[GreenKeys] Replying to Bob McConnell: Open Mouth - Insert Foot!

[NNN7DXB at aol.com]

Hi Bob McConnell:

Your reply in regard to the CommCenter-2.net Virtual Teletype circuit 
appears
to be laced with some inaccuracies, and in many instances, your comments
are unfair, a bit over the top, entirely untrue and have a somewhat
negative connotation to them. 

Perhaps we need to set the record straight here for the group and be
fair to Rod, who is the webmaster for CommCenter-2.net and the SYSOP
for several other diversified online web hosting services. I am the 
moderator
for CommCenter-1 and some other Signal groups. Others from both GreenKeys
and the CommCenter groups have had a hand in putting all of these 
activities
together for a common cause: for fun.

In that you have addressed your comments to the entire forum, I am
replying to you in kind forthwith....as I feel that "turnabout is fair 
play" too.

To begin with, the announcement in regard to CommCenter-2.net was for a
two-fold purpose, none of which were intended to be taken out of context,
nor with the intent of starting a food fight. Most of us who are on 
CommCenter-2
(or CommCenter-1, or CommCenter-5) are ALSO members of the GreenKeys
group, so I think in that regard, we share similar, and common, yet 
somewhat
different and varying interests.  

Rod sent the note to the GreenKeys folks as a COURTESY, and to INVITE one
and all to "take a look". That is, for those who are interested, primarily
with a view toward furthering our collective and joint interests in the old 
and
venerable teletype machines of generations past. The second reason was to
seek and invite former military communicators who might be interested, to
visit and join our military-communicators forum over on CommCenter-1 which
is on yahoogroups.com. The CommCenter groups provides an opportunity for
the CommCenter and RATT guys to work in a pseudo MILCOMMS operation not
otherwise available anywhere else in the world. To that end, we have 
succeeded.
More so, since teletype machines per se, are often hard to obtain, and 
difficult for most of us to maintain, even if we had them.
 
Aside from CommCenter-2.net, there are also vast arrays of archives, files,
photos, links, and an online Media Center and Museum dedicated to the
preservation of military comms experiences, memories, technical data,
reference publications, expertise, and operating mediums, protocols and
procedures which are available no where else. In short, we have a "system",
a "procedure", and a "methodology" that is unmatched by anyone else in 
any other group. We seek to "operate" CommCenters, as well as to "talk"
about them from a military, technical, and nostalgic point of view for both
fun and enjoyment. (We also have Routing Indicator and Call Sign lists,
complete with PLAs and AIGs to support this type of extended operation). 

It appears that you have overlooked his good intentions and missed on both
accounts, and have instead sought to criticize and find fault -- all for no 

apparent reason, except perhaps to minimize or diminish what Rod and others
have attempted to accomplish thus far.         

For the record: here at the TRUE facts....
  
a. CommCenter-2.net (and CommCenter-5) are only REPLICATORS (or, if
you prefer, EMULATORS). They are NOT teletype machines. They are what
we call "virtual" circuits. They seek to mimic teletypewriters in so far as
we are able to make them do that with the intent of making the effort both
"plausible" and "believable". 

b. We are AWARE that they are NOT perfect, and that the visual and sound
effects are not necessarily "in synch". However, for the purposes of 
trafficking,
interoperabilty, communicating, realism, and working in an overall older-era

military-styled CommCenter, Telecomm Center or RATT environment -- it 
works,
and it works wonderfully. No one has complained. There are over 100+ 
members
on the CommCenter groups todate, and there are over 2000 folks now copying
CommCenter-2.net -- without complaint or issue.

c. In the absence of real teletype machines, the intent was to create a
SIMULATION, as much as that was possible or practical, using common-user,
public domain software (in this case Java Script and PERL) on a Microsoft
platform. Microsoft was used, because MOST folks use MS Windows on
their PCs, and its the most common and easily understood operating system
out there these days.

FWIW, other active simulations are also planned, or in the works, as time,
and skills are identified and we can begin work on them.

d. We are aware that ITTY exists and of the further existence of MMTTY,
and many of us belong to those groups as well. Unfortunately, those groups
did not satisfy the military interest, and had no bearing on the old 
CommCenters
that many of us were long familiar with. We wanted something a bit more
challenging with a realistic flare that provided a greater degree of 
interactivity,
military slant and circuit discipline. So, the CommCenter groups were 
born.....

e. It is currently NOT possible to make either a server or a PC to fully 
function
exactly like any model of teletypewriter of any vintage or era. To do so 
would
require a pile of money and a large engineering staff with the patience of 
Job
and an extensive and intimate knowledge of how these machines worked
and acted, to include their exact functional and characteristic sounds at
varying speeds. NONE of those are available to any of us on any group. So, 
we
have done the best we could with what has been available. Limited program-
ming ability from one individual, sound files from another, and 
organizational 
capababilities from several others in the group(s). Much of this has taken
many months to accomplish, organize, set up and then finally get running.

f. We are AWARE that NO ONE else has accomplished quite what we in the
CommCenter groups have accomplished todate. If so, we would like to SEE
it. I might also point out that there are NO, repeat -NO- working, online, 
virtual
teletype circuits anywhere on the Internet that offer both visual and sound
effects such as what the CommCenter-2.net offers to its' monitors and 
users.
Specifically, there exists NO teletypewriter, real or simulated, using a 
PC,
that both prints and makes mechanical teletypewriter sounds, or that sends,
receives, or permits the sending and receiving of two-way and wide-area
"live" record message traffic of any kind, whether real or by emulation on
the order of what CommCenter-2.net does.
 
(CommCenter-2.net sound emulates a Kleinschmidt TT-98/FG;
 CommCenter-5 sound emulates a Model 28 KSR).

It has not been possible to create either a carriage or a print head for 
either
circuit to date. Short of extensive software tech and advanced photo 
imagery,
it is not possible to create and then animate such on a PC.

g. Rod has set up CommCenter-2.net for use with real teletype machines
for those who might be so inclined, with the addition of Heavy Metal. 
Perhaps
that might soothe the perfectionsts a bit, where the PCs come up short.
(Still needs to have the anonymous FTP and IP site added, but it's being
worked).

h. If you have a previous version of Firefox that predates Firefox 3, then
CommCenter-2.net works well, including the sound files. I can't speak for
your brand of software systems that are not in common use such as Linux. We
did not have those systems in mind when CommCenter-2 was developed. It
was intended to be used in an MS environment, using commonly available
and understood software that was in the public domain.

You mentioned that you emailed the webmaster and only received a "so what"
response. Well, after such a critical review of his system, what did you 
expect?
You are lucky that you even received a response from him at all.....!

i. As for yahoogroups Terms of Service (TOS). I think that is your personal
opinion. I don't like yahoogroups either, but unfortunately, there's not a
lot out there to choose from. Yahoogroups has been around for a long time
now, and I personsally have used it for almost 15 years now -- with NO 
issues or problems with their TOS requirements. Most software have TOS
requirements; unless you are a lawyer, there are no serious issues that
should concern the average user if he/she follows the rules. So, your
comments regarding yahoogroups TOS are without merit. 

For visitors to view, monitor or copy CommCenter-2.net, it is NOT a 
requirement to join yahoogroups.com.

It is a requirement to join CommCenter-1 at yahoogroups.com if you want
to be on the CommCenter talk forums which include CommCenter-3 and 4.
CommCenter-2.net, 2 Media Center and 5 are open to the public at large.
CommCenter-1 at yahoogroups is the "anchor" group for all of the CommCenter
groups. CommCenter-1 at yahoogroups is primarily intended for former, current
and retired military members, certain DoD Contractors and DoD Engineers
who have worked and KNOW and understand the military communications 
systems. It is NOT intended for the casual joiner, because, unless you have
some military knowledge, one would get lost in the jargon and tech terms
and many of the topics. 

Your somewhat demeaning comment about not being able to "participate
in our little experiment" sounds like you have a shrunken head or a small
brain. FYI: The CommCenter groups' have been around for awhile now, and
are NO experiment; they are in fact a reality which have been quite
successfull and fulfilling for those who are so interested in that venue. 
These
groups are likely to be around for a long time yet to come. Membership
in the CommCenter groups continues to grow.

Once more, anyone who is interested, is invited to take a look, with no
obligation to join any group: Samples of the CommCenter groups' 
operations....

http://www.commcenter-2.net/opnet.html

http://commcenter-5.cellmail.com/acp/

http://www.commcenter-2.net/media/cpg/index.php

http://commcenter-5.cellmail.com/index.html

http://zulutime.net/

Lastly, the invite to visit the CommCenter-2.net was just that: an invite.
As such, it is a "take it or leave it" proposition. Rod has graciously 
opened
it up to the folks on GreenKeys by dispensing with the password 
requirements.

We are aware that many folks who are not necessarily communicators also
copy CommCenter-2.net (CC-2). It's there to be ENJOYED by all who may have
an interest, or who might want to see how we used to communicate in the
military, and at the same time, hear the sounds of a teletype machine at
60 wpm once more. While not perfect, it's as "close to real" as it 
gets.....

Dave

David C. Freed
Master Sergeant, US Army (Ret)
Communications Operations Chief, 31Z5M
Moderator 1, CommCenter-1