handling when 
moving the machine around.

Hope this helps.

Geo - W7TTY


From kf9nz at juno.com  Mon May 12 00:53:29 2008
From: kf9nz at juno.com (kf9nz@juno.com)
Date: Mon May 12 01:05:28 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] VINTAGE TELETYPE MACHINE TYPE UA KEYBOARD PERFORATOR
	- eBay (item 370044604028 end time Apr-27-08 15:20:36 PDT)
Message-ID: <20080511.235330.-118944547.0.kf9nz@juno.com>

        And if I am not mistaken, I'm the guy who donated perferator and
the cover.  Too bad I didn't hang on to the table too.   It had a chad
box, and a shelf under the top where a large rectifier lurked and
produced the 130v (+/-) DC via a large transformer and copper oxide
bridge rectifier etc.   The power cable was very short since it was made
to plug into an outlet in the top of the table.   A good Operator could
really make a pile of chads in a short time with one of these.   A
Teletype keyboard  (15 or 28) was a clumsy thing to type on, and was
limited by the speed of the machine.  The perforator keyboard was simple
and limited only by the speed of th Op's fingers. Had a lot easier touch
too.  The bad part is that there is no interlock between keys.  You can
depress several at once which results in loosing holes.   If you press
enough keys, it will punch a BLANK. (advance tape and not punch at all I
guess is a better way to put it).

        Interesting that the photos on e-bay were deleted from the page. 
Hmmm.

Frankf9nz


On Fri, 2 May 2008 21:15:47 -0500 Don Robert House <k9tty@dls.net>
writes:
> That is the Iron Horse alright.  We have two of them at the museum.   
> 
> Even more rare than the punch is the cover with copy holder.  We 
> have  
> one of those also.
> However, it is not a Model 14.  I have the documentation to prove 
> it.   
> I am also told that there was a version with a few more electrical  
> 
> parts that you could plug in to 120 volts AC or DC.
> 
> Don - K9TTY
> 
> 
> 
> On 2 May 2008, at 7:12 PM, Larry Tighe wrote:
> 
> This is the Model 14 Keyboard Perforator
> 
>
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=370044604028&ssPa
geName=STRK:MEWN:IT&ih=024
> _______________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> GreenKeys@mailman.qth.net
> http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> 
> _______________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> GreenKeys@mailman.qth.net
> http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> 
> 
From k9tty at dls.net  Mon May 12 01:15:05 2008
From: k9tty at dls.net (Don Robert House)
Date: Mon May 12 01:24:34 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] VINTAGE TELETYPE MACHINE TYPE UA KEYBOARD PERFORATOR 
In-Reply-To: <20080511.235330.-118944547.0.kf9nz@juno.com>
References: <20080511.235330.-118944547.0.kf9nz@juno.com>
Message-ID: <8E7C8B51-C025-4CEC-A841-3FF44B4356A7@dls.net>

Thanks for sharing Frank,

I do not remember who donated the iron horse with the cover.  We  
received a couple of them from a retired professor from San Diego  
State University.
Interestingly the university is now the owner of all of the  
equipment.  I have more for the collection here but I have no idea  
when they will be ready to accept it.

73,
Don
K9TTY


On 11 May 2008, at 11:53 PM, kf9nz@juno.com wrote:

        And if I am not mistaken, I'm the guy who donated perferator and
the cover.  Too bad I didn't hang on to the table too.   It had a chad
box, and a shelf under the top where a large rectifier lurked and
produced the 130v (+/-) DC via a large transformer and copper oxide
bridge rectifier etc.   The power cable was very short since it was made
to plug into an outlet in the top of the table.   A good Operator could
really make a pile of chads in a short time with one of these.   A
Teletype keyboard  (15 or 28) was a clumsy thing to type on, and was
limited by the speed of the machine.  The perforator keyboard was simple
and limited only by the speed of th Op's fingers. Had a lot easier touch
too.  The bad part is that there is no interlock between keys.  You can
depress several at once which results in loosing holes.   If you press
enough keys, it will punch a BLANK. (advance tape and not punch at all I
guess is a better way to put it).

        Interesting that the photos on e-bay were deleted from the page.
Hmmm.

Frankf9nz


On Fri, 2 May 2008 21:15:47 -0500 Don Robert House <k9tty@dls.net>
writes:
> That is the Iron Horse alright.  We have two of them at the museum.
>
> Even more rare than the punch is the cover with copy holder.  We
> have
> one of those also.
> However, it is not a Model 14.  I have the documentation to prove
> it.
> I am also told that there was a version with a few more electrical
>
> parts that you could plug in to 120 volts AC or DC.
>
> Don - K9TTY
>
>
>
> On 2 May 2008, at 7:12 PM, Larry Tighe wrote:
>
> This is the Model 14 Keyboard Perforator
>
>
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=370044604028&ssPa
geName=STRK:MEWN:IT&ih=024
> _______________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> GreenKeys@mailman.qth.net
> http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
>
> _______________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> GreenKeys@mailman.qth.net
> http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
>
>
_______________________________________________
GreenKeys mailing list
GreenKeys@mailman.qth.net
http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys

From comcents at bellsouth.net  Mon May 12 10:56:37 2008
From: comcents at bellsouth.net (Randy or Sherry Guttery)
Date: Mon May 12 11:06:09 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] Needed: TT-98B wiring diagram
Message-ID: <48285AA5.9080605@bellsouth.net>

Need at least a wiring diagram for a TT-98B - eventually it'd be nice to 
have a manual, of course. Willing to pay copy/postage costs - etc. - or 
buy outright.

Thanks!
-- 
randy guttery

A Tender Tale - a page dedicated to those Ships and Crews
so vital to the United States Silent Service:
http://tendertale.com
From comcents at bellsouth.net  Mon May 12 11:02:24 2008
From: comcents at bellsouth.net (Randy or Sherry Guttery)
Date: Mon May 12 11:11:55 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] For Sale  - Northern TU - Type 147 Model # 1
Message-ID: <48285C00.40405@bellsouth.net>

Rack mounted unit- no case. Appears complete - was replaced by the FAA 
when something stopped working (they just replaced everything from the 
receiver through the teletype) - so working condition is unknown. It's 
been in storage a long time - so needs the usual TLC to get back in 
service. Available in Meridian, MS - accepting offers. (just for the 
record - it's not mine I'm posting this for a friend).

best regards
-- 
randy guttery

A Tender Tale - a page dedicated to those Ships and Crews
so vital to the United States Silent Service:
http://tendertale.com
From comcents at bellsouth.net  Mon May 12 13:01:27 2008
From: comcents at bellsouth.net (Randy or Sherry Guttery)
Date: Mon May 12 13:10:59 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] For Sale  - Northern TU - Type 147 Model # 1
In-Reply-To: <051220081637.14558.48287245000D8DCA000038DE22243429029B0A02D29B9B0EBF069908CD0E99@att.net>
References: <051220081637.14558.48287245000D8DCA000038DE22243429029B0A02D29B9B0EBF069908CD0E99@att.net>
Message-ID: <482877E7.3020305@bellsouth.net>

Nick (and some others) have kindly pointed out my dyslexia has gotten me 
again...  The type number on that Northern TU is 174 not 147.  It is 
indeed the tube model with the scope, metering, etc. Sorry for the error...

best regards...
-- 
randy guttery

A Tender Tale - a page dedicated to those Ships and Crews
so vital to the United States Silent Service:
http://tendertale.com
From w5jv at hotmail.com  Mon May 12 13:18:40 2008
From: w5jv at hotmail.com (John Hensley)
Date: Mon May 12 13:28:07 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] DSRTTY-win query
In-Reply-To: <20080512080158.5B745859D7A@mailman.qth.net>
References: <20080512080158.5B745859D7A@mailman.qth.net>
Message-ID: <BAY109-W48ECA64AA16842188508E791CC0@phx.gbl>


Can anyone give me a run down on HAL's DSRTTY-win program?  It's been out for a long time but does anyone know if it will run fine on XP or the Virgin-Vista ??

I'm looking for a serial port RTTY program which can receive text but recognized either a routing indicator or a start/stop message indicator.  Program needs to run fully on XP but eventually be useable on Vintage-Vista.

John W5JV


_________________________________________________________________
Get Free (PRODUCT) RED?  Emoticons, Winks and Display Pics.
http://joinred.spaces.live.com?ocid=TXT_HMTG_prodredemoticons_052008
From comcents at bellsouth.net  Mon May 12 14:38:22 2008
From: comcents at bellsouth.net (Randy or Sherry Guttery)
Date: Mon May 12 14:47:54 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] For Sale  - Northern TU - Type 147 Model # 1
In-Reply-To: <482877E7.3020305@bellsouth.net>
References: <051220081637.14558.48287245000D8DCA000038DE22243429029B0A02D29B9B0EBF069908CD0E99@att.net>
	<482877E7.3020305@bellsouth.net>
Message-ID: <48288E9E.1000207@bellsouth.net>

Randy or Sherry Guttery wrote:

The guy has had this for sale for quite a while - I finally took the 
TT-98 off his hands but I don't need/want the TU.  As far as price - I 
think he was hoping to get around $50 for it - of course that's a local 
price without shipping mucking things up.  Shipping shouldn't be that 
bad - it'll probably be around 35 pound packed - from 39301. As noted - 
he's had it for sale for a while - none of the local HAMS want it - 
so... take your shot... If you want to call him an "discuss" this 
directly (and get me the $#&$*%*^ out of the middle) - private email me 
and I'll give you his cell number.

best regards...
-- 
randy guttery

A Tender Tale - a page dedicated to those Ships and Crews
so vital to the United States Silent Service:
http://tendertale.com
From k9tty at dls.net  Mon May 12 17:13:17 2008
From: k9tty at dls.net (Don Robert House)
Date: Mon May 12 17:22:49 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] VISTA
In-Reply-To: <BAY109-W48ECA64AA16842188508E791CC0@phx.gbl>
References: <20080512080158.5B745859D7A@mailman.qth.net>
	<BAY109-W48ECA64AA16842188508E791CC0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <157FF57D-9D11-4200-9EB5-769B89EB0F6E@dls.net>

VISTA is a poor operating system.  It is not used in any corporate  
environments to my knowledge.
If you can keep from using it you will have many fewer problems.

XP PRO is the best for WINDOWS

Many PC experts are recommending LINUX

Good luck to all,

Don K9TTY


From don at thedjbrothers.com  Mon May 12 17:46:56 2008
From: don at thedjbrothers.com (don@thedjbrothers.com)
Date: Mon May 12 17:56:36 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] VISTA
In-Reply-To: <157FF57D-9D11-4200-9EB5-769B89EB0F6E@dls.net>
References: <20080512080158.5B745859D7A@mailman.qth.net><BAY109-W48ECA64AA16842188508E791CC0@phx.gbl>
	<157FF57D-9D11-4200-9EB5-769B89EB0F6E@dls.net>
Message-ID: <006601c8b479$b7d65a60$6501a8c0@D32YT571>

I am no Vista fan and I don't run it for personal or business use. My stuff
is all on XP. But two of my kids run Vista and they like it. It's aimed at
the whole multi-media-blog-RSS-Animoto-gaming-etc. culture. If you want to
make MP4 videos and animations for your cell phone, then you will be happy
with Vista. If you're surfing the web, hanging out on eBay, doing the
occasional MS-Word document and using serious apps like Photoshop or
AutoCAD, then you are not a Vista candidate due to both performance and
reliability in those environments.

To me, that is where this stands. I'm just glad, knock on wood, that I don't
need to add any computers for work or play right now. Vista would certainly
be in the way for me. Add in all the "emerging" but-not-quite-there-yet
hardware technologies like core 2 quad and eSATA, etc., now is not a great
time to upgrade.

Don Merz

-----Original Message-----
From: greenkeys-bounces@mailman.qth.net
[mailto:greenkeys-bounces@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Don Robert House
Sent: Monday, May 12, 2008 5:13 PM
To: Greenkeys
Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] VISTA

VISTA is a poor operating system.  It is not used in any corporate
environments to my knowledge.
If you can keep from using it you will have many fewer problems.

XP PRO is the best for WINDOWS

Many PC experts are recommending LINUX

Good luck to all,

Don K9TTY


_______________________________________________
GreenKeys mailing list
GreenKeys@mailman.qth.net
http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys

From w3rlw at rochester.rr.com  Mon May 12 21:41:23 2008
From: w3rlw at rochester.rr.com (Roy Wildermuth)
Date: Mon May 12 21:50:58 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] VISTA
In-Reply-To: <006601c8b479$b7d65a60$6501a8c0@D32YT571>
Message-ID: <C44E6A03.1C2%w3rlw@rochester.rr.com>

I switched to MAC and I will never go back to PC.

My thoughts


On 5/12/08 5:46 PM, "don@thedjbrothers.com" <don@thedjbrothers.com> wrote:

> I am no Vista fan and I don't run it for personal or business use. My stuff
> is all on XP. But two of my kids run Vista and they like it. It's aimed at
> the whole multi-media-blog-RSS-Animoto-gaming-etc. culture. If you want to
> make MP4 videos and animations for your cell phone, then you will be happy
> with Vista. If you're surfing the web, hanging out on eBay, doing the
> occasional MS-Word document and using serious apps like Photoshop or
> AutoCAD, then you are not a Vista candidate due to both performance and
> reliability in those environments.
> 
> To me, that is where this stands. I'm just glad, knock on wood, that I don't
> need to add any computers for work or play right now. Vista would certainly
> be in the way for me. Add in all the "emerging" but-not-quite-there-yet
> hardware technologies like core 2 quad and eSATA, etc., now is not a great
> time to upgrade.
> 
> Don Merz
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: greenkeys-bounces@mailman.qth.net
> [mailto:greenkeys-bounces@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Don Robert House
> Sent: Monday, May 12, 2008 5:13 PM
> To: Greenkeys
> Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] VISTA
> 
> VISTA is a poor operating system.  It is not used in any corporate
> environments to my knowledge.
> If you can keep from using it you will have many fewer problems.
> 
> XP PRO is the best for WINDOWS
> 
> Many PC experts are recommending LINUX
> 
> Good luck to all,
> 
> Don K9TTY
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> GreenKeys@mailman.qth.net
> http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> 
> _______________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> GreenKeys@mailman.qth.net
> http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys


From k9tty at dls.net  Mon May 12 23:49:42 2008
From: k9tty at dls.net (Don Robert House)
Date: Mon May 12 23:59:14 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] Re: Macintosh Computers,perhaps a little OT
In-Reply-To: <C44E6A03.1C2%w3rlw@rochester.rr.com>
References: <C44E6A03.1C2%w3rlw@rochester.rr.com>
Message-ID: <4A4CFBBB-FF4D-4F2F-A3A1-AD3743FEC1DC@dls.net>

Good thinking Roy,

I started out in 1983 with a Commodore 128...  then an IBM PCjr I won  
in a raffle with our computer club.
In 1984 We went Mac 128 at Illinois Bell. Upgrading steadily over the  
years until 1996 when the Ameritech Corp decided to go with Gateway PCs.
The IT department went from 6 people to 20 after the changeover.  A  
huge mistake they are still paying for today.
My first Mac was purchased in 1989.  Since then I have accumulated 33  
Macintosh Computers.
Also a LISA 2, Apple II, Apple IIgs.

Most of the 33 Macs still work in OS 7.5.3 and the first three Mac  
128, 512, and 512Ke work with OS 4
My everyday Mac is a 1.6GHz G5 Tower with 4 GB of RAM running OS  
10.5.2 Leopard.
For my radio station I use a Blue & White G3 with 1GB RAM and the  
original 15 inch LCD display.
I just purchased QSO Wizard Pro for this G3 which is running 10.4.11  
Tiger.

I maintain a XP Pro network for our village.
The only PC I use is a DEC Starion 800i running Heavy Metal to feed my  
Model 20 with 6 level TTS Code.

http://www.webshots.com/user/realstuff

Don
K9TTY




On 12 May 2008, at 8:41 PM, Roy Wildermuth wrote:

I switched to MAC and I will never go back to PC.

My thoughts


>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: greenkeys-bounces@mailman.qth.net
> [mailto:greenkeys-bounces@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Don Robert  
> House
> Sent: Monday, May 12, 2008 5:13 PM
> To: Greenkeys
> Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] VISTA
>
> VISTA is a poor operating system.  It is not used in any corporate
> environments to my knowledge.
> If you can keep from using it you will have many fewer problems.
>
> XP PRO is the best for WINDOWS
>
> Many PC experts are recommending LINUX
>
> Good luck to all,
>
> Don K9TTY
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> GreenKeys@mailman.qth.net
> http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
>
> _______________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> GreenKeys@mailman.qth.net
> http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys



From tomkleinschmidt at comcast.net  Tue May 13 09:21:15 2008
From: tomkleinschmidt at comcast.net (Tom Kleinschmidt)
Date: Tue May 13 09:30:50 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] tt-98 manuals
Message-ID: <001f01c8b4fc$39ad8310$ad088930$@net>

Randy:

 

Here is the lowdown on TT-98 manuals:

 

TT-98 teleprinters are used in AN/FGC-20X and AN/UGC-1 systems

 

Maintenance Manuals:

TM11-5815-200-35 

or 

TM11-2230

 

Operators Manual:

TM11-5815-200-10

 

Parts an Tools Manual:

TM11-5815-200-35P

 

I did a quick search on Google by AN# and TM11# with some success finding
web sites that sell reprints or cds of manuals.

 

Tom

 

 

 

 

From WA5CAB at cs.com  Tue May 13 09:53:21 2008
From: WA5CAB at cs.com (WA5CAB@cs.com)
Date: Tue May 13 10:03:07 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] tt-98 manuals
Message-ID: <d4e.27e15523.355af751@cs.com>

This was superceded by TM 11-5815-200-12.

In a message dated 5/13/2008 8:21:44 AM Central Daylight Time, 
tomkleinschmidt@comcast.net writes: 
> Operators Manual:
> 
> TM11-5815-200-10

Robert Downs - Houston
<http://www.wa5cab.com> (Web Store)
MVPA 9480
<wa5cab@cs.com> (Primary email)
<wa5cab@comcast.net> (Backup email)
   
From don at thedjbrothers.com  Tue May 13 10:04:55 2008
From: don at thedjbrothers.com (don@thedjbrothers.com)
Date: Tue May 13 10:14:25 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] VISTA
In-Reply-To: <C44E6A03.1C2%w3rlw@rochester.rr.com>
References: <006601c8b479$b7d65a60$6501a8c0@D32YT571>
	<C44E6A03.1C2%w3rlw@rochester.rr.com>
Message-ID: <002d01c8b502$52e68420$6501a8c0@D32YT571>

I carefully evaluated this last year. I am a heavy Photoshop user so the Mac
would be ideal for me. I was willing to accept the $700 higher cost for an
equivalent hardware platform. But the problem was that none of my software
licenses could be transferred for Photoshop and all the proprietary plug-ins
and other tools I use. If Apple was as smart as they think they are, they
would work with the SW makers to ensure that licenses transfer at no cost.

I see that Mac usage is up to 6% of the PC market. I bet Vista is
responsible for a fair share of that growth. The April issue of Wired
Magazine had a killer article on Apple. In general for $10 a year, everyone
on Earth should read Wired. At least twice a year they produce an issue that
is pure platinum from cover to cover. April was one such issue.


Don Merz
 

-----Original Message-----
From: Roy Wildermuth [mailto:w3rlw@rochester.rr.com] 
Sent: Monday, May 12, 2008 9:41 PM
To: don@thedjbrothers.com; 'Don Robert House'; 'Greenkeys'
Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] VISTA

I switched to MAC and I will never go back to PC.

My thoughts


On 5/12/08 5:46 PM, "don@thedjbrothers.com" <don@thedjbrothers.com> wrote:

> I am no Vista fan and I don't run it for personal or business use. My 
> stuff is all on XP. But two of my kids run Vista and they like it. 
> It's aimed at the whole multi-media-blog-RSS-Animoto-gaming-etc. 
> culture. If you want to make MP4 videos and animations for your cell 
> phone, then you will be happy with Vista. If you're surfing the web, 
> hanging out on eBay, doing the occasional MS-Word document and using 
> serious apps like Photoshop or AutoCAD, then you are not a Vista 
> candidate due to both performance and reliability in those environments.
> 
> To me, that is where this stands. I'm just glad, knock on wood, that I 
> don't need to add any computers for work or play right now. Vista 
> would certainly be in the way for me. Add in all the "emerging" 
> but-not-quite-there-yet hardware technologies like core 2 quad and 
> eSATA, etc., now is not a great time to upgrade.
> 
> Don Merz
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: greenkeys-bounces@mailman.qth.net 
> [mailto:greenkeys-bounces@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Don Robert 
> House
> Sent: Monday, May 12, 2008 5:13 PM
> To: Greenkeys
> Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] VISTA
> 
> VISTA is a poor operating system.  It is not used in any corporate 
> environments to my knowledge.
> If you can keep from using it you will have many fewer problems.
> 
> XP PRO is the best for WINDOWS
> 
> Many PC experts are recommending LINUX
> 
> Good luck to all,
> 
> Don K9TTY
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> GreenKeys@mailman.qth.net
> http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> 
> _______________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> GreenKeys@mailman.qth.net
> http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys



From k9tty at dls.net  Tue May 13 22:42:35 2008
From: k9tty at dls.net (Don Robert House)
Date: Tue May 13 22:52:16 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] Model 19 needs a rectifier...
Message-ID: <399612B1-C3E2-441E-B3B8-8DB47B96AFFD@dls.net>

I have a really nice model 19 that was from the Teletype Museum.   
Everything is there except for the rectifier.
Does anyone have a spare that I might buy, borrow, steal or whatever???

Thanks,
Don
K9TTY


From greenkeys at vaporland.com  Wed May 14 13:32:56 2008
From: greenkeys at vaporland.com (Bryan Brodie)
Date: Wed May 14 13:43:17 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] VISTA (for Don Merz)
Message-ID: <c290a4d30805141032w386dae99xf9dfe36fa29fd20b@mail.gmail.com>

Don,

You could run your Windows Photoshop on any Intel Mac as long as you
have a valid Windows XP SP2 installer CD and serial number.

For only $40 extra, you can run Windows and Mac programs 'side by
side' in the Mac operating system.

While Apple does not make cheapola quality stuff, you can pick up
excellent quality refurbished equipment at Apple.com - I've bought my
last three (refurbished) Macs there. Got a $1200 laptop for $900 (for
example).

Right now, you could buy a refurbished 2.0GHz Intel Core 2 Duo with a
20-inch LCD display, 1GB RAM, 250GB SATA HD, 8x dual layer DVD burner,
bluetooth, gigabit ethernet, USB2, Firewire, 802.11n wireless and
built-in webcam for $950.

Oh, and free shipping! Now, I don't know where you're getting the same
thing for $200 ("$700 higher cost" than this) but please tell me
where, so we both can get one!

This will, by the way, run XP like a bat out of hell.  Macs have come
a long way, baby!

Bryan Brodie

> From: <don@thedjbrothers.com>
> To: "'Roy Wildermuth'" <w3rlw@rochester.rr.com>, "'Don Robert House'" <k9tty@dls.net>, "'Greenkeys'" <greenkeys@mailman.qth.net>
> Date: Tue, 13 May 2008 10:04:55 -0400
> Subject: RE: [GreenKeys] VISTA
> I carefully evaluated this last year. I am a heavy Photoshop user so the Mac
> would be ideal for me. I was willing to accept the $700 higher cost for an
> equivalent hardware platform. But the problem was that none of my software
> licenses could be transferred for Photoshop and all the proprietary plug-ins
> and other tools I use. If Apple was as smart as they think they are, they
> would work with the SW makers to ensure that licenses transfer at no cost.
>
> I see that Mac usage is up to 6% of the PC market. I bet Vista is
> responsible for a fair share of that growth. The April issue of Wired
> Magazine had a killer article on Apple. In general for $10 a year, everyone
> on Earth should read Wired. At least twice a year they produce an issue that
> is pure platinum from cover to cover. April was one such issue.
>
>
> Don Merz
From gil at vauxelectronics.com  Wed May 14 15:43:06 2008
From: gil at vauxelectronics.com (gil smith)
Date: Wed May 14 15:52:46 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] MAC stuff -- guru advice needed -- off-topic,
	but tty-related
Message-ID: <6.1.2.0.2.20080514110310.02651ec0@mail.vauxelectronics.com>

Hi folks:

First, some rambling:

Yes, I too went back to mac this year, after a fifteen year hiatus;  got a 
nice macbook pro.  I'll need to keep some XP machines for some engineering 
and accounting apps, but I hope to never see Vista.  I was a big Mac fan 
back in the early days (still have an SE). Then I started a business, and 
all of my customers were using windows.  At that time, I reluctantly moved 
platforms, since "The Customer is Always Right"  -- you've seen the signs 
in offices everywhere.  Of course we all know the sign should really read 
"The Customer is Usually an A**hole, with Unrealistic Expectations."   Post 
one of those signs, and you'll smile every day.  I still kick myself for 
ever caving in to windows, and wasting untold hundreds of hours on stupid 
problems.  But I digress.

I love the mac -- all of my photo/music/print/web/media stuff is moving 
over.  I got the full Adobe Creative Suite since I do a lot of Photoshop, 
Illustrator, and Acrobat.

Pictures:  We have several Canon cameras -- Canon's photo import utility 
for the mac is just as clumsy as the win version, but it is the only 
utility I have found that lets me prefix the filename with a date (eg: 
20080514_ttypics_0001.jpg).  I love this, since an alpha sort puts 
everything in chronological order, AND, Walgreens prints the filename on 
the back of the pic, so it is much easier when we sit down once or twice a 
year to put pics in an album.

I don't use iPhoto, since I have used Photoshop since version 1.0 on the 
Mac II (the first color Mac), circa 1990-ish.  Had been stuck at version 4 
on windows, until now.  I also don't like the idea that iPhoto combines 
everything into one big proprietary file.  I want all my photos individual, 
chronologically-named, and in jpg format.  I'll take care of copies that 
get edited.

Music:  Can't beat iTunes and iPod for music serving.  I moved 30 GB of 
MP3s over from Winblows, with minimal hassle.  I'd like to delete iTunes' 
pre-defined genres, but that's no biggie, since I just add mine.  The only 
real problem I ran into was that a lot of the MP3s had the Artist and Title 
concatenated together in the Title field.  A bit of googling led me to an 
Applescript that fixed that.  It's pretty nice to find a quick solution to 
what would have been a tedious manual fix.  I'll have to learn Applescript 
someday.

I did my first slide show on the Mac for my cub scouts, and it was a lot of 
fun.  Photoshopped 240 pics, dragged them into iDVD, strung 20-minutes 
of  tunes together in GarageBand, dropped the mix into iDVD, added the 
rotating picture thing as the DVD title menu -- it was pretty easy.  Did 
run into a couple of problems:  I had it set to end perfectly on the last 
song (set show to length of audio, and iDVD calculates the slide-change 
interval for you).  Unfortunately, I swapped out a song in the mix, and 
when I updated the audio track it was 20 secs shorter;  then, near the end 
of the slide show, it wrapped around to the first song again.   Accck.  It 
was 2 in the morning so I didn't change it, since it took about an hour to 
render the first disc (but only a few minutes for copies).  Suppose I 
needed to reselect the "set to length of audio track" option.  The slide 
show also seemed to drop audio for a second or two here and there, and the 
video flickered up and down on a scan line periodically.  Any Mac gurus out 
there who have run into this before?  Maybe I need to select a 
higher-quality render mode.  Hmm.  Still, can't complain;  it turned out 
pretty nice.  Burned a disc for everybody in the den.

After all that preamble, I come to the tty-related question which is the 
focus of this email.  I am trying to re-create Ransom Slayton's slide show 
tour of the Teletype Museum.  I have a DVD of it -- the audio is good, but 
the pictures are very dark (copied from some old video tape).  Then I got 
high-quality scans of the original slides from the IEEE History Center (yes 
Jim, I still need to get these to you;  been trying to get this show done 
to send as well).

I want to take the audio from the DVD, combine it with the good pictures, 
and make a pristine version of the slide show.  Sounds simple enough, but 
here is what I have run into:

iDVD burns DVDs, and allows you to create slide shows, but the slides must 
change at a fixed time interval -- this does not help since the Slayton 
show has variable change intervals.

iMovie says it allows variable slide change intervals, and arbitrary 
transitions (Slayton used both instant and dissolves), but iMovie only 
outputs to Quicktime video -- can you render a high-quality Quicktime mov 
and then put it on DVD somehow?  It would be kinda nice to use iMovie then, 
since a lower-quality QT version could run off of the web.

Just getting the info off of the DVD is not trivial.  Yes, you could play 
it elsewhere, run the audio into the Mac line-in, and digitize it, but I 
found a utility that extracts the audio track from a DVD, so that is not 
necessary.  But I also wanted to see the original video with the audio, so 
I could plot the slide-change times.

No mac application would acknowledge existence of the original DVD .vob 
files (frickin' lawyers).  Then I found another utility (forget the name 
right now) that converts the original DVD .vob files into .mp4 files.  I 
was able open an mp4 file in GarageBand and see the video track and preview 
along with the audio track, determine the slide-change interval with great 
precision, and even place named markers at those locations.  A couple more 
problems though:  the utility that converted the vob to mp4 left truncated 
files, and did not convert the entire vob.  Also, the Slayton DVD has three 
vob files (to convert to three mp4 files), but GarageBand only allows one 
movie track -- since it is really designed for multi-track audio, and the 
movie track is an extra feature to allow syncing your audio mix to video, I 
can't really fault GarageBand for this.  So I would need to concatenate the 
vob or mp4 files first, and also fix the truncated mp4 problem, before 
importing the video/audio into GB -- at this point I could scroll through 
the whole thing, add markers at each slide-change, name the makers 
appropriately (eg:  Wheatstone perforator), and export a quicktime mov file 
(including markers, I presume).  I thought this GB-created mov file would 
be able to be opened in iMovie, but iMovie "only opens certain mov 
files."  Crap.  This is getting much more complicated that I expected.

I was focusing on GarageBand, since it seems to be the only app that lets 
me see the video as I listen to the audio, and place named markers where I 
need the slide changes (and I can likely solve the truncated and 
concatenated vob/mp4 file problems before starting).  But this does me no 
good if I can't get it into iMovie, where I can use the named markers, 
strip off the original video, and create the slide show from the picture files.

So I am a bit stuck at the moment, and in need of some advice.  I also have 
FinalCut -- this looks to be one super-duper video editing program, but 
looks like it is pro-oriented, and is a bit intimidating.  However, I will 
learn it if it will get the job done.

Doesn't seem like this should be as complicated.

Help!

thanks,

gil






Vaux Electronics, Inc.
480-354-5556
(fax: 480-354-5558)
www.vauxelectronics.com


From k9tty at dls.net  Wed May 14 18:55:10 2008
From: k9tty at dls.net (Don Robert House)
Date: Wed May 14 19:04:53 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] MAC stuff -- guru advice needed -- off-topic,
	but tty-related
In-Reply-To: <6.1.2.0.2.20080514110310.02651ec0@mail.vauxelectronics.com>
References: <6.1.2.0.2.20080514110310.02651ec0@mail.vauxelectronics.com>
Message-ID: <295A6264-E074-412F-9A64-FFAC06A6FC62@dls.net>

Amen Gil,

My older son Rich (of Jeopardy fame) tells me that Logic Express is  
what you need to supercharge Garage Band and more.  My son William is  
a professional videographer and is very familiar with the ins and outs  
of Mac software for audio and video.  You might chat with him about  
your needs.  I will ask him to call you if you give me your phone  
number off list.  Will uses FinalCut Express rather than Pro.  Will  
also uses iDVD quite a bit.  Relating audio MP files to print on  
Teletype machines is an area that Jim "Riceguy" Swanberg has  
experience with.

I have a portable display setup here with a PowerBook B3 PISMO running  
OS 10.4.11 with iTunes.  I can connect it anywhere that has WiFi and  
select itty Teletype News from Sequim, WA USA..  then pipe the audio  
jack to the ST-5000 and run a model 28 RO.  I had hoped to put on a  
display at the McHenry County Historical Society but they were only  
interested in MORSE, at least for the time being.

I also tried the local amateur radio club, but they are not interested  
in things mechanical, only yakking over repeaters.

Don
MacUser since 1984
MacCollector since 1994


On 14 May 2008, at 2:43 PM, gil smith wrote:

Hi folks:

First, some rambling:

Yes, I too went back to mac this year, after a fifteen year hiatus;   
got a nice macbook pro.  I'll need to keep some XP machines for some  
engineering and accounting apps, but I hope to never see Vista.  I was  
a big Mac fan back in the early days (still have an SE). Then I  
started a business, and all of my customers were using windows.  At  
that time, I reluctantly moved platforms, since "The Customer is  
Always Right"  -- you've seen the signs in offices everywhere.  Of  
course we all know the sign should really read "The Customer is  
Usually an A**hole, with Unrealistic Expectations."   Post one of  
those signs, and you'll smile every day.  I still kick myself for ever  
caving in to windows, and wasting untold hundreds of hours on stupid  
problems.  But I digress.

I love the mac -- all of my photo/music/print/web/media stuff is  
moving over.  I got the full Adobe Creative Suite since I do a lot of  
Photoshop, Illustrator, and Acrobat.

Pictures:  We have several Canon cameras -- Canon's photo import  
utility for the mac is just as clumsy as the win version, but it is  
the only utility I have found that lets me prefix the filename with a  
date (eg: 20080514_ttypics_0001.jpg).  I love this, since an alpha  
sort puts everything in chronological order, AND, Walgreens prints the  
filename on the back of the pic, so it is much easier when we sit down  
once or twice a year to put pics in an album.

I don't use iPhoto, since I have used Photoshop since version 1.0 on  
the Mac II (the first color Mac), circa 1990-ish.  Had been stuck at  
version 4 on windows, until now.  I also don't like the idea that  
iPhoto combines everything into one big proprietary file.  I want all  
my photos individual, chronologically-named, and in jpg format.  I'll  
take care of copies that get edited.

Music:  Can't beat iTunes and iPod for music serving.  I moved 30 GB  
of MP3s over from Winblows, with minimal hassle.  I'd like to delete  
iTunes' pre-defined genres, but that's no biggie, since I just add  
mine.  The only real problem I ran into was that a lot of the MP3s had  
the Artist and Title concatenated together in the Title field.  A bit  
of googling led me to an Applescript that fixed that.  It's pretty  
nice to find a quick solution to what would have been a tedious manual  
fix.  I'll have to learn Applescript someday.

I did my first slide show on the Mac for my cub scouts, and it was a  
lot of fun.  Photoshopped 240 pics, dragged them into iDVD, strung 20- 
minutes of  tunes together in GarageBand, dropped the mix into iDVD,  
added the rotating picture thing as the DVD title menu -- it was  
pretty easy.  Did run into a couple of problems:  I had it set to end  
perfectly on the last song (set show to length of audio, and iDVD  
calculates the slide-change interval for you).  Unfortunately, I  
swapped out a song in the mix, and when I updated the audio track it  
was 20 secs shorter;  then, near the end of the slide show, it wrapped  
around to the first song again.   Accck.  It was 2 in the morning so I  
didn't change it, since it took about an hour to render the first disc  
(but only a few minutes for copies).  Suppose I needed to reselect the  
"set to length of audio track" option.  The slide show also seemed to  
drop audio for a second or two here and there, and the video flickered  
up and down on a scan line periodically.  Any Mac gurus out there who  
have run into this before?  Maybe I need to select a higher-quality  
render mode.  Hmm.  Still, can't complain;  it turned out pretty  
nice.  Burned a disc for everybody in the den.

After all that preamble, I come to the tty-related question which is  
the focus of this email.  I am trying to re-create Ransom Slayton's  
slide show tour of the Teletype Museum.  I have a DVD of it -- the  
audio is good, but the pictures are very dark (copied from some old  
video tape).  Then I got high-quality scans of the original slides  
from the IEEE History Center (yes Jim, I still need to get these to  
you;  been trying to get this show done to send as well).

I want to take the audio from the DVD, combine it with the good  
pictures, and make a pristine version of the slide show.  Sounds  
simple enough, but here is what I have run into:

iDVD burns DVDs, and allows you to create slide shows, but the slides  
must change at a fixed time interval -- this does not help since the  
Slayton show has variable change intervals.

iMovie says it allows variable slide change intervals, and arbitrary  
transitions (Slayton used both instant and dissolves), but iMovie only  
outputs to Quicktime video -- can you render a high-quality Quicktime  
mov and then put it on DVD somehow?  It would be kinda nice to use  
iMovie then, since a lower-quality QT version could run off of the web.

Just getting the info off of the DVD is not trivial.  Yes, you could  
play it elsewhere, run the audio into the Mac line-in, and digitize  
it, but I found a utility that extracts the audio track from a DVD, so  
that is not necessary.  But I also wanted to see the original video  
with the audio, so I could plot the slide-change times.

No mac application would acknowledge existence of the original  
DVD .vob files (frickin' lawyers).  Then I found another utility  
(forget the name right now) that converts the original DVD .vob files  
into .mp4 files.  I was able open an mp4 file in GarageBand and see  
the video track and preview along with the audio track, determine the  
slide-change interval with great precision, and even place named  
markers at those locations.  A couple more problems though:  the  
utility that converted the vob to mp4 left truncated files, and did  
not convert the entire vob.  Also, the Slayton DVD has three vob files  
(to convert to three mp4 files), but GarageBand only allows one movie  
track -- since it is really designed for multi-track audio, and the  
movie track is an extra feature to allow syncing your audio mix to  
video, I can't really fault GarageBand for this.  So I would need to  
concatenate the vob or mp4 files first, and also fix the truncated mp4  
problem, before importing the video/audio into GB -- at this point I  
could scroll through the whole thing, add markers at each slide- 
change, name the makers appropriately (eg:  Wheatstone perforator),  
and export a quicktime mov file (including markers, I presume).  I  
thought this GB-created mov file would be able to be opened in iMovie,  
but iMovie "only opens certain mov files."  Crap.  This is getting  
much more complicated that I expected.

I was focusing on GarageBand, since it seems to be the only app that  
lets me see the video as I listen to the audio, and place named  
markers where I need the slide changes (and I can likely solve the  
truncated and concatenated vob/mp4 file problems before starting).   
But this does me no good if I can't get it into iMovie, where I can  
use the named markers, strip off the original video, and create the  
slide show from the picture files.

So I am a bit stuck at the moment, and in need of some advice.  I also  
have FinalCut -- this looks to be one super-duper video editing  
program, but looks like it is pro-oriented, and is a bit  
intimidating.  However, I will learn it if it will get the job done.

Doesn't seem like this should be as complicated.

Help!

thanks,

gil






Vaux Electronics, Inc.
480-354-5556
(fax: 480-354-5558)
www.vauxelectronics.com


_______________________________________________
GreenKeys mailing list
GreenKeys@mailman.qth.net
http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys

From don at thedjbrothers.com  Wed May 14 21:42:58 2008
From: don at thedjbrothers.com (don@thedjbrothers.com)
Date: Wed May 14 21:52:39 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] VISTA (for Don Merz)
In-Reply-To: <c290a4d30805141032w386dae99xf9dfe36fa29fd20b@mail.gmail.com>
References: <c290a4d30805141032w386dae99xf9dfe36fa29fd20b@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <004c01c8b62d$012f9be0$6501a8c0@D32YT571>

At the time I looked (2 years ago), the SW licenses could not be moved. A
number of the plug-ins and tools I use did not have Mac versions either. But
that's all water long over the dam. I made my decision and I have no plans
to make a switch.

The answer to your question is: Tigerdirect.com. You have to have good
judgment because they also sell junk. And most of the time, their prices are
no better than ordinary. But if you get on their mailing list, they will
tempt you to spend some money with good deals 2 or 3 times a year.

Don Merz
 

-----Original Message-----
From: greenkeys-bounces@mailman.qth.net
[mailto:greenkeys-bounces@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Bryan Brodie
Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2008 1:33 PM
To: greenkeys@mailman.qth.net
Subject: [GreenKeys] VISTA (for Don Merz)

Don,

You could run your Windows Photoshop on any Intel Mac as long as you have a
valid Windows XP SP2 installer CD and serial number.

For only $40 extra, you can run Windows and Mac programs 'side by side' in
the Mac operating system.

While Apple does not make cheapola quality stuff, you can pick up excellent
quality refurbished equipment at Apple.com - I've bought my last three
(refurbished) Macs there. Got a $1200 laptop for $900 (for example).

Right now, you could buy a refurbished 2.0GHz Intel Core 2 Duo with a
20-inch LCD display, 1GB RAM, 250GB SATA HD, 8x dual layer DVD burner,
bluetooth, gigabit ethernet, USB2, Firewire, 802.11n wireless and built-in
webcam for $950.

Oh, and free shipping! Now, I don't know where you're getting the same thing
for $200 ("$700 higher cost" than this) but please tell me where, so we both
can get one!

This will, by the way, run XP like a bat out of hell.  Macs have come a long
way, baby!

Bryan Brodie

> From: <don@thedjbrothers.com>
> To: "'Roy Wildermuth'" <w3rlw@rochester.rr.com>, "'Don Robert House'" 
> <k9tty@dls.net>, "'Greenkeys'" <greenkeys@mailman.qth.net>
> Date: Tue, 13 May 2008 10:04:55 -0400
> Subject: RE: [GreenKeys] VISTA
> I carefully evaluated this last year. I am a heavy Photoshop user so 
> the Mac would be ideal for me. I was willing to accept the $700 higher 
> cost for an equivalent hardware platform. But the problem was that 
> none of my software licenses could be transferred for Photoshop and 
> all the proprietary plug-ins and other tools I use. If Apple was as 
> smart as they think they are, they would work with the SW makers to ensure
that licenses transfer at no cost.
>
> I see that Mac usage is up to 6% of the PC market. I bet Vista is 
> responsible for a fair share of that growth. The April issue of Wired 
> Magazine had a killer article on Apple. In general for $10 a year, 
> everyone on Earth should read Wired. At least twice a year they 
> produce an issue that is pure platinum from cover to cover. April was one
such issue.
>
>
> Don Merz
_______________________________________________
GreenKeys mailing list
GreenKeys@mailman.qth.net
http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys

From Teletypeparts at aol.com  Thu May 15 12:40:13 2008
From: Teletypeparts at aol.com (Teletypeparts@aol.com)
Date: Thu May 15 12:50:06 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] RTTY Interface
Message-ID: <bf7.342f7c3a.355dc16d@aol.com>

Greetings to all,
 
I have a Hal Computer RTTY Interface, model CRI-200.  
 
I am looking for the manual for this unit.  Plans are to loop the audio thru 
it to my Hal ST-5000 and use the CRI-200 LED display to help tune the RTTY 
signal.  
 
Can I get some advice on the feasibility of this and does anyone have a 
manual or know where to get a copy of one?  I have no power supply for it, but hope 
the manual will help to identify what I need.  
 
If my plan is worthless, then I will give the interface away for shipping 
costs.  
 
Thanks,
 
Wayne 
KB1FDW



**************Wondering what's for Dinner Tonight? Get new twists on family 
favorites at AOL Food.      
(http://food.aol.com/dinner-tonight?NCID=aolfod00030000000001)
From WB6BLV at inreach.com  Thu May 15 13:03:43 2008
From: WB6BLV at inreach.com (WB6BLV  Central California)
Date: Thu May 15 13:16:04 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] RTTY Interface
Message-ID: <011801c8b6ad$f663eb40$5888fea9@dwilegal>

Wayne,

Some years back Ham Radio Mag or 73 Mag (forgot which) ran plans for
building JUST the LED tuning unit for use with other TUs... I constructed
several though I do prefer the CRT + display...   this weekend I will dig
out the mag and scan it for you if you like...

73

John
WB6BLV@inreach.com

From ghenry at halcomm.com  Thu May 15 13:15:12 2008
From: ghenry at halcomm.com (Bill Henry)
Date: Thu May 15 13:24:59 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] RTTY Interface
In-Reply-To: <bf7.342f7c3a.355dc16d@aol.com>
References: <bf7.342f7c3a.355dc16d@aol.com>
Message-ID: <6.1.0.6.2.20080515120911.025fdcf0@mail.halcomm.com>

Hello Wayne,

Photocopies of all manuals for all HAL are available.  The CRI-100/200 
manual is $20.00, post-paid within the U.S.  Call Colleen at 217-367-7373 
to order the manual.  We accept VISA, MasterCard, and American Express.

There is a simpler way to use the CRI as a tuning indicator:  Hook 12 VDC 
to it and wye-connect the RX audio to both the CRI and ST-5000.  The CRI 
will display and the ST-5000 will demodulate - IF - both use the same tone 
set (high-tones were standard for both models in the US but we made 
low-tone ST-5000's for export customers).

Bill Henry, K9GWT
President

At 12:40 PM 5/15/2008 -0400, Teletypeparts@aol.com wrote:
>Greetings to all,
>
>I have a Hal Computer RTTY Interface, model CRI-200.
>
>I am looking for the manual for this unit.  Plans are to loop the audio thru
>it to my Hal ST-5000 and use the CRI-200 LED display to help tune the RTTY
>signal.
>
>Can I get some advice on the feasibility of this and does anyone have a
>manual or know where to get a copy of one?  I have no power supply for it, 
>but hope
>the manual will help to identify what I need.
>
>If my plan is worthless, then I will give the interface away for shipping
>costs.
>
>Thanks,
>
>Wayne
>KB1FDW
>
>
>
>**************Wondering what's for Dinner Tonight? Get new twists on family
>favorites at AOL Food.
>(http://food.aol.com/dinner-tonight?NCID=aolfod00030000000001)
>_______________________________________________
>GreenKeys mailing list
>GreenKeys@mailman.qth.net
>http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys

From k9tty at dls.net  Thu May 15 22:38:52 2008
From: k9tty at dls.net (Don Robert House)
Date: Thu May 15 22:48:41 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] RTTY Interface
In-Reply-To: <bf7.342f7c3a.355dc16d@aol.com>
References: <bf7.342f7c3a.355dc16d@aol.com>
Message-ID: <10A67A31-C636-454E-BB66-F414D5180A5D@dls.net>

Contact Bill Henry at HAL Communications.  He can help you.
<ghenry@halcomm.com>

Don
K9TTY


On 15 May 2008, at 11:40 AM, Teletypeparts@aol.com wrote:

Greetings to all,

I have a Hal Computer RTTY Interface, model CRI-200.

I am looking for the manual for this unit.  Plans are to loop the  
audio thru
it to my Hal ST-5000 and use the CRI-200 LED display to help tune the  
RTTY
signal.

Can I get some advice on the feasibility of this and does anyone have a
manual or know where to get a copy of one?  I have no power supply for  
it, but hope
the manual will help to identify what I need.

If my plan is worthless, then I will give the interface away for  
shipping
costs.

Thanks,

Wayne
KB1FDW



**************Wondering what's for Dinner Tonight? Get new twists on  
family
favorites at AOL Food.
(http://food.aol.com/dinner-tonight?NCID=aolfod00030000000001)
_______________________________________________
GreenKeys mailing list
GreenKeys@mailman.qth.net
http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys

From w3rlw at rochester.rr.com  Fri May 16 00:37:50 2008
From: w3rlw at rochester.rr.com (Roy Wildermuth)
Date: Fri May 16 00:47:41 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] Permitted Posting.
Message-ID: <C45287DE.257%w3rlw@rochester.rr.com>



Before I break any rules I want to ask. Am I permitted to promote the date
and information  of an event (TTY Related) on this newsgroup.

Roy Wildermuth
From k9tty at dls.net  Fri May 16 01:56:22 2008
From: k9tty at dls.net (Don Robert House)
Date: Fri May 16 02:06:14 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] Permitted Posting.
In-Reply-To: <C45287DE.257%w3rlw@rochester.rr.com>
References: <C45287DE.257%w3rlw@rochester.rr.com>
Message-ID: <60E9AC8D-1D6D-420C-8A6E-7DA7318062B6@dls.net>

You certainly are encouraged to post such things.
Gil Smith <gil@baudot.net> is the moderator of this list.

Don

On 15 May 2008, at 11:37 PM, Roy Wildermuth wrote:



Before I break any rules I want to ask. Am I permitted to promote the  
date
and information  of an event (TTY Related) on this newsgroup.

Roy Wildermuth
_______________________________________________
GreenKeys mailing list
GreenKeys@mailman.qth.net
http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys

From gil at baudot.net  Fri May 16 11:08:13 2008
From: gil at baudot.net (gil smith)
Date: Fri May 16 11:18:04 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] Permitted Posting.
Message-ID: <6.1.2.0.2.20080516080705.028e0ec0@mail.vauxelectronics.com>

Hi folks:

Yeah, I'm the greenkeys "moderator."  More of an admin-guy really.

You guys know I don't get too fussy about postings.  I don't mind even 
things that are off-topic, if they seem to have appeal to a good chunk of 
the group.  I think I have only asked the list to to quiet down on a couple 
of discussions, that either got too political or were selling things that 
were more ham-related than tty-related, and I only do that when I get 
complaints from list members.  Sheesh, I've stretched the limits of 
off-topic postings myself, and even been called on it by list members, in 
which case I have to moderate myself.  Some lists don't even tolerate 
for-sale stuff or notes about current ebay auctions -- I say, if there is a 
tty machine out there that needs a home, we all should hear about it, since 
we are really here to save these machines and save a bit of history.  And 
have some fun with them in the process.

Not that this is my list -- I just act on behalf of the members.  I take 
care of subscriptions and spam mostly.  I do very little moderation.  But 
then we have a great group of folks, and it's not really needed.  And it's 
not like the posting volume is enormous and needs filtering just to keep it 
manageable.

But Roy, something tty-related, even vaugly tty-related, well of course you 
can post it!  I'm really curious now.

gil





Vaux Electronics, Inc.
480-354-5556
(fax: 480-354-5558)
www.vauxelectronics.com


From comcents at bellsouth.net  Fri May 16 11:18:36 2008
From: comcents at bellsouth.net (Randy or Sherry Guttery)
Date: Fri May 16 11:28:29 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] Permitted Posting.
In-Reply-To: <6.1.2.0.2.20080516080705.028e0ec0@mail.vauxelectronics.com>
References: <6.1.2.0.2.20080516080705.028e0ec0@mail.vauxelectronics.com>
Message-ID: <482DA5CC.1060902@bellsouth.net>

gil smith wrote:

> Some lists don't even 
> tolerate for-sale stuff or notes about current ebay auctions -- I say, 
> if there is a tty machine out there that needs a home, we all should 
> hear about it, since we are really here to save these machines and save 
> a bit of history.  And have some fun with them in the process.

On that note - I'll point out there is a 28 re-perf on there now...
When it was first listed - he just had it listed as Model 28 Teletype -
$40 shipping - in Texas.  No pics, nothing more.  I sent him a note
noting there were dozens of variations from small tape units (which - as
it turns out - is the case here) to behemoth ASRs. He's now updated the
listing - and provided a link to pixes. I'm not at all familiar with
that unit - appears to have a separate LESU (or perhaps power supply?).

Anyway - might be of interest to someone...

best regards...
-- 
randy guttery

A Tender Tale - a page dedicated to those Ships and Crews
so vital to the United States Silent Service:
http://tendertale.com


From wa2hwj at att.net  Fri May 16 11:21:53 2008
From: wa2hwj at att.net (wa2hwj@att.net)
Date: Fri May 16 11:31:51 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] Permitted Posting.
In-Reply-To: <482DA5CC.1060902@bellsouth.net>
References: <6.1.2.0.2.20080516080705.028e0ec0@mail.vauxelectronics.com><482DA5CC.1060902@bellsouth.net>
Message-ID: <1819009678-1210951286-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-163408067-@bxe012.bisx.prod.on.blackberry>

It looks like a Model 28 TEMPEST TD.


Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry

-----Original Message-----
From: Randy or Sherry Guttery <comcents@bellsouth.net>

Date: Fri, 16 May 2008 10:18:36 
To:"greenkeys@mailman.qth.net" <greenkeys@mailman.qth.net>
Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] Permitted Posting.


gil smith wrote:

> Some lists don't even 
> tolerate for-sale stuff or notes about current ebay auctions -- I say, 
> if there is a tty machine out there that needs a home, we all should 
> hear about it, since we are really here to save these machines and save 
> a bit of history.  And have some fun with them in the process.

On that note - I'll point out there is a 28 re-perf on there now...
When it was first listed - he just had it listed as Model 28 Teletype -
$40 shipping - in Texas.  No pics, nothing more.  I sent him a note
noting there were dozens of variations from small tape units (which - as
it turns out - is the case here) to behemoth ASRs. He's now updated the
listing - and provided a link to pixes. I'm not at all familiar with
that unit - appears to have a separate LESU (or perhaps power supply?).

Anyway - might be of interest to someone...

best regards...
-- 
randy guttery

A Tender Tale - a page dedicated to those Ships and Crews
so vital to the United States Silent Service:
http://tendertale.com


_______________________________________________
GreenKeys mailing list
GreenKeys@mailman.qth.net
http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
From Teletypeparts at aol.com  Fri May 16 11:30:34 2008
From: Teletypeparts at aol.com (Teletypeparts@aol.com)
Date: Fri May 16 11:40:27 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] CRI-200 Inquiries
Message-ID: <bf4.2801ad1c.355f029a@aol.com>

Thanks to all who weighed in on my CRI-200 question.  I have replied off list 
to a couple and I'm all set for now.  
 
73's
 
Wayne
KB1FDW



**************Wondering what's for Dinner Tonight? Get new twists on family 
favorites at AOL Food.      
(http://food.aol.com/dinner-tonight?NCID=aolfod00030000000001)
From gfmurphy at earthlink.net  Fri May 16 13:41:28 2008
From: gfmurphy at earthlink.net (gfmurphy@earthlink.net)
Date: Fri May 16 13:51:19 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] Re: Permitted posting  --  M28 items on ebay
Message-ID: <12560448.1210959688304.JavaMail.root@elwamui-mouette.atl.sa.earthlink.net>

The Model 28 items listed on ebay are both 8 level sets.  In one of the pics
you can see the tape gate of the transmitter-distributor.  Look at the width
of the tape guides.  It is set for 1 inch tape.  Also, look at the hole in 
the tape gate where the tape-out pin would come through.  It's close to the
tape feedwheel.  That's what you would expect to see on a Model 35 TD  On a 
Model 28, the tape-out pin is located close to the bottom edge of the tape. 
Look at the picture showing the reperf:  The width of the tape fragment and 
the width of the tape reel both indicate that it is an 8 level reperf.  Look
at the reperf's stunt box area:  There's no Letters-Figures shift mechanism.
That's another indicator that it is an 8 level set.  Both units are Tempest
machines and have the electronics packages.  The punch block on the reperf
is of the full punch variety.  The reperf is probably an LPR814.  The cover
on the reperf is of a newer variety than the ones we usually see on M28 ROTRs.
I hope this info is of use.  Keep those machines running!
Regards,  Jerry Murphy



From NNN7DXB at aol.com  Fri May 16 17:01:33 2008
From: NNN7DXB at aol.com (NNN7DXB@aol.com)
Date: Fri May 16 17:11:34 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] Tape Relay Equipment
Message-ID: <c08.3870eb4d.355f502d@aol.com>

Hello List:

I have been reading the various posts on the GreenKeys list. Note that
everyone, and every effort seems to have been made to obtain, operate
and preserve small, single and individual pieces of equipment here and
there. What about the bigger sets?

I would like to know if anyone on the list is familiar (having actually 
worked with) tape relay equipment, and if anyone knows if any of
this gear has been preserved, and if so, where?

Specifically, Kleinschmidt AN/TGC-5s, AN/FGC-30s, AN/FGC-70s,
and Teletype Corp models AN/FGC-6, AN/FGC-38 and AN/FGC-39s
variously known in Western Union terms as Teletypewriter Central
Office Sets. (Torn Tape Relay Systems to the military).

The military was most likely the biggest user of this type of equipment,
but the FAA and State Dept used it too, and their use in large, fixed
station relays was quite significant from the 1940 thru the late 1980s.

Appreciate any info, discussion, or comments.

Keep well,

Dave F



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From NNN7DXB at aol.com  Sat May 17 13:44:55 2008
From: NNN7DXB at aol.com (NNN7DXB@aol.com)
Date: Sat May 17 13:55:03 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] For Jim Haynes
Message-ID: <cb1.2df7366c.35607397@aol.com>

Hello Jim:

Is it possible to upload a photo to the group on the AN/FGC-30 system
of tape relay equipment that you have? I tried, but am unable to get the
complete URL off the CommCenter lists Files area.

This photo is a nice example of a post-war tape relay system that might
be of interest, since we are on the subject of a tape relay systems at
the moment.

Appreciate any help,

Dave F



**************
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From NNN7DXB at aol.com  Sat May 17 15:54:16 2008
From: NNN7DXB at aol.com (NNN7DXB@aol.com)
Date: Sat May 17 16:04:23 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] Traffic on qth.mailman.com
Message-ID: <c94.2ef2b611.356091e8@aol.com>

All:

Does anyone know why traffic doesn't make it thru the qth.mailman.net
system? I've sent several messages to the Greenkeys list, and only
saw one (1) message make it through the system. This has happened
before, so it's not the first time. Are individual messages moderated
before being permitted to go to the list? Appreciate any help or
clarification on this one.....(and wish it were on yahoogroups, so everyone
could see, and reply to all the items of interest on the list at the same
time, instead of individually).

thanks,

Dave F



**************
Wondering what's for Dinner Tonight? Get new twists on family 
favorites at AOL Food.
      
(http://food.aol.com/dinner-tonight?NCID=aolfod00030000000001)
From gil at baudot.net  Sat May 17 19:06:13 2008
From: gil at baudot.net (gil@baudot.net)
Date: Sat May 17 19:16:14 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] Traffic on qth.mailman.com
Message-ID: <20080517160613.617ae442d0f8f631a9b3312d6b10cde7.c321e5101c.wbe@email.secureserver.net>

Hi Dave:

I am the greenkeys moderator.  The only reason a postwould get bumped to
me for approval is if it is a message from someonewho is not subscribed
to the list.  Sometimes it is a member who justhappened to post using a
different address (which I either just approveor may subscribe), and
sometimes (usually) it is spam I need todelete.  I usually check
greenkeys every day, but if a message iswaiting for me, it might take up
to a day for me to see it and approveit.  Again, this will only happen
if you post from an non-subscribedaddresss.  Individual messages are not
moderated -- that would reallybe way too much work for me to ever agree
to.

If a messagebounces back to YOU from greenkeys, with a message about it
lookinglike spam, then I never see it.  You can forward me the bounce
and Ican look into it.  I am trying to get one of George's posts to get
pastthe spam filters right now.  Certain phrases will trigger a spam
bounceback to you.  Also, if you try to post in html, it will bounce
back.

Thegreenkeys spam filters are kinda strict I suppose (set up by the
mainguys; not by me).  But they catch a whole crap-load of spam for us,
soI guess we can't complain about the occassional spam-filter bounce
whenit sees a phrase it does not like.  Might be something as simple
as"mortgage rate."

Send me a copy of the message you can not post.

ps: I will be in Disneyland from next Friday to Monday -- don't expect
meto see greenkeys during this time.  And, the weekend after that, I
willbe at cub-scout camp from that Friday to Monday.  Just a couple
ofrather-rare moderation blackout periods where I am gone.

thanks,

gil




 -------- Original Message --------
 Subject: [GreenKeys] Traffic on qth.mailman.com
 From: NNN7DXB@aol.com
 Date: Sat, May 17, 2008 12:54 pm
 To: greenKeys@mailman.qth.net
 
 All:
 
 Does anyone know why traffic doesn't make it thru the qth.mailman.net
 system? I've sent several messages to the Greenkeys list, and only
 saw one (1) message make it through the system. This has happened
 before, so it's not the first time. Are individual messages moderated
 before being permitted to go to the list? Appreciate any help or
 clarification on this one.....(and wish it were on yahoogroups, so
everyone
 could see, and reply to all the items of interest on the list at the
same
 time, instead of individually).
 
 thanks,
 
 Dave F



From gil at baudot.net  Sat May 17 19:27:00 2008
From: gil at baudot.net (gil@baudot.net)
Date: Sat May 17 19:37:01 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] ITTY
Message-ID: <20080517162700.617ae442d0f8f631a9b3312d6b10cde7.39d250418e.wbe@email.secureserver.net>


   Hi folks:  I am forwarding this for George:
   >Saturday May 17, 2008 - - -
   >
   >Good morning ALL ITTY USERS - - -
   >
   >It is not certain what the problem with ITTY is.
   >
   >Examination  of  the  logs at the time that ITTY went blind indicates
   that
   >and  IP with roots to the Asian area of the internet was grabbing the
   mail
   >input at that time.
   >
   >Tracing it revealed that the (edit) for that range of addresses
   >stated  that  the particular address was not in service at that time.
   This
   >leads  me  to  believe  that  some manner of internet hacking/address
   spoofing
   >was happening, but I cannot tell what went on.
   >
   >we'll  keep  plugging  at  it  until  it  is  fixed. Bill Bytheway is
   wandering
   >through  the  great  southwest on vacation, and until he gets wind of
   what is
   >happening I am at a loss as to what is going on.
   >
   >I  have to get going on a project at this time, but will load a bunch
   of
   >news stories this evening.
   >
   >If you have anything you want to put on ITTY, send it to me at
   >w7tty(at)readysetsurf.com and I'll move it over this evening.
   >
   >GEORGE - W7TTY
   >
From gil at baudot.net  Sat May 17 19:32:23 2008
From: gil at baudot.net (gil@baudot.net)
Date: Sat May 17 19:42:27 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] test4
Message-ID: <20080517163223.617ae442d0f8f631a9b3312d6b10cde7.78e6458ed1.wbe@email.secureserver.net>


   account frickin' manager

From gil at baudot.net  Sat May 17 19:42:13 2008
From: gil at baudot.net (gil@baudot.net)
Date: Sat May 17 19:52:13 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] GK spam filter -- does not like account (remove this)
	manager
Message-ID: <20080517164213.617ae442d0f8f631a9b3312d6b10cde7.45dc557a1d.wbe@email.secureserver.net>

Hi folks:

I just found out what caused George grief this morning.  His message had
the phrase "accountxxxx managerxxxx" in it (remove the xxxx) -- this
must be a very naughty thing to say on greenkeys.  I can't actually say
it here in its entirety, or it will bounce back to me, but the phrase
was 

    the word account, followed by the word manager.  

When I sent a test message with ONLY these two words, it also bounced
back to me.  However, when I added a third word in between, as in:

    account frickin' manager

it then went through.


Go figure.

gil




From gil at baudot.net  Sat May 17 21:57:13 2008
From: gil at baudot.net (gil@baudot.net)
Date: Sat May 17 22:07:14 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] Tape Relay Equipment
Message-ID: <20080517185713.617ae442d0f8f631a9b3312d6b10cde7.8bef7a4807.wbe@email.secureserver.net>

Forwarding for Dave -- gil
--------------------------


Subject: Tape Relay Equipment
From:NNN7DXB@aol.com(Add as Preferred Sender) 
Date:Sat, May 17, 2008 10:02 amTo:greenKeys@mailman.qth.net
Hello Jim and Bob:
 
 Bob, thought I'd address this to the entire group, since Jim has
contributed
 some replies as well, separately, in regard to the Tape Relay items you
have.
 
 It occured to me that the unit you (Bob) may have might/might not be
late WW II
 or post war. Here is why: The Army-Navy ("AN/") system didn't come
 into being until after the war. Prior to, and during most of WW II, the
 Army and Navy generally used the commercial model numbers, and 
 didn't have nomenclatures of their own for their equipment. Of course,
 much WW II comm gear was, of necessity, commercial, off-the-shelf
 stuff, rather than a standard military model. So, I am wondering if
there
 is a model number on that AN/TGC-1, or how it was nomenclatured
 as such. The AN/ system was designed more or less for the logistics
 and procurement folks for the Army and the Navy, and each service
 sometimes went its own way in further nomenclaturing its equipment
 beyond all reasonable recognition sometimes. During the WW II years,
 the Air Force wasn't a consideration, since it was still just a branch 
 of the Army, and had not yet become a separate service until itself.
 However, the Air Force eventually adopted the AN/ sysetm as well,
 and it's still in use today. The newest piece of AN/ equipment today:
 AN/TYC-245, tactical DMS automatic switching center.....replacing
 the older AN/TYC-39 AUTODIN switches, and replacing all of the earlier
MGC,
 TSC, an MSC equipment (teletype-based) in their entirety.
 
 
 For an interesting tutorial on what all these AN/ numbers mean, visit
 this site:
 
 http://www.gordon.army.mil/ocos/Museum/an.asp
 
 This is a part of the US Army Signal Museum at Fort Gordon, VA.
 Unfortunately, they have a PhD "historian" who works there, but so
 far, he doesn't know squat about anything, so has been of no help
 whatsoever, in spite of my emails to him for any information regarding
 any tape relay gear. I assume the "museum" doesn't have any (even
 though Fort Gordon Signal School had tons of it in the 60s). I was
 disappointed in the Army Signal Museum -- so far.
 
 I will see if the Navy has a Signal museum. Go to do some web
surfing....
 
 For Bob: You should also know that your machine most likely "might"
 be a former Navy machine. The USN was the leader in the very early
 days of WW II in the torn tape business. The Army didn't learn this
process
 until sometime after the war had started, and instead, relied heavily
 on point-to-point and TWX teletype service (and on commercial carriers)
 for much of their record message comms. Once the Army picked it up,
 it pretty well stuck as a mainstream system, only finally going away
 in the late 1980s. In the Army, and unlike the Navy, teletype equipment
 was never standardized. It would have been common in any Army
 CommCenter, depending where in the world one was stationed, to see
 any and all types of TTY gear: Teletype Corp (US), Siemens and Lorenz
 (Germany), and later, Kleinschmidt (in Germany, France, US). All 3
 companies produced tape relay equipment for the US Army.
 
 More to follow...
 
 Dave F
 

From gil at baudot.net  Sat May 17 21:58:27 2008
From: gil at baudot.net (gil@baudot.net)
Date: Sat May 17 22:08:28 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] Follow - Up to Teletype Tape Relay Systems
Message-ID: <20080517185827.617ae442d0f8f631a9b3312d6b10cde7.ad2b59b7f3.wbe@email.secureserver.net>

Bob and List:
 
 This is for general interest to all. Gives an idea of what a "tape
relay"
 station looks like. Most of these are typical installations, but varied
 from site to site. Tape Relay statoins in the Army also operated in
 the field, and were transportable, and were in use in the US Army
 thru the 1988 with NATO (Europe) circuits. (I was in the Army for
 25 years and tape relays were there when I came into the Army, and
 they were there when I left.....).
 
 Some URLs of photos of typical torn tape teletype relay systems are
listed
 below, in case anyone wants to take a look at what it is we are talking
 about. I am aware that many folks don't know what a tape relay is/was,
 so these photos should help somewhat. Comms were done exclusively,
 using only tape -- no printers. Most tape gear also printed the message
 either on the edge of the tape, or down the tape's center line, so
operators
 could read/route accordingly.
 
 1. US Army "Minor" Tape Relay Station RUMLNHA, Nha Trang, Vietnam,
 using Kleinschmidt AN/FGC-70s (send side only shown):
 
 http://www.history.army.mil/books/Vietnam/Comm-El/Photos/pg90.jpg
 
 2. US Army "Major" Tape Relay Station RUFG, Saran, France, early 60s
 using Teletype Corp AN/FGC-38s (send/receive units)
 
 http:www.geocities.com/Pentagon/Barracks/8386/teletype2.jpg
 
 http://www.geocities.com/Pentagon/Barracks/8386/teletype.jpg
 
 http://www.geocities.com/Pentagon/Barracks/8386/xmitrm.jpg
 
 3. US Army "Minor" Relay Station RUFPAG, 97th Sig Bn Heidelberg,
Germany, 1960s
 
 http://www.usarmygermany.com/units/Signal/Partials_97th%20Sig%20Bn%2011.htm
 (AN/FGC-39 cabinet open, exposing perforator and take up reel on
monitor unit)
 
 http://www.usarmygermany.com/units/Signal/Partials_97th%20Sig%20Bn%2012.htm
 (Shows receiver groups (banks) in a row
 
 http://www.usarmygermany.com/units/Signal/Partials_97th%20Sig%20Bn%2013.htm
 (Shows transmitter groups (TDs) of AN/FGC-39s. Note 3 TDs per unit)
 
 There were 4 types of "tape relays": Primary, Major, Minor and
Terminal"
 More on those later, if anyone is interested.
 
 Let me know if there are any problems with any of the links. I tried to
 copy them accurately......
 
 Dave F
 

From Commtekman at aol.com  Sat May 17 22:26:01 2008
From: Commtekman at aol.com (Commtekman@aol.com)
Date: Sat May 17 22:36:05 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] Tape Relay Equipment
Message-ID: <c87.2d50182d.3560edb9@aol.com>

Dave,
I went out to my comm shop and took  another look at it, it has the following 
on a brass ID plate:

SIGNAL  CORPS, U.S. ARMY
AN/TGC-1A
Serial number 650

All the machines in  the cabinet are made by Teletype with the exception of 
the rewind motor.
The  cabinet has six MWO's listed on the front access door

Does this help  ?

73 Bob
K6OSM  




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From k9tty at dls.net  Sat May 17 22:37:26 2008
From: k9tty at dls.net (Don Robert House)
Date: Sat May 17 22:47:28 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] Re: FYI
In-Reply-To: <482F2A1B.7090004@peoplepc.com>
References: <482F2A1B.7090004@peoplepc.com>
Message-ID: <517EAC41-CC06-4C26-A51D-A96D1359D689@dls.net>

The people at Golden Communications run their own private museum.   
Someone donated this tape printer.  Now they are trying to make money  
on it.
I have written Golden and asked them if they would donate it to our  
museum at S.D.S.U.  It will be interesting to see if I get a reply.

While I was in Fallbrook, CA I arranged for them to receive a complete  
switchboard for their museum which is located in Carlsbad.  You can  
visit Golden if you call for an appointment.

Don
K9TTY

Curator Emeritus NADCOMM
currently exiled in northern Illinois


On 17 May 2008, at 1:55 PM, riceguy wrote:

http://cgi.ebay.com/Rare-Antique-Western-Union-Ticker-Tape-Machine_W0QQitemZ110253023927QQihZ001QQcategoryZ208QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

From k9tty at dls.net  Sat May 17 22:39:21 2008
From: k9tty at dls.net (Don Robert House)
Date: Sat May 17 22:49:21 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] Traffic on qth.mailman.com
In-Reply-To: <c94.2ef2b611.356091e8@aol.com>
References: <c94.2ef2b611.356091e8@aol.com>
Message-ID: <09E6A9FF-1152-40E2-B3B9-748159E64355@dls.net>

Dave,

You have to make absolutely sure that each and every message you send  
is in PLAIN TEXT.
If it is any format other than PLAIN TEXT your messages will not go  
through.

Don
K9TTY


On 17 May 2008, at 2:54 PM, NNN7DXB@aol.com wrote:

All:

Does anyone know why traffic doesn't make it thru the qth.mailman.net
system? I've sent several messages to the Greenkeys list, and only
saw one (1) message make it through the system. This has happened
before, so it's not the first time. Are individual messages moderated
before being permitted to go to the list? Appreciate any help or
clarification on this one.....(and wish it were on yahoogroups, so  
everyone
could see, and reply to all the items of interest on the list at the  
same
time, instead of individually).

thanks,

Dave F



**************
Wondering what's for Dinner Tonight? Get new twists on family
favorites at AOL Food.

(http://food.aol.com/dinner-tonight?NCID=aolfod00030000000001)
_______________________________________________
GreenKeys mailing list
GreenKeys@mailman.qth.net
http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys

From WA5CAB at cs.com  Sat May 17 22:47:35 2008
From: WA5CAB at cs.com (WA5CAB@cs.com)
Date: Sat May 17 22:57:40 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] Tape Relay Equipment
Message-ID: <cb3.30be6d9a.3560f2c7@cs.com>

(a) The AN nomenclature system started up in 1942.  The earliest complete 
listing I have is dated June 1943.

(b)  AN/TGC-1 dates from June 1944.  It stayed in service until the mid or 
late 50's (last TM Change was 03/23/53).  I once had two complete operational 
AN/TGC-1B's.  Unfortunately, when I was forced to move to Houston in 1973 I had 
to shed the cabinets.  Each unit was about the size of a large 
refrigerator-freezer and contained two M14 typing reperfs with tape takeup reels, a 3-head TD 
(two for the reperfs plus an order wire), a loop supply and storage space..  
The units I had came out of Barksdale AFB and only the main cabinets had AN 
nomenclature tags.  The other units had Teletype nameplates.

FWIW, the TG-7-A,-B (M15) did not have military nomenclature assigned to 
anything on the printer except the complete printer  either.  Chests and other 
items associated did.  I still have a couple of TG-7-B's.

In a message dated 5/17/2008 8:57:47 PM Central Daylight Time, gil@baudot.net 
writes: 
> It occured to me that the unit you (Bob) may have might/might not be
> late WW II
> or post war. Here is why: The Army-Navy ("AN/") system didn't come
> into being until after the war. Prior to, and during most of WW II, the
> Army and Navy generally used the commercial model numbers, and 
> didn't have nomenclatures of their own for their equipment. Of course,
> much WW II comm gear was, of necessity, commercial, off-the-shelf
> stuff, rather than a standard military model. So, I am wondering if
> there
> is a model number on that AN/TGC-1, or how it was nomenclatured
> as such.

Robert Downs - Houston
<http://www.wa5cab.com> (Web Store)
MVPA 9480
<wa5cab@cs.com> (Primary email)
<wa5cab@comcast.net> (Backup email)
   
From jhhaynes at earthlink.net  Sat May 17 22:54:16 2008
From: jhhaynes at earthlink.net (Jim Haynes)
Date: Sat May 17 23:04:42 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] Tape Relay Equipment
In-Reply-To: <20080517185713.617ae442d0f8f631a9b3312d6b10cde7.8bef7a4807.wbe@email.secureserver.net>
References: <20080517185713.617ae442d0f8f631a9b3312d6b10cde7.8bef7a4807.wbe@email.secureserver.net>
Message-ID: <alpine.LFD.1.10.0805172152350.3141@localhost.localdomain>

Well I'm away from home and my manuals right now, but the
AN/TGC-1 was late ww-ii equipment.  I'm not sure when the
AN system started, but it was before the end of the war.
Consider the AN/ART-13 which was used on the big airplanes
after the BC-375.

Jim W6JVE



From k1lky at earthlink.net  Sun May 18 10:35:51 2008
From: k1lky at earthlink.net (Roy Morgan)
Date: Sun May 18 10:46:46 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] Re: FYI
In-Reply-To: <517EAC41-CC06-4C26-A51D-A96D1359D689@dls.net>
References: <482F2A1B.7090004@peoplepc.com>
	<517EAC41-CC06-4C26-A51D-A96D1359D689@dls.net>
Message-ID: <849245A1-5CD3-4951-BFC6-18B9B999FB64@earthlink.net>


On May 17, 2008, at 10:37 PM, Don Robert House wrote:

> The people at Golden Communications run their own private museum.   
> Someone donated this tape printer.  Now they are trying to make  
> money on it.

I am sometimes amazed at the laziness of some ebay sellers.  That  
machine would look a LOT better if  someone spent 5 minutes with some  
paper towels and Windex on it.

Maybe they think the dust contributes to the "antique"-ness of the  
thing.

Roy


Roy Morgan
k1lky@earthlink.net
Lovettsville, VA 20180



From weeksh at wildblue.net  Sun May 18 17:54:22 2008
From: weeksh at wildblue.net (Howard Weeks)
Date: Sun May 18 18:03:31 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] Tape Relay Equipment
In-Reply-To: <20080517185713.617ae442d0f8f631a9b3312d6b10cde7.8bef7a4807.wbe@email.secureserver.net>
References: <20080517185713.617ae442d0f8f631a9b3312d6b10cde7.8bef7a4807.wbe@email.secureserver.net>
Message-ID: <48306D4E.13147.1C7D17@weeksh.wildblue.net>

I live a few miles down the road from this museum and have worked 
next door for many years.

It has gone down hill significantly during the last 10 - 15 years.  
In my opinion, not the fault of the museum staff but can be laid at 
the feet of the "senior management" at the school.  Most are just not 
interested in the museum.  There isn't much on display and I do not 
think I saw any type of teletype machine the last time I was there.  

They have traditionally had a lot of stuff stored and very little of 
it on display.  At one time a few years back, much of the stored 
stuff was in an old barracks building with a hole in the roof.  That 
has been corrected but I really do not know whether they still have 
all of the previously stored items or not.  

Fort Monmouth has a better Signal oriented museum than the one at 
Gordon.  It has been a few years since I was in that one so can't say 
what the status is at the present time.  Monmouth is scheduled to be 
closed.  

There has always been two separate communication domains in the Army -
(1) fixed station or strategic communications and systems versus (2) 
tactical communication systems.  The tactical communication systems 
have always been pretty standardized including the TTY gear.  The 
fixed station stuff is as Dave described - all over the place.

Howard K5JCP in Harlem, GA

On 17 May 2008 at 18:57, gil@baudot.net wrote:

> Forwarding for Dave -- gil
> --------------------------
> 
> 
> Subject: Tape Relay Equipment
> From:NNN7DXB@aol.com(Add as Preferred Sender) 
> Date:Sat, May 17, 2008 10:02 amTo:greenKeys@mailman.qth.net
> Hello Jim and Bob:
>  
>  Bob, thought I'd address this to the entire group, since Jim has
> contributed
>  some replies as well, separately, in regard to the Tape Relay items you
> have.
>  
>  It occured to me that the unit you (Bob) may have might/might not be
> late WW II
>  or post war. Here is why: The Army-Navy ("AN/") system didn't come
>  into being until after the war. Prior to, and during most of WW II, the
>  Army and Navy generally used the commercial model numbers, and 
>  didn't have nomenclatures of their own for their equipment. Of course,
>  much WW II comm gear was, of necessity, commercial, off-the-shelf
>  stuff, rather than a standard military model. So, I am wondering if
> there
>  is a model number on that AN/TGC-1, or how it was nomenclatured
>  as such. The AN/ system was designed more or less for the logistics
>  and procurement folks for the Army and the Navy, and each service
>  sometimes went its own way in further nomenclaturing its equipment
>  beyond all reasonable recognition sometimes. During the WW II years,
>  the Air Force wasn't a consideration, since it was still just a branch 
>  of the Army, and had not yet become a separate service until itself.
>  However, the Air Force eventually adopted the AN/ sysetm as well,
>  and it's still in use today. The newest piece of AN/ equipment today:
>  AN/TYC-245, tactical DMS automatic switching center.....replacing
>  the older AN/TYC-39 AUTODIN switches, and replacing all of the earlier
> MGC,
>  TSC, an MSC equipment (teletype-based) in their entirety.
>  
>  
>  For an interesting tutorial on what all these AN/ numbers mean, visit
>  this site:
>  
>  http://www.gordon.army.mil/ocos/Museum/an.asp
>  
>  This is a part of the US Army Signal Museum at Fort Gordon, VA.
>  Unfortunately, they have a PhD "historian" who works there, but so
>  far, he doesn't know squat about anything, so has been of no help
>  whatsoever, in spite of my emails to him for any information regarding
>  any tape relay gear. I assume the "museum" doesn't have any (even
>  though Fort Gordon Signal School had tons of it in the 60s). I was
>  disappointed in the Army Signal Museum -- so far.
>  
>  I will see if the Navy has a Signal museum. Go to do some web
> surfing....
>  
>  For Bob: You should also know that your machine most likely "might"
>  be a former Navy machine. The USN was the leader in the very early
>  days of WW II in the torn tape business. The Army didn't learn this
> process
>  until sometime after the war had started, and instead, relied heavily
>  on point-to-point and TWX teletype service (and on commercial carriers)
>  for much of their record message comms. Once the Army picked it up,
>  it pretty well stuck as a mainstream system, only finally going away
>  in the late 1980s. In the Army, and unlike the Navy, teletype equipment
>  was never standardized. It would have been common in any Army
>  CommCenter, depending where in the world one was stationed, to see
>  any and all types of TTY gear: Teletype Corp (US), Siemens and Lorenz
>  (Germany), and later, Kleinschmidt (in Germany, France, US). All 3
>  companies produced tape relay equipment for the US Army.
>  
>  More to follow...
>  
>  Dave F
>  
> 
> _______________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> GreenKeys@mailman.qth.net
> http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys


Howard Weeks
Harlem, GA 
K5JCP
From ddillman at igc.org  Mon May 19 16:52:20 2008
From: ddillman at igc.org (Richard Dillman)
Date: Mon May 19 17:02:31 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] KSM 5/24 RTTY Broadcast
Message-ID: <18468781.1211230340366.JavaMail.root@mswamui-cedar.atl.sa.earthlink.net>


The KSM RTTY broadcast for 24 May will include text provided by Dave Freed of the CommCenter group.

The CommCenter group was formed to serve those who worked in the military at fixed-station, tactical, mobile and shipboard record message military communications centers (CommCenters) involving teletype, torn tape relay, AUTODIN, and DMS facilities, and any military record messaging services relevant to the military since 1940 and later.

Several CommCenter members have restored military RTTY (or, more properly RATT in this context). We offered the facilities of KSM so CommCenter members and others can enjoy receiving a message in correct military Communications Center format.  

The CommCenter message will be in the rotation with the normal KSM press and weather broadcasts.

The KSM RTTY broadcasts will be at the usual times on the usual frequencies in the usual modes, viz:

Time: Our RTTY broadcasts usually begin at about 1100pdt ((1800Z)

Frequencies: 8433.0kc and 12631.0kc

Modes: Baudot - 170cps shift 45 baud, SITOR - 170cps shift 100 baud

As usual, K6KPH will guard 7050kc, 14050kc and 21050kc for reception reports and general calls.  Since these frequencies are in the scanner along with the ship calling frequencies the best bet is to use commercial calling procedure: Send "K6KPH" repeatedly on one of the above frequencies (within the limits of station identification requirements of course) until the K6KPH operator responds with "DE".  Then send your call sign and traffic.

Reception reports for KSM and K6KPH may be sent to the QSL Mistress at:

PO Box 381
Bolinas, California 94926
USA

If you would like to receive announcements like this and are not already a member of the Radiomarine email distribution list you may become a list member by sending a message to:

radiomarine-subscribe@yahoogroups.org

The KSM operator may be contacted directly via Skype when the station is on the air.  The Skype name is: radio-ksm

VY 73,

RD

 

=================================
Richard Dillman, W6AWO
Chief Operator, Coast Station KSM
Maritime Radio Historical Society
http://www.radiomarine.org
=================================
From larryradio at worldnet.att.net  Mon May 19 16:56:19 2008
From: larryradio at worldnet.att.net (Larry Tighe)
Date: Mon May 19 17:06:27 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] KSM 5/24 RTTY Broadcast
References: <18468781.1211230340366.JavaMail.root@mswamui-cedar.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <008f01c8b9f2$ca64ffa0$2000a8c0@ljt>

What is Skype?

lar
K2JIA
www.antiquetelephone.com

==========================================================
Subject: [GreenKeys] KSM 5/24 RTTY Broadcast


> The KSM operator may be contacted directly via Skype when the station is 
> on the air.  The Skype name is: radio-ksm
>
> VY 73,
>
> RD

From k9tty at dls.net  Mon May 19 17:27:34 2008
From: k9tty at dls.net (Don Robert House)
Date: Mon May 19 17:38:25 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] KSM 5/24 RTTY Broadcast
In-Reply-To: <008f01c8b9f2$ca64ffa0$2000a8c0@ljt>
References: <18468781.1211230340366.JavaMail.root@mswamui-cedar.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
	<008f01c8b9f2$ca64ffa0$2000a8c0@ljt>
Message-ID: <65AD0B86-9740-4448-B996-87560ED6C543@dls.net>

A Voice Over IP (VOIP) communications service.  They also offer video  
conferencing for free.

You can check it out at http://www.skype.com

Don
K9TTY



On 19 May 2008, at 3:56 PM, Larry Tighe wrote:

What is Skype?

lar
K2JIA
www.antiquetelephone.com

==========================================================
Subject: [GreenKeys] KSM 5/24 RTTY Broadcast


> The KSM operator may be contacted directly via Skype when the  
> station is on the air.  The Skype name is: radio-ksm
>
> VY 73,
>
> RD

_______________________________________________
GreenKeys mailing list
GreenKeys@mailman.qth.net
http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys

From ddillman at igc.org  Mon May 19 17:58:08 2008
From: ddillman at igc.org (Richard Dillman)
Date: Mon May 19 18:08:19 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] KSM 5/24 RTTY Broadcast
Message-ID: <15253794.1211234288722.JavaMail.root@mswamui-cedar.atl.sa.earthlink.net>


>What is Skype?

Good question.  I should have mentioned that is is used primarily for VoIP (computer based) phone calls.

But what I should *really* have mentioned is that we can support only keyboard-to-keyboard chats, not voice calls, on our dial up Internet connection a KSM.

Best,

RD

=================================
Richard Dillman, W6AWO
Chief Operator, Coast Station KSM
Maritime Radio Historical Society
http://www.radiomarine.org
=================================
From wd9itr at arrl.net  Mon May 19 19:06:32 2008
From: wd9itr at arrl.net (David Effa)
Date: Mon May 19 19:16:58 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] Teletype Model 15 Keyboard on eBay
Message-ID: <b57442c70805191606i44875d01w70ecad08512748e8@mail.gmail.com>

Hi,

I just joined GreenKeys last week.  I was catching up with the
postings there when I caught a recent mail to the "boatanchors" email
address.  I sent a message to "boatanchors" but have found out that
it's a list that I do not belong too.

Would anyone know if the "boatanchors" contact is the person
(boatanchors8639) selling the Teletype Model 15 Keyboard on eBay (soon
to expire in 1 hr)?

URL:  http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&item=150246814302

I've been bidding on it but was out bidded and not sure if I want to
go higher.  I am trying to get involved again with the old RTTY
machines and I discovered the GreenKeys list off the rtty.com website.
 I have an old 15 but needs some work done.  I hope I can ask this
list for some help and about getting spare parts and obtaining/finding
new machines.

Thanks for your time!

Best regards,

Dave
From larryradio at worldnet.att.net  Mon May 19 19:09:23 2008
From: larryradio at worldnet.att.net (Larry Tighe)
Date: Mon May 19 19:19:47 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] Teletype Model 15 Keyboard on eBay
References: <b57442c70805191606i44875d01w70ecad08512748e8@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <004201c8ba05$61909fd0$0200a8c0@LARRYTIGHE>

David,

There's no doubt you can do better on greenkeys getting parts or a machine 
here!  It is good to mention where you live and maybe one of the list 
members is near and has machines available.

lar
K2JIA
www.antiquetelephone.com



----- Original Message ----- 
From: "David Effa" <wd9itr@arrl.net>
To: <greenkeys@mailman.qth.net>
Sent: Monday, May 19, 2008 19:06
Subject: [GreenKeys] Teletype Model 15 Keyboard on eBay


> Hi,
>
> I just joined GreenKeys last week.  I was catching up with the
> postings there when I caught a recent mail to the "boatanchors" email
> address.  I sent a message to "boatanchors" but have found out that
> it's a list that I do not belong too.
>
> Would anyone know if the "boatanchors" contact is the person
> (boatanchors8639) selling the Teletype Model 15 Keyboard on eBay (soon
> to expire in 1 hr)?
>
> URL: 
> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&item=150246814302
>
> I've been bidding on it but was out bidded and not sure if I want to
> go higher.  I am trying to get involved again with the old RTTY
> machines and I discovered the GreenKeys list off the rtty.com website.
> I have an old 15 but needs some work done.  I hope I can ask this
> list for some help and about getting spare parts and obtaining/finding
> new machines.
>
> Thanks for your time!
>
> Best regards,
>
> Dave
> _______________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> GreenKeys@mailman.qth.net
> http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys 

From k1lky at earthlink.net  Mon May 19 23:07:08 2008
From: k1lky at earthlink.net (Roy Morgan)
Date: Mon May 19 23:17:57 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] Teletype Model 15 Keyboard on eBay
In-Reply-To: <004201c8ba05$61909fd0$0200a8c0@LARRYTIGHE>
References: <b57442c70805191606i44875d01w70ecad08512748e8@mail.gmail.com>
	<004201c8ba05$61909fd0$0200a8c0@LARRYTIGHE>
Message-ID: <C5A83488-D141-4A50-B8C5-BF6645DB4B99@earthlink.net>


On May 19, 2008, at 7:09 PM, Larry Tighe wrote:

> David,
>
> There's no doubt you can do better on greenkeys getting parts or a  
> machine here!  It is good to mention where you live and maybe one  
> of the list members is near and has machines available.

Dave,

Right on.. where do you live?

Roy - now in Northern VA, and about to move to Central New York.

Roy Morgan
k1lky@earthlink.net
Lovettsville, VA 20180



From wd9itr at arrl.net  Tue May 20 00:56:42 2008
From: wd9itr at arrl.net (David Effa)
Date: Tue May 20 01:07:08 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] Teletype Model 15 Keyboard on eBay
In-Reply-To: <C5A83488-D141-4A50-B8C5-BF6645DB4B99@earthlink.net>
References: <b57442c70805191606i44875d01w70ecad08512748e8@mail.gmail.com>
	<004201c8ba05$61909fd0$0200a8c0@LARRYTIGHE>
	<C5A83488-D141-4A50-B8C5-BF6645DB4B99@earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <b57442c70805192156s4dcb0a6fhd811165dc269a6b3@mail.gmail.com>

Hi,

I've received today a few replies from your group and I must say I
feel right at home.  Let me introduce myself and how I got started
with RTTY and teletype.

I live in Grayslake Illinois.  It's north of Chicago about 13 miles
from the Wisconsin border.  I make my livelihood doing support for web
applications and web sites at Abbott Laboratories.  Back when I was in
High School 1971-1975 (Arlington Heights, IL.) a friend of mine
introduce me to a Ham that worked at Motorola as an engineer.  (I was
also big in electronics and used to fix peoples TVs when they had
tubes at the High School!)  In his basement he had a Model 15
teletype.  It was driven by a homemade demod (phased-locked loop
dedicated to FM band reception.  What a engineer would do right?) and
to a "tweaked" Moto radio down to the 2 Meter Amateur band.  It was
receiving weather broadcasts at the time I was there.  I would never
forget the clackly clack of those keys typing away along with the
upshift of the platen.  That mechanical sound along with the RTTY
audio tones has stayed with me forever.

We also visited the local defense center that my town had and they had
I think a Model 28 running there (big sucker) with a big tube receiver
and power supply powering it.  It was quite though when it ran.  That
too was monitoring the weather freq.   It's kinda of weird how all
this came together when I think of it.

My friends and myself looked for teleypes.  I do not remember how we
came across this, but somehow we found out that Teletype (corp.) down
in Blue Island, Illinois was throwing a bunch of them (model 15s) out.
 We went down there and on their scape dock they sat.  The only one
that looked in good shape was one, and I swear, in a greenish cabinet
that looked like a postal mailbox.  Well I got that and lugged it back
to my parents house in the basement.  It was a heavy sucker!

The next step was to get a demodulator.  I read about the HAL ST-6 but
it was too expensive at the time for someone in High School.  What I
did was purchase the blank ST-5 PC boards from HAL with the manual for
both the ST-5 and 6 and built it up buying parts and made my own
cabinet to put it in.  I later stole the auto-start logic and another
board from the ST-6 schematic and etched my own PC boards for it.  It
worked great once I tweaked those toroids at a local college
engineering lab. :-)

During that time period I got my Amateur Technician license (the one
with the Morse requirement).  I am a General class license holder now.
 I quickly bought a 2M radio that I used and also I had a shortwave
radio to copy ARRL bulletins and anything else I could find.

I have to laugh at this.  I often had the 2M radio and demod in my
second story bedroom and used an extra pair of phone line wires from
the phone jack down to the basement.  I ran that pair to the teletype
printer magnets.  In the middle of the night the house seem to shook
the foundation and you could hear it clunk a long.  Sometimes the bell
would ring if there was a weather warning (kept the weather running
when not doing anything else).  I wonder if weather is still around
using Baudot?

A few years later, that Ham where I first seen a Model 15 offered me
the chance to buy it.  I did and gave the other "mailbox" away.  In
hindsight, I should have keep the mechanics for spare parts.  The new
15 was in good shape and working order.  It is still pretty good but
is has not run in a long time.  I will have to take it apart and lube
it up.  I have a original Teletype manual for it.  The 15 is in an all
black cabinet with a Teletype - Chicago label on it.  It has some
drilled holes on the top of the cabinet which I think someone once had
a paper clutched take-up real on it (need to get one of those.)  It
also has a black stand that it sits on but that has a re-orange stamp
on it with U S over an anchor symbol.  Obviously US Navy.  Not sure
both came together from it's past.  The 15 also has a "here-is" key
under a front flap which you can program to type a limited number of
characters.  Not sure that was part of it because the case flap does
not close all the way because of the perturbing spindle part of it.

Well I went to college, moved out on my own and the 15 sat collection
dust at my parents home.  They decided to move it to another place in
the basement and they cut all my wiring.  I got married (late in life)
and when I bought a house and I finally moved the 15 back to it's real
home.  I never got it running because of this and that and babies
came.  But every time I went down to my basement it's there looking at
me and I can smell the grease from it which causes me to think back to
those simpler days of the past and the world was fine.

A friend down in Tennessee found an old ST-6 a few years ago and I
told him to buy it.  I do not know if it works but I always wanted
one.  A bad sign though.  When I move the box something rattles and
there is a hole drilled on the back of it for someones modification to
it in the past.  But I am going to open it open it up and remove the
op-amps and see it it turns on or smokes.

Well I hit age 51 this year, the kids are getting older and I decided
to get this stuff working again and even expand my collection/hobby if
I can.  I started "Googling" around for RTTY information and I found
you guys through a link on the rtty.com web site.  So here I am!

I was bidding on eBay yesterday for a replacement model 15 keyboard.
Mine got bend up a little in all the moving around but still useable.
I have since learned that the person who won with a bid of $80 is a
member of "GreenKeys".  Congratulations to that person.  I only went
to $25.  Is that kind of price typical for parts?  If so, I got a lot
to catch up on!

Well too much reliving my past.  I hope I did not bore everyone!  I
will enjoy reading the posts here and asking a lot of questions or
advice of fixing and finding equipment I am sure.  I have one offer
already!  Thanks Don.

Best regards,

Dave Effa
wd9itr@arrl.net

.
On Mon, May 19, 2008 at 10:07 PM, Roy Morgan <k1lky@earthlink.net> wrote:
>
> On May 19, 2008, at 7:09 PM, Larry Tighe wrote:
>
>> David,
>>
>> There's no doubt you can do better on greenkeys getting parts or a machine
>> here!  It is good to mention where you live and maybe one of the list
>> members is near and has machines available.
>
> Dave,
>
> Right on.. where do you live?
>
> Roy - now in Northern VA, and about to move to Central New York.
>
> Roy Morgan
> k1lky@earthlink.net
> Lovettsville, VA 20180
>
>
>
>
From k9tty at dls.net  Tue May 20 01:29:18 2008
From: k9tty at dls.net (Don Robert House)
Date: Tue May 20 01:39:32 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] Welcome to Greenkeys
In-Reply-To: <b57442c70805192156s4dcb0a6fhd811165dc269a6b3@mail.gmail.com>
References: <b57442c70805191606i44875d01w70ecad08512748e8@mail.gmail.com>
	<004201c8ba05$61909fd0$0200a8c0@LARRYTIGHE>
	<C5A83488-D141-4A50-B8C5-BF6645DB4B99@earthlink.net>
	<b57442c70805192156s4dcb0a6fhd811165dc269a6b3@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <98F2A660-2E72-4AAE-8D47-BAF4B1F28970@dls.net>

Nice write up Dave,

Glad to have you aboard.  Give me a call and we can have lunch and you  
can tour my station.

Don
K9TTY


On 19 May 2008, at 11:56 PM, David Effa wrote:

Hi,

I've received today a few replies from your group and I must say I
feel right at home.  Let me introduce myself and how I got started
with RTTY and teletype.

I live in Grayslake Illinois.  It's north of Chicago about 13 miles
from the Wisconsin border.  I make my livelihood doing support for web
applications and web sites at Abbott Laboratories.  Back when I was in
High School 1971-1975 (Arlington Heights, IL.) a friend of mine
introduce me to a Ham that worked at Motorola as an engineer.  (I was
also big in electronics and used to fix peoples TVs when they had
tubes at the High School!)  In his basement he had a Model 15
teletype.  It was driven by a homemade demod (phased-locked loop
dedicated to FM band reception.  What a engineer would do right?) and
to a "tweaked" Moto radio down to the 2 Meter Amateur band.  It was
receiving weather broadcasts at the time I was there.  I would never
forget the clackly clack of those keys typing away along with the
upshift of the platen.  That mechanical sound along with the RTTY
audio tones has stayed with me forever.

We also visited the local defense center that my town had and they had
I think a Model 28 running there (big sucker) with a big tube receiver
and power supply powering it.  It was quite though when it ran.  That
too was monitoring the weather freq.   It's kinda of weird how all
this came together when I think of it.

My friends and myself looked for teleypes.  I do not remember how we
came across this, but somehow we found out that Teletype (corp.) down
in Blue Island, Illinois was throwing a bunch of them (model 15s) out.
We went down there and on their scape dock they sat.  The only one
that looked in good shape was one, and I swear, in a greenish cabinet
that looked like a postal mailbox.  Well I got that and lugged it back
to my parents house in the basement.  It was a heavy sucker!

The next step was to get a demodulator.  I read about the HAL ST-6 but
it was too expensive at the time for someone in High School.  What I
did was purchase the blank ST-5 PC boards from HAL with the manual for
both the ST-5 and 6 and built it up buying parts and made my own
cabinet to put it in.  I later stole the auto-start logic and another
board from the ST-6 schematic and etched my own PC boards for it.  It
worked great once I tweaked those toroids at a local college
engineering lab. :-)

During that time period I got my Amateur Technician license (the one
with the Morse requirement).  I am a General class license holder now.
I quickly bought a 2M radio that I used and also I had a shortwave
radio to copy ARRL bulletins and anything else I could find.

I have to laugh at this.  I often had the 2M radio and demod in my
second story bedroom and used an extra pair of phone line wires from
the phone jack down to the basement.  I ran that pair to the teletype
printer magnets.  In the middle of the night the house seem to shook
the foundation and you could hear it clunk a long.  Sometimes the bell
would ring if there was a weather warning (kept the weather running
when not doing anything else).  I wonder if weather is still around
using Baudot?

A few years later, that Ham where I first seen a Model 15 offered me
the chance to buy it.  I did and gave the other "mailbox" away.  In
hindsight, I should have keep the mechanics for spare parts.  The new
15 was in good shape and working order.  It is still pretty good but
is has not run in a long time.  I will have to take it apart and lube
it up.  I have a original Teletype manual for it.  The 15 is in an all
black cabinet with a Teletype - Chicago label on it.  It has some
drilled holes on the top of the cabinet which I think someone once had
a paper clutched take-up real on it (need to get one of those.)  It
also has a black stand that it sits on but that has a re-orange stamp
on it with U S over an anchor symbol.  Obviously US Navy.  Not sure
both came together from it's past.  The 15 also has a "here-is" key
under a front flap which you can program to type a limited number of
characters.  Not sure that was part of it because the case flap does
not close all the way because of the perturbing spindle part of it.

Well I went to college, moved out on my own and the 15 sat collection
dust at my parents home.  They decided to move it to another place in
the basement and they cut all my wiring.  I got married (late in life)
and when I bought a house and I finally moved the 15 back to it's real
home.  I never got it running because of this and that and babies
came.  But every time I went down to my basement it's there looking at
me and I can smell the grease from it which causes me to think back to
those simpler days of the past and the world was fine.

A friend down in Tennessee found an old ST-6 a few years ago and I
told him to buy it.  I do not know if it works but I always wanted
one.  A bad sign though.  When I move the box something rattles and
there is a hole drilled on the back of it for someones modification to
it in the past.  But I am going to open it open it up and remove the
op-amps and see it it turns on or smokes.

Well I hit age 51 this year, the kids are getting older and I decided
to get this stuff working again and even expand my collection/hobby if
I can.  I started "Googling" around for RTTY information and I found
you guys through a link on the rtty.com web site.  So here I am!

I was bidding on eBay yesterday for a replacement model 15 keyboard.
Mine got bend up a little in all the moving around but still useable.
I have since learned that the person who won with a bid of $80 is a
member of "GreenKeys".  Congratulations to that person.  I only went
to $25.  Is that kind of price typical for parts?  If so, I got a lot
to catch up on!

Well too much reliving my past.  I hope I did not bore everyone!  I
will enjoy reading the posts here and asking a lot of questions or
advice of fixing and finding equipment I am sure.  I have one offer
already!  Thanks Don.

Best regards,

Dave Effa
wd9itr@arrl.net

.
On Mon, May 19, 2008 at 10:07 PM, Roy Morgan <k1lky@earthlink.net>  
wrote:
>
> On May 19, 2008, at 7:09 PM, Larry Tighe wrote:
>
>> David,
>>
>> There's no doubt you can do better on greenkeys getting parts or a  
>> machine
>> here!  It is good to mention where you live and maybe one of the list
>> members is near and has machines available.
>
> Dave,
>
> Right on.. where do you live?
>
> Roy - now in Northern VA, and about to move to Central New York.
>
> Roy Morgan
> k1lky@earthlink.net
> Lovettsville, VA 20180
>
>
>
>
_______________________________________________
GreenKeys mailing list
GreenKeys@mailman.qth.net
http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys

From jamie2 at hughes.net  Tue May 20 10:23:40 2008
From: jamie2 at hughes.net (jamie2)
Date: Tue May 20 10:35:54 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] RE: GreenKeys Digest, Vol 52, Issue 22
In-Reply-To: <20080520080130.158D5859D4A@mailman.qth.net>
References: <20080520080130.158D5859D4A@mailman.qth.net>
Message-ID: <21C9EDD6C97B4548A06BD829CEA73326@jamie2PC>

Thank you for the post Dave on the teletype machine And Don gives a lot of
info on teletype machines.
  Wish you guys were closer too western WI ellsworth like too get my
teletype too print out emails been my dream.Its funny young people look at
the teletype whats that.It nice people take care of the old teletype,enjoyed
reading your post Dave.I fire mine up type on it keep it going so it don't
lock up from just sitting there thank you all for the storys enjoy them   
 Thank you Jim Ellsworth WI Yes mine is my pc room I take care of it

-----Original Message-----
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Sent: Tuesday, May 20, 2008 3:02 AM
To: greenkeys@mailman.qth.net
Subject: GreenKeys Digest, Vol 52, Issue 22

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Today's Topics:

   1. Welcome to Greenkeys (Don Robert House)


----------------------------------------------------------------------

Message: 1
Date: Tue, 20 May 2008 00:29:18 -0500
From: Don Robert House <k9tty@dls.net>
Subject: [GreenKeys] Welcome to Greenkeys
To: "David Effa" <wd9itr@arrl.net>
Cc: Greenkeys <greenkeys@mailman.qth.net>
Message-ID: <98F2A660-2E72-4AAE-8D47-BAF4B1F28970@dls.net>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed; delsp=yes

Nice write up Dave,

Glad to have you aboard.  Give me a call and we can have lunch and you  
can tour my station.

Don
K9TTY


On 19 May 2008, at 11:56 PM, David Effa wrote:

Hi,

I've received today a few replies from your group and I must say I
feel right at home.  Let me introduce myself and how I got started
with RTTY and teletype.

I live in Grayslake Illinois.  It's north of Chicago about 13 miles
from the Wisconsin border.  I make my livelihood doing support for web
applications and web sites at Abbott Laboratories.  Back when I was in
High School 1971-1975 (Arlington Heights, IL.) a friend of mine
introduce me to a Ham that worked at Motorola as an engineer.  (I was
also big in electronics and used to fix peoples TVs when they had
tubes at the High School!)  In his basement he had a Model 15
teletype.  It was driven by a homemade demod (phased-locked loop
dedicated to FM band reception.  What a engineer would do right?) and
to a "tweaked" Moto radio down to the 2 Meter Amateur band.  It was
receiving weather broadcasts at the time I was there.  I would never
forget the clackly clack of those keys typing away along with the
upshift of the platen.  That mechanical sound along with the RTTY
audio tones has stayed with me forever.

We also visited the local defense center that my town had and they had
I think a Model 28 running there (big sucker) with a big tube receiver
and power supply powering it.  It was quite though when it ran.  That
too was monitoring the weather freq.   It's kinda of weird how all
this came together when I think of it.

My friends and myself looked for teleypes.  I do not remember how we
came across this, but somehow we found out that Teletype (corp.) down
in Blue Island, Illinois was throwing a bunch of them (model 15s) out.
We went down there and on their scape dock they sat.  The only one
that looked in good shape was one, and I swear, in a greenish cabinet
that looked like a postal mailbox.  Well I got that and lugged it back
to my parents house in the basement.  It was a heavy sucker!

The next step was to get a demodulator.  I read about the HAL ST-6 but
it was too expensive at the time for someone in High School.  What I
did was purchase the blank ST-5 PC boards from HAL with the manual for
both the ST-5 and 6 and built it up buying parts and made my own
cabinet to put it in.  I later stole the auto-start logic and another
board from the ST-6 schematic and etched my own PC boards for it.  It
worked great once I tweaked those toroids at a local college
engineering lab. :-)

During that time period I got my Amateur Technician license (the one
with the Morse requirement).  I am a General class license holder now.
I quickly bought a 2M radio that I used and also I had a shortwave
radio to copy ARRL bulletins and anything else I could find.

I have to laugh at this.  I often had the 2M radio and demod in my
second story bedroom and used an extra pair of phone line wires from
the phone jack down to the basement.  I ran that pair to the teletype
printer magnets.  In the middle of the night the house seem to shook
the foundation and you could hear it clunk a long.  Sometimes the bell
would ring if there was a weather warning (kept the weather running
when not doing anything else).  I wonder if weather is still around
using Baudot?

A few years later, that Ham where I first seen a Model 15 offered me
the chance to buy it.  I did and gave the other "mailbox" away.  In
hindsight, I should have keep the mechanics for spare parts.  The new
15 was in good shape and working order.  It is still pretty good but
is has not run in a long time.  I will have to take it apart and lube
it up.  I have a original Teletype manual for it.  The 15 is in an all
black cabinet with a Teletype - Chicago label on it.  It has some
drilled holes on the top of the cabinet which I think someone once had
a paper clutched take-up real on it (need to get one of those.)  It
also has a black stand that it sits on but that has a re-orange stamp
on it with U S over an anchor symbol.  Obviously US Navy.  Not sure
both came together from it's past.  The 15 also has a "here-is" key
under a front flap which you can program to type a limited number of
characters.  Not sure that was part of it because the case flap does
not close all the way because of the perturbing spindle part of it.

Well I went to college, moved out on my own and the 15 sat collection
dust at my parents home.  They decided to move it to another place in
the basement and they cut all my wiring.  I got married (late in life)
and when I bought a house and I finally moved the 15 back to it's real
home.  I never got it running because of this and that and babies
came.  But every time I went down to my basement it's there looking at
me and I can smell the grease from it which causes me to think back to
those simpler days of the past and the world was fine.

A friend down in Tennessee found an old ST-6 a few years ago and I
told him to buy it.  I do not know if it works but I always wanted
one.  A bad sign though.  When I move the box something rattles and
there is a hole drilled on the back of it for someones modification to
it in the past.  But I am going to open it open it up and remove the
op-amps and see it it turns on or smokes.

Well I hit age 51 this year, the kids are getting older and I decided
to get this stuff working again and even expand my collection/hobby if
I can.  I started "Googling" around for RTTY information and I found
you guys through a link on the rtty.com web site.  So here I am!

I was bidding on eBay yesterday for a replacement model 15 keyboard.
Mine got bend up a little in all the moving around but still useable.
I have since learned that the person who won with a bid of $80 is a
member of "GreenKeys".  Congratulations to that person.  I only went
to $25.  Is that kind of price typical for parts?  If so, I got a lot
to catch up on!

Well too much reliving my past.  I hope I did not bore everyone!  I
will enjoy reading the posts here and asking a lot of questions or
advice of fixing and finding equipment I am sure.  I have one offer
already!  Thanks Don.

Best regards,

Dave Effa
wd9itr@arrl.net

.
On Mon, May 19, 2008 at 10:07 PM, Roy Morgan <k1lky@earthlink.net>  
wrote:
>
> On May 19, 2008, at 7:09 PM, Larry Tighe wrote:
>
>> David,
>>
>> There's no doubt you can do better on greenkeys getting parts or a  
>> machine
>> here!  It is good to mention where you live and maybe one of the list
>> members is near and has machines available.
>
> Dave,
>
> Right on.. where do you live?
>
> Roy - now in Northern VA, and about to move to Central New York.
>
> Roy Morgan
> k1lky@earthlink.net
> Lovettsville, VA 20180
>
>
>
>
_______________________________________________
GreenKeys mailing list
GreenKeys@mailman.qth.net
http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys



------------------------------

_______________________________________________
GreenKeys mailing list
GreenKeys@mailman.qth.net
http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys


End of GreenKeys Digest, Vol 52, Issue 22
*****************************************

From jeans at nex.net.au  Tue May 20 10:58:58 2008
From: jeans at nex.net.au (Don Black)
Date: Tue May 20 11:08:52 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] HP TTY Lubricating Kit Information
Message-ID: <4832E732.7080806@nex.net.au>

Hello,
         

I've just got a HP 5080-6610 lubrication kit for teletypes.
I hope to make use of it for general lubrication. Does anyone have any info on the lubricant please. There's a toothpaste type tube of grease (I guess)Teletype part number 145867, a bottle of 5080-6614 Teletype Oil with eye dropper and a small tube of what I assume is grease with a stylized "name" that I think is GP ((general purpose?). Also some brushes and probes
Any information on what the lubricants are used for or service data for Hewlett Packard Teletypes that would use it will be a big help.
Thanks, Don Black.

From k1lky at earthlink.net  Tue May 20 17:01:10 2008
From: k1lky at earthlink.net (Roy Morgan)
Date: Tue May 20 17:12:20 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] Fwd: My new love is in the house!
References: <437842.36363.qm@web82306.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <87057E8A-12ED-4628-B89D-B921B64B9995@earthlink.net>



Begin forwarded message:

> From: John Duggan <radiounity@sbcglobal.net>
> Date: May 20, 2008 7:44:30 AM EDT
> To: k1lky@earthlink.net
> Subject: My new love is in the house!
>
> Roy,
>
> It's here, I think I have broken a few new wrinkles on
> my face today, my new Love is in my life, only us can
> understand what where saying, hope to hear you on the
> air soon, please forward to Greenkeys.
>
> 73 DE John KG6EOT
> NN NN

Roy Morgan
k1lky@earthlink.net
Lovettsville, VA 20180



From k1lky at earthlink.net  Tue May 20 17:42:42 2008
From: k1lky at earthlink.net (Roy Morgan)
Date: Tue May 20 18:44:53 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] MMTTY on Windoze-98
In-Reply-To: <87057E8A-12ED-4628-B89D-B921B64B9995@earthlink.net>
References: <437842.36363.qm@web82306.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<87057E8A-12ED-4628-B89D-B921B64B9995@earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <08A060AA-1C69-4068-838A-1501496B7ED4@earthlink.net>

  Hi, all,

I have found in the storage area a Windoze 98 computer that seems to  
work.  It's the only Windows machine here, so I plan to set up MMTTY  
on it soon.

I may be able to lash up at least a receiving setup.  The computer  
sits next to a 75A-4 and that should do the job ok!  I'll feed the  
receiver with my pitifully low-altitude multiple band dipole  
(approximate height 11 feet).

Roy

Roy Morgan
k1lky@earthlink.net
Lovettsville, VA 20180



From jpl15 at panix.com  Tue May 20 18:44:50 2008
From: jpl15 at panix.com (John Lawson)
Date: Tue May 20 18:55:06 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] MMTTY on Windoze-98
In-Reply-To: <08A060AA-1C69-4068-838A-1501496B7ED4@earthlink.net>
References: <437842.36363.qm@web82306.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<87057E8A-12ED-4628-B89D-B921B64B9995@earthlink.net>
	<08A060AA-1C69-4068-838A-1501496B7ED4@earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <Pine.NEB.4.64.0805201838170.15591@panix1.panix.com>



On Tue, 20 May 2008, Roy Morgan wrote:

> Hi, all,
>
> I have found in the storage area a Windoze 98 computer that seems to work. 
> It's the only Windows machine here, so I plan to set up MMTTY on it soon.
>
> I may be able to lash up at least a receiving setup.  The computer sits next 
> to a 75A-4 and that should do the job ok!  I'll feed the receiver with my 
> pitifully low-altitude multiple band dipole (approximate height 11 feet).


   Mind the video card, cables, and monitor - my first computer-based RTTY 
setup (running TrueTTY on a Win98 box) was utterly useless on 20M - 
because of the hash and noise put out by the video subsystem.

   Gounding the computer case to the station ground, and looping the VGA 
cable and monitor power cable thru a couple of large toroids cleaned it 
mostly up.

  Consider buying an el-cheapo 15" or 17" LCD VGA monitor from Wal-Mart or 
Amazon... they're much quieter since they have no high power scanning 
circuits, or that pesky beam of electrons waving all over the inside of 
the CRT, radiating lots of wide-spectral RF in the process...


   Cheers

John KB6SCO

From k9tty at dls.net  Tue May 20 20:40:55 2008
From: k9tty at dls.net (Don Robert House)
Date: Tue May 20 20:51:17 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] HP TTY Lubricating Kit Information
In-Reply-To: <4832E732.7080806@nex.net.au>
References: <4832E732.7080806@nex.net.au>
Message-ID: <998CF81A-7F4D-4BFF-B597-90530CABD5D4@dls.net>

I am not positive but the kit reads like it is for DataSpeed equipment  
rather than the traditional Teletype machines.  I will look through  
the documentation I have here to see if I can find a reference to the  
145867 part number.

More later,

Don
K9TTY


On 20 May 2008, at 9:58 AM, Don Black wrote:

Hello,

I've just got a HP 5080-6610 lubrication kit for teletypes.
I hope to make use of it for general lubrication. Does anyone have any  
info on the lubricant please. There's a toothpaste type tube of grease  
(I guess)Teletype part number 145867, a bottle of 5080-6614 Teletype  
Oil with eye dropper and a small tube of what I assume is grease with  
a stylized "name" that I think is GP ((general purpose?). Also some  
brushes and probes
Any information on what the lubricants are used for or service data  
for Hewlett Packard Teletypes that would use it will be a big help.
Thanks, Don Black.

_______________________________________________
GreenKeys mailing list
GreenKeys@mailman.qth.net
http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys

From k9tty at dls.net  Tue May 20 20:52:30 2008
From: k9tty at dls.net (Don Robert House)
Date: Tue May 20 21:02:50 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] MMTTY on Windoze-98
In-Reply-To: <Pine.NEB.4.64.0805201838170.15591@panix1.panix.com>
References: <437842.36363.qm@web82306.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<87057E8A-12ED-4628-B89D-B921B64B9995@earthlink.net>
	<08A060AA-1C69-4068-838A-1501496B7ED4@earthlink.net>
	<Pine.NEB.4.64.0805201838170.15591@panix1.panix.com>
Message-ID: <FF0F4514-65AB-4E73-982D-47BB89798C2D@dls.net>

An excellent reminder.  On my old Mac G3 I replaced the CRT with the  
15 inch LCD  and am having much better results.

Thanks John,

Don
K9TTY


On 20 May 2008, at 5:44 PM, John Lawson wrote:



On Tue, 20 May 2008, Roy Morgan wrote:

> Hi, all,
>
> I have found in the storage area a Windoze 98 computer that seems to  
> work. It's the only Windows machine here, so I plan to set up MMTTY  
> on it soon.
>
> I may be able to lash up at least a receiving setup.  The computer  
> sits next to a 75A-4 and that should do the job ok!  I'll feed the  
> receiver with my pitifully low-altitude multiple band dipole  
> (approximate height 11 feet).


  Mind the video card, cables, and monitor - my first computer-based  
RTTY setup (running TrueTTY on a Win98 box) was utterly useless on 20M  
- because of the hash and noise put out by the video subsystem.

  Gounding the computer case to the station ground, and looping the  
VGA cable and monitor power cable thru a couple of large toroids  
cleaned it mostly up.

Consider buying an el-cheapo 15" or 17" LCD VGA monitor from Wal-Mart  
or Amazon... they're much quieter since they have no high power  
scanning circuits, or that pesky beam of electrons waving all over the  
inside of the CRT, radiating lots of wide-spectral RF in the process...


  Cheers

John KB6SCO

_______________________________________________
GreenKeys mailing list
GreenKeys@mailman.qth.net
http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys

From comcents at bellsouth.net  Tue May 20 22:29:13 2008
From: comcents at bellsouth.net (Randy or Sherry Guttery)
Date: Tue May 20 22:39:36 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] HP TTY Lubricating Kit Information
In-Reply-To: <998CF81A-7F4D-4BFF-B597-90530CABD5D4@dls.net>
References: <4832E732.7080806@nex.net.au>
	<998CF81A-7F4D-4BFF-B597-90530CABD5D4@dls.net>
Message-ID: <483388F9.3080401@bellsouth.net>

Don Robert House wrote:

> I have here to see if I can find a reference to the 145867 
> part number.

The 1977 Teletype tool book Section 570-005-800TC lists 145867 as:
4oz.Tube Mobile #2  (P/N 143484 is the same thing in a 1 pound can).

best regards...
-- 
randy guttery

A Tender Tale - a page dedicated to those Ships and Crews
so vital to the United States Silent Service:
http://tendertale.com
From jbs at kadiak.org  Wed May 21 03:13:24 2008
From: jbs at kadiak.org (Joe Stevens)
Date: Wed May 21 03:23:39 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] Model 15 kbd
Message-ID: <0K1700JFSIPW0P00@msgmmp-1.gci.net>

I have two Model 15 machines.  One has a working keyboard but the 
other has an odd pinion on the keyboard shaft.   It has 25 teeth and 
won't mesh with the gear in the printer.  There is no number on the 
pinion.  The shaft is 0.250 inch diameter.  Can anyone supply me 
with  the correct pinion for my keyboard?  It is Western Union 
BK34/HE.  (The machine with the correct pinion is not at this 
location so I can't look at it right 
now.)  Regards,    ...j0e   Kodiak AK   http://www.kadiak.org

From comcents at bellsouth.net  Wed May 21 11:35:00 2008
From: comcents at bellsouth.net (Randy or Sherry Guttery)
Date: Wed May 21 11:45:26 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] Model 28... 
Message-ID: <48344124.6040009@bellsouth.net>

Well - thanks to Riceguy - I'm well on my way to getting a 28. Of course 
- considering his great skills at refurbishing - including manufacturing 
parts, his idea of "putting together" is a bit extreme! However - to 
bring things up to date -

I'm sure some of you remember the "pile of junk parts" offered on ebay 
sometime back that consisted of a rusty autotyper sitting on the remains 
of a keyboard/base. All of the wiring harness (including connector J101) 
had been cannibalized, but it was Model 28 "stuff" so I put in a token 
bid and wound up with it- with the intention of salvaging as many spare 
parts as I could.

Also some time back a friend offered me a Kleinschmidt that he had 
gotten from the local FAA office when they upgraded many years ago. I 
posted it here - but with shipping as high as it would be - and the fact 
it was in marginal condition at best - no takers.  Finally he and I made 
a deal as I figured if I could get it "functional" - and I could use it 
to work on the computer interface I'm building. Once I put out a request 
for a wiring diagram, Riceguy offered the "kit" idea. He had a really 
nice compact sans cover but other wise in fine condition.  His pitch? 
swap. Well- we now know EXACTLY what it cost to ship the TT-98B - at 
74.9 pounds packed - OUCH!.  However - we now have a working RO in the 
house (I'm not sure who's more excited - me or Sherry?). So far - here's 
the plan:

Rebuild the keyboard/base we have - replacing the missing parts and 
re-wiring.  The three parts that are missing (that aren't common parts 
like springs or parts I do have) is the 14 pin connector that the LESU 
plugs into (J101 or Winchester 12-2P); the eccentric follower pawl for 
the auto-shut-off (pawl P/N 195420) -- though that may not be needed if 
I can use the 3 speed transmission from the compact - as it appears 
there isn't a "cam" for it like on intermediate gear, and some 
transmissions.  I don't see a cam on this one so I may have to figure a 
different way to do auto shut-off. The third item is the key cover - 
that part that "wraps" around the sides and bottom of the keyboard.

Of course I'll eventually need an LESU - be nice if it came with a 
cabinet ;-) . But in the mean time - I'll use the compact's "terminals" 
to make the connections.

Question: just how rare are "standard" table top 28 cabinets (like the 
TT-69/70 comes in)?

I'm not in a big hurry, just bringing it up here in case someone is 
fixing to rid themselves of some pieces/parts I can use.

I guess while I'm at it - we still need the case w/fan (or not- we can 
punt on that!) for a URA-8A -- we do have the filter module. We still 
don't have a clue what happened to the case. Best we can figure is that 
it probably got thrown out the time we took a tree limb through the 
garage roof - and a bunch of stuff was ruined.  We had some "help" 
cleaning up - and sometimes what looked like "junk" to them -- wasn't...

Thanks much for all the help on the TT-98B - as you probably figured out 
from this - Riceguy is taking it on as a project - as good as he is- I'm 
glad to know it's going to get a shot at it's former glory.

best regards...
-- 
randy guttery

A Tender Tale - a page dedicated to those Ships and Crews
so vital to the United States Silent Service:
http://tendertale.com
From comcents at bellsouth.net  Wed May 21 12:00:25 2008
From: comcents at bellsouth.net (Randy or Sherry Guttery)
Date: Wed May 21 12:10:50 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] Re: Model 28 Parts...  
Message-ID: <48344719.7080808@bellsouth.net>

My manual is from 1950 - and Teletype has long since changed from the 14 
pin to 20 pin connector (plus locating pin)- so that's what I really need.

Thanks...

and best regards...
-- 
randy guttery

A Tender Tale - a page dedicated to those Ships and Crews
so vital to the United States Silent Service:
http://tendertale.com
From jhhaynes at earthlink.net  Wed May 21 12:12:51 2008
From: jhhaynes at earthlink.net (Jim Haynes)
Date: Wed May 21 12:23:24 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] Model 15 kbd
In-Reply-To: <0K1700JFSIPW0P00@msgmmp-1.gci.net>
References: <0K1700JFSIPW0P00@msgmmp-1.gci.net>
Message-ID: <alpine.LFD.1.10.0805211108480.2701@Frances>



On Tue, 20 May 2008, Joe Stevens wrote:

> I have two Model 15 machines.  One has a working keyboard but the other has 
> an odd pinion on the keyboard shaft.   It has 25 teeth and won't mesh with 
> the gear in the printer.  There is no number on the pinion.  The shaft is 
> 0.250 inch diameter.  Can anyone supply me with  the correct pinion for my 
> keyboard?  It is Western Union BK34/HE.  (The machine with the correct pinion

Well the W.U. explains it.  All but W.U. Model 15 machines used 7.42
unit code, but W.U. used 7.0 unit code.  So the keyboard shaft has to
turn at a slightly different speed to make the baud speed come out right.
But if you change the gear to the one used for 7.42 code then the
speed will still be wrong because of the different cam sleeve.

Hence I'm not clear on what you are asking for.  If it's a W.U. keyboard
then it will have a W.U. cam sleeve and needs the W.U. gear, and
therefore a W.U. typing unit with the correct mating gear.


From jbs at kadiak.org  Wed May 21 12:41:05 2008
From: jbs at kadiak.org (Joe Stevens)
Date: Wed May 21 12:56:47 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] Model 15 kbd
In-Reply-To: <alpine.LFD.1.10.0805211108480.2701@Frances>
References: <0K1700JFSIPW0P00@msgmmp-1.gci.net>
	<alpine.LFD.1.10.0805211108480.2701@Frances>
Message-ID: <0K180033C995M370@msgmmp-1.gci.net>

Jim, That explains a few things...  I think somebody sent me the 
wrong keyboard for the machine.  I'll bet the whole machine is NOT WU 
because it is printing perfectly from a 7.42 TD.  Thanks for that info.

I'll explore the machine a bit further, meanwhile...

Does anybody want a WU keyboard?  Trade for a 7.42 keyboard?

    ...j0e


At 08:12 AM 5/21/2008, you wrote:


>On Tue, 20 May 2008, Joe Stevens wrote:
>
>>I have two Model 15 machines.  One has a working keyboard but the 
>>other has an odd pinion on the keyboard shaft.   It has 25 teeth 
>>and won't mesh with the gear in the printer.  There is no number on 
>>the pinion.  The shaft is 0.250 inch diameter.  Can anyone supply 
>>me with  the correct pinion for my keyboard?  It is Western Union 
>>BK34/HE.  (The machine with the correct pinion
>
>Well the W.U. explains it.  All but W.U. Model 15 machines used 7.42
>unit code, but W.U. used 7.0 unit code.  So the keyboard shaft has to
>turn at a slightly different speed to make the baud speed come out right.
>But if you change the gear to the one used for 7.42 code then the
>speed will still be wrong because of the different cam sleeve.
>
>Hence I'm not clear on what you are asking for.  If it's a W.U. keyboard
>then it will have a W.U. cam sleeve and needs the W.U. gear, and
>therefore a W.U. typing unit with the correct mating gear.
>
>

From jhhaynes at earthlink.net  Wed May 21 12:50:43 2008
From: jhhaynes at earthlink.net (Jim Haynes)
Date: Wed May 21 13:01:12 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] Model 15 kbd
In-Reply-To: <0K180033C995M370@msgmmp-1.gci.net>
References: <0K1700JFSIPW0P00@msgmmp-1.gci.net>
	<alpine.LFD.1.10.0805211108480.2701@Frances>
	<0K180033C995M370@msgmmp-1.gci.net>
Message-ID: <alpine.LFD.1.10.0805211149260.2945@Frances>

Either kind of printer will print perfectly from either a 7.42 or a
7.00 TD.  The printer doesn't need even as much as 1.0 length stop
pulse, so with a longer stop pulse it just rests longer between
characters.


From Teletypeparts at aol.com  Wed May 21 15:18:14 2008
From: Teletypeparts at aol.com (Teletypeparts@aol.com)
Date: Wed May 21 15:28:38 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] Hal CRI-200
Message-ID: <c02.360d3ebf.3565cf76@aol.com>

Thanks to Bill Henry and other Greenkeys advice, I have my Hal CRI-200 hooked 
up for use as a scope monitor for RTTY.  Not sure how much help it will be, 
but will fully check it out with W1AW bulletin tonight.  
 
Wayne
KB1FDW



**************Get trade secrets for amazing burgers. Watch "Cooking with 
Tyler Florence" on AOL Food.      
(http://food.aol.com/tyler-florence?video=4&?NCID=aolfod00030000000002)
From Teletypeparts at aol.com  Wed May 21 15:31:18 2008
From: Teletypeparts at aol.com (Teletypeparts@aol.com)
Date: Wed May 21 15:41:57 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] Hal ST-6
Message-ID: <d1c.248dbf5d.3565d286@aol.com>

I have a Hal ST-6 that I picked up from WA2HWJ.  It worked when he last used 
it.  I hooked it up to an after-market Telex and blew the loop switching 
transistor (The after-market 32 is gone now).  After replacing the keying 
transistor in the ST-6, it seems to work OK, but when I plug in my 32 teletype into the 
printer jack, the mark and space lights stop blinking and the mark light is 
on steady.  No printing on the 32.  This 32 works fine in my Hal ST-5000.  Any 
ideas on what is going on?  Above testing was done with W1AW bulletin tuned 
in.  
 
I dont really need this ST-6, so if anyone is interested buying it (working 
or not working as described above), any offer would be considered.  It is very 
clean inside and out and comes with the manual.  
 
Thanks,
 
Wayne 
KB1FDW



**************Get trade secrets for amazing burgers. Watch "Cooking with 
Tyler Florence" on AOL Food.      
(http://food.aol.com/tyler-florence?video=4&?NCID=aolfod00030000000002)
From ghenry at halcomm.com  Wed May 21 15:51:05 2008
From: ghenry at halcomm.com (Bill Henry)
Date: Wed May 21 16:01:23 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] Hal ST-6
In-Reply-To: <d1c.248dbf5d.3565d286@aol.com>
References: <d1c.248dbf5d.3565d286@aol.com>
Message-ID: <6.1.0.6.2.20080521144606.026c0110@mail.halcomm.com>

Wayne,

Is your 32 loop plug a "mono" plug (2-terminal), "stereo" plug 
(3-terminal), or 6-pin Molex?  Very early HAL ST-6's had mono loop jacks - 
and also had an insulated washer on the rear panel mounting.  If the ST-6 
has a mono jack, the loop wires go to "tip" and "sleeve" terminals of a 
mono plug.  Later ST-6's had a stereo loop jack with no insulating 
washer.  If it's a stereo jack, the loop wires go to "tip and ring" 
terminals - and no connection to the sleeve terminal of a stereo plug.  The 
last ST-6's (late 70's) had a Molex loop connector like that used on your 
ST-5000.  Connecting the printer loop wires to pins 1 and 4 should work for 
both modems.  A steady Mark light with no M/S flicker probably indicates 
that the keyer transistor (Q305) output is shorted to ground - either a 
blown 2N5655 (MJE-340) or a wire is hooked to the wrong place.

Bill Henry


At 03:31 PM 5/21/2008 -0400, Teletypeparts@aol.com wrote:
>I have a Hal ST-6 that I picked up from WA2HWJ.  It worked when he last used
>it.  I hooked it up to an after-market Telex and blew the loop switching
>transistor (The after-market 32 is gone now).  After replacing the keying
>transistor in the ST-6, it seems to work OK, but when I plug in my 32 
>teletype into the
>printer jack, the mark and space lights stop blinking and the mark light is
>on steady.  No printing on the 32.  This 32 works fine in my Hal 
>ST-5000.  Any
>ideas on what is going on?  Above testing was done with W1AW bulletin tuned
>in.
>
>I dont really need this ST-6, so if anyone is interested buying it (working
>or not working as described above), any offer would be considered.  It is 
>very
>clean inside and out and comes with the manual.
>
>Thanks,
>
>Wayne
>KB1FDW
>
>
>
>**************Get trade secrets for amazing burgers. Watch "Cooking with
>Tyler Florence" on AOL Food.
>(http://food.aol.com/tyler-florence?video=4&?NCID=aolfod00030000000002)
>_______________________________________________
>GreenKeys mailing list
>GreenKeys@mailman.qth.net
>http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys

From larryradio at worldnet.att.net  Wed May 21 17:28:18 2008
From: larryradio at worldnet.att.net (Larry Tighe)
Date: Wed May 21 17:38:43 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] DTE & DCE on a modem
Message-ID: <013b01c8bb89$977cc7b0$0200a8c0@LARRYTIGHE>

Howdy Folks,

Got my hands on some Black Box CL050A modems.  Planning to try keying a HV 
transistor with the RS-232 outputs.  They are designed to key a current loop 
which they supply 18 volts to.

Can anyone tell me what DCE and DTE means?  There are dip switches that'll 
have to be set up....

Thanks,
Larry
www.antiquetelephone.com 

From WB6BLV at inreach.com  Wed May 21 17:40:55 2008
From: WB6BLV at inreach.com (WB6BLV  Central California)
Date: Wed May 21 17:53:22 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] DTE etc
Message-ID: <005401c8bb8b$999e5d40$5888fea9@dwilegal>

RS-232 (Recommended Standard 232) is a standard for serial binary data
signals connecting between a DTE (Data terminal equipment) and a DCE (Data
Circuit-terminating Equipment).

(According to the book RS-232 Connection, the 'standard' is not necessarily
followed by many manufacturers, so some DTE and DCE devices may or may not
function as one would expect from reading the 'standard'.)

John
WB6BLV@inreach.com

From gil at baudot.net  Wed May 21 18:01:24 2008
From: gil at baudot.net (gil smith)
Date: Wed May 21 18:16:14 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] DTE & DCE on a modem
In-Reply-To: <013b01c8bb89$977cc7b0$0200a8c0@LARRYTIGHE>
References: <013b01c8bb89$977cc7b0$0200a8c0@LARRYTIGHE>
Message-ID: <6.1.2.0.2.20080521145538.02583240@mail.vauxelectronics.com>

Hi Larry:

One has TX on pin two and RX on pin three, the other one is the opposite -- 
don't recall which is which at the moment.  Ground is on pin seven (this is 
a DB-25).  You may or may not have to provide handshake lines (RTS/CTS, 
DTR/DSR), or pull them to the appropriate levels.

I know that's all pretty non-specific, but I don't have reference docs 
handy right now.  Should be able to google DTE and DCE and find the pinout 
of these two DB-25 connectors.  The connector sex is probably different as 
well, so you know which is which, and can then run a straight-wired cable 
between them.

gil




At 02:28 PM 5/21/2008, Larry Tighe wrote:
>Howdy Folks,
>
>Got my hands on some Black Box CL050A modems.  Planning to try keying a HV 
>transistor with the RS-232 outputs.  They are designed to key a current 
>loop which they supply 18 volts to.
>
>Can anyone tell me what DCE and DTE means?  There are dip switches that'll 
>have to be set up....
>
>Thanks,
>Larry
>www.antiquetelephone.com
>_______________________________________________
>GreenKeys mailing list
>GreenKeys@mailman.qth.net
>http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys



Vaux Electronics, Inc.
480-354-5556
(fax: 480-354-5558)
www.vauxelectronics.com


From rmcconne at lightlink.com  Wed May 21 18:05:19 2008
From: rmcconne at lightlink.com (Bob McConnell)
Date: Wed May 21 18:16:51 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] DTE & DCE on a modem
In-Reply-To: <013b01c8bb89$977cc7b0$0200a8c0@LARRYTIGHE>
References: <013b01c8bb89$977cc7b0$0200a8c0@LARRYTIGHE>
Message-ID: <48349C9F.1020803@lightlink.com>

Larry Tighe wrote:
> Howdy Folks,
> 
> Got my hands on some Black Box CL050A modems.  Planning to try keying a 
> HV transistor with the RS-232 outputs.  They are designed to key a 
> current loop which they supply 18 volts to.
> 
> Can anyone tell me what DCE and DTE means?  There are dip switches 
> that'll have to be set up....
> 

Larry,

Is that a true RS-232 output? If it is, it is a polar output that 
switches between +/- 18 volts. The voltage spec for the RS-232 series 
has always been that valid outputs are between 3 and 24 V, positive or 
negative. Anything less than 3 V is undefined and to be considered below 
the hysteresis threshold. Yes, that is a holdover from the days of glass 
enclosed vacuum tubes.

Bob McConnell
N2SPP
From Teletypeparts at aol.com  Wed May 21 18:37:05 2008
From: Teletypeparts at aol.com (Teletypeparts@aol.com)
Date: Wed May 21 18:47:33 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] ST-6
Message-ID: <ca6.2828c0da.3565fe11@aol.com>

Thanks to Bill and Jack for your help on the ST-6.  I tried reversing leads, 
no good.  However it is sold, amazingly to a local ham that I know.  He didnt 
realize it was me and vice-versa.  Anyway, thanks to all for your advice.  
Maybe the ST-6 just doesnt like the Telex circuitry.  
 
The CRI-200 works very well to fine tune the RTTY signal as soon as I got the 
hang of what to look for.  
 
Thanks again to all.  The ST-6 went for $40 just for your info.  
 
Wayne 
 
KB1FDW



**************Get trade secrets for amazing burgers. Watch "Cooking with 
Tyler Florence" on AOL Food.      
(http://food.aol.com/tyler-florence?video=4&?NCID=aolfod00030000000002)
From greenkeys at vaporland.com  Wed May 21 20:54:12 2008
From: greenkeys at vaporland.com (Bryan Brodie)
Date: Wed May 21 21:04:45 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] great story about WWII Teletype Operators
Message-ID: <c290a4d30805211754r3125974cwbbb4053c7c95cd35@mail.gmail.com>

http://www.capecodchronicle.com/chatnews/chat052208_1.htm
From larryradio at worldnet.att.net  Wed May 21 21:32:21 2008
From: larryradio at worldnet.att.net (Larry Tighe)
Date: Wed May 21 21:42:46 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] x
Message-ID: <00a701c8bbab$af54a160$0200a8c0@LARRYTIGHE>


From jack.rubin at ameritech.net  Wed May 21 23:22:03 2008
From: jack.rubin at ameritech.net (Jack Rubin)
Date: Wed May 21 23:32:45 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] KSR28 question
Message-ID: <000401c8bbbb$074770a0$176fa8c0@obie>

Firmly believing that there are no stupid questions, I throw myself on =
the
mercy of the group -=20

I picked up a beautiful KSR-28 last weekend. It seems to run well and
responds to Local LF and Local CR but I can't figure out how to run in =
local
mode. I can't find a line/local switch as on the 33 or a LOCAL key as on =
the
35 but I'm sure there is a way to run local. Just can't find it ...

HELP!

tnx de KC9HVE,
Jack

No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG.=20
Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 269.23.21/1457 - Release Date: =
5/20/2008
4:45 PM
=20

From k9tty at dls.net  Wed May 21 23:56:14 2008
From: k9tty at dls.net (Don Robert House)
Date: Thu May 22 00:06:41 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] KSR28 question
In-Reply-To: <000401c8bbbb$074770a0$176fa8c0@obie>
References: <000401c8bbbb$074770a0$176fa8c0@obie>
Message-ID: <4B01EF75-0708-4A16-BFEE-5D11F04A50B1@dls.net>

Hi Jack,

On many Model 28s used in the BELL SYSTEM a Line/Test switch was  
provided under the left side of the keyboard.
The switch is actually a long lever that controls a switch on the left  
side of the electrical service unit (LESU)  These machines also had  
their own rectifier in the base and a polar relay in the LESU.
Many machines also did not have the above and depended solely on line  
current to run closed.

If you want to bring your machine up here some day I can try to assist  
you with your needs.

Don
K9TTY


On 21 May 2008, at 10:22 PM, Jack Rubin wrote:

Firmly believing that there are no stupid questions, I throw myself on  
the
mercy of the group -

I picked up a beautiful KSR-28 last weekend. It seems to run well and
responds to Local LF and Local CR but I can't figure out how to run in  
local
mode. I can't find a line/local switch as on the 33 or a LOCAL key as  
on the
35 but I'm sure there is a way to run local. Just can't find it ...

HELP!

tnx de KC9HVE,
Jack

No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG.
Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 269.23.21/1457 - Release Date:  
5/20/2008
4:45 PM


_______________________________________________
GreenKeys mailing list
GreenKeys@mailman.qth.net
http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys

From comcents at bellsouth.net  Thu May 22 00:20:10 2008
From: comcents at bellsouth.net (Randy or Sherry Guttery)
Date: Thu May 22 00:30:35 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] Model 28...
In-Reply-To: <48344124.6040009@bellsouth.net>
References: <48344124.6040009@bellsouth.net>
Message-ID: <4834F47A.2030809@bellsouth.net>

Just a general update about our parts "quest" --- Thanks (again) to 
Riceguy - the parts we need for the keyboard base are taken care of (key 
board cover and connectors). He's also teaching me quite a bit about 
parts of Teletypes I'm not familiar with (never had an RO nor compact - 
now we have both - and finding out that that my "assumption" about "a 28 
autotyper is a 28 autotyper" might just encounter some "Hmmmm--- 
Uh-Ohs"... along the way... (well yeah, come to think of it - an RO 
autotyper doesn't have much use for a keyboard drive gear, does it?!)...

However - I think that's going to be part of the fun and challenge of 
this project.  Fortunately - our 28 never had any serious issues in the 
7 years we had it (it wasn't used but on very rare occasion the last 2); 
so I never really got that deep into it. I did one very thorough 
maintenance on it about a year before I sold it - went through all of 
the checks / adjustments / lube stuff in the book... but that's still 
not like having a major pile of parts on the table while replacing the 
main shaft...

So we're off to a good start... our thanks to all who have helped so far!

best regards...
-- 
randy guttery

A Tender Tale - a page dedicated to those Ships and Crews
so vital to the United States Silent Service:
http://tendertale.com
From odaymg at yahoo.com  Thu May 22 10:47:17 2008
From: odaymg at yahoo.com (Michael O'Day)
Date: Thu May 22 10:57:45 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] DTE & DCE on a modem
In-Reply-To: <013b01c8bb89$977cc7b0$0200a8c0@LARRYTIGHE>
Message-ID: <668232.31928.qm@web50004.mail.re2.yahoo.com>

Larry,
If you want to use the modem without a full RS-232
handshake, you may have to "hot wire" the modem by
connecting some of the signals together. We used to do
it by cutting the wires inside the cable's connector
shell, leaving a half-inch of wire on each pin to be
connected, and soldering them together inside the
connector shell. The basic RS-232 handshake is:

PIN #    Signal   Signal
 2         Tx     Data Transmit - to modem
 3         Rx     Data Receive -  to terminal
 4         RTS    Request to send - to modem
 5         CTS    Clear to send - to terminal
 6         DSR    Data set ready - to modem
 8         DCD    Data Carrier Detect - to terminal
 20        DTR    Data terminal ready - to modem
 7         GRD    Signal Ground - common to all

The hot wire sequence is tie pins 4&5 together, and
separately tie pins 6,8&20 together. There is also a
ring indicator signal on pin 22 (for auto-answer
modems), tell the modem to ignore RI if it has that
option.

Mike O'Day  N9ODM

--- Larry Tighe <larryradio@worldnet.att.net> wrote:

> Howdy Folks,
> 
> Got my hands on some Black Box CL050A modems. 
> Planning to try keying a HV 
> transistor with the RS-232 outputs.  They are
> designed to key a current loop 
> which they supply 18 volts to.
> 
> Can anyone tell me what DCE and DTE means?  There
> are dip switches that'll 
> have to be set up....
> 
> Thanks,
> Larry
> www.antiquetelephone.com 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> GreenKeys@mailman.qth.net
> http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> 



      
From brooke at pacific.net  Thu May 22 10:55:21 2008
From: brooke at pacific.net (Brooke Clarke)
Date: Thu May 22 11:05:53 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] DTE & DCE on a modem
In-Reply-To: <668232.31928.qm@web50004.mail.re2.yahoo.com>
References: <668232.31928.qm@web50004.mail.re2.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <48358959.2060909@pacific.net>

Hi Michael & Larry:

Those pin numbers only apply to a 25pin connector.  They are different for a 9 
pin connector.

Have Fun,

Brooke Clarke
http://www.prc68.com/P/Prod.html  Products I make and sell
http://www.prc68.com/Alpha.shtml  All my web pages listed based on html name
http://www.PRC68.com
http://www.precisionclock.com
http://www.prc68.com/I/WebCam2.shtml 24/7 Sky-Weather-Astronomy Web Cam

Michael O'Day wrote:
> Larry,
> If you want to use the modem without a full RS-232
> handshake, you may have to "hot wire" the modem by
> connecting some of the signals together. We used to do
> it by cutting the wires inside the cable's connector
> shell, leaving a half-inch of wire on each pin to be
> connected, and soldering them together inside the
> connector shell. The basic RS-232 handshake is:
> 
> PIN #    Signal   Signal
>  2         Tx     Data Transmit - to modem
>  3         Rx     Data Receive -  to terminal
>  4         RTS    Request to send - to modem
>  5         CTS    Clear to send - to terminal
>  6         DSR    Data set ready - to modem
>  8         DCD    Data Carrier Detect - to terminal
>  20        DTR    Data terminal ready - to modem
>  7         GRD    Signal Ground - common to all
> 
> The hot wire sequence is tie pins 4&5 together, and
> separately tie pins 6,8&20 together. There is also a
> ring indicator signal on pin 22 (for auto-answer
> modems), tell the modem to ignore RI if it has that
> option.
> 
> Mike O'Day  N9ODM
> 
> --- Larry Tighe <larryradio@worldnet.att.net> wrote:
> 
>> Howdy Folks,
>>
>> Got my hands on some Black Box CL050A modems. 
>> Planning to try keying a HV 
>> transistor with the RS-232 outputs.  They are
>> designed to key a current loop 
>> which they supply 18 volts to.
>>
>> Can anyone tell me what DCE and DTE means?  There
>> are dip switches that'll 
>> have to be set up....
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Larry
>> www.antiquetelephone.com 
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> GreenKeys mailing list
>> GreenKeys@mailman.qth.net
>> http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
>>
> 
> 
> 
>       
> _______________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> GreenKeys@mailman.qth.net
> http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> 
From odaymg at yahoo.com  Thu May 22 11:21:30 2008
From: odaymg at yahoo.com (Michael O'Day)
Date: Thu May 22 11:31:57 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] DTE & DCE on a modem
In-Reply-To: <48358959.2060909@pacific.net>
Message-ID: <763553.5265.qm@web50003.mail.re2.yahoo.com>

Hi Brooke,
Yes indeed they are, I was assuming his modem had a 25
pin connector. I guess I should have remembered what
happens when you do that.

9 pin  25 pin   Signal
 3       2       Tx
 2       3       Rx
 7       4       RTS
 8       5       CTS
 6       6       DSR
 1       8       DCD
 4       20      DTR
 5       7       Signal Ground
 9       22      RI

Also, on some data sets, pin 1 is connected to frame
ground, which might give you trouble if it causes an
AC ground loop. We used to pull all but the basic 8 
pins so the extra ones couldn't give us trouble later.

Mike - N9ODM
 
--- Brooke Clarke <brooke@pacific.net> wrote:

> Hi Michael & Larry:
> 
> Those pin numbers only apply to a 25pin connector. 
> They are different for a 9 
> pin connector.
> 
> Have Fun,
> 
> Brooke Clarke
> http://www.prc68.com/P/Prod.html  Products I make
> and sell
> http://www.prc68.com/Alpha.shtml  All my web pages
> listed based on html name
> http://www.PRC68.com
> http://www.precisionclock.com
> http://www.prc68.com/I/WebCam2.shtml 24/7
> Sky-Weather-Astronomy Web Cam
> 
> Michael O'Day wrote:
> > Larry,
> > If you want to use the modem without a full RS-232
> > handshake, you may have to "hot wire" the modem by
> > connecting some of the signals together. We used
> to do
> > it by cutting the wires inside the cable's
> connector
> > shell, leaving a half-inch of wire on each pin to
> be
> > connected, and soldering them together inside the
> > connector shell. The basic RS-232 handshake is:
> > 
> > PIN #    Signal   Signal
> >  2         Tx     Data Transmit - to modem
> >  3         Rx     Data Receive -  to terminal
> >  4         RTS    Request to send - to modem
> >  5         CTS    Clear to send - to terminal
> >  6         DSR    Data set ready - to modem
> >  8         DCD    Data Carrier Detect - to
> terminal
> >  20        DTR    Data terminal ready - to modem
> >  7         GRD    Signal Ground - common to all
> > 
> > The hot wire sequence is tie pins 4&5 together,
> and
> > separately tie pins 6,8&20 together. There is also
> a
> > ring indicator signal on pin 22 (for auto-answer
> > modems), tell the modem to ignore RI if it has
> that
> > option.
> > 
> > Mike O'Day  N9ODM
> > 
> > --- Larry Tighe <larryradio@worldnet.att.net>
> wrote:
> > 
> >> Howdy Folks,
> >>
> >> Got my hands on some Black Box CL050A modems. 
> >> Planning to try keying a HV 
> >> transistor with the RS-232 outputs.  They are
> >> designed to key a current loop 
> >> which they supply 18 volts to.
> >>
> >> Can anyone tell me what DCE and DTE means?  There
> >> are dip switches that'll 
> >> have to be set up....
> >>
> >> Thanks,
> >> Larry
> >> www.antiquetelephone.com 
> >>
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> GreenKeys mailing list
> >> GreenKeys@mailman.qth.net
> >> http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> >>
> > 
> > 
> > 
> >       
> > _______________________________________________
> > GreenKeys mailing list
> > GreenKeys@mailman.qth.net
> > http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> > 
> 



      
From k9tty at dls.net  Thu May 22 17:27:03 2008
From: k9tty at dls.net (Don Robert House)
Date: Thu May 22 17:37:43 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] A good buy if you are interested...
Message-ID: <C2B6C867-BD2D-4C8D-8777-CB0A8A316938@dls.net>

  Mac Mini For Sale
    Posted by: "Gregg Sperling, KB9DBC" gregg@kb9dbc.net kb9dbc
    Date: Wed May 21, 2008 9:56 pm ((PDT))

I have for sale a used Mac Mini (with PowerPC G4 1.42GHz Processor)
computer.  This is the first generation ?top of the line? series Mac  
Mini
computer.  I am the original owner, as it was purchased direct from  
Apple.
It has been used in a non-smoking environment.



I do not have the original restore disks, but I will install a fresh  
copy of
Mac OS X 10.5 ?Leopard? on it.



*  It has been upgraded to 1GB of RAM.

*  80GB ATA Hard drive

*  4x SuperDrive (DVD?RW/CD-RW)

*  Built-in Airport Express wireless and Bluetooth

*  Two USB 2.0 ports, one FireWire 400 port

*  Built-in Airport Extreme

*  Built-in Bluetooth 2.0

*  Built in speaker and headphone jack

* Included accessories: AC cord, Power adapter, DVI to VGA corded  
adapter,
Original Box (This computer is sold without Keyboard or mouse, you  
supply
both.)



I bought this computer for almost $900 about three years ago.  These  
have
sold on eBay recently for as much as $600.  Because I?m moving and  
trying to
sell this quickly, I?m pricing this for quick and FINAL sale:

$400 includes shipping anywhere in the country.



This is a great and reliable BASIC Mac computer, perfect for someone  
who?s
interested in learning what Mac is all about.



I accept PayPal, as well as Visa, MasterCard, American Express, and
Discover.



Thanks!

Gregg Sperling, KB9DBC

From Til128 at aol.com  Thu May 22 20:27:58 2008
From: Til128 at aol.com (Til128@aol.com)
Date: Thu May 22 20:38:36 2008
Subject: Fwd. for Larry--Re: [GreenKeys] DTE & DCE on a modem 
Message-ID: <c9f.2d30de0c.3567698e@aol.com>

----- Original Message ----- 
From:  <larryradio@att.net>
To: "Michael O'Day" <odaymg@yahoo.com>;  <brooke@pacific.net>
Cc: <greenkeys@mailman.qth.net>
Sent:  Thursday, May 22, 2008 11:30 AM
Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] DTE & DCE on a  modem


> Thank you all.
>
> Indeed, it does have the 25  pin female connector.  That information you've 
> sent is  great....never could have moved forward without that.
>
> Many  thanks again to all for great input.  These units are on ePay for $5  
> ea.  I found the list for something around $280 on several Black  Box 
> sites.
>
> lar
> K2JIA
>  www.antiquetelephone.com
>  




**************Get trade secrets for amazing burgers. Watch "Cooking with 
Tyler Florence" on AOL Food.      
(http://food.aol.com/tyler-florence?video=4&?NCID=aolfod00030000000002)
From telegrapher at att.net  Fri May 23 01:14:24 2008
From: telegrapher at att.net (telegrapher@att.net)
Date: Fri May 23 01:24:56 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] European TTY
Message-ID: <052320080514.25618.483652B00005EF000000641222230682329B0A02D29B9B0EBF9D0A089F0E9D090A040A9B@att.net>

I'm hearing the 850 shift European tty signals tonight here in Arizona.  Few days back when i heard them i was able to work into Europe on 10.1 mc.  Anyone over there listening?  WOrking BPSK maybe up around 10.139 +.  CW?  I think the European stuff was a weird speed?

Larry
W0OGH
From wa3frp at aol.com  Fri May 23 07:23:44 2008
From: wa3frp at aol.com (wa3frp@aol.com)
Date: Fri May 23 07:34:18 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] European TTY
Message-ID: <8CA8ADE984B26EC-7B8-2D67@Webmail-mg03.sim.aol.com>

Larry,

There were a number of Amateur RTTY stations on 30M last evening.  A 
lot of activity was centered around the DXPedition to Market Reef 
(OJ0J) and folks were calling them simplex at and around 10.140.  
Further down the band, at 10134, there were stations calling and 
working the DXPedition to Tunisia (3V8SS). 3V8SS was working split and 
listening up.  Further up the band, PY7AZ in Brazil was calling CQ.  
FM5AA from Martinique was also in there calling CQ as was PZ5RA from 
Surinam. All in all, a good night on 30M RTTY.

73
Russ WA3FRP
From larryradio at att.net  Thu May 22 11:30:23 2008
From: larryradio at att.net (larryradio@att.net)
Date: Fri May 23 08:11:08 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] DTE & DCE on a modem
References: <763553.5265.qm@web50003.mail.re2.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <005001c8bc20$c116c750$6401a8c0@dell3000>

Thank you all.

Indeed, it does have the 25 pin female connector.  That information you've 
sent is great....never could have moved forward without that.

Many thanks again to all for great input.  These units are on ePay for $5 
ea.  I found the list for something around $280 on several Black Box sites.

lar
K2JIA
www.antiquetelephone.com

From larryradio at worldnet.att.net  Fri May 23 09:53:18 2008
From: larryradio at worldnet.att.net (Larry Tighe)
Date: Fri May 23 10:04:03 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] HAL CT2200 Communications Terminal - eBay (item
	180244366887 end time May-23-08 20:02:00 PDT)
Message-ID: <000201c8bcdc$5f292c60$2000a8c0@ljt>

Maybe some folks missed this Hal listing as it didn't say "teletype".

Seems like a bargain at 99 cents


http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=180244366887&ssPageName=STRK:MEWA:PIC&ih=008 

From ghenry at halcomm.com  Fri May 23 10:04:38 2008
From: ghenry at halcomm.com (Bill Henry)
Date: Fri May 23 10:15:01 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] HAL CT2200 Communications Terminal - eBay
	(item 180244366887 end time May-23-08 20:02:00 PDT)
In-Reply-To: <000201c8bcdc$5f292c60$2000a8c0@ljt>
References: <000201c8bcdc$5f292c60$2000a8c0@ljt>
Message-ID: <6.1.0.6.2.20080523090404.0242e720@mail.halcomm.com>

Keep reading - "not working"  "no power supply"  - BOAT ANCHOR!

At 09:53 AM 5/23/2008 -0400, Larry Tighe wrote:
>Maybe some folks missed this Hal listing as it didn't say "teletype".
>
>Seems like a bargain at 99 cents
>
>
>http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=180244366887&ssPageName=STRK:MEWA:PIC&ih=008 
>
>_______________________________________________
>GreenKeys mailing list
>GreenKeys@mailman.qth.net
>http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys

From larryradio at worldnet.att.net  Fri May 23 10:06:17 2008
From: larryradio at worldnet.att.net (Larry Tighe)
Date: Fri May 23 10:16:55 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] HAL CT2200 Communications Terminal - eBay (item
	180244366887 end time May-23-08 20:02:00 PDT)
References: <000201c8bcdc$5f292c60$2000a8c0@ljt>
	<6.1.0.6.2.20080523090404.0242e720@mail.halcomm.com>
Message-ID: <029501c8bcde$2e42caf0$2000a8c0@ljt>

Yes but......

Our guys can make anything work.....again  :>)

lar
----- Original Message ----- 

 Keep reading - "not working"  "no power supply"  - BOAT ANCHOR!
 
Maybe some folks missed this Hal listing as it didn't say "teletype".

Seems like a bargain at 99 cents



From eugene at hertzmail.com  Sat May 24 14:26:40 2008
From: eugene at hertzmail.com (eugene@hertzmail.com)
Date: Sat May 24 14:37:25 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] DTE etc
In-Reply-To: <005401c8bb8b$999e5d40$5888fea9@dwilegal>
Message-ID: <15FF713354AB044F80212306D8035A1002AF2C4F@mse12be2.mse12.exchange.ms>

I am likely wrong, but I recall DTE/DCE as Data Terminal Equipment (the
thing a person uses) and Data Communications Equipment (like a modem).

A DTE connected to a DCE requires a straight through cable (pin 1 to pin
1, etc)

Two DTEs connected together require a NULL Modem cable which puts Tx of
one device onto the Rx of the other and vice versa.

Eugene


-----Original Message-----
From: greenkeys-bounces@mailman.qth.net
[mailto:greenkeys-bounces@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of WB6BLV Central
California
Sent: Wednesday, May 21, 2008 5:41 PM
To: GreenKeys@mailman.qth.net
Subject: [GreenKeys] DTE etc

RS-232 (Recommended Standard 232) is a standard for serial binary data
signals connecting between a DTE (Data terminal equipment) and a DCE
(Data
Circuit-terminating Equipment).

(According to the book RS-232 Connection, the 'standard' is not
necessarily
followed by many manufacturers, so some DTE and DCE devices may or may
not
function as one would expect from reading the 'standard'.)

John
WB6BLV@inreach.com

_______________________________________________
GreenKeys mailing list
GreenKeys@mailman.qth.net
http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
From nerd at verizon.net  Sat May 24 14:38:23 2008
From: nerd at verizon.net (Peter Gottlieb)
Date: Sat May 24 14:49:44 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] DTE etc
In-Reply-To: <15FF713354AB044F80212306D8035A1002AF2C4F@mse12be2.mse12.exchange.ms>
References: <15FF713354AB044F80212306D8035A1002AF2C4F@mse12be2.mse12.exchange.ms>
Message-ID: <4838609F.6070507@verizon.net>

"Circuit terminating" and "Communications" are equivalent in this context.

While it is true not all manufacturers follow the spec, most do, and you 
are correct in regards to when you need a straight through vs. null 
modem cable.  Think of it this way:  The original basic system consisted 
of a serial comm device (TTY or equivalent), a modem, some 
interconnecting channel, another modem, and another serial 
communications device.  If you want to connect two TTYs together, you 
need a cable to act like the modems, hence, a "null modem."  This is 
necessary due to the TTYs always sending on one pin and hence they would 
conflict, and both receiving pins connected together would receive 
nothing.  In the comm network there is a reversal where data received on 
one port is transmitted on another.  The null modem cable thus acts like 
the entire comm network.

The devil is in the details, which I spend years tearing my hair out 
over in the design of X.25 packet systems and asynchronous Front End 
Processors.  Fortunately, never again.

Peter



eugene@hertzmail.com wrote:
> I am likely wrong, but I recall DTE/DCE as Data Terminal Equipment (the
> thing a person uses) and Data Communications Equipment (like a modem).
>
> A DTE connected to a DCE requires a straight through cable (pin 1 to pin
> 1, etc)
>
> Two DTEs connected together require a NULL Modem cable which puts Tx of
> one device onto the Rx of the other and vice versa.
>
> Eugene
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: greenkeys-bounces@mailman.qth.net
> [mailto:greenkeys-bounces@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of WB6BLV Central
> California
> Sent: Wednesday, May 21, 2008 5:41 PM
> To: GreenKeys@mailman.qth.net
> Subject: [GreenKeys] DTE etc
>
> RS-232 (Recommended Standard 232) is a standard for serial binary data
> signals connecting between a DTE (Data terminal equipment) and a DCE
> (Data
> Circuit-terminating Equipment).
>
> (According to the book RS-232 Connection, the 'standard' is not
> necessarily
> followed by many manufacturers, so some DTE and DCE devices may or may
> not
> function as one would expect from reading the 'standard'.)
>
> John
> WB6BLV@inreach.com
>
> _______________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> GreenKeys@mailman.qth.net
> http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> _______________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> GreenKeys@mailman.qth.net
> http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
>
>   
From jhhaynes at earthlink.net  Sat May 24 14:46:55 2008
From: jhhaynes at earthlink.net (Jim Haynes)
Date: Sat May 24 14:57:45 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] DTE etc
In-Reply-To: <15FF713354AB044F80212306D8035A1002AF2C4F@mse12be2.mse12.exchange.ms>
References: <15FF713354AB044F80212306D8035A1002AF2C4F@mse12be2.mse12.exchange.ms>
Message-ID: <alpine.LFD.1.10.0805241341190.4538@Frances>



On Sat, 24 May 2008, eugene@hertzmail.com wrote:

> I am likely wrong, but I recall DTE/DCE as Data Terminal Equipment (the
> thing a person uses) and Data Communications Equipment (like a modem).
>
> A DTE connected to a DCE requires a straight through cable (pin 1 to pin
> 1, etc)
>
> Two DTEs connected together require a NULL Modem cable which puts Tx of
> one device onto the Rx of the other and vice versa.
>
Right.  Now another factor is that the RS-232 spec applies strictly to
a connector mounted on the modem (data set) and the cable end coming
from the DTE ("business machine").  When there is a connector on the
DTE itself, as on the back panel of a computer, that isn't covered by
the standard.  PCs are all the same, but for DTE in general you'll
find all kinds of variations in the gender of the connector and in the
pin assignments.  Back when I was involved with CRT terminals we had
to make quite a variety of different cables to connect the terminal to
a modem or to a computer.


From w6icm at 4fast.net  Sat May 24 15:08:44 2008
From: w6icm at 4fast.net (w6icm)
Date: Sat May 24 15:19:51 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] KSM
Message-ID: <483867BC.60905@4fast.net>

Printing KSM, solid on 8Mhz.
S9 plus 20, using 40 m dipole.
Dovetron, Model 28.

73
Ozzie, w6icm


From ddillman at igc.org  Sat May 24 15:30:05 2008
From: ddillman at igc.org (Richard Dillman)
Date: Sat May 24 15:40:46 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] KSM
Message-ID: <9782540.1211657405124.JavaMail.root@mswamui-cedar.atl.sa.earthlink.net>


>Printing KSM, solid on 8Mhz.
>S9 plus 20, using 40 m dipole.
>Dovetron, Model 28.

Excellent.  We're using a Model 28 here at the receive station to monitor the RTTY transmission from the Bolinas transmitting station.

RD

=================================
Richard Dillman, W6AWO
Chief Operator, Coast Station KSM
Maritime Radio Historical Society
http://www.radiomarine.org
=================================
From radiounity at sbcglobal.net  Sun May 25 08:32:04 2008
From: radiounity at sbcglobal.net (John Duggan)
Date: Sun May 25 08:42:49 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] My new love
Message-ID: <27462.59564.qm@web82303.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Hi to the Group

Is there supposed to be a plastic part that covers the
hammer that strikes the type box on a M28, I think
that I remember term "Peckerhead"?, also the type box
is marked RS, I'm thing to figure out the history of
this machine, I've been trying to send Gil some
pictures of Her, but they bounce, any help?

73 DE John KG6EOT
NN NN
From k9tty at dls.net  Sun May 25 13:05:35 2008
From: k9tty at dls.net (Don Robert House)
Date: Sun May 25 13:16:22 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] My new love
In-Reply-To: <27462.59564.qm@web82303.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
References: <27462.59564.qm@web82303.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <1887B584-CC3E-43B0-96FF-960FB0C70F34@dls.net>

No plastic, just the hammer that hits the pallets.  No attachments are  
allowed on Greenkeys
I will send you some images once I get time.  It is my wife's  
birthday... so gotta go!!!

Don


On 25 May 2008, at 7:32 AM, John Duggan wrote:

Hi to the Group

Is there supposed to be a plastic part that covers the
hammer that strikes the type box on a M28, I think
that I remember term "Peckerhead"?, also the type box
is marked RS, I'm thing to figure out the history of
this machine, I've been trying to send Gil some
pictures of Her, but they bounce, any help?

73 DE John KG6EOT
NN NN
_______________________________________________
GreenKeys mailing list
GreenKeys@mailman.qth.net
http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys

From rmcconne at lightlink.com  Sun May 25 13:19:56 2008
From: rmcconne at lightlink.com (Bob McConnell)
Date: Sun May 25 13:31:53 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] My new love
In-Reply-To: <1887B584-CC3E-43B0-96FF-960FB0C70F34@dls.net>
References: <27462.59564.qm@web82303.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<1887B584-CC3E-43B0-96FF-960FB0C70F34@dls.net>
Message-ID: <48399FBC.80906@lightlink.com>

Don Robert House wrote:
> No plastic, just the hammer that hits the pallets.  No attachments are 
> allowed on Greenkeys
> I will send you some images once I get time.  It is my wife's 
> birthday... so gotta go!!!
> 
> Don

Hey Don,

Give her our best wishes for a very happy birthday and many more. You 
can add your own hugs and kisses.

Bob McConnell
N2SPP

From RLAAG at pacbell.net  Sun May 25 13:28:51 2008
From: RLAAG at pacbell.net (RLAAG@pacbell.net)
Date: Sun May 25 13:39:39 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] My new love
In-Reply-To: <48399FBC.80906@lightlink.com>
References: <27462.59564.qm@web82303.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<1887B584-CC3E-43B0-96FF-960FB0C70F34@dls.net>
	<48399FBC.80906@lightlink.com>
Message-ID: <052520081728.8503.4839A1D3000B1DF60000213722218801869B0A02D204040A0D0C0E9FBFB9BEBEB4AD@att.net>


 
 YES ...  A VERY HAPPY BIRTHDAY TO HER DON...



 -------------- Original message from Bob McConnell <rmcconne@lightlink.com>: --------------


> Don Robert House wrote:
> > No plastic, just the hammer that hits the pallets.  No attachments are 
> > allowed on Greenkeys
> > I will send you some images once I get time.  It is my wife's 
> > birthday... so gotta go!!!
> > 
> > Don
> 
> Hey Don,
> 
> Give her our best wishes for a very happy birthday and many more. You 
> can add your own hugs and kisses.
> 
> Bob McConnell
> N2SPP
> 
> _______________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> GreenKeys@mailman.qth.net
> http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys  
From k9tty at dls.net  Sun May 25 15:07:45 2008
From: k9tty at dls.net (Don Robert House)
Date: Sun May 25 15:18:35 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] Re: His new love, my old love...
In-Reply-To: <48399FBC.80906@lightlink.com>
References: <27462.59564.qm@web82303.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<1887B584-CC3E-43B0-96FF-960FB0C70F34@dls.net>
	<48399FBC.80906@lightlink.com>
Message-ID: <DD51605D-6975-4568-BC00-882D84AC940B@dls.net>

THANKS Bob,

I just sent an image to John Duggan.

We had a nice birthday lunch and my son is bringing over our grand-dog  
for a small celebration.
No hugs and kisses as I am doing the chemo cream again on my arms for  
the next three weeks.
Makes me feel like a leper but it is better than letting these skin  
cells go cancerous.  It is a lot less painful than last summer on my  
face.

I have lots of these print carriage parts thanks to Jim Haynes, so if  
any Greenkeyers need them I will be happy to share.  Actually I have
more than my share of M15, 19, 28 and 35 mechanical parts so ask  
away.  Teletype part numbers and / or images are helpful in locating.

BTW,  I can send no messages to ITTY nor to W7TTY.  All of my messages  
bounce from his server.  Has anyone been able to send to George?

73,
Don
K9TTY




On 25 May 2008, at 12:19 PM, Bob McConnell wrote:

Don Robert House wrote:
> No plastic, just the hammer that hits the pallets.  No attachments  
> are allowed on Greenkeys
> I will send you some images once I get time.  It is my wife's  
> birthday... so gotta go!!!
> Don

Hey Don,

Give her our best wishes for a very happy birthday and many more. You  
can add your own hugs and kisses.

Bob McConnell
N2SPP


From k9tty at dls.net  Sun May 25 16:50:41 2008
From: k9tty at dls.net (Don Robert House)
Date: Sun May 25 17:01:33 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] Print Hammers needed...
Message-ID: <2049F978-AFFA-4443-83C8-9B4CB3D2BB7A@dls.net>

Byron,

George Hutchison, W7TTY is the only person who has made a substitute  
print hammer for a reperforator.  The difficulty as I recall is making  
the square hole in the center of the Delrin.

Jim Swanberg, aka the Riceguy, found a company willing to make both  
the 32, 33, and 38 print hammers and the 28, 35, and 37 reperf hammers.
but the up front  $600. tooling cost was too high for us.  Three of us  
came up with $100. each but it was obviously not enough.

By the way I met George Dean the other day who is a long time RTTY  
fellow.  He was not aware of ITTY nor GREENKEYS.

He told me about a Mini-ASR (an ASR without the tape reader) that he  
once owned that was built for Extended Binary Coded Decimal  
Interchange Code (EBCDIC)
I am trying to remember if this would be a Model 29 or Model 34.   
Perhaps Jim Haynes remembers...

73,

Don
K9TTY
From k9tty at dls.net  Sun May 25 16:55:44 2008
From: k9tty at dls.net (Don Robert House)
Date: Sun May 25 17:06:33 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] Second Try to send this message... OT but important
Message-ID: <05DEBCA4-6603-4EE0-AA95-5CE64E48BB38@dls.net>

Friends,

Thanks to those of you that have expressed good wishes for my latest
skin treatment.
So far, on my arms, this cream has been a walk in the park.  The
problem with the face treatment is all of those tiny little nerve
endings.

The sooner you go through the face treatment the better it will be.
Expect the worst pain and anything less will be welcome.
Also make sure that your doctor prescribes a good pain medication up
front.  I waited way too long to ask for the medication.
The Tylenol 3 helped me through the last week.

Do not put off the treatment too long.  One of our Greenkeyers, Vern
Schroeder, died in 2006 from skin cancer on his face.
Multiple melanomas are not something you want to happen to your skin.
I miss Vern, he was one of the good guys.

Sorry to post this off topic, but hopefully it will help someone, and
not irritate too many of you.

Don
From comcents at bellsouth.net  Sun May 25 17:13:51 2008
From: comcents at bellsouth.net (Randy or Sherry Guttery)
Date: Sun May 25 17:24:43 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] Second Try to send this message... OT but important
In-Reply-To: <05DEBCA4-6603-4EE0-AA95-5CE64E48BB38@dls.net>
References: <05DEBCA4-6603-4EE0-AA95-5CE64E48BB38@dls.net>
Message-ID: <4839D68F.1080709@bellsouth.net>

Don Robert House wrote:

> Sorry to post this off topic, but hopefully it will help someone, and
> not irritate too many of you.

Don:

While I readily admit the following could easily be considered pot 
calling kettle black (being responsible for an occasional out-burst my 
self from time-to-time): Anyone that is more "concerned" about the 
"purity" of Greenkeys than the well-being of their fellow hobbiest - 
should just go take a long BM (providing ample time to reflect on what's 
important in this world); get on with their life and leave the rest of 
us in peace.

As usual - the above is just my .02
-- 
randy guttery

A Tender Tale - a page dedicated to those Ships and Crews
so vital to the United States Silent Service:
http://tendertale.com
From comcents at bellsouth.net  Sun May 25 17:20:54 2008
From: comcents at bellsouth.net (Randy or Sherry Guttery)
Date: Sun May 25 17:31:46 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] Second Try to send this message... OT but important
In-Reply-To: <4839D68F.1080709@bellsouth.net>
References: <05DEBCA4-6603-4EE0-AA95-5CE64E48BB38@dls.net>
	<4839D68F.1080709@bellsouth.net>
Message-ID: <4839D836.8060900@bellsouth.net>

Randy or Sherry Guttery wrote:


> ...Anyone that is more "concerned" about the 
> "purity" of Greenkeys than the well-being of their fellow hobbiest...

> As usual - the above is just my .02

Oooops - the above wasn't intended for the list (shoulda paid more 
attention to the "To:/CC:" stuff)---  but then again...

best regards... and everyone (even the grumps) have a great Memorial Day 
Weekend (and take a moment to remember "the Greatest Generation" Vets... 
I read yesterday we're loosing roughly 1000 a DAY... We owe those men 
and women a lot!)

still just my .02
-- 
randy guttery

A Tender Tale - a page dedicated to those Ships and Crews
so vital to the United States Silent Service:
http://tendertale.com
From k8ary at yahoo.com  Sun May 25 18:01:43 2008
From: k8ary at yahoo.com (Jim Plummer)
Date: Sun May 25 18:12:31 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] M28 Keyboard Part Needed
Message-ID: <903606.27031.qm@web53712.mail.re2.yahoo.com>

I am really starting to get into this 28 ASR refurbishment.? I find that I?could use a 2nd work bench and more room...?maybe at the next QTH.? I did discover that the keyboard cover, part #151325, is cracked.? Does anyone have a spare they are willing to part with?
?
de Jim
Jim Plummer, P.E.
(Cell) 704.860.6589?(Best Way)
(Home) 704.263.5870, k8ary@yahoo.com
(Work) 704.834.2809, plummerj@gmh.org
114 Medallion Ct., Gastonia, NC 28056
Facts do not cease to exist because they are ignored.?


      
From jhhaynes at earthlink.net  Sun May 25 18:22:49 2008
From: jhhaynes at earthlink.net (Jim Haynes)
Date: Sun May 25 18:33:47 2008
Subject: EBCDIC (was Re: [GreenKeys] Print Hammers needed...)
In-Reply-To: <2049F978-AFFA-4443-83C8-9B4CB3D2BB7A@dls.net>
References: <2049F978-AFFA-4443-83C8-9B4CB3D2BB7A@dls.net>
Message-ID: <alpine.LFD.1.10.0805251722180.2931@Frances>



On Sun, 25 May 2008, Don Robert House wrote:
>
> He told me about a Mini-ASR (an ASR without the tape reader) that he once 
> owned that was built for Extended Binary Coded Decimal Interchange Code 
> (EBCDIC)
> I am trying to remember if this would be a Model 29 or Model 34.  Perhaps Jim 
> Haynes remembers...
>
This is unknown to me.  Model 29 was basically a six-level Model 28,
which is to say a 64 character set, tho there may have been seven or
eight levels used to transmit it.  It was originally developed, I'm told,
to replace the Model 20 in Teletypesetter service, but nobody wanted
to buy them.  So it then turned up in a BCD coded version that was
supposedly for internal Bell System use only, as Teletype and Bell did
not want to support any one computer company's code to the exclusion
of any other.  I also saw some ASR keyboards, and perhaps there were
printers to go with them, that were in Fieldata code.  This was a code
the military was trying to standardize on and was a precursor to ASCII.

It seems likely that a Model 35 or 37 could be made to do a subset of
EBCDIC, just by arranging the type box and some of the stunt box
parts.

My understanding is that Model 34 was applied to a Model 28 in Model 35
cabinetry - whether any were built I don't know.

It seems farfetched that Teletype would have made an EBCDIC machine,
since the Bell System was so strongly committed to seeing ASCII
succeed in competition with EBCDIC.  But assuming it was easy to do
by typebox rearrangement, I suppose a third party could have done it,
or Teletype could have done it.


From k9tty at dls.net  Sun May 25 18:43:45 2008
From: k9tty at dls.net (Don Robert House)
Date: Sun May 25 18:54:37 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] M28 Keyboard Part Needed
In-Reply-To: <903606.27031.qm@web53712.mail.re2.yahoo.com>
References: <903606.27031.qm@web53712.mail.re2.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <C21F1453-C6B7-4F0E-A239-D40B09C1DAF7@dls.net>

I might Jim,
I have to put together what I have and see if I can come up with a  
spare.  A good alternative is the use of JB Weld.  It will fix  
anything but a broken heart.

Don
K9TTY


On 25 May 2008, at 5:01 PM, Jim Plummer wrote:

I am really starting to get into this 28 ASR refurbishment.  I find  
that I could use a 2nd work bench and more room... maybe at the next  
QTH.  I did discover that the keyboard cover, part #151325, is  
cracked.  Does anyone have a spare they are willing to part with?

de Jim
Jim Plummer, P.E.
(Cell) 704.860.6589 (Best Way)
(Home) 704.263.5870, k8ary@yahoo.com
(Work) 704.834.2809, plummerj@gmh.org
114 Medallion Ct., Gastonia, NC 28056
Facts do not cease to exist because they are ignored.



_______________________________________________
GreenKeys mailing list
GreenKeys@mailman.qth.net
http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys

From mmacleod at iinet.net.au  Sun May 25 22:46:26 2008
From: mmacleod at iinet.net.au (Malcolm Macleod)
Date: Mon May 26 00:12:13 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] Introduction - And Looking for Sagem TX20 information
Message-ID: <00d901c8beda$b48a4e50$6602a8c0@inspiron700m>

Greetings,

 

I am new to your list.  It is great to see such an active list for these
lovely old machines.

 

I have a couple of old teleprinters (Models 15 and 100) put away for future
restoration, but my short-term project involves a Sagem TX20 Telex machine I
acquired here recently in Melbourne, Australia.  I am interested in driving
it with a microcontroller board to effectively create a telex simulator
(basically a simulator that can exchange messages between the TX20 and a
locally-connected PC).  I want the simulator to be capable of
generating/decoding the original dialing, negotiation and answer-back
protocols etc, as well as the exchange of data.

 

My first challenge though is getting information about both the interfacing
_and_ day-to-day use of the TX20.  Does anyone know of any relevant
resources that may be available on the web relating either specifically to
the TX20, or to the FSK/PSTN telex interface generally?  If possible, my
plan is to build an interface that connects directly to the TX20's modem
(possibly using an old PC external modem in a direct-connect loop?).  If
that is technically too complicated, I am hoping it might be possible to
connect to a current-loop interface within the TX20 (if it exists!).

 

Any thoughts? In particular, are the Telex mark/space frequencies compatible
with those used in PC external modems?  If they are not compatible, how
complicated is it to decode the frequencies by using a PLL detector driven
from a 600 ohm isolation transformer on a local loop?

 

Malcolm.

 

From k9tty at dls.net  Mon May 26 00:13:16 2008
From: k9tty at dls.net (Don Robert House)
Date: Mon May 26 00:24:06 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] Introduction - And Looking for Sagem TX20 information
In-Reply-To: <00d901c8beda$b48a4e50$6602a8c0@inspiron700m>
References: <00d901c8beda$b48a4e50$6602a8c0@inspiron700m>
Message-ID: <A93F87A3-D4EE-438D-88B5-C2E64ECF274D@dls.net>

Malcolm,

I do not think we have many Greenkeyers here in the States with the  
experience you need.  However, the list members in the Britain and  
Germany may be able to help.
Of course the time difference may slow a reply.

Good luck,

Don - K9TTY
Currently in Ringwood, Illinois USA
US Central Daylight Time Zone


On 25 May 2008, at 9:46 PM, Malcolm Macleod wrote:

Greetings,



I am new to your list.  It is great to see such an active list for these
lovely old machines.



I have a couple of old teleprinters (Models 15 and 100) put away for  
future
restoration, but my short-term project involves a Sagem TX20 Telex  
machine I
acquired here recently in Melbourne, Australia.  I am interested in  
driving
it with a microcontroller board to effectively create a telex simulator
(basically a simulator that can exchange messages between the TX20 and a
locally-connected PC).  I want the simulator to be capable of
generating/decoding the original dialing, negotiation and answer-back
protocols etc, as well as the exchange of data.



My first challenge though is getting information about both the  
interfacing
_and_ day-to-day use of the TX20.  Does anyone know of any relevant
resources that may be available on the web relating either  
specifically to
the TX20, or to the FSK/PSTN telex interface generally?  If possible, my
plan is to build an interface that connects directly to the TX20's modem
(possibly using an old PC external modem in a direct-connect loop?).  If
that is technically too complicated, I am hoping it might be possible to
connect to a current-loop interface within the TX20 (if it exists!).



Any thoughts? In particular, are the Telex mark/space frequencies  
compatible
with those used in PC external modems?  If they are not compatible, how
complicated is it to decode the frequencies by using a PLL detector  
driven
from a 600 ohm isolation transformer on a local loop?



Malcolm.



_______________________________________________
GreenKeys mailing list
GreenKeys@mailman.qth.net
http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys

From wa7duy at charter.net  Mon May 26 00:55:40 2008
From: wa7duy at charter.net (Jim Pruitt)
Date: Mon May 26 01:06:37 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] Need help identifying an interface
Message-ID: <240f01c8beec$bf1a4bb0$6401a8c0@PRUITT1>

Some time back I picked up a piece of "rtty" gear on ebay.  It is actually a
TOR interface of some type as the 2716 eprom is labeled "TOR Mk 2".

Would anyone have any information on this item and where it might have
appeared in print (if it did)?  It used a 6800 series  cpu.  Needless to say
there was no documentation and not all jacks are labeled but this is what is
known:
The front panel has four push-button switches, labeled BR, BA, BB, and BC.
Underneath those are two toggle switches labeled SP and LC.    The top row
of small LEDs is labeled CO, TL, ER, RQ, and TC, while the bottom row is
labeled ID, CH, PH, SB, and EN.    The toggle switch on the far right is
labeled PWR, and the larger LED above it comes on when the power is switched
on.

The back panel has a grounding terminal next to the fuseholder.    On the
right is a four pin connector (purpose unknown) with 3 pins hooked up and
one is 12v coming from the regulator and one pin also going to the RO RCA
jack.    Under that is a single RCA phono jack, unlabeled.    Under that are
three more phono jacks, labeled FI, (no label), and RO.    The BNC connector
is labeled 1024 KHZ.

On the plug-in perf board inside are three rows of IC's.    The top row of
IC's is B2716 (with a paper label on it that says TOR MKII), HM6116LP-3, two
555's, and 74LS10N .    The middle row is SN74LS138N, HD74LS00P, HEF4020BP,
and  SN7404N.    The bottom row is HD46802P / HD6802P, 6821, and DM8842N /
QM7442P5.

I am sure that is probably a lot of superfulous info but if anyone
recognizes it I would appreciate a heads up.

Thank you.

Jim Pruitt

From wb6blv at inreach.com  Mon May 26 01:03:54 2008
From: wb6blv at inreach.com (WB6BLV  Central California)
Date: Mon May 26 01:14:49 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] TX20
Message-ID: <004a01c8beed$e677da00$5888fea9@dwilegal>

Aussie site with a little info and a 'contact' link:

http://www.telemuseum.org/Teleprinter.html

perhaps somebody at that site can assist you with tech info on the TX20

John
From dd1lm at t-online.de  Tue May 27 01:25:38 2008
From: dd1lm at t-online.de (Andreas =?iso-8859-15?q?M=FCller?=)
Date: Tue May 27 01:42:16 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] Introduction - And Looking for Sagem TX20 information
In-Reply-To: <00d901c8beda$b48a4e50$6602a8c0@inspiron700m>
References: <00d901c8beda$b48a4e50$6602a8c0@inspiron700m>
Message-ID: <200805270725.38936.dd1lm@t-online.de>

Hi Malcolm,
if you want to use your teleprinters, you might have a look at the telexphone 
project on www.teleprinter.net. As far as I remember, there are already 
Australian members.
Regards
Andreas

Am Montag, 26. Mai 2008 04:46 schrieb Malcolm Macleod:
> Greetings,
>
>
>
> I am new to your list.  It is great to see such an active list for these
> lovely old machines.
>
>
>
> I have a couple of old teleprinters (Models 15 and 100) put away for future
> restoration, but my short-term project involves a Sagem TX20 Telex machine
> I acquired here recently in Melbourne, Australia.  I am interested in
> driving it with a microcontroller board to effectively create a telex
> simulator (basically a simulator that can exchange messages between the
> TX20 and a locally-connected PC).  I want the simulator to be capable of
> generating/decoding the original dialing, negotiation and answer-back
> protocols etc, as well as the exchange of data.
>
>
>
> My first challenge though is getting information about both the interfacing
> _and_ day-to-day use of the TX20.  Does anyone know of any relevant
> resources that may be available on the web relating either specifically to
> the TX20, or to the FSK/PSTN telex interface generally?  If possible, my
> plan is to build an interface that connects directly to the TX20's modem
> (possibly using an old PC external modem in a direct-connect loop?).  If
> that is technically too complicated, I am hoping it might be possible to
> connect to a current-loop interface within the TX20 (if it exists!).
>
>
>
> Any thoughts? In particular, are the Telex mark/space frequencies
> compatible with those used in PC external modems?  If they are not
> compatible, how complicated is it to decode the frequencies by using a PLL
> detector driven from a 600 ohm isolation transformer on a local loop?
>
>
>
> Malcolm.
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> GreenKeys@mailman.qth.net
> http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
From larryradio at worldnet.att.net  Tue May 27 09:29:50 2008
From: larryradio at worldnet.att.net (Larry Tighe)
Date: Tue May 27 09:40:48 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] Einstein was correct
Message-ID: <005701c8bffd$bd968ad0$2000a8c0@ljt>

The wireless telegraph is not difficult to understand. The ordinary 
telegraph is like a very long cat. You pull the tail in New York, and it 
meows in Los Angeles. The wireless is the same, only without the cat.

Albert Einstein 


Larry 
K2JIA
www.antiquetelephone.com
From Til128 at aol.com  Tue May 27 16:56:50 2008
From: Til128 at aol.com (Til128@aol.com)
Date: Tue May 27 17:08:04 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] Gear help needed please
Message-ID: <d2c.2be93e7c.356dcf92@aol.com>

Hi gang!
The gorillas at the  post office have gone above and beyond their official 
duties of destruction and  surpassed the UPS and FedEx combined in order to 
destroy a fiber gear on a  reperf that I have sent to the great Rice for repair. 
They must have run a truck  over it for this kind of damage.
I am asking the group if there  is a spare fibre gear out there for this 
machine. (It goes on my RT set  reperf.)
The gear was broken to the extent that we are guessing  at the number. It is 
either 159701 OR 158701.
Any help in locating  this gear would be greatly appreciated.

73,
DE Tom Tillson
All  things electromechanical.
ITTY
HeavyMetal
LL TTY
NNNN  




**************Get trade secrets for amazing burgers. Watch "Cooking with 
Tyler Florence" on AOL Food.      
(http://food.aol.com/tyler-florence?video=4&?NCID=aolfod00030000000002)
From larryradio at worldnet.att.net  Tue May 27 19:02:54 2008
From: larryradio at worldnet.att.net (Larry Tighe)
Date: Tue May 27 19:14:07 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] CV-483
Message-ID: <002701c8c04d$ccfd0d50$0200a8c0@LARRYTIGHE>

Got my second CV-483 today from eBay...worked great.  Now to hook it up for 
diversity.  Looks pretty simple to do.

Anyone running a pair in diversity these days?  W1AW comes thru so strong 
here in NJ on 80 meters, there's seldom a fade.

What's the procedure for diversity....receive on 40 and 80 or receive on 80 
with two different antennae?  I suspect the latter.


Larry
K2JIA
www.antiquetelephone.com 

From paulpenn at knology.net  Tue May 27 19:31:01 2008
From: paulpenn at knology.net (Paul A. Pennington)
Date: Tue May 27 19:42:10 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] CV-483
References: <002701c8c04d$ccfd0d50$0200a8c0@LARRYTIGHE>
Message-ID: <001601c8c051$b9d4bcb0$6401a8c0@A31PAUL>

    Larry;

    You have your choice:  frequency diversity or space diversity (two 
antennas some distance apart).  Hopefully, if one frequency or antenna takes 
a fade, the other will have a good signal.

    Paul Pennington
    Augusta, Georgia


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Larry Tighe" <larryradio@worldnet.att.net>
To: <greenKeys@mailman.qth.net>
Sent: Tuesday, May 27, 2008 7:02 PM
Subject: [GreenKeys] CV-483


> Got my second CV-483 today from eBay...worked great.  Now to hook it up 
> for diversity.  Looks pretty simple to do.
>
> Anyone running a pair in diversity these days?  W1AW comes thru so strong 
> here in NJ on 80 meters, there's seldom a fade.
>
> What's the procedure for diversity....receive on 40 and 80 or receive on 
> 80 with two different antennae?  I suspect the latter.
>
>
> Larry
> K2JIA
> www.antiquetelephone.com
> _______________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> GreenKeys@mailman.qth.net
> http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> 

From rmcconne at lightlink.com  Tue May 27 19:35:46 2008
From: rmcconne at lightlink.com (Bob McConnell)
Date: Tue May 27 19:48:02 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] CV-483
In-Reply-To: <002701c8c04d$ccfd0d50$0200a8c0@LARRYTIGHE>
References: <002701c8c04d$ccfd0d50$0200a8c0@LARRYTIGHE>
Message-ID: <483C9AD2.1070604@lightlink.com>

Larry Tighe wrote:
> Got my second CV-483 today from eBay...worked great.  Now to hook it up 
> for diversity.  Looks pretty simple to do.
> 
> Anyone running a pair in diversity these days?  W1AW comes thru so 
> strong here in NJ on 80 meters, there's seldom a fade.
> 
> What's the procedure for diversity....receive on 40 and 80 or receive on 
> 80 with two different antennae?  I suspect the latter.

Larry,

I'm stretching the memory cells here, but the basic idea the Navy taught 
me about diversity was to receive the same signal on two frequencies. 
The diversity units actually worked on signal strength. We set all 
receivers' output to 0 dBm, so when one faded, the other would still 
provided clean copy. It was very seldom that both would fade 
simultaneously. Although, if you weren't paying attention, the second 
might fade out after the first was long gone. You could also QSY one 
receiver while the other kept copying the signal. It was standard 
practice to keep two receivers up on the multi-channel broadcasts, which 
were commonly transmitted on five frequencies simultaneously. Diversity 
on single channel signals wasn't as common. Of course, it was relatively 
easy with synthesized receivers locked to a stable frequency standard. 
The R-1051B was the most common HF receiver of that era in the tin-can 
service.

Bob McConnell
N2SPP
Ex-RM2, NFIT 1970-74, NLM 74-77
From brooke at pacific.net  Tue May 27 19:52:08 2008
From: brooke at pacific.net (Brooke Clarke)
Date: Tue May 27 20:02:59 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] CV-483
In-Reply-To: <002701c8c04d$ccfd0d50$0200a8c0@LARRYTIGHE>
References: <002701c8c04d$ccfd0d50$0200a8c0@LARRYTIGHE>
Message-ID: <483C9EA8.9030102@pacific.net>

Hi Larry:

Reading the theory for the BR MD-1142 HF modem that in band fades occur 
differently for frequency offsets of a few kHz.  The BR modem uses combined 
multiple tones and time offsets for a very redundant transmission.
http://www.prc68.com/I/MD1142.shtml

So I think you will get the best results tuning to the band that has the 
strongest signal and using two different antennas (either separated by distance 
or polarization).

Have Fun,

Brooke Clarke
http://www.prc68.com/P/Prod.html  Products I make and sell
http://www.prc68.com/Alpha.shtml  All my web pages listed based on html name
http://www.PRC68.com
http://www.precisionclock.com
http://www.prc68.com/I/WebCam2.shtml 24/7 Sky-Weather-Astronomy Web Cam

Larry Tighe wrote:
> Got my second CV-483 today from eBay...worked great.  Now to hook it up 
> for diversity.  Looks pretty simple to do.
> 
> Anyone running a pair in diversity these days?  W1AW comes thru so 
> strong here in NJ on 80 meters, there's seldom a fade.
> 
> What's the procedure for diversity....receive on 40 and 80 or receive on 
> 80 with two different antennae?  I suspect the latter.
> 
> 
> Larry
> K2JIA
> www.antiquetelephone.com
> _______________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> GreenKeys@mailman.qth.net
> http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> 
From herbert3 at centurytel.net  Tue May 27 23:24:28 2008
From: herbert3 at centurytel.net (Lee Mushel)
Date: Tue May 27 23:29:24 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] CV-483
References: <002701c8c04d$ccfd0d50$0200a8c0@LARRYTIGHE>
	<483C9AD2.1070604@lightlink.com>
Message-ID: <009001c8c072$58c1a6b0$0701a8c0@system1>

Gentlemen:

The possibility of having true dual diversity was what first attracted me to
Flex Radio's software defined products.   I am anxiously awaiting the
arrival of a second receiver for my Flex 5000A.  This should be fun!   You
might want to visit the Flex site to see a current commercial ham product
with the capability.

73

Lee K9WRU
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Bob McConnell" <rmcconne@lightlink.com>
To: "Larry Tighe" <larryradio@worldnet.att.net>
Cc: <greenKeys@mailman.qth.net>
Sent: Tuesday, May 27, 2008 6:35 PM
Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] CV-483


> Larry Tighe wrote:
> > Got my second CV-483 today from eBay...worked great.  Now to hook it up
> > for diversity.  Looks pretty simple to do.
> >
> > Anyone running a pair in diversity these days?  W1AW comes thru so
> > strong here in NJ on 80 meters, there's seldom a fade.
> >
> > What's the procedure for diversity....receive on 40 and 80 or receive on
> > 80 with two different antennae?  I suspect the latter.
>
> Larry,
>
> I'm stretching the memory cells here, but the basic idea the Navy taught
> me about diversity was to receive the same signal on two frequencies.
> The diversity units actually worked on signal strength. We set all
> receivers' output to 0 dBm, so when one faded, the other would still
> provided clean copy. It was very seldom that both would fade
> simultaneously. Although, if you weren't paying attention, the second
> might fade out after the first was long gone. You could also QSY one
> receiver while the other kept copying the signal. It was standard
> practice to keep two receivers up on the multi-channel broadcasts, which
> were commonly transmitted on five frequencies simultaneously. Diversity
> on single channel signals wasn't as common. Of course, it was relatively
> easy with synthesized receivers locked to a stable frequency standard.
> The R-1051B was the most common HF receiver of that era in the tin-can
> service.
>
> Bob McConnell
> N2SPP
> Ex-RM2, NFIT 1970-74, NLM 74-77
> _______________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> GreenKeys@mailman.qth.net
> http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
>
>


From k1lky at earthlink.net  Wed May 28 09:49:56 2008
From: k1lky at earthlink.net (Roy Morgan)
Date: Wed May 28 10:01:15 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] CV-483
In-Reply-To: <483C9AD2.1070604@lightlink.com>
References: <002701c8c04d$ccfd0d50$0200a8c0@LARRYTIGHE>
	<483C9AD2.1070604@lightlink.com>
Message-ID: <6303B4A4-A785-4847-A30A-A4302EE4C7A6@earthlink.net>


On May 27, 2008, at 7:35 PM, Bob McConnell wrote:

> ...t the basic idea the Navy taught me about diversity was to  
> receive the same signal on two frequencies.... The R-1051B was the  
> most common HF receiver of that era in the tin-can service.


As mentioned:

Frequency diversity:  receive two or more frequencies carrying the  
same information. Combine and/or choose the stronger one.

Space Diversity:  Use two or more antennas on the same frequency,  
preferably 500 or more feet apart.  You can't do that on a destroyer  
("tin can"), which may be about 300-500 feet long.  They may have been  
able to do it on carriers (800 to 1200 feet long) with the side  
mounted vertical antennas commonly used on them.

The combine/choose function could be carried out between two receivers  
by letting the one with the stronger signal "turn down the gain" on  
the one with the weaker signal (tie the AGC lines together).  Or it  
could be done at the decoded signal level by using the stronger of two  
signals in a comparator, as in the URA-8 or similar.

I would guess that there is polarization diversity, where  
horizontally- and vertically-polarized antennas are used, possibly at  
the same location or even the same antenna structure.  Maybe the  
cubical quad antenna acts this way.

Roy


Roy Morgan
k1lky@earthlink.net
Lovettsville, VA 20180



From lobasa at bellsouth.net  Wed May 28 09:58:08 2008
From: lobasa at bellsouth.net (lobasa)
Date: Wed May 28 10:09:13 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] MITE Teleprinter
Message-ID: <004301c8c0ca$dc37a460$6101a8c0@JamesTanton>

Hi. Gang,
    I have had very few responses from my last letter to the 
Greenkeys Group.  One in the south both of us emailed for 
about a week and they wouldn't give a price and ask me to 
suggest a price.   I haven't heard from him since.  Another
wanted a high price for the manual, when I can get a Navy
version TT-299 manual for half his offer.
  I even went to another site, but they suggested Greenkeys
would be my best bet.  
  So I am asking for the last time does anyone seriously want
to sell a MITE Teleprinter?  If not I'll will drop the subject.
  I worked on them back in the 70's and enjoyed the MITE.
If I acquire one I will take good care of it.  
                                 Thanks in advance,
                                 James Tanton
             
From k1lky at earthlink.net  Wed May 28 11:58:26 2008
From: k1lky at earthlink.net (Roy Morgan)
Date: Wed May 28 12:09:57 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] CV-483
In-Reply-To: <009001c8c072$58c1a6b0$0701a8c0@system1>
References: <002701c8c04d$ccfd0d50$0200a8c0@LARRYTIGHE>
	<483C9AD2.1070604@lightlink.com>
	<009001c8c072$58c1a6b0$0701a8c0@system1>
Message-ID: <EE3CFB4A-0511-49B2-8E44-BB4DD95EEF4F@earthlink.net>


On May 27, 2008, at 11:24 PM, Lee Mushel wrote:

> Gentlemen:
>
> The possibility of having true dual diversity was what first  
> attracted me to
> Flex Radio's software defined products.

Lee,

Is that where the radio is run by a computer and is quite small and  
has no tubes at all and no knobs whatsoever?  I've heard of that sort  
of thing.

It will be easier for me here to get two tube type receivers going and  
a couple of antennas.  R-390A's, a vertical and a long wire maybe.

Maybe in the future I'll get one of those modern things.  -:)

Roy

Roy Morgan
k1lky@earthlink.net
Lovettsville, VA 20180



From wjneill at consolidated.net  Wed May 28 12:14:14 2008
From: wjneill at consolidated.net (William J. Neill)
Date: Wed May 28 12:25:30 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] CV-483
In-Reply-To: <EE3CFB4A-0511-49B2-8E44-BB4DD95EEF4F@earthlink.net>
References: <002701c8c04d$ccfd0d50$0200a8c0@LARRYTIGHE>
	<483C9AD2.1070604@lightlink.com>
	<009001c8c072$58c1a6b0$0701a8c0@system1>
	<EE3CFB4A-0511-49B2-8E44-BB4DD95EEF4F@earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <969E9EC0-1829-4F47-A43A-0C1189D7E54D@consolidated.net>

FWIW, there are three types of diversity operation, as previously  
speculated upon.

USAF Training Projects Publication T-5-12-I dated January 25, 1955,  
describes (1) frequency, (2) space, and (3) polarization.

Here at home, running two AN/FRR-38's, I go with whatever I can find  
and my application of space diversity is basically two GI 25-foot  
whips about 100 feet apart.  I find very little frequency diversity  
operation these days simply because of the negligible amount of RTTY  
traffic out there in the netherworld.

Bill Neill
Conroe, Texas

On May 28, 2008, at 10:58 AM, Roy Morgan wrote:

>
> On May 27, 2008, at 11:24 PM, Lee Mushel wrote:
>
>> Gentlemen:
>>
>> The possibility of having true dual diversity was what first  
>> attracted me to
>> Flex Radio's software defined products.
>
> Lee,
>
> Is that where the radio is run by a computer and is quite small and  
> has no tubes at all and no knobs whatsoever?  I've heard of that  
> sort of thing.
>
> It will be easier for me here to get two tube type receivers going  
> and a couple of antennas.  R-390A's, a vertical and a long wire maybe.
>
> Maybe in the future I'll get one of those modern things.  -:)
>
> Roy
>
> Roy Morgan
> k1lky@earthlink.net
> Lovettsville, VA 20180
From herbert3 at centurytel.net  Wed May 28 12:32:17 2008
From: herbert3 at centurytel.net (Lee Mushel)
Date: Wed May 28 12:37:31 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] CV-483
References: <002701c8c04d$ccfd0d50$0200a8c0@LARRYTIGHE>
	<483C9AD2.1070604@lightlink.com>
	<009001c8c072$58c1a6b0$0701a8c0@system1>
	<EE3CFB4A-0511-49B2-8E44-BB4DD95EEF4F@earthlink.net>
	<969E9EC0-1829-4F47-A43A-0C1189D7E54D@consolidated.net>
Message-ID: <003001c8c0e0$6a66fa00$0701a8c0@system1>

There's a bit more to dual diversity than just having two receivers.   As
you might expect, signals are "acted upon" differently because of slight
path changes and so forth so some phase compensation is needed.   As far as
computers are concerned I guess all I can say is that if you fear or avoid
them you are missing a really great addition to ham radio.   I can honestly
say I get as much pleasure from my Software Defined Radios as I do from my
teletype machines---I value and enjoy them both!  Bill, Roy, since I have
your email addresses I will try to send you some pics.

73

Lee
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "William J. Neill" <wjneill@consolidated.net>
To: "Roy Morgan" <k1lky@earthlink.net>
Cc: "Lee Mushel" <herbert3@centurytel.net>; <greenKeys@mailman.qth.net>
Sent: Wednesday, May 28, 2008 11:14 AM
Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] CV-483


> FWIW, there are three types of diversity operation, as previously
> speculated upon.
>
> USAF Training Projects Publication T-5-12-I dated January 25, 1955,
> describes (1) frequency, (2) space, and (3) polarization.
>
> Here at home, running two AN/FRR-38's, I go with whatever I can find
> and my application of space diversity is basically two GI 25-foot
> whips about 100 feet apart.  I find very little frequency diversity
> operation these days simply because of the negligible amount of RTTY
> traffic out there in the netherworld.
>
> Bill Neill
> Conroe, Texas
>
> On May 28, 2008, at 10:58 AM, Roy Morgan wrote:
>
> >
> > On May 27, 2008, at 11:24 PM, Lee Mushel wrote:
> >
> >> Gentlemen:
> >>
> >> The possibility of having true dual diversity was what first
> >> attracted me to
> >> Flex Radio's software defined products.
> >
> > Lee,
> >
> > Is that where the radio is run by a computer and is quite small and
> > has no tubes at all and no knobs whatsoever?  I've heard of that
> > sort of thing.
> >
> > It will be easier for me here to get two tube type receivers going
> > and a couple of antennas.  R-390A's, a vertical and a long wire maybe.
> >
> > Maybe in the future I'll get one of those modern things.  -:)
> >
> > Roy
> >
> > Roy Morgan
> > k1lky@earthlink.net
> > Lovettsville, VA 20180
>
>


From weeksh at wildblue.net  Wed May 28 16:25:38 2008
From: weeksh at wildblue.net (Howard Weeks)
Date: Wed May 28 16:35:30 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] MITE Teleprinter
In-Reply-To: <004301c8c0ca$dc37a460$6101a8c0@JamesTanton>
References: <004301c8c0ca$dc37a460$6101a8c0@JamesTanton>
Message-ID: <483D8782.9344.114D81@weeksh.wildblue.net>

James,

I do not have one.

On 28 May 2008 at 8:58, lobasa wrote:

> Hi. Gang,
>     I have had very few responses from my last letter to the 
> Greenkeys Group.  One in the south both of us emailed for 
> about a week and they wouldn't give a price and ask me to 
> suggest a price.   I haven't heard from him since.  Another
> wanted a high price for the manual, when I can get a Navy
> version TT-299 manual for half his offer.
>   I even went to another site, but they suggested Greenkeys
> would be my best bet.  
>   So I am asking for the last time does anyone seriously want
> to sell a MITE Teleprinter?  If not I'll will drop the subject.
>   I worked on them back in the 70's and enjoyed the MITE.
> If I acquire one I will take good care of it.  
>                                  Thanks in advance,
>                                  James Tanton
>              
> _______________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> GreenKeys@mailman.qth.net
> http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys


Howard Weeks
Harlem, GA 
K5JCP
From k9tty at dls.net  Wed May 28 22:18:06 2008
From: k9tty at dls.net (Don Robert House)
Date: Wed May 28 22:29:19 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] 
	Gears, Pinions, belts, and Sprockets M14, 15, 19, 20, 28, 35
Message-ID: <8EA89F62-C237-4FBC-BF3C-EAA99ABEA6E9@dls.net>

Tom and George,

I have gone through all of my parts here and separated all of the  
gears, sprockets, belts, and pinions.
Over the last two days I have inventoried these, of which there are  
well over 200.
I do not have the Gear, Fiber 158701 that I was hoping to find for you  
both.

I am putting together a database in Excel and will sort both by part  
number and by description.
As with any inventory there are a few mysteries.  One fiber gear has a  
large hole in the center like a donut with no number.
Another group of fiber gears have only the number of teeth and no part  
number.
Three have no markings whatsoever.  I will try to include images of  
the mystery gears at the end of the listing.

When I finish I will make copies available to whoever would like one.   
The listing will be in Excel and also in PDF.
Please do not ask for a copy until I finish the project and announce  
it's availability.

73,
Don K9TTY

From k9tty at dls.net  Thu May 29 00:47:21 2008
From: k9tty at dls.net (Don Robert House)
Date: Thu May 29 00:58:30 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] 	Gears, Pinions, belts, and Sprockets M14, 15, 19, 20,
	28, 35
In-Reply-To: <483E2D19.1060903@bellsouth.net>
References: <8EA89F62-C237-4FBC-BF3C-EAA99ABEA6E9@dls.net>
	<483E2D19.1060903@bellsouth.net>
Message-ID: <F478ABA0-AD07-44A9-9E29-1A18C3F9BB5F@dls.net>

It is not on my list.

I will keep a lookout for the number.
Don


On 28 May 2008, at 11:12 PM, Randy or Sherry Guttery wrote:

Don Robert House wrote:

> As with any inventory there are a few mysteries.

I have one; though this should be easy for someone that can look it up  
(sure isn't in my M28 book, though!)...  Teletype P/N 163459.  I  
*thought* it was an input (driven) gear for a 28 mainshaft... but I  
also *thought* that all input gears were 60 tooth/ 26 pitch ... and  
this gear "isn't".

Anyone know what it is?

Thanks!
-- 
randy guttery

A Tender Tale - a page dedicated to those Ships and Crews
so vital to the United States Silent Service:
http://tendertale.com

From w7tty at readysetsurf.com  Thu May 29 09:08:01 2008
From: w7tty at readysetsurf.com (George B. Hutchison)
Date: Thu May 29 09:19:12 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] ITTY SHUTDOWN
Message-ID: <000301c8c18d$06b0d1e0$0201a8c0@MAINCOMP>

GreenKeyers - - -

ITTY has been shutdown until after Bill gets back from his vacation.

Something has happened to the scheduler I cannot determine and cannot 
get home
during the week to investigate.

Y'all have a nice vacation,as well.

W7TTY


From radiounity at sbcglobal.net  Thu May 29 11:44:01 2008
From: radiounity at sbcglobal.net (John Duggan)
Date: Thu May 29 11:55:26 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] Oddball 28?
Message-ID: <403692.11933.qm@web82302.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Hi to all,

My new love is already becoming a pain!, everything I
have learned about 28's over the years don't add up,
broken and/or missing parts aside, the LESU is a type
30, it has 2 TD's, now here's the strange part, the
inboard one appears to have a parallel output, inboard
TD marked LX3, outboard is a LXD4, could this machine
been used to punch cards? (I found a small sliver of a
card in the bottom, looks 5 level, not IBM for sure).

Also this machine has a 3/4 inch cable terminated with
a large Winchester connector (75 pin), any help?

73 DE John KG6EOT

From duncanancy at earthlink.net  Thu May 29 12:14:51 2008
From: duncanancy at earthlink.net (Duncan M. Brown)
Date: Thu May 29 12:24:39 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] "Mystery" M28D
Message-ID: <380-220085429161451308@earthlink.net>

 
The AWA Museum has been offered a Teletype model "28D".  In looking on the
Internet for info on a "D" model (never heard of it before), the only place
I found any detail about it is on Nick's Virhistory site
http://www.virhistory.com/ham/rtty-05.htm  where he asks about it.  
 
Nick has pictures & differences on the above site, so I won't repeat it
here.  Anyone Know what it's modifications were for??
 
Thanks, 
 
Duncan Brown, K2OEQ
 
Chief TTY operator & repairman
AWA Electronic Communication Museum
http://www.antiquewireless.org/
 
 


From comcents at bellsouth.net  Thu May 29 14:38:36 2008
From: comcents at bellsouth.net (Randy or Sherry Guttery)
Date: Thu May 29 14:49:50 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] "Mystery" M28D
In-Reply-To: <380-220085429161451308@earthlink.net>
References: <380-220085429161451308@earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <483EF82C.4030104@bellsouth.net>

Duncan M. Brown wrote:
>  
> The AWA Museum has been offered a Teletype model "28D".  In looking on the
> Internet for info on a "D" model (never heard of it before), the only place
> I found any detail about it is on Nick's Virhistory site
> http://www.virhistory.com/ham/rtty-05.htm  where he asks about it.  
>  
> Nick has pictures & differences on the above site, so I won't repeat it
> here.  Anyone Know what it's modifications were for??

No, but I do have a couple of observations - he notes the keyboard drive 
gear is 26 teeth vs. 20 - As some may have read - I just asked about a 
strange main-shaft gear that was 66 teeth vs. 60 - (which Jerry Murphy 
identified as the input (driven) gear for a 7.00 machine (vs. 7.42)) and 
the keyboard drive gear common with that is indeed a 66 tooth gear. 
Likely then, that this mod is for a military machine (since they seemed 
to be the primary 7.00 vs. 7.42 code customer).

Considering the mod on the spacing wheel appears to be "indexed" roughly 
in "spaces" - and tabs can be set at various horizontal locations which 
operate a lever - it looks suspiciously like a horizontal tabbing unit.

just my .02...
-- 
randy guttery

A Tender Tale - a page dedicated to those Ships and Crews
so vital to the United States Silent Service:
http://tendertale.com
From k9tty at dls.net  Thu May 29 19:15:57 2008
From: k9tty at dls.net (Don Robert House)
Date: Thu May 29 19:27:11 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] "Mystery" M28D
In-Reply-To: <380-220085429161451308@earthlink.net>
References: <380-220085429161451308@earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <79681DC8-D571-42F1-87F8-998DCA63D203@dls.net>

28D is the plain jane friction feed typing unit. When you open the  
cover of the machine it is the first tag you see.
This designation has nothing to do with the rest of the machine.

Don
K9TTY


On 29 May 2008, at 11:14 AM, Duncan M. Brown wrote:


The AWA Museum has been offered a Teletype model "28D".  In looking on  
the
Internet for info on a "D" model (never heard of it before), the only  
place
I found any detail about it is on Nick's Virhistory site
http://www.virhistory.com/ham/rtty-05.htm  where he asks about it.

Nick has pictures & differences on the above site, so I won't repeat it
here.  Anyone Know what it's modifications were for??

Thanks,

Duncan Brown, K2OEQ

Chief TTY operator & repairman
AWA Electronic Communication Museum
http://www.antiquewireless.org/




_______________________________________________
GreenKeys mailing list
GreenKeys@mailman.qth.net
http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys

From gil at baudot.net  Thu May 29 20:25:15 2008
From: gil at baudot.net (gil smith)
Date: Thu May 29 20:36:34 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] moderator will be away
Message-ID: <6.1.2.0.2.20080529172129.029421e0@mail.vauxelectronics.com>

Hi folks:

I will be gone until sometime late Tuesday at cub scout camp, and will not 
have email access for any greenkeys stuff until then.  If something doesn't 
post or whatever, please don't worry about it until I get back.

thanks,

gil




Vaux Electronics, Inc.
480-354-5556
(fax: 480-354-5558)
www.vauxelectronics.com


From w7tty at readysetsurf.com  Fri May 30 01:25:52 2008
From: w7tty at readysetsurf.com (George B. Hutchison)
Date: Fri May 30 01:37:09 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] Oddball 28?
References: <403692.11933.qm@web82302.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <003f01c8c215$a0fe9600$0201a8c0@MAINCOMP>

John - - -

The machine you have was part of the Air Force's Autodin System - 
AUTODIN being an anacronym for "Automatic Digital Network". The 
machines were owned by the government but were serviced by Western 
Union.

Around the time that the famous "Mouse" 28's were being made 
available to California (and ultimately nationwide) amateurs, Western 
Union had seven of those machines sitting in their shop in San 
Francisco. They wanted them very badly for the parts, but could not 
dismantle them because of the governmental ownership.

By some magic quirk of fate it was decided that those machines should 
go to radio amateurs, and it was my privelage to be able to go to San 
Francisco and scarf all of them.

When the mouse machines were distributed via the moving company hired 
to transport them all over the U.S., those hams around the country 
who wanted to pay the extra freight had one loaded on the moving vans 
with their name on it. Five of them went around the country, and I 
kept two for myself.

If the machine is complete, there is a five-level with edge-notching 
LARP parallel reperforator under the dome.

The large cable with the Winchester connector was the means whereby 
the machines were connected to the cryptographic equipment.

Note that the inboard tape reader, a parallel-reading teletype model 
LX3, has the five bit-sensing pins one would normally find, plus 
there is a sixth sense pin which was used to sense a notch in the 
edge of the tape. I believe the tape was notched in the event that 
there was a discarded/incorrect character in the tape which was to be 
discarded.

The dual-headed TD was geared for only 100 speed. To my knowledge 
there were never any gears for any other speed manufactured for them. 
You cannot ordinarily use regular TD gears as they would run the TD 
shafts in reverse, and that would not be nice!

The LARP perforator ran at 200 WPM, and was parallel fed by six 
magnets (One for the notch), and the clutch magnet which when tripped 
caused the perf cam to make a half-revolution, as these units had 
dual stop clutches in them.

You have indeed a rarie!.

Of the two I kept I gave one to a friend in Mount Shasta, California, 
who ultimately took it to the dump many years ago.

The other resides in a little ham shack on the North Kitsap 
Peninsula, here in Washington state.

George - W7TTY


From k8mtr at yahoo.com  Fri May 30 10:02:40 2008
From: k8mtr at yahoo.com (Mark T. Regan, K8MTR)
Date: Fri May 30 10:14:44 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] OT: Why typewriters beat computers
Message-ID: <003f01c8c25d$d34264f0$79c72ed0$@com>

While not exactly about teletypes, this news article is about its cousin, the typewriter.

===============

They're clunky, dirty and can't access the internet, yet every year thousands of people buy typewriters when they could probably
afford a computer. Why?

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/magazine/7427237.stm 

73s,

Mark, K8MTR



From Telegrapher at att.net  Fri May 30 20:21:16 2008
From: Telegrapher at att.net (Telegrapher@att.net)
Date: Fri May 30 20:32:37 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] CV-483
In-Reply-To: <969E9EC0-1829-4F47-A43A-0C1189D7E54D@consolidated.net>
References: <002701c8c04d$ccfd0d50$0200a8c0@LARRYTIGHE>
	<483C9AD2.1070604@lightlink.com>
	<009001c8c072$58c1a6b0$0701a8c0@system1>
	<EE3CFB4A-0511-49B2-8E44-BB4DD95EEF4F@earthlink.net>
	<969E9EC0-1829-4F47-A43A-0C1189D7E54D@consolidated.net>
Message-ID: <053120080021.3925.484099FC0008722D00000F5522230703629B0A02D29B9B0EBF9D0A089F0E9D090A040AAB@att.net>


 
 Well there might be more Freq. diversity stuff that you realize.  It's just not copyable cause it's Mil or coded stuff of some sort..  I used to watch and listen on a couple different freq's at the same time.  Same sounding info including the stop for id and traffic breaks.  Amateur wise or otherwise commercial, don't know where you'd find anything like that.  

Larry
W0OGH

 -------------- Original message from "William J. Neill" <wjneill@consolidated.net>: --------------


> FWIW, there are three types of diversity operation, as previously  
> speculated upon.
> 
> USAF Training Projects Publication T-5-12-I dated January 25, 1955,  
> describes (1) frequency, (2) space, and (3) polarization.
> 
> Here at home, running two AN/FRR-38's, I go with whatever I can find  
> and my application of space diversity is basically two GI 25-foot  
> whips about 100 feet apart.  I find very little frequency diversity  
> operation these days simply because of the negligible amount of RTTY  
> traffic out there in the netherworld.
> 
> Bill Neill
> Conroe, Texas
> 
> On May 28, 2008, at 10:58 AM, Roy Morgan wrote:
> 
> >
> > On May 27, 2008, at 11:24 PM, Lee Mushel wrote:
> >
> >> Gentlemen:
> >>
> >> The possibility of having true dual diversity was what first  
> >> attracted me to
> >> Flex Radio's software defined products.
> >
> > Lee,
> >
> > Is that where the radio is run by a computer and is quite small and  
> > has no tubes at all and no knobs whatsoever?  I've heard of that  
> > sort of thing.
> >
> > It will be easier for me here to get two tube type receivers going  
> > and a couple of antennas.  R-390A's, a vertical and a long wire maybe.
> >
> > Maybe in the future I'll get one of those modern things.  -:)
> >
> > Roy
> >
> > Roy Morgan
> > k1lky@earthlink.net
> > Lovettsville, VA 20180
> _______________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> GreenKeys@mailman.qth.net
> http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys  
From larryradio at worldnet.att.net  Fri May 30 20:43:55 2008
From: larryradio at worldnet.att.net (Larry Tighe)
Date: Fri May 30 20:55:26 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] CV-483
References: <002701c8c04d$ccfd0d50$0200a8c0@LARRYTIGHE><483C9AD2.1070604@lightlink.com><009001c8c072$58c1a6b0$0701a8c0@system1><EE3CFB4A-0511-49B2-8E44-BB4DD95EEF4F@earthlink.net><969E9EC0-1829-4F47-A43A-0C1189D7E54D@consolidated.net>
	<053120080021.3925.484099FC0008722D00000F5522230703629B0A02D29B9B0EBF9D0A089F0E9D090A040AAB@att.net>
Message-ID: <002301c8c2b7$6a943280$0200a8c0@LARRYTIGHE>

Right Lar.   My only diversity will be W1AW these days.  There's virtually 
nothing out there anymore.  That's what's making it so damn hard for me to 
stay in the 50's/60's.

I'm getting a bit weary of waiting for this transistor//computer-fad to end 
so we can get back to tubes and relays.

I punched the entire ARRL transmission tonite so I can run that tape into my 
66 WPM TD and exercise my RCA Model 15's.  I resist changing the gears to 60 
'cause I'm stuck on originality :>)

I used a Model 28 reperf rather than fire up the ASR tonite.  Gotta exercise 
all the gear so as to keep it in shape for when they come back into common 
worldwide use.  Don't you agree?

lar
K2JIA


Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] CV-483


>
>
> Well there might be more Freq. diversity stuff that you realize.  It's 
> just not copyable cause it's Mil or coded stuff of some sort..  I used to 
> watch and listen on a couple different freq's at the same time.  Same 
> sounding info including the stop for id and traffic breaks.  Amateur wise 
> or otherwise commercial, don't know where you'd find anything like that.
>
> Larry
> W0OGH

From wjneill at consolidated.net  Fri May 30 21:00:14 2008
From: wjneill at consolidated.net (William J. Neill)
Date: Fri May 30 21:11:36 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] CV-483
In-Reply-To: <002301c8c2b7$6a943280$0200a8c0@LARRYTIGHE>
References: <002701c8c04d$ccfd0d50$0200a8c0@LARRYTIGHE><483C9AD2.1070604@lightlink.com><009001c8c072$58c1a6b0$0701a8c0@system1><EE3CFB4A-0511-49B2-8E44-BB4DD95EEF4F@earthlink.net><969E9EC0-1829-4F47-A43A-0C1189D7E54D@consolidated.net>
	<053120080021.3925.484099FC0008722D00000F5522230703629B0A02D29B9B0EBF9D0A089F0E9D090A040AAB@att.net>
	<002301c8c2b7$6a943280$0200a8c0@LARRYTIGHE>
Message-ID: <41075DE7-2459-4B0D-99DC-DDCEA3A6B60E@consolidated.net>

" . . . get back to tubes and relays."  Like, uh, are you alluding to  
technologies that don't use vacuum tubes?  Did I miss some epochal  
revelation over the past 40 years?

Having learned to telegraph at age 19 so that I could work as a  
telegrapher for the M-K-T RR in North Texas, I fear I may be stuck in  
some kind of time warp.  Does that mean my telegraph sounders, Model  
15s, and R-390s are obsolete?  Should I chuck them for whatever  
newfangled stuff is being used?

Bill Neill

On May 30, 2008, at 7:43 PM, Larry Tighe wrote:

> Right Lar.   My only diversity will be W1AW these days.  There's  
> virtually nothing out there anymore.  That's what's making it so  
> damn hard for me to stay in the 50's/60's.
>
> I'm getting a bit weary of waiting for this transistor//computer- 
> fad to end so we can get back to tubes and relays.
>
> I punched the entire ARRL transmission tonite so I can run that  
> tape into my 66 WPM TD and exercise my RCA Model 15's.  I resist  
> changing the gears to 60 'cause I'm stuck on originality :>)
>
> I used a Model 28 reperf rather than fire up the ASR tonite.  Gotta  
> exercise all the gear so as to keep it in shape for when they come  
> back into common worldwide use.  Don't you agree?
>
> lar
> K2JIA
>
>
> Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] CV-483
>
>>
>> Well there might be more Freq. diversity stuff that you realize.   
>> It's just not copyable cause it's Mil or coded stuff of some  
>> sort..  I used to watch and listen on a couple different freq's at  
>> the same time.  Same sounding info including the stop for id and  
>> traffic breaks.  Amateur wise or otherwise commercial, don't know  
>> where you'd find anything like that.
>>
>> Larry
>> W0OGH
From k1lky at earthlink.net  Fri May 30 22:05:57 2008
From: k1lky at earthlink.net (Roy Morgan)
Date: Fri May 30 22:18:07 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] CV-483
In-Reply-To: <41075DE7-2459-4B0D-99DC-DDCEA3A6B60E@consolidated.net>
References: <002701c8c04d$ccfd0d50$0200a8c0@LARRYTIGHE><483C9AD2.1070604@lightlink.com><009001c8c072$58c1a6b0$0701a8c0@system1><EE3CFB4A-0511-49B2-8E44-BB4DD95EEF4F@earthlink.net><969E9EC0-1829-4F47-A43A-0C1189D7E54D@consolidated.net>
	<053120080021.3925.484099FC0008722D00000F5522230703629B0A02D29B9B0EBF9D0A089F0E9D090A040AAB@att.net>
	<002301c8c2b7$6a943280$0200a8c0@LARRYTIGHE>
	<41075DE7-2459-4B0D-99DC-DDCEA3A6B60E@consolidated.net>
Message-ID: <26D96DA3-AEFD-4072-90C5-6728128D7AF4@earthlink.net>


On May 30, 2008, at 9:00 PM, William J. Neill wrote
:... I fear I may be stuck in some kind of time warp.  Does that mean  
my telegraph sounders, Model 15s, and R-390s are obsolete?  Should I  
chuck them for whatever newfangled stuff is being used?

Yes, indeed. And to make the transition less difficult, I'll trade you  
a nice nearly 20 year old solly state transceiver for all them ole'  
R-390's and the other junk.

HAH!

Roy

Roy Morgan
k1lky@earthlink.net
Lovettsville, VA 20180



From herbert3 at centurytel.net  Sat May 31 09:33:48 2008
From: herbert3 at centurytel.net (Lee Mushel)
Date: Sat May 31 09:38:55 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] CV-483
References: <002701c8c04d$ccfd0d50$0200a8c0@LARRYTIGHE><483C9AD2.1070604@lightlink.com><009001c8c072$58c1a6b0$0701a8c0@system1><EE3CFB4A-0511-49B2-8E44-BB4DD95EEF4F@earthlink.net><969E9EC0-1829-4F47-A43A-0C1189D7E54D@consolidated.net><053120080021.3925.484099FC0008722D00000F5522230703629B0A02D29B9B0EBF9D0A089F0E9D090A040AAB@att.net><002301c8c2b7$6a943280$0200a8c0@LARRYTIGHE><41075DE7-2459-4B0D-99DC-DDCEA3A6B60E@consolidated.net>
	<26D96DA3-AEFD-4072-90C5-6728128D7AF4@earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <001a01c8c322$f6509640$0701a8c0@system1>

You guys,

I really do wish I knew how to change people's minds where this thing we
call a computer is concerned.  There is no way I would part with any of the
components of my 1958 Novice station and that includes my very first
Heathkit, the AT-1.  And I've told you that when I look around my integrated
shack and see those old machines, fully functional, sitting there, my blood
pressure lowers by twenty points.  And while my original straight key (maybe
1955---it took me a while to get my ticket) is close by on the bench and
while I have never regretted for one second the money the Begali key cost
you have no idea how satisfying it was last night to sit with those monitors
in front of me and see two software programs controlling two pieces of
software defined radios (the Flex5000A and the SDR IQ) both displaying (but
not identically since they were connected to different antennas) the
spectrum in the neighborhood of 600 meters for the Lofer project!

I don't feel I've suffered in any way from making the transition from tuning
by rocking a knob to snapping to a signal I can see clearly with the click
of a mouse.  And when I note the powerful tools I now have at my disposal to
optimize signal quality I am certain that, at least for some of us, ham
radio is just as entertaining, exciting and valuable as ever.  Right now I
am in the process of making the transition from a principally AUDIO based
shack to one that is based on VISION.   Given the fact that none of us like
change, that may be a problem for a lot of people.  But my goal is to be
able to sit in my old contour chair, swivel out the two tables to bring the
mouse, keyboard and key into convenient position and then pivot the three
video displays down from the ceiling.   A really nice 32 inch and two 22
inch displays will enable me to do all my hamming, watch broadcast and
satellite TV, access the internet and sleep and never move---well other than
let the motor in that chair rotate me a few degrees!   My biggest problem is
getting the XYL to give me enough time to get this stuff done!   And I will
admit to disappointment that there is no room for a pug dog to sit on my
stomach.

73

Lee   K9WRU
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Roy Morgan" <k1lky@earthlink.net>
To: "William J. Neill" <wjneill@consolidated.net>
Cc: <greenKeys@mailman.qth.net>; <Telegrapher@att.net>
Sent: Friday, May 30, 2008 9:05 PM
Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] CV-483


>
> On May 30, 2008, at 9:00 PM, William J. Neill wrote
> :... I fear I may be stuck in some kind of time warp.  Does that mean
> my telegraph sounders, Model 15s, and R-390s are obsolete?  Should I
> chuck them for whatever newfangled stuff is being used?
>
> Yes, indeed. And to make the transition less difficult, I'll trade you
> a nice nearly 20 year old solly state transceiver for all them ole'
> R-390's and the other junk.
>
> HAH!
>
> Roy
>
> Roy Morgan
> k1lky@earthlink.net
> Lovettsville, VA 20180
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> GreenKeys@mailman.qth.net
> http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
>
>


From duncanancy at earthlink.net  Sat May 31 11:47:02 2008
From: duncanancy at earthlink.net (Duncan M. Brown)
Date: Sat May 31 11:57:00 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] "Mystery" M28D
Message-ID: <380-22008563115471998@earthlink.net>

Thanks to everyone who responded to my query on "Mystery M28D". (Most of my
TTY experience has been with Kleinschmidts.)  I'm learning that some of
these model number labels can be quite confusing and there are lots of
different flavors of  the "model 28." 

"Model 28D" was the "only" label that the guy saw when he checked it out. 
We will be getting this M28 (and a M33) in the next week or two and then we
will know for sure what we have.

As far as strange labeling goes, the Museum has what I would call a "Model
28 Perforator". Standard M28 keyboard and motor; all it does is punch tape
(has a neat vacuum cleaner run by the motor to suck up the chad into the
chad bin).  The label on the chassis identifies it as a "LKPE 500BSF".  But
the label on the outside of the cover says "Teletype Corporation  Model
34/35"

Who is confused??

Have fun,

Duncan Brown, K2OEQ

Chief TTY operator & repairman
AWA Electronic Communication Museum
http://www.antiquewireless.org/


>
>  How does he know its a "D?  that info would be stamped ontoa lable on
the keyboard bas unit.  Doesn't mean it's a D.  Just uses that base wiring
arrangement.
>
> larry
> W0OGH

>
> 28D is the plain jane friction feed typing unit. When you open the  
> cover of the machine it is the first tag you see.
> This designation has nothing to do with the rest of the machine.
>
> Don
> K9TTY
>
>


From jhhaynes at earthlink.net  Sat May 31 12:04:35 2008
From: jhhaynes at earthlink.net (Jim Haynes)
Date: Sat May 31 12:16:17 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] "Mystery" M28D
In-Reply-To: <380-22008563115471998@earthlink.net>
References: <380-22008563115471998@earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <alpine.LFD.1.10.0805311052370.2859@localhost.localdomain>


On Sat, 31 May 2008, Duncan M. Brown wrote:

> As far as strange labeling goes, the Museum has what I would call a "Model
> 28 Perforator". Standard M28 keyboard and motor; all it does is punch tape
> (has a neat vacuum cleaner run by the motor to suck up the chad into the
> chad bin).  The label on the chassis identifies it as a "LKPE 500BSF".  But
> the label on the outside of the cover says "Teletype Corporation  Model
> 34/35"
>
Various machines made by Teletype have those letter-number codes on them.
Everything starting with L is Model 28/29/34/35.  So a typing unit is LP-
something, and the 8-level ones are LP-8xx.  Maybe later on they decided
that 5-level stuff should have a leading 5 in the number; that was after
my time.  The letters after the first are kinda mnemonic, but you can't
always predict them.
LP is a printer
LK is a keyboard
LAC is an apparatus cabinet
LAAC is an apparatus cabinet for the ASR set
LESU is an electrical service unit
LPW is a paper winder
LPR is a typing reperforator
LAK is a keyboard for the ASR set
LKPE is apparently a keyboard with a perforator
LXD, LAXD, LBXD, LCXD... are transmitter-distributors
LB is a base
LXB is a base for a transmitter-distributor (as are LAXB, LBXB, ...)
LARP is the multi-magnet parallel input reperforator, non-typing
and they go on and on.

Equipment made for the Bell System usually used the numbered models
so that's why the 28D typing unit.  (which is equivalent to LP-something)

The appearance of a 28D typing unit in the special machine you have is
surprising, suggests some previous owner may have substituted a Bell 
System typing unit for the original one.


From wjneill at consolidated.net  Sat May 31 13:01:06 2008
From: wjneill at consolidated.net (William J. Neill)
Date: Sat May 31 13:12:34 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] CV-483
In-Reply-To: <001a01c8c322$f6509640$0701a8c0@system1>
References: <002701c8c04d$ccfd0d50$0200a8c0@LARRYTIGHE><483C9AD2.1070604@lightlink.com><009001c8c072$58c1a6b0$0701a8c0@system1><EE3CFB4A-0511-49B2-8E44-BB4DD95EEF4F@earthlink.net><969E9EC0-1829-4F47-A43A-0C1189D7E54D@consolidated.net><053120080021.3925.484099FC0008722D00000F5522230703629B0A02D29B9B0EBF9D0A089F0E9D090A040AAB@att.net><002301c8c2b7$6a943280$0200a8c0@LARRYTIGHE><41075DE7-2459-4B0D-99DC-DDCEA3A6B60E@consolidated.net>
	<26D96DA3-AEFD-4072-90C5-6728128D7AF4@earthlink.net>
	<001a01c8c322$f6509640$0701a8c0@system1>
Message-ID: <C99CFF06-DE93-4D97-9FCB-90D843038EDB@consolidated.net>

Well, uh, lemme say this about that:

I use my iBook G4 primarily for exciting activities in graduate  
school, eBay, reading news on a global basis, and communicating with  
friends and unindicted co-conspirators.

When it comes to radio traffic, I wanna hear real radio with some  
QRM, I wanna see vacuum tubes glowing, I wanna see real cables  
running from and to the various ancillary equipment, I wanna hear the  
Teletype machines ka-chunking and have the floor vibrating at 60-,  
75-, and 100wpm oscillations, and listen to the electrical wiring in  
the walls humming at 60Hz.

Anything less might as well be the onset of an untimely death.  I  
don't like change.  I watched the railroad business go all to hell  
when the MBAs showed up and started managing operations with  
flowcharts and spreadsheets.  All things considered, I suppose I'm a  
21st Century Luddite.

Of course, I really don't have the faintest idea about how  
computerized nonsense works other than if it doesn't work, turn it  
off and turn it on.  If it doesn't fire up again, I thrash it with a  
spud wrench.  If it breaks, it needed replacement anyway.

Bill Neill
Conroe, People's Democratic Republic of Texas

On May 31, 2008, at 8:33 AM, Lee Mushel wrote:

> You guys,
>
> I really do wish I knew how to change people's minds where this  
> thing we
> call a computer is concerned.  There is no way I would part with  
> any of the
> components of my 1958 Novice station and that includes my very first
> Heathkit, the AT-1.  And I've told you that when I look around my  
> integrated
> shack and see those old machines, fully functional, sitting there,  
> my blood
> pressure lowers by twenty points.  And while my original straight  
> key (maybe
> 1955---it took me a while to get my ticket) is close by on the  
> bench and
> while I have never regretted for one second the money the Begali  
> key cost
> you have no idea how satisfying it was last night to sit with those  
> monitors
> in front of me and see two software programs controlling two pieces of
> software defined radios (the Flex5000A and the SDR IQ) both  
> displaying (but
> not identically since they were connected to different antennas) the
> spectrum in the neighborhood of 600 meters for the Lofer project!
>
> I don't feel I've suffered in any way from making the transition  
> from tuning
> by rocking a knob to snapping to a signal I can see clearly with  
> the click
> of a mouse.  And when I note the powerful tools I now have at my  
> disposal to
> optimize signal quality I am certain that, at least for some of us,  
> ham
> radio is just as entertaining, exciting and valuable as ever.   
> Right now I
> am in the process of making the transition from a principally AUDIO  
> based
> shack to one that is based on VISION.   Given the fact that none of  
> us like
> change, that may be a problem for a lot of people.  But my goal is  
> to be
> able to sit in my old contour chair, swivel out the two tables to  
> bring the
> mouse, keyboard and key into convenient position and then pivot the  
> three
> video displays down from the ceiling.   A really nice 32 inch and  
> two 22
> inch displays will enable me to do all my hamming, watch broadcast and
> satellite TV, access the internet and sleep and never move---well  
> other than
> let the motor in that chair rotate me a few degrees!   My biggest  
> problem is
> getting the XYL to give me enough time to get this stuff done!    
> And I will
> admit to disappointment that there is no room for a pug dog to sit  
> on my
> stomach.
>
> 73
>
> Lee   K9WRU
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Roy Morgan" <k1lky@earthlink.net>
> To: "William J. Neill" <wjneill@consolidated.net>
> Cc: <greenKeys@mailman.qth.net>; <Telegrapher@att.net>
> Sent: Friday, May 30, 2008 9:05 PM
> Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] CV-483
>
>
>>
>> On May 30, 2008, at 9:00 PM, William J. Neill wrote
>> :... I fear I may be stuck in some kind of time warp.  Does that mean
>> my telegraph sounders, Model 15s, and R-390s are obsolete?  Should I
>> chuck them for whatever newfangled stuff is being used?
>>
>> Yes, indeed. And to make the transition less difficult, I'll trade  
>> you
>> a nice nearly 20 year old solly state transceiver for all them ole'
>> R-390's and the other junk.
>>
>> HAH!
>>
>> Roy
>>
>> Roy Morgan
>> k1lky@earthlink.net
>> Lovettsville, VA 20180
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> GreenKeys mailing list
>> GreenKeys@mailman.qth.net
>> http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
>>
>>
>
>

From k9tty at dls.net  Sat May 31 20:06:43 2008
From: k9tty at dls.net (Don Robert House)
Date: Sat May 31 20:18:41 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] "Mystery" M28D
In-Reply-To: <380-22008563115471998@earthlink.net>
References: <380-22008563115471998@earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <143F1C61-98BC-447A-842F-3BBDF476DFCE@dls.net>

The Model 28 and 35 covers for perforators were the same.   
Interchangeable.

Don


On 31 May 2008, at 10:47 AM, Duncan M. Brown wrote:

Thanks to everyone who responded to my query on "Mystery M28D". (Most  
of my
TTY experience has been with Kleinschmidts.)  I'm learning that some of
these model number labels can be quite confusing and there are lots of
different flavors of  the "model 28."

"Model 28D" was the "only" label that the guy saw when he checked it  
out.
We will be getting this M28 (and a M33) in the next week or two and  
then we
will know for sure what we have.

As far as strange labeling goes, the Museum has what I would call a  
"Model
28 Perforator". Standard M28 keyboard and motor; all it does is punch  
tape
(has a neat vacuum cleaner run by the motor to suck up the chad into the
chad bin).  The label on the chassis identifies it as a "LKPE  
500BSF".  But
the label on the outside of the cover says "Teletype Corporation  Model
34/35"

Who is confused??

Have fun,

Duncan Brown, K2OEQ

Chief TTY operator & repairman
AWA Electronic Communication Museum
http://www.antiquewireless.org/


>
> How does he know its a "D?  that info would be stamped ontoa lable on
the keyboard bas unit.  Doesn't mean it's a D.  Just uses that base  
wiring
arrangement.
>
> larry
> W0OGH

>
> 28D is the plain jane friction feed typing unit. When you open the
> cover of the machine it is the first tag you see.
> This designation has nothing to do with the rest of the machine.
>
> Don
> K9TTY
>
>


_______________________________________________
GreenKeys mailing list
GreenKeys@mailman.qth.net
http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys

From larryradio at worldnet.att.net  Sat May 31 22:16:50 2008
From: larryradio at worldnet.att.net (Larry Tighe)
Date: Sat May 31 22:28:23 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] Back to the future
Message-ID: <005401c8c38d$8e35ba70$0200a8c0@LARRYTIGHE>

----- Original Message ----- 
From:
Sent: Saturday, May 31, 2008 22:10
Subject: Fw: RCA BTA-250M Broadcast Transmitter


See folks, this is what is waiting for us once the computer fad ends and we 
get back to real humming xfmrs, hot tubes and clattering machinery.  I 
wonder how to FSK that crystal.

lar
----- Original Message ----- 

Sent: Saturday, May 31, 2008 21:35
Subject: RCA BTA-250M Broadcast Transmitter


Hello Larry-

If it's appropriate, I would appreciate it if you would post the following 
eBay link to  a suitable amateur radio listserve. It is my understanding 
that hams are converting them for amateur radio service.

Thanks-

Steve Cichorsky

RCA BTA-250M Broadcast Transmitter            eBay Item number: 320258553472



From wa2hwj at att.net  Sat May 31 23:13:26 2008
From: wa2hwj at att.net (wa2hwj@att.net)
Date: Sat May 31 23:24:59 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] Greenkeyers, lend me your ears...
Message-ID: <060120080313.21923.484213D6000A816A000055A322243323629B0A02D29B9B0EBF069908CD0E99@att.net>

ZCZC

I am in need of a pair of rackmount side plates for a Dovetron. If anyone has
a rackmount Dovetron that they don't have mounted in a rack, I'd be happy
to trade a set of the "non-rackmount" side plates. The side plates are
interchangeable.

Thanks and 73,

Jack WA2HWJ/0

NNNN
From k1lky at earthlink.net  Sat May 31 23:13:44 2008
From: k1lky at earthlink.net (Roy Morgan)
Date: Sat May 31 23:25:28 2008
Subject: [GreenKeys] Back to the future
In-Reply-To: <005401c8c38d$8e35ba70$0200a8c0@LARRYTIGHE>
References: <005401c8c38d$8e35ba70$0200a8c0@LARRYTIGHE>
Message-ID: <CC17B3C8-C8C7-452D-90F2-A274FC9235F9@earthlink.net>


On May 31, 2008, at 10:16 PM, Larry Tighe wrote:
> RCA BTA-250M Broadcast Transmitter            eBay Item number:  
> 320258553472

Turns out that this thing is on the WEST coast of the US:
"... in Paso Robles, California. About half-way between L.A. and San  
Franscisco. "

Roy

Roy Morgan
k1lky@earthlink.net
Lovettsville, VA 20180



