From w7tty at centurylink.net  Fri Jan  1 02:46:08 2021
From: w7tty at centurylink.net (George Hutchison)
Date: Fri, 1 Jan 2021 02:46:08 -0500 (EST)
Subject: [GreenKeys] Gearset 28 conversion
In-Reply-To: <CANpP5D441NA58=SiPOmu65ZKAEnjJK5d6H+UTHybSK1JpqL4bQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <0b0301d6dfb5$4a4bbb00$dee33100$.ref@bellsouth.net>
	<0b0301d6dfb5$4a4bbb00$dee33100$@bellsouth.net>
	<CAB55hNc5vhB4FBYG96O6TMzJUryrcez9vOCfe4OE-2nNzVibGg@mail.gmail.com>
	<03BAE198-7596-411A-88B6-8D8A35BFD655@tapr.org>
	<alpine.DEB.2.20.2012311946270.12303@Frances>
	<CANpP5D441NA58=SiPOmu65ZKAEnjJK5d6H+UTHybSK1JpqL4bQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <148408207.164411649.1609487168679.JavaMail.zimbra@centurylink.net>

The early days of teletype saw power sources for teletype machines were often supplied by municipalities whose power was generated by small dams and plants running on frequencies from DC to 25, 50, 60 cycles and maybe a few more that could be all over the place when it came to frequencies.Ideally all of the machine selectors would start from zero and stop at exactly the ideal time to start another character.exactly 22 milliseconds after the last selector cycle ended. But, Podunk City Power, or Bob's Local Steam Plant, Aunt Minnie's Wonderful AC Bin and Pawn Shop, or Precision Pete's Mule Powered Hayburner and Threshing Machine Belt Driven Generating Plant were all running at different speeds, at which errors, garble, missed stop pulses, etc., caused editors to freak out and fire reporters, etc. The Genius Staff at the TELETYPE Machine Factory looked at the problem, and decided to allow a wee bit of additional time for all the machines to stop the selector cycle at a slightly longer time after the mark and space stream ended, and came to the conclusion that 9 more milliseconds to allow everything to be stopped before the next character started its journey to the world would help the situation out, thus the 31 millisecond stop pulse.When the National 60-cycle power distribution system became a reality, everyone could at last rest, allowing machines to be more reliably synchronized and far less garble was experienced. This made it possible to concentrate on more difficult problems such as selective fading between the mark and space frequencies of teletype signals emanating from radio transmitters running thousands of miles from their receivers. Decision threshold converters, running two transmitters  850 cycles away from each other, slideback detectors, and automatic threshold correction circuitry gave the engineers something new to play with.W7TTY

> 

> Wondering what percent of 28 stuff was other 7.42?

> 

Mainly Western Union, and machines W.U. supplied to the military.

I've posted an explanation of where 7.42 came from, but will refrain

from repeating unless someone asks for it.

______________________________________________________________

GreenKeys mailing list

Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys

Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm

Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net


>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch

>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/

>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html

>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html


This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net

Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

Message delivered to ad7i at ad7i.net
condition----- Original Message -----
From: ad7i <ad7i at ad7i.net>
To: Jim Haynes <jhhaynes at earthlink.net>
Cc: Greenkeys <greenkeys at mailman.qth.net>
Sent: Thu, 31 Dec 2020 23:09:57 -0500 (EST)
Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] Gearset 28 conversion
I'd be very interested in knowing the origin of 7.42.
Paul, ad7i

On Thu, Dec 31, 2020 at 8:48 PM Jim Haynes <jhhaynes at earthlink.net> wrote:On Thu, 31 Dec 2020, w9ddd at tapr.org wrote:

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From jim.w2jc at gmail.com  Fri Jan  1 02:52:37 2021
From: jim.w2jc at gmail.com (Jim Cooper)
Date: Fri, 01 Jan 2021 02:52:37 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] M28 manuals
Message-ID: <5FEED4C5.11736.24D1975@jim.w2jc.gmail.com>

Just a reminder that I have full sets of 
M28 Teletype Corp. manuals in like-new 
condition for reasonable cost ... 

Bull. 216B  Principles of Operation
Bull. 217B Adjustment & Lubrication 
Bull. 1149  Parts, KSR & RO 

see them 
at   http://bit.ly/TTY-stuff  

We've kicked 2020 into the bit bucket, 
so now we can all revise our  2-do  lists 
for 2021 !!  

Jim  w2jc 



From w9ddd at tapr.org  Fri Jan  1 17:49:49 2021
From: w9ddd at tapr.org (John, W9DDD)
Date: Fri, 1 Jan 2021 16:49:49 -0600
Subject: [GreenKeys] Autostart freq for 170 shift RTTY
In-Reply-To: <00a501d6df03$0f70b970$2e522c50$@net>
References: <CAB55hNd4=cBZUJnU19rbrMgjGpiiYLBPN360Q_uwgGXQ0kCoMA@mail.gmail.com>
	<66b5f6c505ddcfb2fc44349c47b7f05b.squirrel@mai.hallikainen.org>
	<EF3EE04D-9214-4CFB-85D2-ED3A5287E81E@tapr.org>
	<00a501d6df03$0f70b970$2e522c50$@net>
Message-ID: <0991265b-11aa-590e-aa77-6138777617df@tapr.org>

I forgot to mention that Lissajous patterns could easily be used to 
check these different frequencies from one reference (e. g. 425).? All 
these numbers being related to each other by a integer factor.

Back then access to an accurate counter was rare. So one had to use 
trick to set frequency.? Scopes weren't cheap back then either, but you 
didn't need a fancy one to do the Lissajous patterns.

This chart might be of interest.

1 	85 		
2 	170 	Narrow shift 	
3 	255 		
4 	340 		
5 	425 	some commerical shift 	tuning fork
6 	510 		
7 	595 		
8 	680 		
9 	765 		
10 	850 	wide shift 	
11 	935 		
12 	1020 		
13 	1105 		
14 	1190 		
15 	1275 	Eu mark 	
16 	1360 		
17 	1445 	Eu space 	
18 	1530 		
19 	1615 		
20 	1700 		
21 	1785 		
22 	1870 		
23 	1955 		
24 	2040 		
25 	2125 	NA afsk mark 	5x425
26 	2210 		
27 	2295 	NA afsk space 170 shift 	
28 	2380 		
29 	2465 		
30 	2550 		
31 	2635 		
32 	2720 		
33 	2805 		
34 	2890 		
35 	2975 	NA afsk space 850 shift 	7x425
36 	3060 		
37 	3145 		
38 	3230 		
39 	3315 		

John, W9DDD

On 12/30/2020 5:25 PM, Ralph Mowery wrote:
> Just to add a few items to this.
>
> Rtty was allowed on the ham HF bands, but it was just a make and break
> similar to CW and not the  two tones that have been used for many years.  I
> think the audio two tones on AM was  legal on the old 11 meter frequency
> before the hams lost it to the CB.
> The VHF bands could use the audio so much of it was on AM and used the two
> tones mentioned for that reason.
>
> As many of the receivers and transmitters were not all that stable years ago
> the FCC let hams use any shift up to 1000 Hz (cycles back then) so they
> stayed at 850 shift for many years .  As the gear became more stable the 170
> hz was used as it was 850 divided by 5.  Not sure why they used 5.
>
> ON HF any tone pair could be used as long as it was 850 or 170 hz
> separation.   When ssb became more common and it was found that clean audio
> put into the microphone input would generate signals like the two tone shift
> and was legal.  I really hate it when people say AFSK on the low bands by
> putting RTTY into the mic jack of a SSB transmitter as the result is not
> really AFSK like it would be if AM or FM was used.  So the same gear could
> be used on HF or VHF (which was usually AM or FM) the tones of 2125 and 170
> or 850 up were used.  To generate clean tones out of the SSB transmitter it
> is advised to stay above 1500 Hz for the mark so the 2nd and above harmonics
> will be past the 2.2 or 2.5 khz ssb filter in many rigs.
>
> Ralph ku4pt
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: greenkeys-bounces at mailman.qth.net
> [mailto:greenkeys-bounces at mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of w9ddd at tapr.org
> Sent: Wednesday, December 30, 2020 5:41 PM
> To: harold at w6iwi.org
> Cc: greenkeys at mailman.qth.net
> Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] Autostart freq for 170 shift RTTY
>
> Hi all,
>
> I'll make some comments that aren't necessarily facts, bit tidbits that may
> help trigger some one else's memory.
> First amateur RTTY was only allowed on VHF and higher frequencies. Why 2125
> and 2975.  The 850 shift was in use on commercial circuits. Some commercial
> used 425 shift. 2125 is fifth harmonic of 425. 2975 is seventh harmonic of
> 425.  You can crate a frequency standard with a tuning fork (I made one).
> Mark was probably low because a closed keyboard contact switches in more
> capacitance, therefore lower frequency.  Not sure why space is low on HF.
> Also inherited from commercial use?  Not much SSB in use at the time hams
> were granted HF RTTY! Even less folks would have thought of using the SSB
> mode of a transmitter to do RTTY in that era.
>
> I'm still trying to remember how I did 14,070 auto start with a KWM-1 around
> '71.  I remember I was shifting the PTO by making an adapter that plugged
> the PTO tube socket, running in CW mode and dropping the drive level to keep
> from overheating the finals.
>
> John, W9DDD
>
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
>
>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to w9ddd at tapr.org

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From djones at k6yic.com  Fri Jan  1 20:17:58 2021
From: djones at k6yic.com (Daniel Jones)
Date: Fri, 1 Jan 2021 17:17:58 -0800
Subject: [GreenKeys] Autostart
Message-ID: <19C3833C-E615-4202-9AD4-79A479CE5849@k6yic.com>

I have not used the autostart feed before.  I have a TU-170 that works and would like to give it a shot.

Is there anything that I need to worry about?


Daniel Jones (K6YIC)
DJones at k6yic.com
http://K6YIC.com


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From wcwuttke at att.net  Fri Jan  1 21:07:12 2021
From: wcwuttke at att.net (William Wuttke)
Date: Fri, 1 Jan 2021 18:07:12 -0800
Subject: [GreenKeys] Autostart
In-Reply-To: <19C3833C-E615-4202-9AD4-79A479CE5849@k6yic.com>
References: <19C3833C-E615-4202-9AD4-79A479CE5849@k6yic.com>
Message-ID: <4DB044D4-1966-4DB2-974B-8E0BB43CB1ED@att.net>

Hi Daniel,

The M28s had some sort of motor slow start relays, but my machine didn?t have one and the motor leads
were brought out separately to plug into the TU. I connected the motor directly to the machine 115 VAC
power, to be switched on with the power switch, along with the loop circuitry.

That being said, I plugged the M28 into the back of my TU and so far everything seems to be working OK.

Whether or not that is the correct way to do autostart, I do not know. I?m very new to to teletypes.
But it works.

Bill
KE3BK
> On Jan 1, 2021, at 5:17 PM, Daniel Jones <djones at k6yic.com> wrote:
> 
> I have not used the autostart feed before.  I have a TU-170 that works and would like to give it a shot.
> 
> Is there anything that I need to worry about?
> 
> 
> Daniel Jones (K6YIC)
> DJones at k6yic.com <mailto:DJones at k6yic.com>
> http://K6YIC.com <http://k6yic.com/>
> 
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From w9ddd at tapr.org  Fri Jan  1 21:37:02 2021
From: w9ddd at tapr.org (w9ddd at tapr.org)
Date: Fri, 1 Jan 2021 20:37:02 -0600
Subject: [GreenKeys] Did Teletype make a mistake?
Message-ID: <10384B5C-DC14-410C-BD70-64AD7974305D@tapr.org>


I was trouble shooting why the margin lamp wasn't working after removing modifications made for customer (FAA?).

After starting at the wrong end, assuming I goofed the mod removal, I finally determined the problem was missing wires in the keyboard.  Wires from the switch go up to the terminal strip that also has the motor leads.  Wires between that terminal strip and the 20 pin connector were missing. 

Looked up the WD 4262 for the LK25.  Darn if it doesn't show margin switch wires there either, Intentional?  Maybe not.  It doesn't show wires from pins 12 & 13 to the motor leads either, but those are present in the keyboard.

Mentally an easy fix, physically not so much.  Won't be the official wire colors though.

John, W9DDD



From djones at k6yic.com  Fri Jan  1 21:51:00 2021
From: djones at k6yic.com (Daniel Jones)
Date: Fri, 1 Jan 2021 18:51:00 -0800
Subject: [GreenKeys] Autostart
In-Reply-To: <4DB044D4-1966-4DB2-974B-8E0BB43CB1ED@att.net>
References: <4DB044D4-1966-4DB2-974B-8E0BB43CB1ED@att.net>
Message-ID: <A5AF4171-37F9-445D-BCAA-3BEA18BE700D@k6yic.com>

Since I have a KSR I brought the 115ac directly to the back of the TU-170.  I have been streaming the autostart for about 25 minutes and it seems to work fine.  The TU kicks the power on, it prints and then it shuts down about 20 secs from last character transmission.  

It?s pretty cool. 

Thanks for the advice.  Now in need to wire the TU-170 to my Kenwood.  

Daniel 

K6YIC 
http://K6YIC.com

From jgibbs at telus.net  Fri Jan  1 23:35:15 2021
From: jgibbs at telus.net (John VE7BDQ)
Date: Fri, 1 Jan 2021 20:35:15 -0800
Subject: [GreenKeys] 40 &20m rtty
Message-ID: <CA+EZRJmorwemdUAimDpJpEvCMsK0d-dQOLKcAiAUJuRN018jTg@mail.gmail.com>

What time of day is anyone using 7086 or 14086.  Been looking at those
frequencies and sent some calls and nothing seen.  Maybe propagation is
poor when I'm on around 4pm pst or 0000 utc.

73  John /  VE7BDQ
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From navy.radio at gmail.com  Sat Jan  2 07:57:19 2021
From: navy.radio at gmail.com (Nick England)
Date: Sat, 2 Jan 2021 07:57:19 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] 40 &20m rtty
In-Reply-To: <CA+EZRJmorwemdUAimDpJpEvCMsK0d-dQOLKcAiAUJuRN018jTg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CA+EZRJmorwemdUAimDpJpEvCMsK0d-dQOLKcAiAUJuRN018jTg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAB55hNf0seZgz5piOCwvbD-56z_AvwH4nPaRPQwucJ5V_RKLxQ@mail.gmail.com>

I?ve been working CO, TX, and CA from NC around 1400Z-1800Z on 14086.

This weekend is the big RTTY Roundup contest so there will be lots of
activity from 1800Z Saturday to 2359Z Sunday, but no one pausing for a
chat.
Cheers
Nick K4NYW

On Fri, Jan 1, 2021 at 11:36 PM John VE7BDQ <jgibbs at telus.net> wrote:

> What time of day is anyone using 7086 or 14086.  Been looking at those
> frequencies and sent some calls and nothing seen.  Maybe propagation is
> poor when I'm on around 4pm pst or 0000 utc.
>
> 73  John /  VE7BDQ
>
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
>
> >>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool:
> https://teletype.net/gksearch
> >>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive:
> http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
> >>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive:
> http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
> >>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool:
> http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to navy.radio at gmail.com

-- 
Nick England K4NYW
www.navy-radio.com
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From kn4ucl at gmail.com  Sat Jan  2 12:07:00 2021
From: kn4ucl at gmail.com (Andy KN4UCL)
Date: Sat, 2 Jan 2021 12:07:00 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] 33 punch problem?
Message-ID: <CA+H6KCkDN=NfWsSbDSomhnku4zG6WbkeqF=z1inwyUrEiQ7vsQ@mail.gmail.com>

Happy new year folks, my beloved ASR 33 is not feeding tape in for
punching.It seems that the feed wheel does not 'grab' the tape.

Before I start dismantling everything beyond recognition, any thoughts?  I
have attached a thrilling video of it not quite working.

cheers!
Andy

  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MSbvWhP7nYU
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From kn4ucl at gmail.com  Sat Jan  2 12:55:36 2021
From: kn4ucl at gmail.com (Andy KN4UCL)
Date: Sat, 2 Jan 2021 12:55:36 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] 33 punch problem?
In-Reply-To: <CA+H6KCkDN=NfWsSbDSomhnku4zG6WbkeqF=z1inwyUrEiQ7vsQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CA+H6KCkDN=NfWsSbDSomhnku4zG6WbkeqF=z1inwyUrEiQ7vsQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CA+H6KCmGFXeS6MU87o-G-rtNcMDdrQ5dyeLVV8xgwiyrqKLFVA@mail.gmail.com>

Thanks all for the excellent suggestions!  I sliced a plastic straw
length-ways and using a flossing motion, went underneath the rollers and
whatnot a few times.

And great news -although I didn't see any gunge get dislodged, it did the
trick!

I would post a followup video on youtube but I feel the excitement might be
too much :-)

thanks again!!

Andy



On Sat, Jan 2, 2021 at 12:07 PM Andy KN4UCL <kn4ucl at gmail.com> wrote:

> Happy new year folks, my beloved ASR 33 is not feeding tape in for
> punching.It seems that the feed wheel does not 'grab' the tape.
>
> Before I start dismantling everything beyond recognition, any thoughts?  I
> have attached a thrilling video of it not quite working.
>
> cheers!
> Andy
>
>   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MSbvWhP7nYU
>
>
>
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From harold at w6iwi.org  Sat Jan  2 13:01:09 2021
From: harold at w6iwi.org (Harold Hallikainen)
Date: Sat, 2 Jan 2021 10:01:09 -0800
Subject: [GreenKeys] 40 &20m rtty
In-Reply-To: <CAB55hNf0seZgz5piOCwvbD-56z_AvwH4nPaRPQwucJ5V_RKLxQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CA+EZRJmorwemdUAimDpJpEvCMsK0d-dQOLKcAiAUJuRN018jTg@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAB55hNf0seZgz5piOCwvbD-56z_AvwH4nPaRPQwucJ5V_RKLxQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <9ae2e7dfb190f6d64f2de9411aea5d8e.squirrel@mai.hallikainen.org>

I have my autostart receiver on 14.086 LSB (https://w6iwi.org/rtty/ )
pretty much all day. There is also a fair amount of traffic that I hear
(but does not autostart unless I retune) up 1 kHz).  I've had several QSOs
with east and west coast stations.

I've added a graph of the Boulder CO MUF to https://w6iwi.org . The
day/night transition are pretty abrupt. At 14:01 UTC today, the MUF was
8.54 MHz. At 15:01 UTC, it had increased to 15.54 MHz and continues to
increase.

See you on autostart!

Harold
https://w6iwi.org



> I???ve been working CO, TX, and CA from NC around 1400Z-1800Z on 14086.
>
> This weekend is the big RTTY Roundup contest so there will be lots of
> activity from 1800Z Saturday to 2359Z Sunday, but no one pausing for a
> chat.
> Cheers
> Nick K4NYW
>
> On Fri, Jan 1, 2021 at 11:36 PM John VE7BDQ <jgibbs at telus.net> wrote:
>
>> What time of day is anyone using 7086 or 14086.  Been looking at those
>> frequencies and sent some calls and nothing seen.  Maybe propagation is
>> poor when I'm on around 4pm pst or 0000 utc.
>>
>> 73  John /  VE7BDQ
>>
>>
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> GreenKeys mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
>>
>> >>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool:
>> https://teletype.net/gksearch
>> >>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive:
>> http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>> >>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive:
>> http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>> >>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool:
>> http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
>>
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>> Message delivered to navy.radio at gmail.com
>
> --
> Nick England K4NYW
> www.navy-radio.com
> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
>
>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool:
>>>> https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive:
>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive:
>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool:
>>>> http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to harold at w6iwi.org


-- 
FCC Rules Updated Daily at http://www.hallikainen.com
Not sent from an iPhone.

From w9ddd at tapr.org  Sat Jan  2 13:02:42 2021
From: w9ddd at tapr.org (John, W9DDD)
Date: Sat, 2 Jan 2021 12:02:42 -0600
Subject: [GreenKeys] Did Teletype make a mistake?
In-Reply-To: <10384B5C-DC14-410C-BD70-64AD7974305D@tapr.org>
References: <10384B5C-DC14-410C-BD70-64AD7974305D@tapr.org>
Message-ID: <a9853753-b609-9552-4ae6-2b1d6fa4d00e@tapr.org>

I can send a direct answer to this if anyone is interested.  Boils down 
to the usual case of insides didn't match the cabinet.

John, W9DDD

On 1/1/2021 8:37 PM, w9ddd at tapr.org wrote:
> 
> I was trouble shooting why the margin lamp wasn't working after removing modifications made for customer (FAA?).
> 
> After starting at the wrong end, assuming I goofed the mod removal, I finally determined the problem was missing wires in the keyboard.  Wires from the switch go up to the terminal strip that also has the motor leads.  Wires between that terminal strip and the 20 pin connector were missing.
> 
> Looked up the WD 4262 for the LK25.  Darn if it doesn't show margin switch wires there either, Intentional?  Maybe not.  It doesn't show wires from pins 12 & 13 to the motor leads either, but those are present in the keyboard.
> 
> Mentally an easy fix, physically not so much.  Won't be the official wire colors though.
> 
> John, W9DDD
> 
> 
> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
> 
>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
> 
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to w9ddd at tapr.org
> 

From wcwuttke at att.net  Sat Jan  2 15:03:44 2021
From: wcwuttke at att.net (William Wuttke)
Date: Sat, 2 Jan 2021 12:03:44 -0800
Subject: [GreenKeys] 40 &20m rtty
In-Reply-To: <CA+EZRJmorwemdUAimDpJpEvCMsK0d-dQOLKcAiAUJuRN018jTg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CA+EZRJmorwemdUAimDpJpEvCMsK0d-dQOLKcAiAUJuRN018jTg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <EA98F698-46B2-4EC1-9D16-1B91F12FE8F2@att.net>

For me, same as Harold. I?m usually monitoring 14.086 and 7.086 (for west coasters) all day. I printed a VE the other day,
but the rest was garble. You should be able to hit me on 40m during the day, but I don?t actively monitor the frequencies.
I check the M28 every couple of hours. Just for fun, you can try my KiwiSDR to see if you are making it here: http://73.185.80.191:8073/ <http://73.185.80.191:8073/>.

I won?t be monitoring this weekend due to the contest. But, I?ll be using the keyboard and TDs to see how many QSOs
I can make with heavy metal.

73,
Bill
KE3BK

> On Jan 1, 2021, at 8:35 PM, John VE7BDQ <jgibbs at telus.net> wrote:
> 
> What time of day is anyone using 7086 or 14086.  Been looking at those frequencies and sent some calls and nothing seen.  Maybe propagation is poor when I'm on around 4pm pst or 0000 utc. 
> 
> 73  John /  VE7BDQ

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From wcwuttke at att.net  Sat Jan  2 18:20:07 2021
From: wcwuttke at att.net (William Wuttke)
Date: Sat, 2 Jan 2021 15:20:07 -0800
Subject: [GreenKeys] 40 &20m rtty
In-Reply-To: <96155893.289929.1609619914210@connect.xfinity.com>
References: <CA+EZRJmorwemdUAimDpJpEvCMsK0d-dQOLKcAiAUJuRN018jTg@mail.gmail.com>
	<EA98F698-46B2-4EC1-9D16-1B91F12FE8F2@att.net>
	<96155893.289929.1609619914210@connect.xfinity.com>
Message-ID: <70046D4C-9EBB-49E3-A2BF-D5D2664FEFD2@att.net>

2 JAN 2020  2300Z
ARRL RTTY Roundup update. It?s break time. While off to a slow start due to my continual setup problems,
I?m up to 40 QSO's. However, is it cheating if you use two TD?s? I think Russ mentioned that?s the way
to do contests. I?m still using M28 equipment. In Search & Pounce mode you only need two tapes.
One with your call to respond to the CQ and one with your exchange. If you have two TD?s all
you have to do is switch back and forth between the two, never touching the keyboard (unless you
want to).

73,
Bill
KE3BK



From kn4ucl at gmail.com  Sun Jan  3 07:43:00 2021
From: kn4ucl at gmail.com (Andy KN4UCL)
Date: Sun, 3 Jan 2021 07:43:00 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] M28 LESU / wiring
Message-ID: <CA+H6KC=3AFHDED_ODjHJS3HMjLWj-BgDscBSufk8y2C33wfhaQ@mail.gmail.com>

Good morning everyone -  as part of my ASR 28 restore effort, what is the
general opinion on the  wiring diagram makes the most sense for use with my
particular LESU? (see photo)

Thanks in advance for any help!

best wishes
Andy
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From w9ddd at tapr.org  Sun Jan  3 09:27:15 2021
From: w9ddd at tapr.org (w9ddd at tapr.org)
Date: Sun, 3 Jan 2021 08:27:15 -0600
Subject: [GreenKeys] M28 LESU / wiring
In-Reply-To: <CA+H6KC=3AFHDED_ODjHJS3HMjLWj-BgDscBSufk8y2C33wfhaQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CA+H6KC=3AFHDED_ODjHJS3HMjLWj-BgDscBSufk8y2C33wfhaQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <2CF99B7E-EF50-4C48-AC12-7BF39AD84510@tapr.org>

Hi Andy,
http://navy-radio.com/manuals/tty/navy-asr-cross-6705.pdf
Shows SB-959/UG as equal to LESU 13, WD 3292 and 3294.

John, W9DDD


> On Jan 3, 2021, at 6:43 AM, Andy KN4UCL <kn4ucl at gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> Good morning everyone -  as part of my ASR 28 restore effort, what is the general opinion on the  wiring diagram makes the most sense for use with my particular LESU? (see photo) 
> 
> Thanks in advance for any help!
> 
> best wishes
> Andy
> <PART AND SERIAL NO.jpg>
> <LESU side2.jpg>
> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
> 
>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
> 
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to w9ddd at tapr.org


From kn4ucl at gmail.com  Sun Jan  3 09:57:02 2021
From: kn4ucl at gmail.com (Andy KN4UCL)
Date: Sun, 3 Jan 2021 09:57:02 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] M28 LESU / wiring
In-Reply-To: <2CF99B7E-EF50-4C48-AC12-7BF39AD84510@tapr.org>
References: <2CF99B7E-EF50-4C48-AC12-7BF39AD84510@tapr.org>
Message-ID: <880CC0EA-565C-4DA1-9A4F-65821CB6A123@gmail.com>

Awesome thank you!

> On Jan 3, 2021, at 9:27 AM, w9ddd at tapr.org wrote:
> 
> ?Hi Andy,
> http://navy-radio.com/manuals/tty/navy-asr-cross-6705.pdf
> Shows SB-959/UG as equal to LESU 13, WD 3292 and 3294.
> 
> John, W9DDD
> 
> 
>> On Jan 3, 2021, at 6:43 AM, Andy KN4UCL <kn4ucl at gmail.com> wrote:
>> 
>> Good morning everyone -  as part of my ASR 28 restore effort, what is the general opinion on the  wiring diagram makes the most sense for use with my particular LESU? (see photo) 
>> 
>> Thanks in advance for any help!
>> 
>> best wishes
>> Andy
>> <PART AND SERIAL NO.jpg>
>> <LESU side2.jpg>
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> GreenKeys mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
>> 
>>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
>> 
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>> Message delivered to w9ddd at tapr.org
> 

From teletypeparts at comcast.net  Sun Jan  3 12:08:34 2021
From: teletypeparts at comcast.net (WAYNE)
Date: Sun, 3 Jan 2021 12:08:34 -0500 (EST)
Subject: [GreenKeys] HP 33 ASR Restoration
Message-ID: <1032769278.298655.1609693714792@connect.xfinity.com>

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From steve.n4tty at gmail.com  Sun Jan  3 14:38:48 2021
From: steve.n4tty at gmail.com (Steve Garrison)
Date: Sun, 3 Jan 2021 14:38:48 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] ASR LMU12 Motor
Message-ID: <25aa01d6e208$0f050010$2d0f0030$@gmail.com>

OK, folks what can go wrong with a synchronous motor that can make it seem
to be turning at a much higher RPM than it should be?

 

I had a mishap that shorted a wire against the motor that caused a spark, a
pop, and the fuse in the LESU blowing.  After removing the short, replacing
the fuse, then powering back up, the machine was running but "sounded
funny!"  After removing the typing unit and powering backup I still had the 
"funny" sound, just not quite as loud.  Without the typing unit it was just
the motor and the reperf churning.  The TD drive shafts had been removed
earlier.

 

My feeling is the "funny" noise is the mechanisms running at a higher RPM
than designed.

 

I still need to repair the shorted wire, but it isn't part of the motor
circuit anyway.

 

Steve G./N4TTY

 

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From w9ddd at tapr.org  Sun Jan  3 15:54:53 2021
From: w9ddd at tapr.org (w9ddd at tapr.org)
Date: Sun, 3 Jan 2021 14:54:53 -0600
Subject: [GreenKeys] ASR LMU12 Motor
In-Reply-To: <25aa01d6e208$0f050010$2d0f0030$@gmail.com>
References: <25aa01d6e208$0f050010$2d0f0030$@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CF977115-D49C-4658-9927-BB0F5C5190C5@tapr.org>

Hi Steve,

I can't picture hoe the motor could over speed. 

What part of the motor did it touch?  Does your motor have the ground strap between motor housing and the cradle or base?

Do your have other words to describe the sound?

John, W9DDD


> On Jan 3, 2021, at 1:38 PM, Steve Garrison <steve.n4tty at gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> OK, folks what can go wrong with a synchronous motor that can make it seem to be turning at a much higher RPM than it should be?
>  
> I had a mishap that shorted a wire against the motor that caused a spark, a pop, and the fuse in the LESU blowing.  After removing the short, replacing the fuse, then powering back up, the machine was running but ?sounded funny!?  After removing the typing unit and powering backup I still had the 
> ?funny? sound, just not quite as loud.  Without the typing unit it was just the motor and the reperf churning.  The TD drive shafts had been removed earlier.
>  
> My feeling is the ?funny? noise is the mechanisms running at a higher RPM than designed.
>  
> I still need to repair the shorted wire, but it isn?t part of the motor circuit anyway.
>  
> Steve G./N4TTY
>  
> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
> 
>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
> 
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to w9ddd at tapr.org
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From ka2ivy at verizon.net  Sun Jan  3 16:28:29 2021
From: ka2ivy at verizon.net (Bruce Gentry)
Date: Sun, 3 Jan 2021 16:28:29 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] Fwd: Re:  ASR LMU12 Motor
In-Reply-To: <955bbdb7-a654-33f1-3147-e011f0ff0ae7@verizon.net>
References: <955bbdb7-a654-33f1-3147-e011f0ff0ae7@verizon.net>
Message-ID: <499e28ab-66ef-e249-63b6-6c385c7ff018@verizon.net>

I fear the short damaged bearings in the motor or shafting. The motor 
mount is resiliant rubber, and if the motor frame was not grounded, the 
current may have passed through the bearings. This arcs and etches the 
bearing balls and races. If the motor frame was grounded, did the wire 
touch the motor shaft, fan, or anything metal connected to it?.  Any 
current passing through  any bearings in the machine can do the damage. 
The synchronous motor in a 28 is 3600 RPM, that is the fastest a 
synchronous motor can go on 60 cycles. No sort of short or other damage 
or change can increase the speed beyond that.  If  you were dealing 
with  a goverened motor, that is a totally different matter.

       Bruce Gentry, KA2IVY


On 1/3/21 14:38, Steve Garrison wrote:
>
> OK, folks what can go wrong with a synchronous motor that can make it 
> seem to be turning at a much higher RPM than it should be?
>
> I had a mishap that shorted a wire against the motor that caused a 
> spark, a pop, and the fuse in the LESU blowing.  After removing the 
> short, replacing the fuse, then powering back up, the machine was 
> running but ???sounded funny!???  After removing the typing unit and 
> powering backup I still had the
> ???funny??? sound, just not quite as loud.  Without the typing unit it was 
> just the motor and the reperf churning.  The TD drive shafts had been 
> removed earlier.
>
> My feeling is the ???funny??? noise is the mechanisms running at a higher 
> RPM than designed.
>
> I still need to repair the shorted wire, but it isn???t part of the 
> motor circuit anyway.
>
> Steve G./N4TTY
>
>
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home:http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help:http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post:mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
>
>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool:https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive:http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive:http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool:http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
> This list hosted by:http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list:http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered toka2ivy at verizon.net

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From steve.n4tty at gmail.com  Sun Jan  3 16:57:14 2021
From: steve.n4tty at gmail.com (Steve Garrison)
Date: Sun, 3 Jan 2021 16:57:14 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] Fwd: Re:  ASR LMU12 Motor
In-Reply-To: <499e28ab-66ef-e249-63b6-6c385c7ff018@verizon.net>
References: <955bbdb7-a654-33f1-3147-e011f0ff0ae7@verizon.net>
	<499e28ab-66ef-e249-63b6-6c385c7ff018@verizon.net>
Message-ID: <269101d6e21b$65e18080$31a48180$@gmail.com>

The short was against the fan.  The cable from the LESU to the printer was
resting against the fan and I didn?t notice it.  That?s what I guess I get
for moving things around so much and not being extra cautious.

 

The fan rubbed its way through the sheathing on the cable bundle and then
through the insulation on at least one wire.  I haven?t even gotten to the
cable bundle repair yet.  The motor frame case was grounded as I found that
it wasn?t just a day or two ago and put the ground strap back under the
screw head where it belonged.

 

The damaged bearings sounds to me to be the most likely ?funny sound? I?m
now hearing.

 

Thank you for the insight Bruce, I?ll admit I never would have thought of
that problem.  And thanks to the others that have responded as well.  As all
of you have commented, it is the line frequency that sets the speed of a
synchronous motor.  Why that fact didn?t pop to the front of my mind I?ll
never know, but as they say you learn something new every day!

 

Steve G

 

From: greenkeys-bounces at mailman.qth.net <greenkeys-bounces at mailman.qth.net>
On Behalf Of Bruce Gentry via GreenKeys
Sent: Sunday, January 3, 2021 4:28 PM
To: greenkeys at mailman.qth.net
Subject: [GreenKeys] Fwd: Re: ASR LMU12 Motor

 

I fear the short damaged bearings in the motor or shafting. The motor mount
is resiliant rubber, and if the motor frame was not grounded, the current
may have passed through the bearings. This arcs and etches the bearing balls
and races. If the motor frame was grounded, did the wire touch the motor
shaft, fan, or anything metal connected to it?.??? Any current passing
through??? any bearings in the machine can do the damage. The synchronous
motor in a 28 is 3600 RPM, that is the fastest a synchronous motor can go on
60 cycles. No sort of short or other damage or change can increase the speed
beyond that.??? If??? you were dealing with??? a goverened motor, that is a
totally different matter.

??????????????? Bruce Gentry, KA2IVY

 

On 1/3/21 14:38, Steve Garrison wrote:

OK, folks what can go wrong with a synchronous motor that can make it seem
to be turning at a much higher RPM than it should be?

???

I had a mishap that shorted a wire against the motor that caused a spark, a
pop, and the fuse in the LESU blowing.??? After removing the short,
replacing the fuse, then powering back up, the machine was running but
???sounded funny!?????? After removing the typing unit and powering backup I
still had the 
???funny??? sound, just not quite as loud.??? Without the typing unit it was
just the motor and the reperf churning.??? The TD drive shafts had been
removed earlier.

???

My feeling is the ???funny??? noise is the mechanisms running at a higher
RPM than designed.

???

I still need to repair the shorted wire, but it isn???t part of the motor
circuit anyway.

???

Steve G./N4TTY

???






______________________________________________________________
GreenKeys mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
 

Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool:
https://teletype.net/gksearch
2002-to-present greenkeys archive:
http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive:
http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool:
http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to ka2ivy at verizon.net <mailto:ka2ivy at verizon.net> 

 

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From w9ddd at tapr.org  Sun Jan  3 17:04:01 2021
From: w9ddd at tapr.org (John, W9DDD)
Date: Sun, 3 Jan 2021 16:04:01 -0600
Subject: [GreenKeys] ASR LMU12 Motor
In-Reply-To: <26a701d6e21b$9ce954e0$d6bbfea0$@gmail.com>
References: <25aa01d6e208$0f050010$2d0f0030$@gmail.com>
	<CF977115-D49C-4658-9927-BB0F5C5190C5@tapr.org>
	<26a701d6e21b$9ce954e0$d6bbfea0$@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <72479ac0-79d2-d9c8-2274-14e391a76a74@tapr.org>

As my grandfather used to say.

We get too soon old and too late smart.

John, W9DDD

On 1/3/2021 3:58 PM, Steve Garrison wrote:
> As others have pointed out to me as well.? At least I?m getting better 
> educated.? Too bad it is happening so late in life! ?
> 
> SG
> 
> *From:* w9ddd at tapr.org <w9ddd at tapr.org>
> *Sent:* Sunday, January 3, 2021 3:55 PM
> *To:* N4TTY at ARRL.NET
> *Cc:* Greenkeys <greenkeys at mailman.qth.net>
> *Subject:* Re: [GreenKeys] ASR LMU12 Motor
> 
> Hi Steve,
> 
> I can't picture hoe the motor could over speed.
> 
> What part of the motor did it touch? ?Does your motor have the ground 
> strap between motor housing and the cradle or base?
> 
> Do your have other words to describe the sound?
> 
> John, W9DDD
> 
> 
> On Jan 3, 2021, at 1:38 PM, Steve Garrison <steve.n4tty at gmail.com 
> <mailto:steve.n4tty at gmail.com>> wrote:
> 
>     OK, folks what can go wrong with a synchronous motor that can make
>     it seem to be turning at a much higher RPM than it should be?
> 
>     I had a mishap that shorted a wire against the motor that caused a
>     spark, a pop, and the fuse in the LESU blowing.? After removing the
>     short, replacing the fuse, then powering back up, the machine was
>     running but ?sounded funny!?? After removing the typing unit and
>     powering backup I still had the
>     ?funny? sound, just not quite as loud.? Without the typing unit it
>     was just the motor and the reperf churning.? The TD drive shafts had
>     been removed earlier.
> 
>     My feeling is the ?funny? noise is the mechanisms running at a
>     higher RPM than designed.
> 
>     I still need to repair the shorted wire, but it isn?t part of the
>     motor circuit anyway.
> 
>     Steve G./N4TTY
> 
>     ______________________________________________________________
>     GreenKeys mailing list
>     Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
>     Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>     Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
> 
> 
>                 Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool:
>                 https://teletype.net/gksearch
> 
>                 2002-to-present greenkeys archive:
>                 http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
> 
>                 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive:
>                 http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
> 
>                 Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool:
>                 http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
> 
> 
>     This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>     Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>     Message delivered to w9ddd at tapr.org <mailto:w9ddd at tapr.org>
> 

From jhhaynes at earthlink.net  Sun Jan  3 17:14:03 2021
From: jhhaynes at earthlink.net (Jim Haynes)
Date: Sun, 3 Jan 2021 16:14:03 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [GreenKeys] ASR LMU12 Motor
In-Reply-To: <CF977115-D49C-4658-9927-BB0F5C5190C5@tapr.org>
References: <25aa01d6e208$0f050010$2d0f0030$@gmail.com>
	<CF977115-D49C-4658-9927-BB0F5C5190C5@tapr.org>
Message-ID: <alpine.DEB.2.20.2101031612410.11252@Frances>

On Sun, 3 Jan 2021, w9ddd at tapr.org wrote:

> Hi Steve,
> 
> I can't picture hoe the motor could over speed.?
> 
I suggested as a guess that the motor starting relay might be bad and
thus the starting section lets the motor speed up above synchronous
speed because it isn't cutting out when the motor gets up to speed.

From wcwuttke at att.net  Sun Jan  3 19:54:53 2021
From: wcwuttke at att.net (William Wuttke)
Date: Sun, 3 Jan 2021 16:54:53 -0800
Subject: [GreenKeys] 40 &20m rtty
In-Reply-To: <70046D4C-9EBB-49E3-A2BF-D5D2664FEFD2@att.net>
References: <CA+EZRJmorwemdUAimDpJpEvCMsK0d-dQOLKcAiAUJuRN018jTg@mail.gmail.com>
	<EA98F698-46B2-4EC1-9D16-1B91F12FE8F2@att.net>
	<96155893.289929.1609619914210@connect.xfinity.com>
	<70046D4C-9EBB-49E3-A2BF-D5D2664FEFD2@att.net>
Message-ID: <3951A24C-D563-4EF0-8407-7AA1A038C028@att.net>

3 JAN 2020 2400Z
ARRL RTTY Roundup update. Well, it?s over. Today I operated using the keyboard. Actually, QSO?s went
fairly quickly, with only a few mistakes made. I had to take a couple of breaks, though. My body seems
to get pains in the knees and hands if I stay attached to the M28 for too long. Final outcome is 116 QSO?s,
39 multipliers, 3 zones, 4872 points. I won?t win any contests, but I had a lot of fun on my first Greenkeys
RTTY contest.

73,
Bill
KE3BK

> On Jan 2, 2021, at 3:20 PM, William Wuttke <wcwuttke at att.net> wrote:
> 
> 2 JAN 2020  2300Z
> ARRL RTTY Roundup update. It?s break time. While off to a slow start due to my continual setup problems,
> I?m up to 40 QSO's. However, is it cheating if you use two TD?s? I think Russ mentioned that?s the way
> to do contests. I?m still using M28 equipment. In Search & Pounce mode you only need two tapes.
> One with your call to respond to the CQ and one with your exchange. If you have two TD?s all
> you have to do is switch back and forth between the two, never touching the keyboard (unless you
> want to).
> 
> 73,
> Bill
> KE3BK
> 
> 


From harold at w6iwi.org  Sun Jan  3 19:59:53 2021
From: harold at w6iwi.org (Harold Hallikainen)
Date: Sun, 3 Jan 2021 16:59:53 -0800
Subject: [GreenKeys] 40 &20m rtty
In-Reply-To: <3951A24C-D563-4EF0-8407-7AA1A038C028@att.net>
References: <CA+EZRJmorwemdUAimDpJpEvCMsK0d-dQOLKcAiAUJuRN018jTg@mail.gmail.com>
	<EA98F698-46B2-4EC1-9D16-1B91F12FE8F2@att.net>
	<96155893.289929.1609619914210@connect.xfinity.com>
	<70046D4C-9EBB-49E3-A2BF-D5D2664FEFD2@att.net>
	<3951A24C-D563-4EF0-8407-7AA1A038C028@att.net>
Message-ID: <05b6cf8970b7c8bc1e107c3b3b98295a.squirrel@mai.hallikainen.org>


> 3 JAN 2020 2400Z
> ARRL RTTY Roundup update. Well, it???s over. Today I operated using the
> keyboard. Actually, QSO???s went
> fairly quickly, with only a few mistakes made. I had to take a couple of
> breaks, though. My body seems
> to get pains in the knees and hands if I stay attached to the M28 for too
> long. Final outcome is 116 QSO???s,
> 39 multipliers, 3 zones, 4872 points. I won???t win any contests, but I
> had a lot of fun on my first Greenkeys
> RTTY contest.
>
> 73,
> Bill
> KE3BK

Great! I heard a lot of traffic, and now and then my machine would start
up. The transmissions were so short, though, that the machine often did
not have a chance to sync up.

I'm listening for a friend on 40 meter SSB right now, but will be back on
7086 MHz autostart later, then 14.086 MHz tomorrow.

Harold



-- 
FCC Rules Updated Daily at http://www.hallikainen.com
Not sent from an iPhone.

From steve.n4tty at gmail.com  Sun Jan  3 20:00:26 2021
From: steve.n4tty at gmail.com (Steve Garrison)
Date: Sun, 3 Jan 2021 20:00:26 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] 40 &20m rtty
In-Reply-To: <3951A24C-D563-4EF0-8407-7AA1A038C028@att.net>
References: <CA+EZRJmorwemdUAimDpJpEvCMsK0d-dQOLKcAiAUJuRN018jTg@mail.gmail.com>	<EA98F698-46B2-4EC1-9D16-1B91F12FE8F2@att.net>	<96155893.289929.1609619914210@connect.xfinity.com>	<70046D4C-9EBB-49E3-A2BF-D5D2664FEFD2@att.net>
	<3951A24C-D563-4EF0-8407-7AA1A038C028@att.net>
Message-ID: <27e801d6e234$fddc5360$f994fa20$@gmail.com>

Congrats Bill!

-----Original Message-----
From: greenkeys-bounces at mailman.qth.net <greenkeys-bounces at mailman.qth.net> On Behalf Of William Wuttke
Sent: Sunday, January 3, 2021 7:55 PM
To: Greenkeys <greenkeys at mailman.qth.net>
Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] 40 &20m rtty

3 JAN 2020 2400Z
ARRL RTTY Roundup update. Well, it?s over. Today I operated using the keyboard. Actually, QSO?s went fairly quickly, with only a few mistakes made. I had to take a couple of breaks, though. My body seems to get pains in the knees and hands if I stay attached to the M28 for too long. Final outcome is 116 QSO?s,
39 multipliers, 3 zones, 4872 points. I won?t win any contests, but I had a lot of fun on my first Greenkeys RTTY contest.

73,
Bill
KE3BK

> On Jan 2, 2021, at 3:20 PM, William Wuttke <wcwuttke at att.net> wrote:
> 
> 2 JAN 2020  2300Z
> ARRL RTTY Roundup update. It?s break time. While off to a slow start 
> due to my continual setup problems, I?m up to 40 QSO's. However, is it 
> cheating if you use two TD?s? I think Russ mentioned that?s the way to do contests. I?m still using M28 equipment. In Search & Pounce mode you only need two tapes.
> One with your call to respond to the CQ and one with your exchange. If 
> you have two TD?s all you have to do is switch back and forth between 
> the two, never touching the keyboard (unless you want to).
> 
> 73,
> Bill
> KE3BK
> 
> 

______________________________________________________________
GreenKeys mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net

>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: 
>>> https://teletype.net/gksearch 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: 
>>> http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: 
>>> http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: 
>>> http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to steve.n4tty at gmail.com


From braund813 at hotmail.com  Sun Jan  3 22:33:21 2021
From: braund813 at hotmail.com (Dale Braun)
Date: Mon, 4 Jan 2021 03:33:21 +0000
Subject: [GreenKeys] 40 &20m rtty
In-Reply-To: <3951A24C-D563-4EF0-8407-7AA1A038C028@att.net>
References: <CA+EZRJmorwemdUAimDpJpEvCMsK0d-dQOLKcAiAUJuRN018jTg@mail.gmail.com>
	<EA98F698-46B2-4EC1-9D16-1B91F12FE8F2@att.net>
	<96155893.289929.1609619914210@connect.xfinity.com>
	<70046D4C-9EBB-49E3-A2BF-D5D2664FEFD2@att.net>,
	<3951A24C-D563-4EF0-8407-7AA1A038C028@att.net>
Message-ID: <DM6PR13MB420433F5C87CFD30368683B2FBD20@DM6PR13MB4204.namprd13.prod.outlook.com>

Congrats, Bill.  I could only operate a couple of hours but managed to make 40 QSO?s using my Model 19 Teletype.  Using a pre-punched QSO exchange tape and the TD sure made a difference.

73,
Dale
W9DKB


Sent from Mail<https://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkId=550986> for Windows 10

From: William Wuttke<mailto:wcwuttke at att.net>
Sent: Sunday, January 3, 2021 6:55 PM
To: Greenkeys<mailto:greenkeys at mailman.qth.net>
Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] 40 &20m rtty

3 JAN 2020 2400Z
ARRL RTTY Roundup update. Well, it?s over. Today I operated using the keyboard. Actually, QSO?s went
fairly quickly, with only a few mistakes made. I had to take a couple of breaks, though. My body seems
to get pains in the knees and hands if I stay attached to the M28 for too long. Final outcome is 116 QSO?s,
39 multipliers, 3 zones, 4872 points. I won?t win any contests, but I had a lot of fun on my first Greenkeys
RTTY contest.

73,
Bill
KE3BK

> On Jan 2, 2021, at 3:20 PM, William Wuttke <wcwuttke at att.net> wrote:
>
> 2 JAN 2020  2300Z
> ARRL RTTY Roundup update. It?s break time. While off to a slow start due to my continual setup problems,
> I?m up to 40 QSO's. However, is it cheating if you use two TD?s? I think Russ mentioned that?s the way
> to do contests. I?m still using M28 equipment. In Search & Pounce mode you only need two tapes.
> One with your call to respond to the CQ and one with your exchange. If you have two TD?s all
> you have to do is switch back and forth between the two, never touching the keyboard (unless you
> want to).
>
> 73,
> Bill
> KE3BK
>
>

______________________________________________________________
GreenKeys mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net

>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to braund813 at hotmail.com

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From steve.n4tty at gmail.com  Mon Jan  4 12:33:06 2021
From: steve.n4tty at gmail.com (Steve Garrison)
Date: Mon, 4 Jan 2021 12:33:06 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] M28ASR Motor Saga
Message-ID: <294c01d6e2bf$aa5a8be0$ff0fa3a0$@gmail.com>

It is definitely the bearings!  With the motor assembly removed from the
base, spinning the motor quickly even by hand is quite noisy.  Under power
on the test bench it is a very noticeable noise and qualifies as the "funny
sound" I was hearing after replacing the fuse blown by my mistake and
powering the machine back up.

 

Live and learn, and at my ripe old age I still learn something new every
day.

 

I now need to replace the bearings.  Does anyone have a Teletype part number
84020 bearing puller the wouldn't mind parting with?  Or maybe I should
check with Paul Cembura.  Or just use eBay or Amazon.

 

I already have the bearings on order.

 

Steve G./N4TTY

 

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From teletypeparts at comcast.net  Mon Jan  4 14:20:33 2021
From: teletypeparts at comcast.net (WAYNE)
Date: Mon, 4 Jan 2021 14:20:33 -0500 (EST)
Subject: [GreenKeys] 40 &20m rtty
In-Reply-To: <DM6PR13MB420433F5C87CFD30368683B2FBD20@DM6PR13MB4204.namprd13.prod.outlook.com>
References: <CA+EZRJmorwemdUAimDpJpEvCMsK0d-dQOLKcAiAUJuRN018jTg@mail.gmail.com>
	<EA98F698-46B2-4EC1-9D16-1B91F12FE8F2@att.net>
	<96155893.289929.1609619914210@connect.xfinity.com>
	<70046D4C-9EBB-49E3-A2BF-D5D2664FEFD2@att.net>,
	<3951A24C-D563-4EF0-8407-7AA1A038C028@att.net>
	<DM6PR13MB420433F5C87CFD30368683B2FBD20@DM6PR13MB4204.namprd13.prod.outlook.com>
Message-ID: <1658296989.98522.1609788034058@connect.xfinity.com>

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From djones at k6yic.com  Mon Jan  4 16:11:53 2021
From: djones at k6yic.com (Daniel Jones)
Date: Mon, 4 Jan 2021 13:11:53 -0800
Subject: [GreenKeys] Good RTTY issue of 73 Mag
Message-ID: <08BD56B7-B7AB-4AB9-9EA0-AECEFAD53E5E@k6yic.com>

Found this edition of 73 Magazine (Sept 1977)

Lots of good information as a large majority of the issue was dedicated to RTTY and since 73 is free to view on archive.org I figured I would give the link.  

https://archive.org/details/73-magazine-1977-09/mode/2up

Daniel

K6YIC 
http://K6YIC.com
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From jim.w2jc at gmail.com  Mon Jan  4 16:12:51 2021
From: jim.w2jc at gmail.com (Jim Cooper)
Date: Mon, 04 Jan 2021 16:12:51 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] AC Sych Motors
Message-ID: <5FF384D3.20028.149CCEDE@jim.w2jc.gmail.com>

Been probing around in the storage area again ... 




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From jhhaynes at earthlink.net  Mon Jan  4 16:21:51 2021
From: jhhaynes at earthlink.net (Jim Haynes)
Date: Mon, 4 Jan 2021 15:21:51 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [GreenKeys] M28ASR Motor Saga
In-Reply-To: <294c01d6e2bf$aa5a8be0$ff0fa3a0$@gmail.com>
References: <294c01d6e2bf$aa5a8be0$ff0fa3a0$@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <alpine.DEB.2.20.2101041516170.8739@Frances>

I have replaced a lot of noisy motor bearings, but it's been a while so
I don't remember the exact procedure.  But I know I didn't have the
official bearing puller.  Maybe something I got at an auto store.  Since
the bearings you are taking off are no good it doesn't matter if you
ruin them further getting them off.  And to put the new ones on you just
need a piece of pipe or tubing that will fit over the shaft and press on
the inner bearing cylinder.  And then start the bearing onto the shaft
and tap on the end of the pipe.

 	---

 	"Ya can argue all ya wanna, but it's dif'rent than it was."
 	"No it ain't! No it ain't!  But ya gotta know the territory."
 		Meredith Willson, The Music Man

From hanyou at xsmail.com  Mon Jan  4 16:55:54 2021
From: hanyou at xsmail.com (E.)
Date: Mon, 4 Jan 2021 15:55:54 -0600
Subject: [GreenKeys] Help ID'ing a 15/19 type basket part...
Message-ID: <5B8D79C1-42BC-43AF-B424-6F2BDC0EF949@xsmail.com>


Hey all,

Having a heck of a time trying to ID this one part ;o ? it goes into the middle round slot of the 15/19 type basket ribbon holder (nutted onto it below the holder) and the spool shaft goes into middle of the ?it".  As you can see, I busted it in half years ago while trying to unseize the shaft :/ (always the last step in something when it breaks - at least seems like it ~o~; . . .).  Part diagram and photo attached :) .


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From w9ddd at tapr.org  Mon Jan  4 17:14:14 2021
From: w9ddd at tapr.org (John, W9DDD)
Date: Mon, 4 Jan 2021 16:14:14 -0600
Subject: [GreenKeys] Help ID'ing a 15/19 type basket part...
In-Reply-To: <5B8D79C1-42BC-43AF-B424-6F2BDC0EF949@xsmail.com>
References: <5B8D79C1-42BC-43AF-B424-6F2BDC0EF949@xsmail.com>
Message-ID: <9dbc25d9-fb33-3737-cd50-8fcb9f7102d6@tapr.org>

My guess would be the bushing 74969

John, W9DDD

On 1/4/2021 3:55 PM, E. wrote:
> 
> Hey all,
> 
> Having a heck of a time trying to ID this one part ;o ? it goes into the 
> middle round slot of the 15/19 type basket ribbon holder (nutted onto it 
> below the holder) and the spool shaft goes into middle of the ?it". ?As 
> you can see, I busted it in half years ago while trying to unseize the 
> shaft :/ (always the last step in something when it breaks - at least 
> seems like it ~o~; . . .). ?Part diagram and photo attached :) .
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
> 
>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
> 
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to w9ddd at tapr.org
> 

From steve.n4tty at gmail.com  Mon Jan  4 17:25:28 2021
From: steve.n4tty at gmail.com (Steve Garrison)
Date: Mon, 4 Jan 2021 17:25:28 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] M28ASR Motor Saga
In-Reply-To: <alpine.DEB.2.20.2101041516170.8739@Frances>
References: <294c01d6e2bf$aa5a8be0$ff0fa3a0$@gmail.com>
	<alpine.DEB.2.20.2101041516170.8739@Frances>
Message-ID: <2b3501d6e2e8$81f73440$85e59cc0$@gmail.com>

Yes Jim, I have a bearing puller coming from Amazon that should work just
fine.  Although I have sent a note to Paul Cembura to see if he had the
official Teletype bearing puller (part #84020) in his stock, just in case
the one from Amazon doesn't look like it will work.  And that method for
putting the new bearings onto the shaft has been noted by a couple of other.
Especially about pressing on the inner bearing cylinder.

Steve G./N4TTY



-----Original Message-----
From: Jim Haynes <jhhaynes at earthlink.net> 
Sent: Monday, January 4, 2021 4:22 PM
To: N4TTY at ARRL.NET
Cc: Greenkeys <greenkeys at mailman.qth.net>
Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] M28ASR Motor Saga

I have replaced a lot of noisy motor bearings, but it's been a while so I
don't remember the exact procedure.  But I know I didn't have the official
bearing puller.  Maybe something I got at an auto store.  Since the bearings
you are taking off are no good it doesn't matter if you ruin them further
getting them off.  And to put the new ones on you just need a piece of pipe
or tubing that will fit over the shaft and press on the inner bearing
cylinder.  And then start the bearing onto the shaft and tap on the end of
the pipe.

 	---

 	"Ya can argue all ya wanna, but it's dif'rent than it was."
 	"No it ain't! No it ain't!  But ya gotta know the territory."
 		Meredith Willson, The Music Man


From hanyou at xsmail.com  Mon Jan  4 17:26:50 2021
From: hanyou at xsmail.com (E.)
Date: Mon, 4 Jan 2021 16:26:50 -0600
Subject: [GreenKeys] Help ID'ing a 15/19 type basket part...
Message-ID: <6AD1551A-D2EF-418B-BCC4-2FC2C0E7C6CF@xsmail.com>


Whoa, hey guys, that was an explosion of emails all at once ;p !  Quite a few offered to send the part and also look for it too, so thank you all for your replies and offers ^^ !!!  I?m going to reply to one here shortly - may have to draw a number out of a basket to make it fair/even xD .

Thanks again and happy New Years all ^^ !

^_^

From nagle at animats.com  Mon Jan  4 19:33:24 2021
From: nagle at animats.com (John Nagle)
Date: Mon, 4 Jan 2021 16:33:24 -0800
Subject: [GreenKeys] Help ID'ing a 15/19 type basket part...
In-Reply-To: <mailman.26808.1609797365.3115.greenkeys@mailman.qth.net>
References: <mailman.26808.1609797365.3115.greenkeys@mailman.qth.net>
Message-ID: <268c66d4-ad12-b286-c742-2c9228957dca@animats.com>


On 1/4/21 1:56 PM, greenkeys-request at mailman.qth.net wrote:
> Having a heck of a time trying to ID this one part ;o ? it goes into the middle round slot of the 15/19 type basket ribbon holder (nutted onto it below the holder) and the spool shaft goes into middle of the ?it".  As you can see, I busted it in half years ago while trying to unseize the shaft :/ (always the last step in something when it breaks - at least seems like it ~o~; . . .).  Part diagram and photo attached :) .

2201 Nut
74969 Bushing
70796 Spool Cup

I'm not clear on exactly what holds the
spool cup on, though. I just looked at a
Model 15, and it's not obvious.

				John Nagle

From harold at w6iwi.org  Mon Jan  4 21:30:11 2021
From: harold at w6iwi.org (Harold Hallikainen)
Date: Mon, 4 Jan 2021 18:30:11 -0800
Subject: [GreenKeys] Model 14 typing reperf keyboard key caps needed
Message-ID: <46f2c7fae4b86813379dfd61cdd32fa4.squirrel@mai.hallikainen.org>

Anyone have extra keycaps? I'm missing P and blank.

THANKS!

Harold
https://w6iwi.org



-- 
FCC Rules Updated Daily at http://www.hallikainen.com
Not sent from an iPhone.

From harold at w6iwi.org  Mon Jan  4 21:52:16 2021
From: harold at w6iwi.org (Harold Hallikainen)
Date: Mon, 4 Jan 2021 18:52:16 -0800
Subject: [GreenKeys] WTB: 11/16 inch paper tape for model 14
Message-ID: <182e81a7b9118608aaab839004eb0f4c.squirrel@mai.hallikainen.org>

Since I just got a model 14 typing reperf running, I'll need some tape.
Does anyone have some on hand or suggest a supplier?

Thanks!

Harold
https://w6iwi.org




-- 
FCC Rules Updated Daily at http://www.hallikainen.com
Not sent from an iPhone.

From harold at w6iwi.org  Tue Jan  5 00:45:29 2021
From: harold at w6iwi.org (Harold Hallikainen)
Date: Mon, 4 Jan 2021 21:45:29 -0800
Subject: [GreenKeys] Good RTTY issue of 73 Mag
In-Reply-To: <08BD56B7-B7AB-4AB9-9EA0-AECEFAD53E5E@k6yic.com>
References: <08BD56B7-B7AB-4AB9-9EA0-AECEFAD53E5E@k6yic.com>
Message-ID: <307a392dcde4dcca1c4aa7d1e7b124f9.squirrel@mai.hallikainen.org>


> Found this edition of 73 Magazine (Sept 1977)
>
> Lots of good information as a large majority of the issue was dedicated to
> RTTY and since 73 is free to view on archive.org I figured I would give
> the link.
>
> https://archive.org/details/73-magazine-1977-09/mode/2up
>
> Daniel
>
> K6YIC

Nice to review! It took a lot of hardware to do anything then (such as the
moving character display and CRT displays). In the late 1970s I designed a
product that used the Lear Siegler ADM-1 CRT terminal. There was a huge
PCB full of small scale integration ICs. I think back then I paid about
$1.2k per terminal. Now you can do more with a $10 Raspberry Pi.

Stuff has changed, but my model 15 still works great!

Harold
https://w6iwi.org




-- 
FCC Rules Updated Daily at http://www.hallikainen.com
Not sent from an iPhone.

From djones at k6yic.com  Wed Jan  6 15:00:11 2021
From: djones at k6yic.com (Daniel Jones)
Date: Wed, 6 Jan 2021 12:00:11 -0800
Subject: [GreenKeys] TT-253/UG KTR followed me home
Message-ID: <F2E62552-7AFA-4868-A389-ADAA70AA864B@k6yic.com>

Just picked up this clean KTR locally.  Now I will have to hear my wife ask why I need another loud teletype.  Preserving history is becoming a hard sell LOL. 

Daniel 

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K6YIC 
http://K6YIC.com

From w9ddd at tapr.org  Wed Jan  6 15:07:38 2021
From: w9ddd at tapr.org (John, W9DDD)
Date: Wed, 6 Jan 2021 14:07:38 -0600
Subject: [GreenKeys] TT-253/UG KTR followed me home
In-Reply-To: <F2E62552-7AFA-4868-A389-ADAA70AA864B@k6yic.com>
References: <F2E62552-7AFA-4868-A389-ADAA70AA864B@k6yic.com>
Message-ID: <7bc111c8-47e6-cec1-2419-9ef5d9d9f596@tapr.org>

Looks pretty cherry!

John, W9DDD

On 1/6/2021 2:00 PM, Daniel Jones wrote:
> Just picked up this clean KTR locally.  Now I will have to hear my wife ask why I need another loud teletype.  Preserving history is becoming a hard sell LOL.
> 
> Daniel
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> K6YIC
> http://K6YIC.com
> 
> 
> 
> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
> 
>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
> 
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to w9ddd at tapr.org
> 

From djones at k6yic.com  Wed Jan  6 15:28:11 2021
From: djones at k6yic.com (Daniel Jones)
Date: Wed, 6 Jan 2021 12:28:11 -0800
Subject: [GreenKeys] M35 ASR 8 level machine
Message-ID: <876D41FF-DFC3-4FFC-9A72-4743331B7200@k6yic.com>

The guy I picked up my KTR has this 35 ASR also.  He has it listed for 400 on eBay but would take 250 for it.  It?s complete and an great shape.  

It?s in Glendale California.  Message me off line if interested and I can give you his email.  I have no part in the sale except for passing the information along.  

https://www.ebay.com/itm/224222004696

Daniel

K6YIC 
http://K6YIC.com
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From til128 at juno.com  Wed Jan  6 15:59:28 2021
From: til128 at juno.com (til128 at juno.com)
Date: Wed, 6 Jan 2021 20:59:28 GMT
Subject: [GreenKeys] TT-253/UG KTR followed me home
Message-ID: <20210106.155928.17511.0@webmail04.dca.untd.com>

Just do what I do - tell her it was in the garage all the time and you just pulled it out. LOL!

TT


---------- Original Message ----------
From: Daniel Jones <djones at k6yic.com>
To: GREENKEYS BULLETIN BOARD <greenkeys at mailman.qth.net>
Subject: [GreenKeys] TT-253/UG KTR followed me home
Date: Wed, 6 Jan 2021 12:00:11 -0800

Just picked up this clean KTR locally.  Now I will have to hear my wife ask why I need another loud teletype.  Preserving history is becoming a hard sell LOL. 

Daniel 
____________________________________________________________
Sponsored by https://www.newser.com/?utm_source=part&utm_medium=uol&utm_campaign=rss_taglines_more

Protesters Storm Barricades, Breach the US Capitol
http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL3131/5ff6250743c81250749dast04duc1
Republicans Object to Arizona Tally, to Applause
http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL3131/5ff6250768bfc250749dast04duc2
Report: Merrick Garland Will Be Biden's Attorney General
http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL3131/5ff625078e0b9250749dast04duc3

From kn4ucl at gmail.com  Wed Jan  6 17:20:21 2021
From: kn4ucl at gmail.com (Andy KN4UCL)
Date: Wed, 6 Jan 2021 17:20:21 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] TT-253/UG KTR followed me home
In-Reply-To: <F2E62552-7AFA-4868-A389-ADAA70AA864B@k6yic.com>
References: <F2E62552-7AFA-4868-A389-ADAA70AA864B@k6yic.com>
Message-ID: <C87B5822-A6E3-4FBB-9419-5B7FCDF2B4DE@gmail.com>

That is a nice looking machine!

> On Jan 6, 2021, at 3:00 PM, Daniel Jones <djones at k6yic.com> wrote:
> 
> ?Just picked up this clean KTR locally.  Now I will have to hear my wife ask why I need another loud teletype.  Preserving history is becoming a hard sell LOL. 
> 
> Daniel 
> 
> <image0.jpeg>
> 
> 
> K6YIC 
> http://K6YIC.com______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
> 
>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
> 
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to kn4ucl at gmail.com

From djones at k6yic.com  Wed Jan  6 19:06:17 2021
From: djones at k6yic.com (Daniel Jones)
Date: Wed, 6 Jan 2021 16:06:17 -0800
Subject: [GreenKeys] TT-253/UG KTR followed me home
In-Reply-To: <20210106.155928.17511.0@webmail04.dca.untd.com>
References: <20210106.155928.17511.0@webmail04.dca.untd.com>
Message-ID: <FD38BC7F-3340-45AA-943A-1130DDDF8A2B@k6yic.com>

That is something I also use, works almost every time.  

She once told me that sometimes she walks around my garage shop just to see what else looks new.  

She is very understanding of my hobby (problem) of vintage Navy and Teletype equipment.  

Dan

K6YIC 
http://K6YIC.com

> On Jan 6, 2021, at 13:01, til128 at juno.com wrote:
> 
> ?Just do what I do - tell her it was in the garage all the time and you just pulled it out. LOL!
> 
> TT
> 
> 
> ---------- Original Message ----------
> From: Daniel Jones <djones at k6yic.com>
> To: GREENKEYS BULLETIN BOARD <greenkeys at mailman.qth.net>
> Subject: [GreenKeys] TT-253/UG KTR followed me home
> Date: Wed, 6 Jan 2021 12:00:11 -0800
> 
> Just picked up this clean KTR locally.  Now I will have to hear my wife ask why I need another loud teletype.  Preserving history is becoming a hard sell LOL. 
> 
> Daniel 
> ____________________________________________________________
> Sponsored by https://www.newser.com/?utm_source=part&utm_medium=uol&utm_campaign=rss_taglines_more
> 
> Protesters Storm Barricades, Breach the US Capitol
> http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL3131/5ff6250743cf125071c0est03duc1
> Republicans Object to Arizona Tally, to Applause
> http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL3131/5ff6250767d0c25071c0est03duc2
> Report: Merrick Garland Will Be Biden's Attorney General
> http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL3131/5ff625078c0fd25071c0est03duc3


From trsnider at cox.net  Wed Jan  6 19:19:21 2021
From: trsnider at cox.net (Tony Snider)
Date: Wed, 6 Jan 2021 19:19:21 -0500 (EST)
Subject: [GreenKeys] TT-253/UG KTR followed me home
In-Reply-To: <FD38BC7F-3340-45AA-943A-1130DDDF8A2B@k6yic.com>
References: <20210106.155928.17511.0@webmail04.dca.untd.com>
	<FD38BC7F-3340-45AA-943A-1130DDDF8A2B@k6yic.com>
Message-ID: <435580398.1064999.1609978761307@myemail.cox.net>

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From wa3frp at gmail.com  Fri Jan  8 09:00:14 2021
From: wa3frp at gmail.com (Russ Miller)
Date: Fri, 8 Jan 2021 09:00:14 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] RTTY QSO
Message-ID: <CAMVk04A=spMNnEJF6XqsNPLRm6CSQXW+wZGi73Q7miXxFwbi-w@mail.gmail.com>

Hi Nick,

If things work out, I plan to try to transmit 850 Hz shift tomorrow and
join you and the group on 40M RTTY.

Please listen for me if that is possible.

Thanks  73

Russ WA3FRP
i-Telex 834328 WUTMPAM CHIL
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From dave at horsfall.org  Sun Jan 10 04:03:09 2021
From: dave at horsfall.org (Dave Horsfall)
Date: Sun, 10 Jan 2021 20:03:09 +1100 (EST)
Subject: [GreenKeys] The most annoying part of Teletype restoration.
In-Reply-To: <d40b6365-1a04-d098-ed3f-4d1660b788ec@ntlworld.com>
References: <4C448179-311A-4641-A2EE-308F15B54E01@tapr.org>
	<78B1CAA6-43D9-4AB8-A2B0-A3B567471B2C@wowway.com>
	<437d01d6d51a$9b389150$d1a9b3f0$@net>
	<74FEEF8C-B331-42E5-99BC-7BC3CFD36D55@xsmail.com>
	<d76e2c1d-1fb9-cd0f-3ab4-9b15fcefe66a@ix.netcom.com>
	<d40b6365-1a04-d098-ed3f-4d1660b788ec@ntlworld.com>
Message-ID: <alpine.BSF.2.21.9999.2101101950480.26789@aneurin.horsfall.org>

On Sat, 19 Dec 2020, Sam Hallas via GreenKeys wrote:

> I have a roll of the flat variety and use it so seldom it will last my 
> lifetime, I'm sure. I learned how to lace cables 50 years ago when I 
> worked on exchange installation in the days of step-by-step switching.

Also known here in Oz as "stagger by stagger" switching, according to my 
brother who used to work for the PMG.  And if you've seen those things in 
action, you'll know why.

And yes, cable lacing is an art.

> I have been told that waxed twine can be bought at ship's chandlers as I 
> understand it's used in mending sails.

Chandlers sell all sorts of things; there was one opposite where I used to 
slave ^W work (my then $PHB wanted to know where he could buy an NMEA 
receiver for his boat).

-- Dave

From djones at k6yic.com  Sun Jan 10 18:58:56 2021
From: djones at k6yic.com (Daniel Jones)
Date: Sun, 10 Jan 2021 15:58:56 -0800
Subject: [GreenKeys] Raspberry pi
Message-ID: <B5C66BA8-C9D0-439B-A7FD-ED25B09BE02A@k6yic.com>

I have just acquired a RPi that is set up to feed my machine the autostart channel.  It?s a heck of a lot easier then leaving my computer hooked up all the time.  

Gary Lopes WA6MEM set it up.  We are planning on using the same thing at the battleship Iowa to have allow the teletypes to occasionally operate while tours are going on.  

Daniel

K6YIC 
http://K6YIC.com

From w9ddd at tapr.org  Sun Jan 10 20:03:39 2021
From: w9ddd at tapr.org (w9ddd at tapr.org)
Date: Sun, 10 Jan 2021 19:03:39 -0600
Subject: [GreenKeys] Raspberry pi
In-Reply-To: <B5C66BA8-C9D0-439B-A7FD-ED25B09BE02A@k6yic.com>
References: <B5C66BA8-C9D0-439B-A7FD-ED25B09BE02A@k6yic.com>
Message-ID: <3270F2C0-CC17-4EB9-BAF1-56AF976EB519@tapr.org>

Details please!

John, W9DDD


> On Jan 10, 2021, at 5:58 PM, Daniel Jones <djones at k6yic.com> wrote:
> 
> I have just acquired a RPi that is set up to feed my machine the autostart channel.  It?s a heck of a lot easier then leaving my computer hooked up all the time.  
> 
> Gary Lopes WA6MEM set it up.  We are planning on using the same thing at the battleship Iowa to have allow the teletypes to occasionally operate while tours are going on.  
> 
> Daniel
> 
> K6YIC 
> http://K6YIC.com
> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
> 
>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
> 
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to w9ddd at tapr.org


From creativegardening at hotmail.com  Sun Jan 10 20:06:49 2021
From: creativegardening at hotmail.com (Nick)
Date: Mon, 11 Jan 2021 01:06:49 +0000
Subject: [GreenKeys] Raspberry pi
In-Reply-To: <3270F2C0-CC17-4EB9-BAF1-56AF976EB519@tapr.org>
References: <B5C66BA8-C9D0-439B-A7FD-ED25B09BE02A@k6yic.com>,
	<3270F2C0-CC17-4EB9-BAF1-56AF976EB519@tapr.org>
Message-ID: <BN7PR03MB3922B296E6B563655AAE9CF3AFAB0@BN7PR03MB3922.namprd03.prod.outlook.com>

..... and a few pictures of the actual event later on.

Thanks,
Nick  -  N0NCQ



Sent from my T-Mobile 4G LTE Device



-------- Original message --------
From: w9ddd at tapr.org
Date: 1/10/21 7:04 PM (GMT-06:00)
To: Daniel Jones <djones at k6yic.com>
Cc: GREENKEYS BULLETIN BOARD <greenkeys at mailman.qth.net>
Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] Raspberry pi

Details please!

John, W9DDD


> On Jan 10, 2021, at 5:58 PM, Daniel Jones <djones at k6yic.com> wrote:
>
> I have just acquired a RPi that is set up to feed my machine the autostart channel.  It?s a heck of a lot easier then leaving my computer hooked up all the time.
>
> Gary Lopes WA6MEM set it up.  We are planning on using the same thing at the battleship Iowa to have allow the teletypes to occasionally operate while tours are going on.
>
> Daniel
>
> K6YIC
> http://K6YIC.com
> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
>
>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to w9ddd at tapr.org

______________________________________________________________
GreenKeys mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net

>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to creativegardening at hotmail.com
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From duncanancy at earthlink.net  Mon Jan 11 09:50:59 2021
From: duncanancy at earthlink.net (Duncan Brown)
Date: Mon, 11 Jan 2021 09:50:59 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] Raspberry pi
In-Reply-To: <B5C66BA8-C9D0-439B-A7FD-ED25B09BE02A@k6yic.com>
References: <B5C66BA8-C9D0-439B-A7FD-ED25B09BE02A@k6yic.com>
Message-ID: <7d0d55f7-9845-7fb9-b75d-d2e379fd54b1@earthlink.net>

RasPi works great for bringing in ITTY for your TTYs!

The AWA Museum has one (thanks to Paul, W2TTY) for copying the main ITTY 
stream. It powers up when we turn on the TTY display, connects to our 
WIFI, and in a few seconds is providing AFSK background "music". It also 
drives a Dovetron (with real CRT display). Whenever we want to show a 
TTY in action, we just take the Dovetron out of standby and start 
printing ITTY.

At the end of the day, we just kill all the power to the display. It 
does not seem to bother the RasPi to be shut down that way.

Have fun,

Duncan
K2OEQ


On 10-Jan-21 18:58, Daniel Jones wrote:
> I have just acquired a RPi that is set up to feed my machine the autostart channel.  It?s a heck of a lot easier then leaving my computer hooked up all the time.
>
> Gary Lopes WA6MEM set it up.  We are planning on using the same thing at the battleship Iowa to have allow the teletypes to occasionally operate while tours are going on.
>
> Daniel
>
> K6YIC
> http://K6YIC.com
> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
>
>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to duncanancy at earthlink.net


From paul0926 at comcast.net  Mon Jan 11 10:20:38 2021
From: paul0926 at comcast.net (Paul Heller)
Date: Mon, 11 Jan 2021 16:20:38 +0100
Subject: [GreenKeys] Raspberry pi
In-Reply-To: <7d0d55f7-9845-7fb9-b75d-d2e379fd54b1@earthlink.net>
References: <7d0d55f7-9845-7fb9-b75d-d2e379fd54b1@earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <967DC3BF-708D-4348-85E0-8CD257A3B63D@comcast.net>

I have a made and given away a few raspberry PIs to receive the various ITTY stations. Over time they began to work better, but all versions (the first ones were pretty crude) have the same basic features: a momentary push button to change the channels among the ITTY channels and a flashing LED that indicates what channel is being listened to. It was all driven by python and gave me a chance to experiment with the PI and provide something useful.

They all run headless without the need for a keyboard or display.

If you only want one ITTY channel, you don?t need the push button nor the LED.

Have fun!

Paul
W2TTY

> On Jan 11, 2021, at 3:51 PM, Duncan Brown <duncanancy at earthlink.net> wrote:
> 
> ?RasPi works great for bringing in ITTY for your TTYs!
> 
> The AWA Museum has one (thanks to Paul, W2TTY) for copying the main ITTY stream. It powers up when we turn on the TTY display, connects to our WIFI, and in a few seconds is providing AFSK background "music". It also drives a Dovetron (with real CRT display). Whenever we want to show a TTY in action, we just take the Dovetron out of standby and start printing ITTY.
> 
> At the end of the day, we just kill all the power to the display. It does not seem to bother the RasPi to be shut down that way.
> 
> Have fun,
> 
> Duncan
> K2OEQ
> 
> 
>> On 10-Jan-21 18:58, Daniel Jones wrote:
>> I have just acquired a RPi that is set up to feed my machine the autostart channel.  It?s a heck of a lot easier then leaving my computer hooked up all the time.
>> 
>> Gary Lopes WA6MEM set it up.  We are planning on using the same thing at the battleship Iowa to have allow the teletypes to occasionally operate while tours are going on.
>> 
>> Daniel
>> 
>> K6YIC
>> http://K6YIC.com
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> GreenKeys mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
>> 
>>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>> Message delivered to duncanancy at earthlink.net
> 
> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
> 
>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
> 
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to paul0926 at comcast.net


From w9ddd at tapr.org  Mon Jan 11 14:10:22 2021
From: w9ddd at tapr.org (John, W9DDD)
Date: Mon, 11 Jan 2021 13:10:22 -0600
Subject: [GreenKeys] Crooked Crossbar
Message-ID: <9f76ad7d-14f1-05ec-41c5-5e59b9b3ff6c@tapr.org>

The crossbar on my KSR looks like a swayback horse.  It has almost a 
1/4" gap between it and keyboard gasket.

Suggestions on how to straighten it will be appreciated.  This seems 
like something that could go wrong if done the wrong way.


-- 
John, W9DDD

From w9ddd at tapr.org  Mon Jan 11 14:13:24 2021
From: w9ddd at tapr.org (John, W9DDD)
Date: Mon, 11 Jan 2021 13:13:24 -0600
Subject: [GreenKeys] Raspberry pi
In-Reply-To: <967DC3BF-708D-4348-85E0-8CD257A3B63D@comcast.net>
References: <7d0d55f7-9845-7fb9-b75d-d2e379fd54b1@earthlink.net>
	<967DC3BF-708D-4348-85E0-8CD257A3B63D@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <1804320a-f2dd-d94c-f5f9-0349e34d75e1@tapr.org>

So are you these to get audio out to a TU, or some other way to drive 
the printer.  Possibly fldigi and running into a Volpe board and 
skipping audio out.

I can certainly see using a Pi separate from the PC, since anytime I 
bump the mouse on the PC, the printer skips a beat.

John, W9DDD

On 1/11/2021 9:20 AM, Paul Heller wrote:
> I have a made and given away a few raspberry PIs to receive the various ITTY stations. Over time they began to work better, but all versions (the first ones were pretty crude) have the same basic features: a momentary push button to change the channels among the ITTY channels and a flashing LED that indicates what channel is being listened to. It was all driven by python and gave me a chance to experiment with the PI and provide something useful.
> 
> They all run headless without the need for a keyboard or display.
> 
> If you only want one ITTY channel, you don?t need the push button nor the LED.
> 
> Have fun!
> 
> Paul
> W2TTY
> 
>> On Jan 11, 2021, at 3:51 PM, Duncan Brown <duncanancy at earthlink.net> wrote:
>>
>> ?RasPi works great for bringing in ITTY for your TTYs!
>>
>> The AWA Museum has one (thanks to Paul, W2TTY) for copying the main ITTY stream. It powers up when we turn on the TTY display, connects to our WIFI, and in a few seconds is providing AFSK background "music". It also drives a Dovetron (with real CRT display). Whenever we want to show a TTY in action, we just take the Dovetron out of standby and start printing ITTY.
>>
>> At the end of the day, we just kill all the power to the display. It does not seem to bother the RasPi to be shut down that way.
>>
>> Have fun,
>>
>> Duncan
>> K2OEQ
>>
>>
>>> On 10-Jan-21 18:58, Daniel Jones wrote:
>>> I have just acquired a RPi that is set up to feed my machine the autostart channel.  It?s a heck of a lot easier then leaving my computer hooked up all the time.
>>>
>>> Gary Lopes WA6MEM set it up.  We are planning on using the same thing at the battleship Iowa to have allow the teletypes to occasionally operate while tours are going on.
>>>
>>> Daniel
>>>
>>> K6YIC
>>> http://K6YIC.com
>>> ______________________________________________________________
>>> GreenKeys mailing list
>>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
>>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>>> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
>>>
>>>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>>>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
>>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>>> Message delivered to duncanancy at earthlink.net
>>
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> GreenKeys mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
>>
>>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
>>
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>> Message delivered to paul0926 at comcast.net
> 
> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
> 
>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
> 
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to w9ddd at tapr.org
> 

From duncanancy at earthlink.net  Mon Jan 11 14:18:07 2021
From: duncanancy at earthlink.net (Duncan Brown)
Date: Mon, 11 Jan 2021 14:18:07 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] RTTY operating bands
Message-ID: <376c5cdb-3ae5-6d10-9e1b-ff8dfb856ff0@earthlink.net>

Besides here on Greenkeys, there has recently been some interest on the 
MMTTY-SB-RTTY email list about (non-contest) RTTY operating.

Here is a URL listing the RTTY operating sub-bands:
https://www.rttycontesting.com/rtty/rtty-sub-bands/ 
<https://www.rttycontesting.com/rtty/rtty-sub-bands/>

Have fun,

Duncan,
K2OEQ




From paul0926 at comcast.net  Mon Jan 11 14:42:06 2021
From: paul0926 at comcast.net (Paul Heller)
Date: Mon, 11 Jan 2021 20:42:06 +0100
Subject: [GreenKeys] Raspberry pi
In-Reply-To: <1804320a-f2dd-d94c-f5f9-0349e34d75e1@tapr.org>
References: <1804320a-f2dd-d94c-f5f9-0349e34d75e1@tapr.org>
Message-ID: <82559426-E9B7-413D-AF9F-00AFCF146FD3@comcast.net>

In my case, because I wanted to use the TU, the Raspberry PI captures the ITTY stream, decodes it and sends it out its audio port (jack). That is then fed into a TU. 

When I set mine up, I used MPD (music player daemon) and daemontools-run to automatically start PMD each time the Raspberry PI was plugged in. 

As Duncan said, it can be set up with your wifi credentials or just used a wired Ethernet connection.

If there is interest, I could make a few SD cards available for sale at cost, set up and ready to go. You would have to furnish the raspberry PI and case. I could set things up so the default stream is ITTY, and if you want to invest in a momentary push button and an LED you could switch to the other streams. I won?t be able to work on this until late February, however, due to other commitments. 

Someday I am going to try using one of those small LCD screens on the PI to display what feed is being played. 

Paul
W2TTY

ITTY: 		HTTP://INTERNET-TTY.NET:8000/ITTY
AUTOSTART: HTTP://INTERNET-TTY.NET:8030/AUTOSTART
EUROPE: 	HTTP://INTERNET-TTY.NET:8040/EUROPE

> On Jan 11, 2021, at 8:17 PM, John, W9DDD <w9ddd at tapr.org> wrote:
> 
> ?So are you these to get audio out to a TU, or some other way to drive the printer.  Possibly fldigi and running into a Volpe board and skipping audio out.
> 
> I can certainly see using a Pi separate from the PC, since anytime I bump the mouse on the PC, the printer skips a beat.
> 
> John, W9DDD
> 
>> On 1/11/2021 9:20 AM, Paul Heller wrote:
>> I have a made and given away a few raspberry PIs to receive the various ITTY stations. Over time they began to work better, but all versions (the first ones were pretty crude) have the same basic features: a momentary push button to change the channels among the ITTY channels and a flashing LED that indicates what channel is being listened to. It was all driven by python and gave me a chance to experiment with the PI and provide something useful.
>> They all run headless without the need for a keyboard or display.
>> If you only want one ITTY channel, you don?t need the push button nor the LED.
>> Have fun!
>> Paul
>> W2TTY
>>>> On Jan 11, 2021, at 3:51 PM, Duncan Brown <duncanancy at earthlink.net> wrote:
>>> 
>>> ?RasPi works great for bringing in ITTY for your TTYs!
>>> 
>>> The AWA Museum has one (thanks to Paul, W2TTY) for copying the main ITTY stream. It powers up when we turn on the TTY display, connects to our WIFI, and in a few seconds is providing AFSK background "music". It also drives a Dovetron (with real CRT display). Whenever we want to show a TTY in action, we just take the Dovetron out of standby and start printing ITTY.
>>> 
>>> At the end of the day, we just kill all the power to the display. It does not seem to bother the RasPi to be shut down that way.
>>> 
>>> Have fun,
>>> 
>>> Duncan
>>> K2OEQ
>>> 
>>> 
>>>> On 10-Jan-21 18:58, Daniel Jones wrote:
>>>> I have just acquired a RPi that is set up to feed my machine the autostart channel.  It?s a heck of a lot easier then leaving my computer hooked up all the time.
>>>> 
>>>> Gary Lopes WA6MEM set it up.  We are planning on using the same thing at the battleship Iowa to have allow the teletypes to occasionally operate while tours are going on.
>>>> 
>>>> Daniel
>>>> 
>>>> K6YIC
>>>> http://K6YIC.com
>>>> ______________________________________________________________
>>>> GreenKeys mailing list
>>>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
>>>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>>>> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
>>>> 
>>>>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>>>>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
>>>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>>>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>>>> Message delivered to duncanancy at earthlink.net
>>> 
>>> ______________________________________________________________
>>> GreenKeys mailing list
>>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
>>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>>> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
>>> 
>>>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>>>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
>>> 
>>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>>> Message delivered to paul0926 at comcast.net
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> GreenKeys mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
>>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>> Message delivered to w9ddd at tapr.org
> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
> 
>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
> 
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to paul0926 at comcast.net
-------------- next part --------------
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From w9ddd at tapr.org  Mon Jan 11 14:51:23 2021
From: w9ddd at tapr.org (John, W9DDD)
Date: Mon, 11 Jan 2021 13:51:23 -0600
Subject: [GreenKeys] Raspberry pi
In-Reply-To: <82559426-E9B7-413D-AF9F-00AFCF146FD3@comcast.net>
References: <1804320a-f2dd-d94c-f5f9-0349e34d75e1@tapr.org>
	<82559426-E9B7-413D-AF9F-00AFCF146FD3@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <b38b0cbb-fa6c-cb9d-acdd-dea6782bf6c8@tapr.org>

I've done this with a Linux PC and I have several Pies, so I was just 
looking to see is anyone has been able to either use the Volpe board or 
other way of getting actual serial bits out of the Pi.

John, W9DDD

On 1/11/2021 1:42 PM, Paul Heller wrote:
> In my case, because I wanted to use the TU, the Raspberry PI captures 
> the ITTY stream, decodes it and sends it out its audio port (jack). That 
> is then fed into a TU.
> 
> When I set mine up, I used MPD (music player daemon) and daemontools-run 
> to automatically start PMD each time the Raspberry PI was plugged in.
> 
> As Duncan said, it can be set up with your wifi credentials or just used 
> a wired Ethernet connection.
> 
> If there is interest, I could make a few SD cards available for sale at 
> cost, set up and ready to go. You would have to furnish the raspberry PI 
> and case. I could set things up so the default stream is ITTY, and if 
> you want to invest in a momentary push button and an LED you could 
> switch to the other streams. I won?t be able to work on this until late 
> February, however, due to other commitments.
> 
> Someday I am going to try using one of those small LCD screens on the PI 
> to display what feed is being played.
> 
> Paul
> W2TTY
> 
> ITTY: HTTP://INTERNET-TTY.NET:8000/ITTY <HTTP://internet-tty.net:8000/ITTY>
> AUTOSTART: HTTP://INTERNET-TTY.NET:8030/AUTOSTART 
> <HTTP://internet-tty.net:8030/AUTOSTART>
> EUROPE: HTTP://INTERNET-TTY.NET:8040/EUROPE 
> <HTTP://internet-tty.net:8040/EUROPE>
> 
>> On Jan 11, 2021, at 8:17 PM, John, W9DDD <w9ddd at tapr.org> wrote:
>>
>> ?So are you these to get audio out to a TU, or some other way to drive 
>> the printer. ?Possibly fldigi and running into a Volpe board and 
>> skipping audio out.
>>
>> I can certainly see using a Pi separate from the PC, since anytime I 
>> bump the mouse on the PC, the printer skips a beat.
>>
>> John, W9DDD
>>
>> On 1/11/2021 9:20 AM, Paul Heller wrote:
>>> I have a made and given away a few raspberry PIs to receive the 
>>> various ITTY stations. Over time they began to work better, but all 
>>> versions (the first ones were pretty crude) have the same basic 
>>> features: a momentary push button to change the channels among the 
>>> ITTY channels and a flashing LED that indicates what channel is being 
>>> listened to. It was all driven by python and gave me a chance to 
>>> experiment with the PI and provide something useful.
>>> They all run headless without the need for a keyboard or display.
>>> If you only want one ITTY channel, you don?t need the push button nor 
>>> the LED.
>>> Have fun!
>>> Paul
>>> W2TTY
>>>> On Jan 11, 2021, at 3:51 PM, Duncan Brown <duncanancy at earthlink.net> 
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> ?RasPi works great for bringing in ITTY for your TTYs!
>>>>
>>>> The AWA Museum has one (thanks to Paul, W2TTY) for copying the main 
>>>> ITTY stream. It powers up when we turn on the TTY display, connects 
>>>> to our WIFI, and in a few seconds is providing AFSK background 
>>>> "music". It also drives a Dovetron (with real CRT display). Whenever 
>>>> we want to show a TTY in action, we just take the Dovetron out of 
>>>> standby and start printing ITTY.
>>>>
>>>> At the end of the day, we just kill all the power to the display. It 
>>>> does not seem to bother the RasPi to be shut down that way.
>>>>
>>>> Have fun,
>>>>
>>>> Duncan
>>>> K2OEQ
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> On 10-Jan-21 18:58, Daniel Jones wrote:
>>>>> I have just acquired a RPi that is set up to feed my machine the 
>>>>> autostart channel. ?It?s a heck of a lot easier then leaving my 
>>>>> computer hooked up all the time.
>>>>>
>>>>> Gary Lopes WA6MEM set it up. ?We are planning on using the same 
>>>>> thing at the battleship Iowa to have allow the teletypes to 
>>>>> occasionally operate while tours are going on.
>>>>>
>>>>> Daniel
>>>>>
>>>>> K6YIC
>>>>> http://K6YIC.com
>>>>> ______________________________________________________________
>>>>> GreenKeys mailing list
>>>>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
>>>>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>>>>> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: 
>>>>>>>> https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>>>>>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: 
>>>>>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>>>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: 
>>>>>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>>>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: 
>>>>>>>> http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
>>>>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>>>>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>>>>> Message delivered to duncanancy at earthlink.net
>>>>
>>>> ______________________________________________________________
>>>> GreenKeys mailing list
>>>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
>>>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>>>> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
>>>>
>>>>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: 
>>>>>>> https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>>>>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: 
>>>>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: 
>>>>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: 
>>>>>>> http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
>>>>
>>>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>>>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>>>> Message delivered to paul0926 at comcast.net
>>> ______________________________________________________________
>>> GreenKeys mailing list
>>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
>>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>>> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
>>>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: 
>>>>>> https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>>>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: 
>>>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: 
>>>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: 
>>>>>> http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
>>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>>> Message delivered to w9ddd at tapr.org
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> GreenKeys mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
>>
>>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: 
>>>>> https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: 
>>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: 
>>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: 
>>>>> http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
>>
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>> Message delivered to paul0926 at comcast.net

From epvgk at limpoc.com  Mon Jan 11 15:04:39 2021
From: epvgk at limpoc.com (epvgk at limpoc.com)
Date: Mon, 11 Jan 2021 12:04:39 -0800
Subject: [GreenKeys] Raspberry pi
In-Reply-To: <b38b0cbb-fa6c-cb9d-acdd-dea6782bf6c8@tapr.org>
References: <1804320a-f2dd-d94c-f5f9-0349e34d75e1@tapr.org>
	<82559426-E9B7-413D-AF9F-00AFCF146FD3@comcast.net>
	<b38b0cbb-fa6c-cb9d-acdd-dea6782bf6c8@tapr.org>
Message-ID: <20210111200439.GA33502@limpoc.com>

On Mon, Jan 11, 2021 at 01:51:23PM -0600, John, W9DDD wrote:
> I've done this with a Linux PC and I have several Pies, so I was just
> looking to see is anyone has been able to either use the Volpe board or
> other way of getting actual serial bits out of the Pi.
> 
> John, W9DDD

Yeah, it works fine for me. I use mplayer to play the itty stream and
a straight-through audio cable from the pi to the demod board. 

mplayer http://internet-tty.net:8000/ITTY

If you don't want to go to analog FSK audio and back to bits, you can do 
the demodulating in software on the pi itself and then send the ascii data to 
a loop via a USB-tty interface: 

curl -N -s http://internet-tty.net:8000/ITTY | lame --decode --quiet --mp3input - - | minimodem rtty -i -a -q --rx-one -R 11025 -f /dev/ttyACM0

Of course you can also use fldigi or whatever as well if you want a GUI. I think 
it has an option to write decoded text to a file, which you can then "tail -f" and
redirect into a usb interface or something else. 

> 
> On 1/11/2021 1:42 PM, Paul Heller wrote:
> > In my case, because I wanted to use the TU, the Raspberry PI captures
> > the ITTY stream, decodes it and sends it out its audio port (jack). That
> > is then fed into a TU.
> > 
> > When I set mine up, I used MPD (music player daemon) and daemontools-run
> > to automatically start PMD each time the Raspberry PI was plugged in.
> > 
> > As Duncan said, it can be set up with your wifi credentials or just used
> > a wired Ethernet connection.
> > 
> > If there is interest, I could make a few SD cards available for sale at
> > cost, set up and ready to go. You would have to furnish the raspberry PI
> > and case. I could set things up so the default stream is ITTY, and if
> > you want to invest in a momentary push button and an LED you could
> > switch to the other streams. I won?t be able to work on this until late
> > February, however, due to other commitments.
> > 
> > Someday I am going to try using one of those small LCD screens on the PI
> > to display what feed is being played.
> > 
> > Paul
> > W2TTY
> > 
> > ITTY: HTTP://INTERNET-TTY.NET:8000/ITTY <HTTP://internet-tty.net:8000/ITTY>
> > AUTOSTART: HTTP://INTERNET-TTY.NET:8030/AUTOSTART
> > <HTTP://internet-tty.net:8030/AUTOSTART>
> > EUROPE: HTTP://INTERNET-TTY.NET:8040/EUROPE
> > <HTTP://internet-tty.net:8040/EUROPE>
> > 
> > > On Jan 11, 2021, at 8:17 PM, John, W9DDD <w9ddd at tapr.org> wrote:
> > > 
> > > ?So are you these to get audio out to a TU, or some other way to
> > > drive the printer. ?Possibly fldigi and running into a Volpe board
> > > and skipping audio out.
> > > 
> > > I can certainly see using a Pi separate from the PC, since anytime I
> > > bump the mouse on the PC, the printer skips a beat.
> > > 
> > > John, W9DDD
> > > 
> > > On 1/11/2021 9:20 AM, Paul Heller wrote:
> > > > I have a made and given away a few raspberry PIs to receive the
> > > > various ITTY stations. Over time they began to work better, but
> > > > all versions (the first ones were pretty crude) have the same
> > > > basic features: a momentary push button to change the channels
> > > > among the ITTY channels and a flashing LED that indicates what
> > > > channel is being listened to. It was all driven by python and
> > > > gave me a chance to experiment with the PI and provide something
> > > > useful.
> > > > They all run headless without the need for a keyboard or display.
> > > > If you only want one ITTY channel, you don?t need the push
> > > > button nor the LED.
> > > > Have fun!
> > > > Paul
> > > > W2TTY
> > > > > On Jan 11, 2021, at 3:51 PM, Duncan Brown
> > > > > <duncanancy at earthlink.net> wrote:
> > > > > 
> > > > > ?RasPi works great for bringing in ITTY for your TTYs!
> > > > > 
> > > > > The AWA Museum has one (thanks to Paul, W2TTY) for copying
> > > > > the main ITTY stream. It powers up when we turn on the TTY
> > > > > display, connects to our WIFI, and in a few seconds is
> > > > > providing AFSK background "music". It also drives a Dovetron
> > > > > (with real CRT display). Whenever we want to show a TTY in
> > > > > action, we just take the Dovetron out of standby and start
> > > > > printing ITTY.
> > > > > 
> > > > > At the end of the day, we just kill all the power to the
> > > > > display. It does not seem to bother the RasPi to be shut
> > > > > down that way.
> > > > > 
> > > > > Have fun,
> > > > > 
> > > > > Duncan
> > > > > K2OEQ
> > > > > 
> > > > > 
> > > > > > On 10-Jan-21 18:58, Daniel Jones wrote:
> > > > > > I have just acquired a RPi that is set up to feed my
> > > > > > machine the autostart channel. ?It?s a heck of a lot
> > > > > > easier then leaving my computer hooked up all the time.
> > > > > > 
> > > > > > Gary Lopes WA6MEM set it up. ?We are planning on using
> > > > > > the same thing at the battleship Iowa to have allow the
> > > > > > teletypes to occasionally operate while tours are going
> > > > > > on.
> > > > > > 
> > > > > > Daniel
> > > > > > 
> > > > > > K6YIC
> > > > > > http://K6YIC.com
> > > > > > ______________________________________________________________
> > > > > > GreenKeys mailing list
> > > > > > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> > > > > > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> > > > > > Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
> > > > > > 
> > > > > > > > > Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search
> > > > > > > > > Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
> > > > > > > > > 2002-to-present greenkeys archive:
> > > > > > > > > http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
> > > > > > > > > 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive:
> > > > > > > > > http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
> > > > > > > > > Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys
> > > > > > > > > Search Tool:
> > > > > > > > > http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
> > > > > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> > > > > > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> > > > > > Message delivered to duncanancy at earthlink.net
> > > > > 
> > > > > ______________________________________________________________
> > > > > GreenKeys mailing list
> > > > > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> > > > > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> > > > > Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
> > > > > 
> > > > > > > > Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search
> > > > > > > > Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
> > > > > > > > 2002-to-present greenkeys archive:
> > > > > > > > http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
> > > > > > > > 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive:
> > > > > > > > http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
> > > > > > > > Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search
> > > > > > > > Tool:
> > > > > > > > http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
> > > > > 
> > > > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> > > > > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> > > > > Message delivered to paul0926 at comcast.net
> > > > ______________________________________________________________
> > > > GreenKeys mailing list
> > > > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> > > > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> > > > Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
> > > > > > > Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool:
> > > > > > > https://teletype.net/gksearch
> > > > > > > 2002-to-present greenkeys archive:
> > > > > > > http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
> > > > > > > 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive:
> > > > > > > http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
> > > > > > > Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool:
> > > > > > > http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
> > > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> > > > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> > > > Message delivered to w9ddd at tapr.org
> > > ______________________________________________________________
> > > GreenKeys mailing list
> > > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> > > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> > > Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
> > > 
> > > > > > Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool:
> > > > > > https://teletype.net/gksearch
> > > > > > 2002-to-present greenkeys archive:
> > > > > > http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
> > > > > > 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive:
> > > > > > http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
> > > > > > Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool:
> > > > > > http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
> > > 
> > > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> > > Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> > > Message delivered to paul0926 at comcast.net
> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
> 
> > > > Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
> > > > 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
> > > > 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
> > > > Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
> 
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to epvgk at limpoc.com

From navy.radio at gmail.com  Mon Jan 11 15:05:58 2021
From: navy.radio at gmail.com (Nick England)
Date: Mon, 11 Jan 2021 15:05:58 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] Utica NY estate sale - teletype?
Message-ID: <CAB55hNd71eWPc_jDe84diq2JeDt+bsY-9A1jrXZ1sFjffP8rxQ@mail.gmail.com>

The ad says " WWII teletype writer machine" but I didn't see it in the
photos. There is a LOT of interesting stuff here. I know nothing more.
https://syracuse.craigslist.org/gms/d/marcy-collectors-dream-sale/7259858836.html
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From hanyou at xsmail.com  Mon Jan 11 15:10:13 2021
From: hanyou at xsmail.com (E.)
Date: Mon, 11 Jan 2021 14:10:13 -0600
Subject: [GreenKeys] Raspberry pi
In-Reply-To: <b38b0cbb-fa6c-cb9d-acdd-dea6782bf6c8@tapr.org>
References: <1804320a-f2dd-d94c-f5f9-0349e34d75e1@tapr.org>
	<82559426-E9B7-413D-AF9F-00AFCF146FD3@comcast.net>
	<b38b0cbb-fa6c-cb9d-acdd-dea6782bf6c8@tapr.org>
Message-ID: <8214B225-85F6-4CFC-B6FC-AE20A18C98F3@xsmail.com>


What I do - I have a v1 Volpe board in series with the v2 Volpe board on the line loop? audio (and power) hooked up to the v1 with USB hooked up to the v2 - all via the Pi.  ITTY runs pretty well when I run the audio stream in the browser on the Pi through the v1 (some stuttering at the very beginning due to buffeting) - and Python scripts just the same (runs very well) when running them through v2.  Have had no real issues - except my Pi?s RAM can fill up pretty fast - but most of the time, GC comes to the rescue on that :) .  The real fun comes when you run both audio and a Python script at the same time ;p ? one of the two operators (Volpe boards) needs to hit that break switch and neither ever does ;) ~


> On Jan 11, 2021, at 1:51 pm, John, W9DDD <w9ddd at tapr.org> wrote:
> 
> I've done this with a Linux PC and I have several Pies, so I was just looking to see is anyone has been able to either use the Volpe board or other way of getting actual serial bits out of the Pi.
> 
> John, W9DDD


From navy.radio at gmail.com  Mon Jan 11 15:10:06 2021
From: navy.radio at gmail.com (Nick England)
Date: Mon, 11 Jan 2021 15:10:06 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] Erie PA - Western Union M15 KSR - $50
Message-ID: <CAB55hNdP4Z-hidMh1KkRf4cVmVoPbO34SMq-Liy-w6pkwukM8A@mail.gmail.com>

https://erie.craigslist.org/atq/d/erie-western-union-teletype-machine/7245327025.html
I know nothing more
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From navy.radio at gmail.com  Mon Jan 11 15:13:44 2021
From: navy.radio at gmail.com (Nick England)
Date: Mon, 11 Jan 2021 15:13:44 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] Teletype dental drill ??
Message-ID: <CAB55hNc96N-GC+F0N5Z96Z8k1x_KWQ9S59NiGqvEYY6xEdH6rg@mail.gmail.com>

Hey, I didn't make up the title - for your amusement...
https://sfbay.craigslist.org/eby/atq/d/concord-antique-teletype-dental-rotary/7255586180.html
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From hanyou at xsmail.com  Mon Jan 11 15:14:56 2021
From: hanyou at xsmail.com (E.)
Date: Mon, 11 Jan 2021 14:14:56 -0600
Subject: [GreenKeys] Utica NY estate sale - teletype?  (OT)
In-Reply-To: <CAB55hNd71eWPc_jDe84diq2JeDt+bsY-9A1jrXZ1sFjffP8rxQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAB55hNd71eWPc_jDe84diq2JeDt+bsY-9A1jrXZ1sFjffP8rxQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <86519FD6-5C79-4AB8-8734-E809A3EE59FB@xsmail.com>


Man, there?s some real cool train stuff there - including some Marx items ;o !  I used to collect that stuff, until the market priced me out of buying them ;p .


> On Jan 11, 2021, at 2:05 pm, Nick England <navy.radio at gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> The ad says " WWII teletype writer machine" but I didn't see it in the photos. There is a LOT of interesting stuff here. I know nothing more.
> https://syracuse.craigslist.org/gms/d/marcy-collectors-dream-sale/7259858836.html
> 
> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
> 
>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
> 
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to hanyou at xsmail.com


From kh-phillips at 9-5usa.org  Mon Jan 11 15:27:44 2021
From: kh-phillips at 9-5usa.org (Kevin H. Phillips)
Date: Mon, 11 Jan 2021 14:27:44 -0600
Subject: [GreenKeys] Teletype dental drill ??
In-Reply-To: <CAB55hNc96N-GC+F0N5Z96Z8k1x_KWQ9S59NiGqvEYY6xEdH6rg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAB55hNc96N-GC+F0N5Z96Z8k1x_KWQ9S59NiGqvEYY6xEdH6rg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <ff82bd50-f201-3233-9b92-fbda4cd4c8cd@9-5usa.org>

LOL.? "Now, just hold still.? This won't hurt a bit . . . "


Kevin

W5TTY


On 1/11/2021 2:13 PM, Nick England wrote:
> Hey, I didn't make up the title - for your amusement...
> https://sfbay.craigslist.org/eby/atq/d/concord-antique-teletype-dental-rotary/7255586180.html 
> <https://sfbay.craigslist.org/eby/atq/d/concord-antique-teletype-dental-rotary/7255586180.html>
>
>
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
>
>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to kh-phillips at 9-5usa.org


-- 
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
https://www.avast.com/antivirus
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From ka2ivy at verizon.net  Mon Jan 11 15:42:28 2021
From: ka2ivy at verizon.net (Bruce Gentry)
Date: Mon, 11 Jan 2021 15:42:28 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] Teletype dental drill ??
In-Reply-To: <CAB55hNc96N-GC+F0N5Z96Z8k1x_KWQ9S59NiGqvEYY6xEdH6rg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAB55hNc96N-GC+F0N5Z96Z8k1x_KWQ9S59NiGqvEYY6xEdH6rg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <77a8ac2b-fb37-6c6a-de2c-cfda3dedfdbb@verizon.net>

Interesting and skillful homebrew!

        Bruce Gentry, KA2IVY


On 1/11/21 15:13, Nick England wrote:
> Hey, I didn't make up the title - for your amusement...
> https://sfbay.craigslist.org/eby/atq/d/concord-antique-teletype-dental-rotary/7255586180.html
>
>
>
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
>
>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to ka2ivy at verizon.net

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From w9ddd at tapr.org  Mon Jan 11 15:46:55 2021
From: w9ddd at tapr.org (John, W9DDD)
Date: Mon, 11 Jan 2021 14:46:55 -0600
Subject: [GreenKeys] Utica NY estate sale - teletype?
In-Reply-To: <CAB55hNd71eWPc_jDe84diq2JeDt+bsY-9A1jrXZ1sFjffP8rxQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAB55hNd71eWPc_jDe84diq2JeDt+bsY-9A1jrXZ1sFjffP8rxQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <5bf135e4-460f-1b80-9f09-58a8bbf79434@tapr.org>

Oh, goodness don't let Mrs. W9DDD see those milk cans.  I closed my eyes 
at the train pictures, I don't need another hobby, although studying 
layout wiring diagrams as a 12 year old is what got me into ham radio 
and electronics.

John, W9DDD

On 1/11/2021 2:05 PM, Nick England wrote:
> The ad says " WWII teletype writer machine" but I didn't see it in the 
> photos. There is a LOT of interesting stuff here. I know nothing more.
> https://syracuse.craigslist.org/gms/d/marcy-collectors-dream-sale/7259858836.html
> 
> 
> 
> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
> 
>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
> 
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to w9ddd at tapr.org
> 

From harold at w6iwi.org  Mon Jan 11 16:52:57 2021
From: harold at w6iwi.org (Harold Hallikainen)
Date: Mon, 11 Jan 2021 13:52:57 -0800
Subject: [GreenKeys] Raspberry pi
In-Reply-To: <7d0d55f7-9845-7fb9-b75d-d2e379fd54b1@earthlink.net>
References: <B5C66BA8-C9D0-439B-A7FD-ED25B09BE02A@k6yic.com>
	<7d0d55f7-9845-7fb9-b75d-d2e379fd54b1@earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <c4ab937898a45a9386fbd5b08395c846.squirrel@mai.hallikainen.org>

Is there a web page that describes the project (required hardware, etc.)
and a software image? I have not used the RP before, but I understand that
you can just put an image on an SD card and boot it up.

Thanks!

Harold
https://w6iwi.org



-- 
FCC Rules Updated Daily at http://www.hallikainen.com
Not sent from an iPhone.

From dave at horsfall.org  Mon Jan 11 17:31:46 2021
From: dave at horsfall.org (Dave Horsfall)
Date: Tue, 12 Jan 2021 09:31:46 +1100 (EST)
Subject: [GreenKeys] Teletype dental drill ??
In-Reply-To: <ff82bd50-f201-3233-9b92-fbda4cd4c8cd@9-5usa.org>
References: <CAB55hNc96N-GC+F0N5Z96Z8k1x_KWQ9S59NiGqvEYY6xEdH6rg@mail.gmail.com>
	<ff82bd50-f201-3233-9b92-fbda4cd4c8cd@9-5usa.org>
Message-ID: <alpine.BSF.2.21.9999.2101120930080.26789@aneurin.horsfall.org>

On Mon, 11 Jan 2021, Kevin H. Phillips wrote:

> LOL.? "Now, just hold still.? This won't hurt a bit . . . "

Standard dentist joke:

"Will this hurt"?

"No, it won't hurt me a bit".

-- Dave VK2KFU

From tony.podrasky at gmail.com  Mon Jan 11 17:38:56 2021
From: tony.podrasky at gmail.com (tony.podrasky)
Date: Mon, 11 Jan 2021 14:38:56 -0800
Subject: [GreenKeys] Teletype dental drill ??
In-Reply-To: <alpine.BSF.2.21.9999.2101120930080.26789@aneurin.horsfall.org>
References: <CAB55hNc96N-GC+F0N5Z96Z8k1x_KWQ9S59NiGqvEYY6xEdH6rg@mail.gmail.com>	<ff82bd50-f201-3233-9b92-fbda4cd4c8cd@9-5usa.org>
	<alpine.BSF.2.21.9999.2101120930080.26789@aneurin.horsfall.org>
Message-ID: <5FFCD380.3040102@gmail.com>

That was bad, Dave - but I do much worse:

Wife: where are you going?
Husband: to the dentist. I think I have a cavity.
Wife: what time is your appointment?
Husband: Tooth Hurty

UE,
K2EAA - TONY
NNNN
ZCZC

On 01/11/2021 02:31 PM, Dave Horsfall wrote:
> On Mon, 11 Jan 2021, Kevin H. Phillips wrote:
>
>> LOL.  "Now, just hold still.  This won't hurt a bit . . . "
>
> Standard dentist joke:
>
> "Will this hurt"?
>
> "No, it won't hurt me a bit".
>
> -- Dave VK2KFU
>
>
-- 
Oh, great: This new "Day Planner" I bought has
nothing but blank pages.  Now I have no idea
what I'm supposed to be doing tomorrow.
                              -Blaine Hofmockel

From w8roi at wowway.com  Mon Jan 11 17:51:44 2021
From: w8roi at wowway.com (Ralph Irish)
Date: Mon, 11 Jan 2021 17:51:44 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] Teletype dental drill ??
In-Reply-To: <5FFCD380.3040102@gmail.com>
References: <CAB55hNc96N-GC+F0N5Z96Z8k1x_KWQ9S59NiGqvEYY6xEdH6rg@mail.gmail.com>	<ff82bd50-f201-3233-9b92-fbda4cd4c8cd@9-5usa.org>
	<alpine.BSF.2.21.9999.2101120930080.26789@aneurin.horsfall.org>
	<5FFCD380.3040102@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <A9A4A113-D4E6-4A5F-A82C-C294954F97B1@wowway.com>

Tony

Go to your room and sit in the corner until dinner!

-   -   -   -   -   -   -   -

On Jan 11, 2021, at 5:38 PM, tony.podrasky wrote:

> That was bad, Dave - but I do much worse:
> 
> Wife: where are you going?
> Husband: to the dentist. I think I have a cavity.
> Wife: what time is your appointment?
> Husband: Tooth Hurty
> 
> UE,
> K2EAA - TONY
> NNNN
> ZCZC
> 
> On 01/11/2021 02:31 PM, Dave Horsfall wrote:
>> On Mon, 11 Jan 2021, Kevin H. Phillips wrote:
>> 
>>> LOL.  "Now, just hold still.  This won't hurt a bit . . . "
>> 
>> Standard dentist joke:
>> 
>> "Will this hurt"?
>> 
>> "No, it won't hurt me a bit".
>> 
>> -- Dave VK2KFU
>> 
>> 
> -- 
> Oh, great: This new "Day Planner" I bought has
> nothing but blank pages.  Now I have no idea
> what I'm supposed to be doing tomorrow.
>                             -Blaine Hofmockel
> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
> 
>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
> 
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to w8roi at wowway.com

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From hanyou at xsmail.com  Mon Jan 11 18:04:36 2021
From: hanyou at xsmail.com (E.)
Date: Mon, 11 Jan 2021 17:04:36 -0600
Subject: [GreenKeys] Teletype dental drill ??
In-Reply-To: <5FFCD380.3040102@gmail.com>
References: <CAB55hNc96N-GC+F0N5Z96Z8k1x_KWQ9S59NiGqvEYY6xEdH6rg@mail.gmail.com>
	<ff82bd50-f201-3233-9b92-fbda4cd4c8cd@9-5usa.org>
	<alpine.BSF.2.21.9999.2101120930080.26789@aneurin.horsfall.org>
	<5FFCD380.3040102@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <15CED5B9-5953-4AE2-93CC-54A328AA1096@xsmail.com>


Dad jokes ;p ~


> On Jan 11, 2021, at 4:38 pm, tony.podrasky <tony.podrasky at gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> That was bad, Dave - but I do much worse:
> 
> Wife: where are you going?
> Husband: to the dentist. I think I have a cavity.
> Wife: what time is your appointment?
> Husband: Tooth Hurty
> 
> UE,
> K2EAA - TONY
> NNNN
> ZCZC
> 
> On 01/11/2021 02:31 PM, Dave Horsfall wrote:
>> On Mon, 11 Jan 2021, Kevin H. Phillips wrote:
>> 
>>> LOL.  "Now, just hold still.  This won't hurt a bit . . . "
>> 
>> Standard dentist joke:
>> 
>> "Will this hurt"?
>> 
>> "No, it won't hurt me a bit".
>> 
>> -- Dave VK2KFU

From tony.podrasky at gmail.com  Mon Jan 11 19:31:09 2021
From: tony.podrasky at gmail.com (tony.podrasky)
Date: Mon, 11 Jan 2021 16:31:09 -0800
Subject: [GreenKeys] Teletype dental drill ??
In-Reply-To: <A9A4A113-D4E6-4A5F-A82C-C294954F97B1@wowway.com>
References: <CAB55hNc96N-GC+F0N5Z96Z8k1x_KWQ9S59NiGqvEYY6xEdH6rg@mail.gmail.com>	<ff82bd50-f201-3233-9b92-fbda4cd4c8cd@9-5usa.org>
	<alpine.BSF.2.21.9999.2101120930080.26789@aneurin.horsfall.org>
	<5FFCD380.3040102@gmail.com>
	<A9A4A113-D4E6-4A5F-A82C-C294954F97B1@wowway.com>
Message-ID: <5FFCEDCD.2010604@gmail.com>

I'll see my way out, now...

On 01/11/2021 02:51 PM, Ralph Irish wrote:
> *Tony*
> *
> *
> *Go to your room and sit in the corner until dinner!*
> *
> *
> *-   -   -   -   -   -   -   -*
> *
> *
> *On Jan 11, 2021, at 5:38 PM, tony.podrasky wrote:*
> *
> *
>> *That was bad, Dave - but I do much worse:
>>
>> Wife: where are you going?
>> Husband: to the dentist. I think I have a cavity.
>> Wife: what time is your appointment?
>> Husband: Tooth Hurty
>>
>> UE,
>> K2EAA - TONY
>> NNNN
>> ZCZC
>>
>> On 01/11/2021 02:31 PM, Dave Horsfall wrote:
>> *
>>> *On Mon, 11 Jan 2021, Kevin H. Phillips wrote:
>>> *
>>> *
>>> *
>>>> *LOL.  "Now, just hold still.  This won't hurt a bit . . . "
>>>> *
>>> *
>>> *
>>> *Standard dentist joke:
>>> *
>>> *
>>> *
>>> *"Will this hurt"?
>>> *
>>> *
>>> *
>>> *"No, it won't hurt me a bit".
>>> *
>>> *
>>> *
>>> *-- Dave VK2KFU
>>> *
>>> *
>>> *
>>> *
>>> *
>> *--
>> Oh, great: This new "Day Planner" I bought has
>> nothing but blank pages.  Now I have no idea
>> what I'm supposed to be doing tomorrow.
>>                             -Blaine Hofmockel
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> GreenKeys mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
>>
>> *
>>>>> *Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool:
>>>>> https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>>>> *
>>>>> *2002-to-present greenkeys archive:
>>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>>> *
>>>>> *1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive:
>>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>>> *
>>>>> *Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool:
>>>>> http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
>>>>> *
>> *
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>> Message delivered to w8roi at wowway.com <mailto:w8roi at wowway.com>
>> *
>

-- 
We trained hard... but it seemed that every time
we were beginning to form up into teams we would
be reorganized. I was to learn later in life
that we meet any new situation by reorganizing,
and a wonderful method it can be for creating the
illusion of progress while producing confusion,
inefficiency, and demoralization.
                -General Gaius Petronius (210 B.C.)

From navy.radio at gmail.com  Tue Jan 12 19:59:55 2021
From: navy.radio at gmail.com (Nick England)
Date: Tue, 12 Jan 2021 19:59:55 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] Real RTTY is noisy
Message-ID: <CAB55hNdRXE+=7zdsrbFBdurYSH0BUyBiGtc7mw=HsMQe6MPEyw@mail.gmail.com>

I had two nice QSOs on 20m today. All three of us were using 28ASRs.
Great fun! I claim the distinction of worst typing, FIGS/LTRS confusion,
etc.
cheers
Nick K4NYW

-- 
Nick England K4NYW
www.navy-radio.com
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From harold at w6iwi.org  Tue Jan 12 20:58:40 2021
From: harold at w6iwi.org (Harold Hallikainen)
Date: Tue, 12 Jan 2021 17:58:40 -0800
Subject: [GreenKeys] Real RTTY is noisy
In-Reply-To: <CAB55hNdRXE+=7zdsrbFBdurYSH0BUyBiGtc7mw=HsMQe6MPEyw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAB55hNdRXE+=7zdsrbFBdurYSH0BUyBiGtc7mw=HsMQe6MPEyw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <a09b6f3a90d46feed79510722f242584.squirrel@mai.hallikainen.org>


> I had two nice QSOs on 20m today. All three of us were using 28ASRs.
> Great fun! I claim the distinction of worst typing, FIGS/LTRS confusion,
> etc.
> cheers
> Nick K4NYW
>

I was away from home but saw your QSOs on my model 15 when I got home.

Then, this afternoon, I turned on the AC power on my Dentron Clipperton L
and half the AC outlets in our house went out. All the circuit breakers
are fine (checking with voltmeter at breaker panel). The AC wiring in the
basement is really convoluted, so I so far cannot tell what drives what.
Some back porch outlets are also out, so I suspect there's a GFCI
somewhere that's tripped, but can't find it, and would not expect inside
outlets (other than kitchen and bathroom) to be on a GFCI. So, right now,
there are extension cords running around the house to make stuff work.

Always something!

By the way, I how have an area zoom feature on the MUF graph at
https://w6iwi.org . I've also made a couple "Teletype patch panels" using
4x4 steel electrical boxes. Four 1/4 inch TRS jacks with switches were
mounted on the cover of each of the boxes. The jacks include a shorting
switch when nothing is plugged in, shorting tip to ring. One of the boxes
is connected to the Flesher TU-170. The other is connected to a loop
supply with current limit resistor. I can move the model 15, 14 reperf,
and 14 TD back and forth as desired. The 14 TD shows up Thursday! Now I
just have to get the electrical outlets working...


Harold
https://w6iwi.org


-- 
FCC Rules Updated Daily at http://www.hallikainen.com
Not sent from an iPhone.

From zarco at sonic.net  Tue Jan 12 20:28:22 2021
From: zarco at sonic.net (Steve)
Date: Tue, 12 Jan 2021 17:28:22 -0800
Subject: [GreenKeys] FS: model 33ASR, Los Altos, CA
Message-ID: <001a01d6e94b$62fcc500$04d61bc6@starwars>

Got a call from an elderly ham the other day asking if I wanted his
33ASR. Since I'm mostly into baudot machines, offered to help
him find a good home for it. It was in regular use till he went in
another direction. Its been in dry, indoor storage and is complete
and in good condtion. He'd like to get $250 or close for it. 
Pick up in Los Altos, CA (San Fransicso bay area). No shipping.
If interested send me an email (zarco at sonic.net) and will pass
them on. Not getting anything out of this other than knowing another
machine is going to someone that will use it rather than ending up in
a landfill.
Steve W6SSP
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From w2hx at w2hx.com  Wed Jan 13 12:04:07 2021
From: w2hx at w2hx.com (W2HX)
Date: Wed, 13 Jan 2021 17:04:07 +0000
Subject: [GreenKeys] Real RTTY is noisy
In-Reply-To: <CAB55hNdRXE+=7zdsrbFBdurYSH0BUyBiGtc7mw=HsMQe6MPEyw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAB55hNdRXE+=7zdsrbFBdurYSH0BUyBiGtc7mw=HsMQe6MPEyw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <0b5c7c317c7b4315929d198eccf33f8a@EXBE015SV3.NA02.MSEXCHANGEOUTLOOK.COM>

I?m curious what antennas you folks are using. High dipoles? Low dipoles? Verticals? I have a vertical for 20m which is intended for DX. I think that the take off angle might be too low for domestic work.

Eugene


From: greenkeys-bounces at mailman.qth.net <greenkeys-bounces at mailman.qth.net> On Behalf Of Nick England
Sent: Tuesday, January 12, 2021 8:00 PM
To: Greenkeys <greenkeys at mailman.qth.net>
Subject: [GreenKeys] Real RTTY is noisy

I had two nice QSOs on 20m today. All three of us were using 28ASRs.
Great fun! I claim the distinction of worst typing, FIGS/LTRS confusion, etc.
cheers
Nick K4NYW

--
Nick England K4NYW
www.navy-radio.com<http://www.navy-radio.com>
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From harold at w6iwi.org  Wed Jan 13 12:23:52 2021
From: harold at w6iwi.org (Harold Hallikainen)
Date: Wed, 13 Jan 2021 09:23:52 -0800
Subject: [GreenKeys] Real RTTY is noisy
In-Reply-To: <0b5c7c317c7b4315929d198eccf33f8a@EXBE015SV3.NA02.MSEXCHANGEOUTLOOK.COM>
References: <CAB55hNdRXE+=7zdsrbFBdurYSH0BUyBiGtc7mw=HsMQe6MPEyw@mail.gmail.com>
	<0b5c7c317c7b4315929d198eccf33f8a@EXBE015SV3.NA02.MSEXCHANGEOUTLOOK.COM>
Message-ID: <4532273e2797a5cdfbdf9e29cb5aaca5.squirrel@mai.hallikainen.org>


> I???m curious what antennas you folks are using. High dipoles? Low
> dipoles? Verticals? I have a vertical for 20m which is intended for DX. I
> think that the take off angle might be too low for domestic work.
>
> Eugene

I'm using a Cushcraft A3S at 25 feet above ground ( https://w6iwi.org/A3S/ ).

What does the Reverse Beacon Network report for you?

Harold
https://w6iwi.org/



-- 
FCC Rules Updated Daily at http://www.hallikainen.com
Not sent from an iPhone.

From djones at k6yic.com  Wed Jan 13 16:33:29 2021
From: djones at k6yic.com (Daniel Jones)
Date: Wed, 13 Jan 2021 13:33:29 -0800
Subject: [GreenKeys] Real RTTY is noisy
In-Reply-To: <0b5c7c317c7b4315929d198eccf33f8a@EXBE015SV3.NA02.MSEXCHANGEOUTLOOK.COM>
References: <0b5c7c317c7b4315929d198eccf33f8a@EXBE015SV3.NA02.MSEXCHANGEOUTLOOK.COM>
Message-ID: <6A3B19A7-773D-49A9-8E1D-A8513F53AEA3@k6yic.com>

I am using a 7m DX Commander with 40, 20, 17 meter elements.  The tuner in my Kenwood can tune in everything from 80-6m.  

Daniel

K6YIC 
http://K6YIC.com
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From wcwuttke at att.net  Wed Jan 13 16:46:49 2021
From: wcwuttke at att.net (William Wuttke)
Date: Wed, 13 Jan 2021 13:46:49 -0800
Subject: [GreenKeys] Real RTTY is noisy
In-Reply-To: <0b5c7c317c7b4315929d198eccf33f8a@EXBE015SV3.NA02.MSEXCHANGEOUTLOOK.COM>
References: <CAB55hNdRXE+=7zdsrbFBdurYSH0BUyBiGtc7mw=HsMQe6MPEyw@mail.gmail.com>
	<0b5c7c317c7b4315929d198eccf33f8a@EXBE015SV3.NA02.MSEXCHANGEOUTLOOK.COM>
Message-ID: <6219F20F-977B-48B8-A274-3AC7AC97BAAF@att.net>

I?m using a G5RV in a modified inverted V configuration, with the apex only 16 ft off the ground. The antenna
can?t see the horizon in any direction, just houses and trees. It?s really an NVIS antenna, but it gets all over
the US. As Harold mentioned, try the Reverse Beacon Network to get an idea of where you are propagating to.
You can also see and hear your signal on any number of WebSDRs and KiwiSDRs.

Bill
KE3BK

> On Jan 13, 2021, at 9:04 AM, W2HX <w2hx at w2hx.com> wrote:
> 
> I?m curious what antennas you folks are using. High dipoles? Low dipoles? Verticals? I have a vertical for 20m which is intended for DX. I think that the take off angle might be too low for domestic work.
>  
> Eugene
>  
>  
> From: greenkeys-bounces at mailman.qth.net <greenkeys-bounces at mailman.qth.net> On Behalf Of Nick England
> Sent: Tuesday, January 12, 2021 8:00 PM
> To: Greenkeys <greenkeys at mailman.qth.net>
> Subject: [GreenKeys] Real RTTY is noisy
>  
> I had two nice QSOs on 20m today. All three of us were using 28ASRs. 
> Great fun! I claim the distinction of worst typing, FIGS/LTRS confusion, etc. 
> cheers
> Nick K4NYW
>  
> -- 
> Nick England K4NYW
> www.navy-radio.com <http://www.navy-radio.com/>______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
> 
>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
> 
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to wcwuttke at att.net

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From djones at k6yic.com  Wed Jan 13 20:41:11 2021
From: djones at k6yic.com (Daniel Jones)
Date: Wed, 13 Jan 2021 17:41:11 -0800
Subject: [GreenKeys] =?utf-8?q?Reperf_wheel_for_1=E2=80=9D_core?=
Message-ID: <91D76666-A162-4293-948A-9B9962D89275@k6yic.com>

I had my buddy make one of these wheels to support 1? core 11/16 paper for the Reperfs.  (I mistakenly bought an entire carton, 10 rolls of the 1? core stuff)

It?s heavy plastic with a steel axle.  If anyone wants or needs one let me know.  He is asking $25+shipping.  

Dan

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K6YIC 
http://K6YIC.com

From zarco at sonic.net  Fri Jan 15 08:44:02 2021
From: zarco at sonic.net (Steve)
Date: Fri, 15 Jan 2021 05:44:02 -0800
Subject: [GreenKeys] SOLD: 33ASR in Los Altos
Message-ID: <003a01d6eb44$7d4b5200$04d61bc6@starwars>

Thanks for the responses. If I come across other TTY machines looking for
a home will send them here.
Steve W6SSP
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From zarco at sonic.net  Sun Jan 17 09:55:18 2021
From: zarco at sonic.net (Steve)
Date: Sun, 17 Jan 2021 06:55:18 -0800
Subject: [GreenKeys] Odd problem with m28
Message-ID: <000b01d6ece0$c7f8f760$03d61bc6@starwars>

The model 28 I have setup for iTTY has always worked perfectly except
for one thing. When it prints an apostropy, it does not move to the next space.
In other words, rather than printing  "we'll", it'll print "well" with the apostophy
printed over the first "l". 

A minor problem in the grand scheme of things but wondering if anyone
has seen and fixed this issue?

I'm very familar with m15's but not as much with m28's as the two
I have in use just seem to work after a good cleaning and lube for years!
TIA.
Steve W6SSP
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From steve.n4tty at gmail.com  Sun Jan 17 18:30:44 2021
From: steve.n4tty at gmail.com (Steve Garrison)
Date: Sun, 17 Jan 2021 18:30:44 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] Odd problem with m28
In-Reply-To: <000b01d6ece0$c7f8f760$03d61bc6@starwars>
References: <000b01d6ece0$c7f8f760$03d61bc6@starwars>
Message-ID: <0c2701d6ed28$c7577280$56065780$@gmail.com>

I would guess that the typing unit, specifically the stunt box, was setup
for Telex which would prevent spacing on FIGS J as on a Telex machine FIGS J
was the bell, so no spacing will occur.  But the type box you have on your
typing unit has an apostrophe in the FIGS J position, so it prints the
apostrophe instead of nothing and also does not space, so the following L
types on top of the apostrophe.

 

My thoughts anyway.  Any others want to pipe in and help us all learn
something more about the M28s?

 

Steve G./N4TTY

 

From: greenkeys-bounces at mailman.qth.net <greenkeys-bounces at mailman.qth.net>
On Behalf Of Steve
Sent: Sunday, January 17, 2021 9:55 AM
To: greenkeys at mailman.qth.net
Subject: [GreenKeys] Odd problem with m28

 

The model 28 I have setup for iTTY has always worked perfectly except

for one thing. When it prints an apostropy, it does not move to the next
space.

In other words, rather than printing  "we'll", it'll print "well" with the
apostophy

printed over the first "l". 

 

A minor problem in the grand scheme of things but wondering if anyone

has seen and fixed this issue?

 

I'm very familar with m15's but not as much with m28's as the two

I have in use just seem to work after a good cleaning and lube for years!

TIA.

Steve W6SSP

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From jhhaynes at earthlink.net  Sun Jan 17 18:36:38 2021
From: jhhaynes at earthlink.net (Jim Haynes)
Date: Sun, 17 Jan 2021 17:36:38 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [GreenKeys] Odd problem with m28
In-Reply-To: <0c2701d6ed28$c7577280$56065780$@gmail.com>
References: <000b01d6ece0$c7f8f760$03d61bc6@starwars>
	<0c2701d6ed28$c7577280$56065780$@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <alpine.DEB.2.20.2101171735380.11131@Frances>

On Sun, 17 Jan 2021, Steve Garrison wrote:
> 
> I would guess that the typing unit, specifically the stunt box, was setup
> for Telex which would prevent spacing on FIGS J as on a Telex machine FIGS J

I would make the same guess, and ask what happens when you receive FIGS S


From steve.n4tty at gmail.com  Sun Jan 17 18:37:54 2021
From: steve.n4tty at gmail.com (Steve Garrison)
Date: Sun, 17 Jan 2021 18:37:54 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] Progress on my M28 ASR
Message-ID: <0c3601d6ed29$c772f450$5658dcf0$@gmail.com>

Some YouTube videos documenting some of my progress.

 

First the NOISY bearings in the motor:  Before:
https://youtu.be/wprH89K7hAs

 

Then the motor with new bearings:  After:  https://youtu.be/9NdZpM3p2iw

 

And with it all back together and copying ITTY News:
https://youtu.be/nyZDW_Wz960

 

There will be a video that documents what happened in between the Before and
After videos as soon as I can get it edited into one video.  So it will be
Before, After, and Everything In Between.

 

Steve G./N4TTY

 

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From ranickels at gmail.com  Sun Jan 17 19:11:40 2021
From: ranickels at gmail.com (Robert Nickels)
Date: Sun, 17 Jan 2021 18:11:40 -0600
Subject: [GreenKeys] The Money Machine
Message-ID: <956a97a5-a0c6-3cdf-f7e2-296d90bc05bc@gmail.com>

Is an episode of the "Mission Impossible" TV series that I've been a big 
fan of since the 60s.??? A Teletype machine played an important role in 
an episode last night called "The Money Machine", when tech guru Barney 
Collier patched it into a financial news circuit and? sent fake 
information as part of the MI plan involving a computerized machine that 
prints counterfeit money:

https://missionimpossible.fandom.com/wiki/The_Money_Machine

The teletype machine is brought in with the housing removed, which is 
then assembled and prepared by team members.???? It looked like a 28KSR 
to me, and Barney did appear to type the message very smoothly by hand 
rather than sending a tape (which was obviously done for filming).

I couldn't decide which is more impressive:? that Barney always knows 
just where to put those alligator clips, or that the writers were able 
to envision ink-jet printing decades before it was a reality (loading 
the machine with liquid red, green, blue, and black inks).

73, Bob W9RAN


From hanyou at xsmail.com  Sun Jan 17 19:44:01 2021
From: hanyou at xsmail.com (E.)
Date: Sun, 17 Jan 2021 18:44:01 -0600
Subject: [GreenKeys] The Money Machine
In-Reply-To: <956a97a5-a0c6-3cdf-f7e2-296d90bc05bc@gmail.com>
References: <956a97a5-a0c6-3cdf-f7e2-296d90bc05bc@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <043789B1-8DF4-465A-B504-9DD227A47FE3@xsmail.com>


I've just found a link to the episode? it can be seen at around the 5:30, 25:30 and 27:00 mark? it?s a 15 :) :

https://www.dailymotion.com/video/x5ihi38


> On Jan 17, 2021, at 6:11 pm, Robert Nickels <ranickels at gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> Is an episode of the "Mission Impossible" TV series that I've been a big fan of since the 60s.    A Teletype machine played an important role in an episode last night called "The Money Machine", when tech guru Barney Collier patched it into a financial news circuit and  sent fake information as part of the MI plan involving a computerized machine that prints counterfeit money:
> 
> https://missionimpossible.fandom.com/wiki/The_Money_Machine
> 
> The teletype machine is brought in with the housing removed, which is then assembled and prepared by team members.     It looked like a 28KSR to me, and Barney did appear to type the message very smoothly by hand rather than sending a tape (which was obviously done for filming).
> 
> I couldn't decide which is more impressive:  that Barney always knows just where to put those alligator clips, or that the writers were able to envision ink-jet printing decades before it was a reality (loading the machine with liquid red, green, blue, and black inks).
> 
> 73, Bob W9RAN
> 
> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
> 
>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
> 
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to hanyou at xsmail.com


From jim.w2jc at gmail.com  Sun Jan 17 19:55:18 2021
From: jim.w2jc at gmail.com (Jim Cooper)
Date: Sun, 17 Jan 2021 19:55:18 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] Odd problem with m28
In-Reply-To: <000b01d6ece0$c7f8f760$03d61bc6@starwars>
References: <000b01d6ece0$c7f8f760$03d61bc6@starwars>
Message-ID: <6004DC76.8806.2EA9B169@jim.w2jc.gmail.com>

On 17 Jan 2021 at 6:55, Steve wrote:

> In other words, rather than printing
>  "we'll", it'll print "well" with the
> apostophy printed over the first "l".
> 
there is probably a function bar in the 
stunt box that is coded to respond on 
apostrophy and is linked to mechanical 
blocking of the spacing.

look at the stuntbox from underneath 
and see if you can see an area with linkage 
and then see if that linkage interacts with 
the spacing. 

if you find the mischeivious function bar, 
you might be able to just disable it; or you 
could be brave and remove it from the 
stunt box ... 

w2jc 




From navy.radio at gmail.com  Sun Jan 17 20:21:27 2021
From: navy.radio at gmail.com (Nick England)
Date: Sun, 17 Jan 2021 20:21:27 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] Odd problem with m28
In-Reply-To: <000b01d6ece0$c7f8f760$03d61bc6@starwars>
References: <000b01d6ece0$c7f8f760$03d61bc6@starwars>
Message-ID: <CAB55hNcK_Z_vw-xWr2_WUJ3dVxrWk4M5V1REHwT3j=Zh71U1+A@mail.gmail.com>

I agree with the other Steve. I think your stunt box thinks figs-S is a
non-spacing bell and your typebox thinks it is an apostrophe. Type repeated
figs-S while watching the stunt box to see which lever moves. Then tie up
that lever to disable the non-spacing action. It?ll also disable the bell
but you only need that at Christmas time to play the ?Jingle Bells" tape.
Cheers
Nick


On Sun, Jan 17, 2021 at 6:21 PM Steve <zarco at sonic.net> wrote:

> The model 28 I have setup for iTTY has always worked perfectly except
> for one thing. When it prints an apostropy, it does not move to the next
> space.
> In other words, rather than printing  "we'll", it'll print "well" with the
> apostophy
> printed over the first "l".
>
> A minor problem in the grand scheme of things but wondering if anyone
> has seen and fixed this issue?
>
> I'm very familar with m15's but not as much with m28's as the two
> I have in use just seem to work after a good cleaning and lube for years!
> TIA.
> Steve W6SSP
> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
>
> >>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool:
> https://teletype.net/gksearch
> >>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive:
> http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
> >>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive:
> http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
> >>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool:
> http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to navy.radio at gmail.com

-- 
Nick England K4NYW
www.navy-radio.com
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From navy.radio at gmail.com  Sun Jan 17 20:38:19 2021
From: navy.radio at gmail.com (Nick England)
Date: Sun, 17 Jan 2021 20:38:19 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] Odd problem with m28
In-Reply-To: <CAB55hNcK_Z_vw-xWr2_WUJ3dVxrWk4M5V1REHwT3j=Zh71U1+A@mail.gmail.com>
References: <000b01d6ece0$c7f8f760$03d61bc6@starwars>
	<CAB55hNcK_Z_vw-xWr2_WUJ3dVxrWk4M5V1REHwT3j=Zh71U1+A@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAB55hNe8O7QH3mtPGHfcS4TyTC7rDXZEt1yDdV4_t3MShqgFSA@mail.gmail.com>

Or maybe I meant figs-J. It?s not just my machines that are confused.

I?m not sure about ITTY, but so far most RTTY people have sent figs-S for
apostrophe. All my Navy machines ring a bell on figs-S.



On Sun, Jan 17, 2021 at 8:21 PM Nick England <navy.radio at gmail.com> wrote:

> I agree with the other Steve. I think your stunt box thinks figs-S is a
> non-spacing bell and your typebox thinks it is an apostrophe. Type repeated
> figs-S while watching the stunt box to see which lever moves. Then tie up
> that lever to disable the non-spacing action. It?ll also disable the bell
> but you only need that at Christmas time to play the ?Jingle Bells" tape.
> Cheers
> Nick
>
>
> On Sun, Jan 17, 2021 at 6:21 PM Steve <zarco at sonic.net> wrote:
>
>> The model 28 I have setup for iTTY has always worked perfectly except
>> for one thing. When it prints an apostropy, it does not move to the next
>> space.
>> In other words, rather than printing  "we'll", it'll print "well" with
>> the apostophy
>> printed over the first "l".
>>
>> A minor problem in the grand scheme of things but wondering if anyone
>> has seen and fixed this issue?
>>
>> I'm very familar with m15's but not as much with m28's as the two
>> I have in use just seem to work after a good cleaning and lube for years!
>> TIA.
>> Steve W6SSP
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> GreenKeys mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
>>
>> >>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool:
>> https://teletype.net/gksearch
>> >>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive:
>> http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>> >>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive:
>> http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>> >>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool:
>> http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
>>
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>> Message delivered to navy.radio at gmail.com
>
> --
> Nick England K4NYW
> www.navy-radio.com
>
-- 
Nick England K4NYW
www.navy-radio.com
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From navy.radio at gmail.com  Sun Jan 17 20:56:51 2021
From: navy.radio at gmail.com (Nick England)
Date: Sun, 17 Jan 2021 20:56:51 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] Apostrophe test via greenkeys
Message-ID: <CAB55hNeRS4iXF-XKHMcyOjtqdO5ujzOUTmMjFYAd1r9TBZfepQ@mail.gmail.com>

Here's what I have seen so far -
Apostrophes show up OK on ITTY
Apostrophes show up OK on direct submissions to autostart
Apostrophes do not show up on a greenkeys post reflected to autostart
a'p'o's't'r'o'p'h'e'
There should be an symbol like this ' between each letter of
a'p'o's't'r'o'p'h'e
Nick England K4NYW
www.navy-radio.com
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From jhhaynes at earthlink.net  Sun Jan 17 20:58:54 2021
From: jhhaynes at earthlink.net (Jim Haynes)
Date: Sun, 17 Jan 2021 19:58:54 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [GreenKeys] Odd problem with m28
In-Reply-To: <CAB55hNe8O7QH3mtPGHfcS4TyTC7rDXZEt1yDdV4_t3MShqgFSA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <000b01d6ece0$c7f8f760$03d61bc6@starwars>
	<CAB55hNcK_Z_vw-xWr2_WUJ3dVxrWk4M5V1REHwT3j=Zh71U1+A@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAB55hNe8O7QH3mtPGHfcS4TyTC7rDXZEt1yDdV4_t3MShqgFSA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <alpine.DEB.2.20.2101171957490.12812@Frances>

On Sun, 17 Jan 2021, Nick England wrote:
> I?m not sure about ITTY, but so far most RTTY people have sent figs-S for
> apostrophe. All my Navy machines ring a bell on figs-S.?
> 
J bell is Western Union and I guess Telex.  S bell is us government,
Bell System, and TWX.  In my days of mechanical RTTY most people used
S bell and J apostrophe, but maybe that has changed by now.

From harold at w6iwi.org  Sun Jan 17 20:59:59 2021
From: harold at w6iwi.org (Harold Hallikainen)
Date: Sun, 17 Jan 2021 17:59:59 -0800
Subject: [GreenKeys] Odd problem with m28
In-Reply-To: <CAB55hNe8O7QH3mtPGHfcS4TyTC7rDXZEt1yDdV4_t3MShqgFSA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <000b01d6ece0$c7f8f760$03d61bc6@starwars>
	<CAB55hNcK_Z_vw-xWr2_WUJ3dVxrWk4M5V1REHwT3j=Zh71U1+A@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAB55hNe8O7QH3mtPGHfcS4TyTC7rDXZEt1yDdV4_t3MShqgFSA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <72fb86bf345d71b2671a3f53b385490e.squirrel@mai.hallikainen.org>

So many choices! My model 15 has Bell on FIGS-S and apostrophe on FIGS-J.
The model 14 typing reperf has does the same, but has 3/8, 5/8, and 7/8 on
FIGS V, B, N.

Harold


> Or maybe I meant figs-J. It???s not just my machines that are confused.
>
> I???m not sure about ITTY, but so far most RTTY people have sent figs-S
> for
> apostrophe. All my Navy machines ring a bell on figs-S.
>
>
>
> On Sun, Jan 17, 2021 at 8:21 PM Nick England <navy.radio at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> I agree with the other Steve. I think your stunt box thinks figs-S is a
>> non-spacing bell and your typebox thinks it is an apostrophe. Type
>> repeated
>> figs-S while watching the stunt box to see which lever moves. Then tie
>> up
>> that lever to disable the non-spacing action. It???ll also disable the
>> bell
>> but you only need that at Christmas time to play the ???Jingle Bells"
>> tape.
>> Cheers
>> Nick
>>
>>
>> On Sun, Jan 17, 2021 at 6:21 PM Steve <zarco at sonic.net> wrote:
>>
>>> The model 28 I have setup for iTTY has always worked perfectly except
>>> for one thing. When it prints an apostropy, it does not move to the
>>> next
>>> space.
>>> In other words, rather than printing  "we'll", it'll print "well" with
>>> the apostophy
>>> printed over the first "l".
>>>
>>> A minor problem in the grand scheme of things but wondering if anyone
>>> has seen and fixed this issue?
>>>
>>> I'm very familar with m15's but not as much with m28's as the two
>>> I have in use just seem to work after a good cleaning and lube for
>>> years!
>>> TIA.
>>> Steve W6SSP
>>> ______________________________________________________________
>>> GreenKeys mailing list
>>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
>>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>>> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
>>>
>>> >>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool:
>>> https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>> >>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive:
>>> http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>> >>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive:
>>> http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>> >>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool:
>>> http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
>>>
>>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>>> Message delivered to navy.radio at gmail.com
>>
>> --
>> Nick England K4NYW
>> www.navy-radio.com
>>
> --
> Nick England K4NYW
> www.navy-radio.com
> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
>
>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool:
>>>> https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive:
>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive:
>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool:
>>>> http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to harold at w6iwi.org


-- 
FCC Rules Updated Daily at http://www.hallikainen.com
Not sent from an iPhone.

From til128 at juno.com  Mon Jan 18 06:47:45 2021
From: til128 at juno.com (til128 at juno.com)
Date: Mon, 18 Jan 2021 11:47:45 GMT
Subject: [GreenKeys] ITTY Etc.
Message-ID: <20210118.064745.8225.0@webmail01.dca.untd.com>

Hi all:

For those who use ITTY and the other services, there was a power failure in ITTY headquarters last night for a couple of hours.

The services are now up and running normally for your use.

We apologize for any inconvenience and appreciate your patience.

Tom WB2TTY


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From navy.radio at gmail.com  Mon Jan 18 09:27:40 2021
From: navy.radio at gmail.com (Nick England)
Date: Mon, 18 Jan 2021 09:27:40 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] Beating apostrophes to death
Message-ID: <CAB55hNdo-=+VP__hfUhmzs0mNgd1a1_VuUxQYdw_=uTAO_+K1w@mail.gmail.com>

Just one more test, honest.
I?m sending this message from my iPhone instead of my computer. Of course
it?s different because .......Apple.
A?p?o?s?t?r?o?p?h?e
That should have had a ? between each letter

You know, the world just went rapidly downhill when they started all this
8-bit character business. Should have stuck with 5 bits.
-- 
Nick England K4NYW
www.navy-radio.com
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From steve.n4tty at gmail.com  Mon Jan 18 10:10:42 2021
From: steve.n4tty at gmail.com (Steve Garrison)
Date: Mon, 18 Jan 2021 10:10:42 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] M28 Typebox Parts Illustrations
Message-ID: <0df201d6edac$1770e200$4652a600$@gmail.com>

I know I have seen it somewhere, probably on Nick's Navy-Radio page, but
darn if I can find it now!

 

Looking for the Parts Breakdown for the typebox used on the M28, and I would
guess the M35 as well.  Really looking for the part number for the spring
that is on every type pallet inside the typebox.  Would like to see if Paul
Cembura has any in his parts stock.

 

How many of you have ever taken a type box apart?  Any pointers on getting
the spring disconnected from the pallet to prevent you from ruining the
spring?

 

Now I know why the instructors in my USAF tech school were so upset with me
when I discovered they had reversed the R and the Y that were in the typebox
on the machine I was assigned to "discover the bug."  I found the bug much
more quickly than the time it must have taken them to get the pallets
switched!  And now I understand the statement they made when they handed me
a unmodified typebox and said "we're saving this for the next smart-ass that
come through here!"

 

I was playing musical type pallets on a type box that was blank at the
FIGS-H position (STOP?) while my keyboard had a # sign on the FIGS position
and would space but not print anything.  I removed the # type pallet from a
typebox that had the fractional character type pallets that I knew I would
never use.

 

Steve G./N4TTY

 

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From navy.radio at gmail.com  Mon Jan 18 10:33:27 2021
From: navy.radio at gmail.com (Nick England)
Date: Mon, 18 Jan 2021 10:33:27 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] M28 Typebox Parts Illustrations
In-Reply-To: <0df201d6edac$1770e200$4652a600$@gmail.com>
References: <0df201d6edac$1770e200$4652a600$@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAB55hNfjT_93E0ZtMuQBv-vahCQHi-505ogE9T5PPxaYjULDOg@mail.gmail.com>

In the 28 parts book 1149B
See this edition
http://www.navy-radio.com/manuals/tty/1149B-6201.pdf
pages 3-42 and 3-43 cover the EARLY and LATE style typeboxes.

Nick England K4NYW
www.navy-radio.com


On Mon, Jan 18, 2021 at 10:15 AM Steve Garrison <steve.n4tty at gmail.com>
wrote:

> I know I have seen it somewhere, probably on Nick?s Navy-Radio page, but
> darn if I can find it now!
>
>
>
> Looking for the Parts Breakdown for the typebox used on the M28, and I
> would guess the M35 as well.  Really looking for the part number for the
> spring that is on every type pallet inside the typebox.  Would like to see
> if Paul Cembura has any in his parts stock.
>
>
>
> How many of you have ever taken a type box apart?  Any pointers on getting
> the spring disconnected from the pallet to prevent you from ruining the
> spring?
>
>
>
> Now I know why the instructors in my USAF tech school were so upset with
> me when I discovered they had reversed the R and the Y that were in the
> typebox on the machine I was assigned to ?discover the bug.?  I found the
> bug much more quickly than the time it must have taken them to get the
> pallets switched!  And now I understand the statement they made when they
> handed me a unmodified typebox and said ?we?re saving this for the next
> smart-ass that come through here!?
>
>
>
> I was playing musical type pallets on a type box that was blank at the
> FIGS-H position (STOP?) while my keyboard had a # sign on the FIGS position
> and would space but not print anything.  I removed the # type pallet from a
> typebox that had the fractional character type pallets that I knew I would
> never use.
>
>
>
> Steve G./N4TTY
>
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
>
> >>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool:
> https://teletype.net/gksearch
> >>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive:
> http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
> >>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive:
> http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
> >>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool:
> http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to navy.radio at gmail.com
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From w9ddd at tapr.org  Mon Jan 18 18:03:04 2021
From: w9ddd at tapr.org (w9ddd at tapr.org)
Date: Mon, 18 Jan 2021 17:03:04 -0600
Subject: [GreenKeys] M28 Typebox Parts Illustrations
In-Reply-To: <0df201d6edac$1770e200$4652a600$@gmail.com>
References: <0df201d6edac$1770e200$4652a600$@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <D17393A2-11AF-48E2-A488-7137D91062EE@tapr.org>

Speaking of these springs, if you had some loose in a box, how would you know if they were old or new design?  I would guess the newer design is shorter, but if you don't have some of each, you still don't know.

John, W9DDD


> On Jan 18, 2021, at 9:10 AM, Steve Garrison <steve.n4tty at gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> I know I have seen it somewhere, probably on Nick?s Navy-Radio page, but darn if I can find it now!
>  
> Looking for the Parts Breakdown for the typebox used on the M28, and I would guess the M35 as well.  Really looking for the part number for the spring that is on every type pallet inside the typebox.  Would like to see if Paul Cembura has any in his parts stock.
>  
> How many of you have ever taken a type box apart?  Any pointers on getting the spring disconnected from the pallet to prevent you from ruining the spring?
>  
> Now I know why the instructors in my USAF tech school were so upset with me when I discovered they had reversed the R and the Y that were in the typebox on the machine I was assigned to ?discover the bug.?  I found the bug much more quickly than the time it must have taken them to get the pallets switched!  And now I understand the statement they made when they handed me a unmodified typebox and said ?we?re saving this for the next smart-ass that come through here!?
>  
> I was playing musical type pallets on a type box that was blank at the FIGS-H position (STOP?) while my keyboard had a # sign on the FIGS position and would space but not print anything.  I removed the # type pallet from a typebox that had the fractional character type pallets that I knew I would never use.
>  
> Steve G./N4TTY
>  
> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
> 
>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
> 
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to w9ddd at tapr.org
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From steve.n4tty at gmail.com  Mon Jan 18 18:37:55 2021
From: steve.n4tty at gmail.com (Steve Garrison)
Date: Mon, 18 Jan 2021 18:37:55 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] M28 Typebox Parts Illustrations
In-Reply-To: <D17393A2-11AF-48E2-A488-7137D91062EE@tapr.org>
References: <0df201d6edac$1770e200$4652a600$@gmail.com>
	<D17393A2-11AF-48E2-A488-7137D91062EE@tapr.org>
Message-ID: <0ee501d6edf2$f30073d0$d9015b70$@gmail.com>

Plus how do I know if the typebox I?m currently holding in my hand is the old style or the new style?  Is there a trick to knowing which is which?

 

Steve G./N4TTY

From: w9ddd at tapr.org <w9ddd at tapr.org> 
Sent: Monday, January 18, 2021 6:03 PM
To: N4TTY at ARRL.NET
Cc: Greenkeys <greenkeys at mailman.qth.net>
Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] M28 Typebox Parts Illustrations

 

Speaking of these springs, if you had some loose in a box, how would you know if they were old or new design?  I would guess the newer design is shorter, but if you don't have some of each, you still don't know.

John, W9DDD

 


On Jan 18, 2021, at 9:10 AM, Steve Garrison <steve.n4tty at gmail.com <mailto:steve.n4tty at gmail.com> > wrote:

I know I have seen it somewhere, probably on Nick?s Navy-Radio page, but darn if I can find it now!

 

Looking for the Parts Breakdown for the typebox used on the M28, and I would guess the M35 as well.  Really looking for the part number for the spring that is on every type pallet inside the typebox.  Would like to see if Paul Cembura has any in his parts stock.

 

How many of you have ever taken a type box apart?  Any pointers on getting the spring disconnected from the pallet to prevent you from ruining the spring?

 

Now I know why the instructors in my USAF tech school were so upset with me when I discovered they had reversed the R and the Y that were in the typebox on the machine I was assigned to ?discover the bug.?  I found the bug much more quickly than the time it must have taken them to get the pallets switched!  And now I understand the statement they made when they handed me a unmodified typebox and said ?we?re saving this for the next smart-ass that come through here!?

 

I was playing musical type pallets on a type box that was blank at the FIGS-H position (STOP?) while my keyboard had a # sign on the FIGS position and would space but not print anything.  I removed the # type pallet from a typebox that had the fractional character type pallets that I knew I would never use.

 

Steve G./N4TTY

 

______________________________________________________________
GreenKeys mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net




Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch

2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/

1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html

Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html


This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
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From navy.radio at gmail.com  Mon Jan 18 18:40:27 2021
From: navy.radio at gmail.com (Nick England)
Date: Mon, 18 Jan 2021 18:40:27 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] M28 Typebox Parts Illustrations
In-Reply-To: <0ee501d6edf2$f30073d0$d9015b70$@gmail.com>
References: <0df201d6edac$1770e200$4652a600$@gmail.com>
	<D17393A2-11AF-48E2-A488-7137D91062EE@tapr.org>
	<0ee501d6edf2$f30073d0$d9015b70$@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAB55hNeLg0EtShv0LtFOZX-jo9C9oG3KbPorJxtyJ831Z6JujA@mail.gmail.com>

I have seen an explanation of old/new somewhere. I?ll try to find it.
Nick


On Mon, Jan 18, 2021 at 6:39 PM Steve Garrison <steve.n4tty at gmail.com>
wrote:

> Plus how do I know if the typebox I?m currently holding in my hand is the
> old style or the new style?  Is there a trick to knowing which is which?
>
>
>
> Steve G./N4TTY
>
> *From:* w9ddd at tapr.org <w9ddd at tapr.org>
> *Sent:* Monday, January 18, 2021 6:03 PM
> *To:* N4TTY at ARRL.NET
> *Cc:* Greenkeys <greenkeys at mailman.qth.net>
> *Subject:* Re: [GreenKeys] M28 Typebox Parts Illustrations
>
>
>
> Speaking of these springs, if you had some loose in a box, how would you
> know if they were old or new design?  I would guess the newer design is
> shorter, but if you don't have some of each, you still don't know.
>
> John, W9DDD
>
>
>
>
> On Jan 18, 2021, at 9:10 AM, Steve Garrison <steve.n4tty at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> I know I have seen it somewhere, probably on Nick?s Navy-Radio page, but
> darn if I can find it now!
>
>
>
> Looking for the Parts Breakdown for the typebox used on the M28, and I
> would guess the M35 as well.  Really looking for the part number for the
> spring that is on every type pallet inside the typebox.  Would like to see
> if Paul Cembura has any in his parts stock.
>
>
>
> How many of you have ever taken a type box apart?  Any pointers on getting
> the spring disconnected from the pallet to prevent you from ruining the
> spring?
>
>
>
> Now I know why the instructors in my USAF tech school were so upset with
> me when I discovered they had reversed the R and the Y that were in the
> typebox on the machine I was assigned to ?discover the bug.?  I found the
> bug much more quickly than the time it must have taken them to get the
> pallets switched!  And now I understand the statement they made when they
> handed me a unmodified typebox and said ?we?re saving this for the next
> smart-ass that come through here!?
>
>
>
> I was playing musical type pallets on a type box that was blank at the
> FIGS-H position (STOP?) while my keyboard had a # sign on the FIGS position
> and would space but not print anything.  I removed the # type pallet from a
> typebox that had the fractional character type pallets that I knew I would
> never use.
>
>
>
> Steve G./N4TTY
>
>
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net <GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net>
>
>
> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool:
> https://teletype.net/gksearch
>
> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive:
> http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>
> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive:
> http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>
> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool:
> http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
>
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to w9ddd at tapr.org
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
>
> >>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool:
> https://teletype.net/gksearch
> >>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive:
> http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
> >>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive:
> http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
> >>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool:
> http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to navy.radio at gmail.com

-- 
Nick England K4NYW
www.navy-radio.com
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From w9ddd at tapr.org  Mon Jan 18 19:13:38 2021
From: w9ddd at tapr.org (w9ddd at tapr.org)
Date: Mon, 18 Jan 2021 18:13:38 -0600
Subject: [GreenKeys] M28 Typebox Parts Illustrations
In-Reply-To: <CAB55hNeLg0EtShv0LtFOZX-jo9C9oG3KbPorJxtyJ831Z6JujA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <0df201d6edac$1770e200$4652a600$@gmail.com>
	<D17393A2-11AF-48E2-A488-7137D91062EE@tapr.org>
	<0ee501d6edf2$f30073d0$d9015b70$@gmail.com>
	<CAB55hNeLg0EtShv0LtFOZX-jo9C9oG3KbPorJxtyJ831Z6JujA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <EF7674EE-DCFA-47C3-B1BF-2A58E7B6F876@tapr.org>

New style has an X on the edge.  I think the top edge if I remember correctly

John, W9DDD


> On Jan 18, 2021, at 5:40 PM, Nick England <navy.radio at gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> I have seen an explanation of old/new somewhere. I?ll try to find it. 
> Nick
> 
> 
>> On Mon, Jan 18, 2021 at 6:39 PM Steve Garrison <steve.n4tty at gmail.com> wrote:
>> Plus how do I know if the typebox I?m currently holding in my hand is the old style or the new style?  Is there a trick to knowing which is which?
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> Steve G./N4TTY
>> 
>> From: w9ddd at tapr.org <w9ddd at tapr.org> 
>> Sent: Monday, January 18, 2021 6:03 PM
>> To: N4TTY at ARRL.NET
>> Cc: Greenkeys <greenkeys at mailman.qth.net>
>> Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] M28 Typebox Parts Illustrations
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> Speaking of these springs, if you had some loose in a box, how would you know if they were old or new design?  I would guess the newer design is shorter, but if you don't have some of each, you still don't know.
>> 
>> John, W9DDD
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> 
>> On Jan 18, 2021, at 9:10 AM, Steve Garrison <steve.n4tty at gmail.com> wrote:
>> 
>> I know I have seen it somewhere, probably on Nick?s Navy-Radio page, but darn if I can find it now!
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> Looking for the Parts Breakdown for the typebox used on the M28, and I would guess the M35 as well.  Really looking for the part number for the spring that is on every type pallet inside the typebox.  Would like to see if Paul Cembura has any in his parts stock.
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> How many of you have ever taken a type box apart?  Any pointers on getting the spring disconnected from the pallet to prevent you from ruining the spring?
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> Now I know why the instructors in my USAF tech school were so upset with me when I discovered they had reversed the R and the Y that were in the typebox on the machine I was assigned to ?discover the bug.?  I found the bug much more quickly than the time it must have taken them to get the pallets switched!  And now I understand the statement they made when they handed me a unmodified typebox and said ?we?re saving this for the next smart-ass that come through here!?
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> I was playing musical type pallets on a type box that was blank at the FIGS-H position (STOP?) while my keyboard had a # sign on the FIGS position and would space but not print anything.  I removed the # type pallet from a typebox that had the fractional character type pallets that I knew I would never use.
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> Steve G./N4TTY
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> GreenKeys mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
>> 
>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>> 
>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>> 
>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
>> 
>> 
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>> Message delivered to w9ddd at tapr.org
>> 
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> GreenKeys mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
>> 
>> >>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
>> >>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>> >>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>> >>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
>> 
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>> Message delivered to navy.radio at gmail.com
> -- 
> Nick England K4NYW
> www.navy-radio.com
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From steve.n4tty at gmail.com  Mon Jan 18 19:35:05 2021
From: steve.n4tty at gmail.com (Steve Garrison)
Date: Mon, 18 Jan 2021 19:35:05 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] M28 Typebox Parts Illustrations
In-Reply-To: <EF7674EE-DCFA-47C3-B1BF-2A58E7B6F876@tapr.org>
References: <0df201d6edac$1770e200$4652a600$@gmail.com>
	<D17393A2-11AF-48E2-A488-7137D91062EE@tapr.org>
	<0ee501d6edf2$f30073d0$d9015b70$@gmail.com>
	<CAB55hNeLg0EtShv0LtFOZX-jo9C9oG3KbPorJxtyJ831Z6JujA@mail.gmail.com>
	<EF7674EE-DCFA-47C3-B1BF-2A58E7B6F876@tapr.org>
Message-ID: <0f4f01d6edfa$eee43b30$ccacb190$@gmail.com>

And it looks like the early style had a little larger depth from the backside of the typebox to the mounting ?ears? that are used to locate the typebox into the carriage mechanism.

 

Steve G./N4TTY

 

From: w9ddd at tapr.org <w9ddd at tapr.org> 
Sent: Monday, January 18, 2021 7:14 PM
To: Nick England <navy.radio at gmail.com>
Cc: N4TTY at arrl.net; Greenkeys <greenkeys at mailman.qth.net>
Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] M28 Typebox Parts Illustrations

 

New style has an X on the edge.  I think the top edge if I remember correctly

John, W9DDD

 


On Jan 18, 2021, at 5:40 PM, Nick England <navy.radio at gmail.com <mailto:navy.radio at gmail.com> > wrote:

I have seen an explanation of old/new somewhere. I?ll try to find it. 

Nick

 

 

On Mon, Jan 18, 2021 at 6:39 PM Steve Garrison <steve.n4tty at gmail.com <mailto:steve.n4tty at gmail.com> > wrote:

Plus how do I know if the typebox I?m currently holding in my hand is the old style or the new style?  Is there a trick to knowing which is which?

 

Steve G./N4TTY

From: w9ddd at tapr.org <mailto:w9ddd at tapr.org>  <w9ddd at tapr.org <mailto:w9ddd at tapr.org> > 
Sent: Monday, January 18, 2021 6:03 PM
To: N4TTY at ARRL.NET <mailto:N4TTY at ARRL.NET> 
Cc: Greenkeys <greenkeys at mailman.qth.net <mailto:greenkeys at mailman.qth.net> >
Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] M28 Typebox Parts Illustrations

 

Speaking of these springs, if you had some loose in a box, how would you know if they were old or new design?  I would guess the newer design is shorter, but if you don't have some of each, you still don't know.

John, W9DDD

 


On Jan 18, 2021, at 9:10 AM, Steve Garrison <steve.n4tty at gmail.com <mailto:steve.n4tty at gmail.com> > wrote:

I know I have seen it somewhere, probably on Nick?s Navy-Radio page, but darn if I can find it now!

 

Looking for the Parts Breakdown for the typebox used on the M28, and I would guess the M35 as well.  Really looking for the part number for the spring that is on every type pallet inside the typebox.  Would like to see if Paul Cembura has any in his parts stock.

 

How many of you have ever taken a type box apart?  Any pointers on getting the spring disconnected from the pallet to prevent you from ruining the spring?

 

Now I know why the instructors in my USAF tech school were so upset with me when I discovered they had reversed the R and the Y that were in the typebox on the machine I was assigned to ?discover the bug.?  I found the bug much more quickly than the time it must have taken them to get the pallets switched!  And now I understand the statement they made when they handed me a unmodified typebox and said ?we?re saving this for the next smart-ass that come through here!?

 

I was playing musical type pallets on a type box that was blank at the FIGS-H position (STOP?) while my keyboard had a # sign on the FIGS position and would space but not print anything.  I removed the # type pallet from a typebox that had the fractional character type pallets that I knew I would never use.

 

Steve G./N4TTY

 

______________________________________________________________
GreenKeys mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net



Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch

2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/

1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html

Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html


This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to w9ddd at tapr.org <mailto:w9ddd at tapr.org> 

______________________________________________________________
GreenKeys mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net <mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net> 

>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to navy.radio at gmail.com <mailto:navy.radio at gmail.com> 

-- 

Nick England K4NYW
www.navy-radio.com <http://www.navy-radio.com> 

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From alffisher2 at gmail.com  Wed Jan 20 06:55:49 2021
From: alffisher2 at gmail.com (Alf Fisher)
Date: Wed, 20 Jan 2021 11:55:49 +0000
Subject: [GreenKeys] ARRL Handbook TU Limiter Circuit wanted
Message-ID: <1502d459-70a0-612f-cfad-e5037aacf6d4@gmail.com>

Hi folks,

Please can someone find me a scan of the the input Limiter circuit used 
in a TU in an ARRL handbook - probably around 1955 to1960.

It uses a double triode (6SN7 or 12AU7) with its cathodes connected 
together and the output is taken via a transformer.

I have an article that claims to use that circuit but the there are 
errors in the drawing such as the grid of the right hand half isnt 
connected to anything and the transformer secondary feeds mark and space 
filters via pot (presumably for balancing) but there are no terminating 
resistors so the pot wont do anything.

73,
Alf
G3WSD


From kh6cn at earthlink.net  Wed Jan 20 13:13:19 2021
From: kh6cn at earthlink.net (James Harper)
Date: Wed, 20 Jan 2021 10:13:19 -0800
Subject: [GreenKeys] Dovetron MPC-1000R
Message-ID: <001201d6ef57$ef2bd9f0$cd838dd0$@net>

Looking for parts for my Dovetron MPC-100R. Need a power transformer to
start with.

 

Jim Harper - KH6CN

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From w8roi at wowway.com  Wed Jan 20 14:21:06 2021
From: w8roi at wowway.com (Ralph Irish)
Date: Wed, 20 Jan 2021 14:21:06 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] ARRL Handbook TU Limiter Circuit wanted
In-Reply-To: <1502d459-70a0-612f-cfad-e5037aacf6d4@gmail.com>
References: <1502d459-70a0-612f-cfad-e5037aacf6d4@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <FB7B79A0-A784-479C-B93A-28E32287EEF4@wowway.com>

Alf

This might not be exactly what you specify below, but it might be of use.

The Limiter shows cathodes both grounded, but is a different tube.  It is
a dual triode, though.

This came from the 1961 ARRL Handbook, the oldest one I own, other than 
one from 1939, and I didn't even bother to look there!

Hope this helps some.

Ralph - W8ROI






-   -   -   -   -   -   -   -

On Jan 20, 2021, at 6:55 AM, Alf Fisher wrote:

> Hi folks,
> 
> Please can someone find me a scan of the the input Limiter circuit used in a TU in an ARRL handbook - probably around 1955 to1960.
> 
> It uses a double triode (6SN7 or 12AU7) with its cathodes connected together and the output is taken via a transformer.
> 
> I have an article that claims to use that circuit but the there are errors in the drawing such as the grid of the right hand half isnt connected to anything and the transformer secondary feeds mark and space filters via pot (presumably for balancing) but there are no terminating resistors so the pot wont do anything.
> 
> 73,
> Alf
> G3WSD
> 
> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
> 
>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
> 
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to w8roi at wowway.com

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From harold at w6iwi.org  Wed Jan 20 15:49:29 2021
From: harold at w6iwi.org (Harold Hallikainen)
Date: Wed, 20 Jan 2021 12:49:29 -0800
Subject: [GreenKeys] ARRL Handbook TU Limiter Circuit wanted
In-Reply-To: <1502d459-70a0-612f-cfad-e5037aacf6d4@gmail.com>
References: <1502d459-70a0-612f-cfad-e5037aacf6d4@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <3e20cc0f0235d93e0b0ae3884b4b0b14.squirrel@mai.hallikainen.org>


> Hi folks,
>
> Please can someone find me a scan of the the input Limiter circuit used
> in a TU in an ARRL handbook - probably around 1955 to1960.
>
> It uses a double triode (6SN7 or 12AU7) with its cathodes connected
> together and the output is taken via a transformer.
>
> I have an article that claims to use that circuit but the there are
> errors in the drawing such as the grid of the right hand half isnt
> connected to anything and the transformer secondary feeds mark and space
> filters via pot (presumably for balancing) but there are no terminating
> resistors so the pot wont do anything.
>
> 73,
> Alf
> G3WSD

Looking around, I find this:
https://ia903106.us.archive.org/13/items/arrl-1970-radio-amateur-handbook/arrl-1970-radio-amateur-handbook.pdf#page=294
, from 1970. It is a vacuum tube circuit (1974 uses op amps), but the
12AX7 appears to just be a two stage amplifier. There is a diode clipper
before the 12AX7.

I wonder about the use of limiters in the use of two filter envelope
detectors. Since we are comparing the amplitudes of the mark and space
signals, what does clipping the signal before the filters do?

Harold




-- 
FCC Rules Updated Daily at http://www.hallikainen.com
Not sent from an iPhone.

From rmowery42 at charter.net  Wed Jan 20 16:12:25 2021
From: rmowery42 at charter.net (Ralph Mowery)
Date: Wed, 20 Jan 2021 16:12:25 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] ARRL Handbook TU Limiter Circuit wanted
In-Reply-To: <3e20cc0f0235d93e0b0ae3884b4b0b14.squirrel@mai.hallikainen.org>
References: <1502d459-70a0-612f-cfad-e5037aacf6d4@gmail.com>
	<3e20cc0f0235d93e0b0ae3884b4b0b14.squirrel@mai.hallikainen.org>
Message-ID: <002701d6ef70$f3b04740$db10d5c0$@net>

You have to remember that only one tone is sent at a time.  So it is not
comparing the amplitude of the mark to the space,but rather the tone to the
noise.  So if the tone is just slightly out of the noise it will be boosted
well above just the noise of the other tone frequency noise at that time.

Ralph ku4pt




-----Original Message-----
From: greenkeys-bounces at mailman.qth.net
[mailto:greenkeys-bounces at mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Harold Hallikainen
Sent: Wednesday, January 20, 2021 3:49 PM
To: greenkeys at mailman.qth.net
Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] ARRL Handbook TU Limiter Circuit wanted


> Hi folks,
>
> Please can someone find me a scan of the the input Limiter circuit used
> in a TU in an ARRL handbook - probably around 1955 to1960.
>
> It uses a double triode (6SN7 or 12AU7) with its cathodes connected
> together and the output is taken via a transformer.
>
> I have an article that claims to use that circuit but the there are
> errors in the drawing such as the grid of the right hand half isnt
> connected to anything and the transformer secondary feeds mark and space
> filters via pot (presumably for balancing) but there are no terminating
> resistors so the pot wont do anything.
>
> 73,
> Alf
> G3WSD

Looking around, I find this:
https://ia903106.us.archive.org/13/items/arrl-1970-radio-amateur-handbook/ar
rl-1970-radio-amateur-handbook.pdf#page=294
, from 1970. It is a vacuum tube circuit (1974 uses op amps), but the
12AX7 appears to just be a two stage amplifier. There is a diode clipper
before the 12AX7.

I wonder about the use of limiters in the use of two filter envelope
detectors. Since we are comparing the amplitudes of the mark and space
signals, what does clipping the signal before the filters do?

Harold



From elb at kb8ojh.net  Wed Jan 20 16:17:25 2021
From: elb at kb8ojh.net (Ethan Blanton)
Date: Wed, 20 Jan 2021 16:17:25 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] ARRL Handbook TU Limiter Circuit wanted
In-Reply-To: <1502d459-70a0-612f-cfad-e5037aacf6d4@gmail.com>
References: <1502d459-70a0-612f-cfad-e5037aacf6d4@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20210120211725.GA14959@mail.kb8ojh.net>

Alf Fisher wrote:
> Please can someone find me a scan of the the input Limiter circuit used in a
> TU in an ARRL handbook - probably around 1955 to1960.
>
> It uses a double triode (6SN7 or 12AU7) with its cathodes connected together
> and the output is taken via a transformer.

I couldn't find it, but I can confirm that by 1965 it was not the
circuit you are looking for.  1965 is a W2PAT design which uses a 6SN7
with both cathodes grounded, but the output is  taken off the plate of
the second section at pin 5.

Ethan

From mngreer53 at gmail.com  Wed Jan 20 16:48:01 2021
From: mngreer53 at gmail.com (Matthew Greer)
Date: Wed, 20 Jan 2021 15:48:01 -0600
Subject: [GreenKeys] ARRL Handbook TU Limiter Circuit wanted
In-Reply-To: <FB7B79A0-A784-479C-B93A-28E32287EEF4@wowway.com>
References: <1502d459-70a0-612f-cfad-e5037aacf6d4@gmail.com>
	<FB7B79A0-A784-479C-B93A-28E32287EEF4@wowway.com>
Message-ID: <CALhRXNEVo8F-YsS=2cib=a2mJYH+sxZ90t0tarhUr2VH6=6s6A@mail.gmail.com>

>From "The New RTTY Handbook", 1962, here is a schematic that may be
relevant to your request. Seems to match the description somewhat.
Way out of my league here.. If it is of interest, I can scan more of the
pages that describe the circuit.
Regards, Matt

On Wed, Jan 20, 2021 at 1:24 PM Ralph Irish <w8roi at wowway.com> wrote:

> *Alf*
>
> *This might not be exactly what you specify below, but it might be of use.*
>
> *The Limiter shows cathodes both grounded, but is a different tube.  It is*
> *a dual triode, though.*
>
> *This came from the 1961 ARRL Handbook, the oldest one I own, other than *
> *one from 1939, and I didn't even bother to look there!*
>
> *Hope this helps some.*
>
> *Ralph - W8ROI*
>
>
>
>
>
> *-   -   -   -   -   -   -   -*
>
> *On Jan 20, 2021, at 6:55 AM, Alf Fisher wrote:*
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> *Hi folks,Please can someone find me a scan of the the input Limiter
> circuit used in a TU in an ARRL handbook - probably around 1955 to1960.It
> uses a double triode (6SN7 or 12AU7) with its cathodes connected together
> and the output is taken via a transformer.I have an article that claims to
> use that circuit but the there are errors in the drawing such as the grid
> of the right hand half isnt connected to anything and the transformer
> secondary feeds mark and space filters via pot (presumably for balancing)
> but there are no terminating resistors so the pot wont do
> anything.73,AlfG3WSD______________________________________________________________GreenKeys
> mailing listHome: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> <http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys>Help:
> http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm <http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm>Post:
> mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net <GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net>*
>
>
> *Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool:
> https://teletype.net/gksearch <https://teletype.net/gksearch>*
>
>
> *2002-to-present greenkeys archive:
> http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
> <http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/>*
>
>
> *1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive:
> http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
> <http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html>*
>
>
> *Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool:
> http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
> <http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html>*
>
>
>
>
>
> *This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net <http://www.qsl.net>Please help
> support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> <http://www.qsl.net/donate.html>Message delivered to w8roi at wowway.com
> <w8roi at wowway.com>*
>
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
>
> >>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool:
> https://teletype.net/gksearch
> >>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive:
> http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
> >>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive:
> http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
> >>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool:
> http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to mngreer53 at gmail.com
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From harold at w6iwi.org  Wed Jan 20 16:58:31 2021
From: harold at w6iwi.org (Harold Hallikainen)
Date: Wed, 20 Jan 2021 13:58:31 -0800
Subject: [GreenKeys] ARRL Handbook TU Limiter Circuit wanted
In-Reply-To: <002701d6ef70$f3b04740$db10d5c0$@net>
References: <1502d459-70a0-612f-cfad-e5037aacf6d4@gmail.com>
	<3e20cc0f0235d93e0b0ae3884b4b0b14.squirrel@mai.hallikainen.org>
	<002701d6ef70$f3b04740$db10d5c0$@net>
Message-ID: <ef8dc7e0898404cc03633911ba103a16.squirrel@mai.hallikainen.org>


> You have to remember that only one tone is sent at a time.  So it is not
> comparing the amplitude of the mark to the space,but rather the tone to
> the
> noise.  So if the tone is just slightly out of the noise it will be
> boosted
> well above just the noise of the other tone frequency noise at that time.
>
> Ralph ku4pt

Thanks! I need to run a Spice simulation of this. The peak amplitudes of
both the tone (in one filter) and the noise (in the other filter) would be
the same after clipping, but the tone filter output would be less when fed
with the clipped noise than with the clipped tone. But is this an
improvement over not clipping the signal?

Again, I need to simulate it!

Thanks!

Harold



-- 
FCC Rules Updated Daily at http://www.hallikainen.com
Not sent from an iPhone.

From ad7i at ad7i.net  Wed Jan 20 17:02:49 2021
From: ad7i at ad7i.net (ad7i)
Date: Wed, 20 Jan 2021 17:02:49 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] Model 15 Selector Magnets
Message-ID: <CANpP5D6xOFK+-Bd0zemo6=tG7UXmNvaEihp0cDOQBADST-dpBQ@mail.gmail.com>

Greetings --

I'm trying to understand the operation of Model 15 selector magnets.
Several people have told me that there are two sets of coils:  pulling
coils and holding coils.  From this description I can imagine a
mechanical-electric switching arrangement that, when an armature over the
pulling coil is moved by the flux produced by the pulling coil, that the
actuated armature causes current to be routed away from the pulling magnet
and to the holding magnet, which holds the armature in place until current
through that holding magnet is interrupted.  Again, this is the mental
construct I have in my head based on the terms pulling coil and holding
coil.

Yet, when I look at a schematic of a circuit used to control the selector
magnets in a Model 15 (such as shown on PDF page 4 of the document at
http://www.navy-radio.com/manuals/tty/wd/15_wd_drh.pdf, shown below as a
JPG ), I see a selector magnet formed like that of a model 28, as in two
adjacent parallel solenoid coils with opposing windings, carrying the same
current, to form a N-S poll face at either end of the coils (like the open
end of a horseshoe magnet).  Based on the schematic showing two coils that
carry the same current at the same time, with no switching arrangement
between the coils, as shown on PDF page 4 of the above referenced document,
I don't understand how the terms pulling coil and holding coil apply.

[image: m15-selector-magnets.jpg]

I'd be grateful for any info people can share with me regarding the Model
15 selector magnet operation.

Paul, ad7i
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From dave at horsfall.org  Wed Jan 20 17:12:38 2021
From: dave at horsfall.org (Dave Horsfall)
Date: Thu, 21 Jan 2021 09:12:38 +1100 (EST)
Subject: [GreenKeys] ARRL Handbook TU Limiter Circuit wanted
In-Reply-To: <ef8dc7e0898404cc03633911ba103a16.squirrel@mai.hallikainen.org>
References: <1502d459-70a0-612f-cfad-e5037aacf6d4@gmail.com>
	<3e20cc0f0235d93e0b0ae3884b4b0b14.squirrel@mai.hallikainen.org>
	<002701d6ef70$f3b04740$db10d5c0$@net>
	<ef8dc7e0898404cc03633911ba103a16.squirrel@mai.hallikainen.org>
Message-ID: <alpine.BSF.2.21.9999.2101210911400.95135@aneurin.horsfall.org>

On Wed, 20 Jan 2021, Harold Hallikainen wrote:

[ ... ]

> Again, I need to simulate it!

Please post the results (and the program itself if possible)!

-- Dave VK2KFU

From harold at w6iwi.org  Wed Jan 20 17:16:41 2021
From: harold at w6iwi.org (Harold Hallikainen)
Date: Wed, 20 Jan 2021 14:16:41 -0800
Subject: [GreenKeys] Model 15 Selector Magnets
In-Reply-To: <CANpP5D6xOFK+-Bd0zemo6=tG7UXmNvaEihp0cDOQBADST-dpBQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CANpP5D6xOFK+-Bd0zemo6=tG7UXmNvaEihp0cDOQBADST-dpBQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4be65a8ff836df4feab5379cb0c05d28.squirrel@mai.hallikainen.org>

My thoughts on this...

For holding magnets, the armature is pushed to the pole pieces by a cam
before the loop current is sampled. The cam then releases the armature. If
it falls away, this is a space. If not, this is a mark.

It takes considerably less current for the selector magnet to hold the
armature in place than it takes to pull the armature in. So, with pulling
magnets, you pace the coils in series for use with a 60 mA loop.

With holding magnets, fewer ampere turns are required to hold the
armature, so the coils are put in parallel for a 60 mA loop (30 mA through
each coil) or series for a 20 mA loop (20 mA through each coil).

The hold versus pull-in current is interesting. It is a form of
hysteresis. You have to increase the current above some amount to pull in
the armature, but reduce far below that to release the armature. I used
this years ago to make latching relays in a broadcast transmitter control
system. I put two resistors in series with a relay coil, one between
positive supply and the coil, the other between the other side of the coil
and ground. The current with both resistors in place was below the pull in
current and above the release current. If I shorted the resistor to
ground, the current would go above the pull in current, and the relay
would pull in. Removing the short returned the current to the hold
current, but above the drop out current, so the relay stayed pulled in.
Shorting the other end of the coil to ground recued the coil current to
zero, so the relay dropped out. We ended up with a latching relay where
one closure to ground would latch it, and the other closure to ground
would unlatch it.

Another interesting thing about selector magnets is how the inductance
changes dramatically based on whether the armature is contact with the
pole pieces or not. This is evident in the scope photos at
https://w6iwi.org/rtty/tu170/ .

Harold
https://w6iwi.org



-- 
FCC Rules Updated Daily at http://www.hallikainen.com
Not sent from an iPhone.

From rmowery42 at charter.net  Wed Jan 20 17:54:20 2021
From: rmowery42 at charter.net (Ralph Mowery)
Date: Wed, 20 Jan 2021 17:54:20 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] ARRL Handbook TU Limiter Circuit wanted
In-Reply-To: <ef8dc7e0898404cc03633911ba103a16.squirrel@mai.hallikainen.org>
References: <1502d459-70a0-612f-cfad-e5037aacf6d4@gmail.com>	<3e20cc0f0235d93e0b0ae3884b4b0b14.squirrel@mai.hallikainen.org>	<002701d6ef70$f3b04740$db10d5c0$@net>
	<ef8dc7e0898404cc03633911ba103a16.squirrel@mai.hallikainen.org>
Message-ID: <003401d6ef7f$30b3c0a0$921b41e0$@net>

It has been a long time ago that I read the articles by Hoff.  I think that
he decided way back that the limiter was not the way to go IF you had other
circuits that were automatic threshold/decision correction and some other
circuits.  However for the hams and ones with limited abilities or budgets
then the limiter circuits were the way to go.   His designs of the later
tube circuits and the ST-6 were the standards to shoot for back then.
Simple and inexpensive enough to build but worked very well.  One good thing
about the limiter/discriminator circuit is that the tones do not have to be
spaced apart and on frequency as close.  Way back then very few had a good
way to build and calibrate filters and tone generators for 170 Hz shift.
Now an audio frequency to high RF frequency counter is a few bucks and
computer software can generate and detect audio frequencies for free.

Ralph ku4pt






-----Original Message-----
From: greenkeys-bounces at mailman.qth.net
[mailto:greenkeys-bounces at mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Harold Hallikainen
Sent: Wednesday, January 20, 2021 4:59 PM
To: greenkeys at mailman.qth.net
Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] ARRL Handbook TU Limiter Circuit wanted


> You have to remember that only one tone is sent at a time.  So it is not
> comparing the amplitude of the mark to the space,but rather the tone to
> the
> noise.  So if the tone is just slightly out of the noise it will be
> boosted
> well above just the noise of the other tone frequency noise at that time.
>
> Ralph ku4pt

Thanks! I need to run a Spice simulation of this. The peak amplitudes of
both the tone (in one filter) and the noise (in the other filter) would be
the same after clipping, but the tone filter output would be less when fed
with the clipped noise than with the clipped tone. But is this an
improvement over not clipping the signal?

Again, I need to simulate it!

Thanks!

Harold



From kb8tq at n1k.org  Wed Jan 20 18:05:12 2021
From: kb8tq at n1k.org (Bob kb8tq)
Date: Wed, 20 Jan 2021 18:05:12 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] ARRL Handbook TU Limiter Circuit wanted
In-Reply-To: <003401d6ef7f$30b3c0a0$921b41e0$@net>
References: <1502d459-70a0-612f-cfad-e5037aacf6d4@gmail.com>
	<3e20cc0f0235d93e0b0ae3884b4b0b14.squirrel@mai.hallikainen.org>
	<002701d6ef70$f3b04740$db10d5c0$@net>
	<ef8dc7e0898404cc03633911ba103a16.squirrel@mai.hallikainen.org>
	<003401d6ef7f$30b3c0a0$921b41e0$@net>
Message-ID: <9A425DB9-1998-463B-973C-D0F1B3B94192@n1k.org>

Hi

The 741 op amp came out in 1963. Poly Packs had parts ?for cheap? not more
than a couple years after that. Once you had cheap / simple op amps ?.. this 
all changed in a big hurry. 

Bob 

> On Jan 20, 2021, at 5:54 PM, Ralph Mowery <rmowery42 at charter.net> wrote:
> 
> It has been a long time ago that I read the articles by Hoff.  I think that
> he decided way back that the limiter was not the way to go IF you had other
> circuits that were automatic threshold/decision correction and some other
> circuits.  However for the hams and ones with limited abilities or budgets
> then the limiter circuits were the way to go.   His designs of the later
> tube circuits and the ST-6 were the standards to shoot for back then.
> Simple and inexpensive enough to build but worked very well.  One good thing
> about the limiter/discriminator circuit is that the tones do not have to be
> spaced apart and on frequency as close.  Way back then very few had a good
> way to build and calibrate filters and tone generators for 170 Hz shift.
> Now an audio frequency to high RF frequency counter is a few bucks and
> computer software can generate and detect audio frequencies for free.
> 
> Ralph ku4pt
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: greenkeys-bounces at mailman.qth.net
> [mailto:greenkeys-bounces at mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Harold Hallikainen
> Sent: Wednesday, January 20, 2021 4:59 PM
> To: greenkeys at mailman.qth.net
> Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] ARRL Handbook TU Limiter Circuit wanted
> 
> 
>> You have to remember that only one tone is sent at a time.  So it is not
>> comparing the amplitude of the mark to the space,but rather the tone to
>> the
>> noise.  So if the tone is just slightly out of the noise it will be
>> boosted
>> well above just the noise of the other tone frequency noise at that time.
>> 
>> Ralph ku4pt
> 
> Thanks! I need to run a Spice simulation of this. The peak amplitudes of
> both the tone (in one filter) and the noise (in the other filter) would be
> the same after clipping, but the tone filter output would be less when fed
> with the clipped noise than with the clipped tone. But is this an
> improvement over not clipping the signal?
> 
> Again, I need to simulate it!
> 
> Thanks!
> 
> Harold
> 
> 
> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
> 
>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
> 
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to kb8tq at n1k.org


From jim.w2jc at gmail.com  Wed Jan 20 18:22:02 2021
From: jim.w2jc at gmail.com (Jim Cooper)
Date: Wed, 20 Jan 2021 18:22:02 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] Model 15 Selector Magnets
In-Reply-To: <CANpP5D6xOFK+-Bd0zemo6=tG7UXmNvaEihp0cDOQBADST-dpBQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CANpP5D6xOFK+-Bd0zemo6=tG7UXmNvaEihp0cDOQBADST-dpBQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <6008BB1A.6349.904A948@jim.w2jc.gmail.com>

On 20 Jan 2021 at 17:02, ad7i wrote:

> causes current to be routed away
> from the pulling magnet and to the
> holding magnet, 

basic mis-understanding of the concept !!

A machine has only ONE type of selector magnet...
EITHER a pulling or a holding selector magnet. 

As described in other replies, you can tell by 
looking for the cam on the main shaft which 
PUSHES the selector armature against the 
selector magnet face -- that is the HOLDING 
type.  Without the cam, it's the pulling type. 

The holding magnet concept increased the 
useable range a lot, but also allowed the use 
of 20mA loop current rather than 60mA.  

w2jc 




From alffisher2 at gmail.com  Wed Jan 20 18:29:56 2021
From: alffisher2 at gmail.com (Alf Fisher)
Date: Wed, 20 Jan 2021 23:29:56 +0000
Subject: [GreenKeys] ARRL Handbook TU Limiter Circuit wanted
In-Reply-To: <20210120211725.GA14959@mail.kb8ojh.net>
References: <1502d459-70a0-612f-cfad-e5037aacf6d4@gmail.com>
	<20210120211725.GA14959@mail.kb8ojh.net>
Message-ID: <c7e843b9-b5b9-58a9-b3ab-e4dbef17363c@gmail.com>

Guys,
Thank you all so much for your input on this.
The limiter circuit in question which I have extracted the front end is 
allegedly in one of the ARRL handbooks but has got some 
draughting/copying errors.
I suspect pin 2 of V1 should be grounded and the circuit surrounding R4 
seems wrong to me.
I thought it was kind-of nice because the filter circuits are tuneable.

73,
Alf
G3WSD


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From rmowery42 at charter.net  Wed Jan 20 18:49:12 2021
From: rmowery42 at charter.net (Ralph Mowery)
Date: Wed, 20 Jan 2021 18:49:12 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] ARRL Handbook TU Limiter Circuit wanted
In-Reply-To: <9A425DB9-1998-463B-973C-D0F1B3B94192@n1k.org>
References: <1502d459-70a0-612f-cfad-e5037aacf6d4@gmail.com>
	<3e20cc0f0235d93e0b0ae3884b4b0b14.squirrel@mai.hallikainen.org>
	<002701d6ef70$f3b04740$db10d5c0$@net>
	<ef8dc7e0898404cc03633911ba103a16.squirrel@mai.hallikainen.org>
	<003401d6ef7f$30b3c0a0$921b41e0$@net>
	<9A425DB9-1998-463B-973C-D0F1B3B94192@n1k.org>
Message-ID: <000001d6ef86$dad13c50$9073b4f0$@net>

I am not sure when the 709 came out, but it was about the same as the741 op amp.  

I built a ST-6 in the early 1980's on a piece of perf board.  That thing still used about 7 of the op amps and a few transistors.  While not extremely difficult to build, changeling enough for just a ham hobbyist.   That unit is probably about all the common ham would build.  I was lucky as I had a Heathkit frequency counter and could adjust the filters to the exact frequency.  Hal did come out with the unit in several forms from kits to maybe a wired unit.

Ralph ku4pt


-----Original Message-----
From: Bob kb8tq [mailto:kb8tq at n1k.org] 
Sent: Wednesday, January 20, 2021 6:05 PM
To: Ralph Mowery
Cc: greenkeys at mailman.qth.net
Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] ARRL Handbook TU Limiter Circuit wanted

Hi

The 741 op amp came out in 1963. Poly Packs had parts ?for cheap? not more
than a couple years after that. Once you had cheap / simple op amps ?.. this 
all changed in a big hurry. 

Bob 

> On Jan 20, 2021, at 5:54 PM, Ralph Mowery <rmowery42 at charter.net> wrote:
> 
> It has been a long time ago that I read the articles by Hoff.  I think that
> he decided way back that the limiter was not the way to go IF you had other
> circuits that were automatic threshold/decision correction and some other
> circuits.  However for the hams and ones with limited abilities or budgets
> then the limiter circuits were the way to go.   His designs of the later
> tube circuits and the ST-6 were the standards to shoot for back then.
> Simple and inexpensive enough to build but worked very well.  One good thing
> about the limiter/discriminator circuit is that the tones do not have to be
> spaced apart and on frequency as close.  Way back then very few had a good
> way to build and calibrate filters and tone generators for 170 Hz shift.
> Now an audio frequency to high RF frequency counter is a few bucks and
> computer software can generate and detect audio frequencies for free.
> 
> Ralph ku4pt
> 
> 
> 
> 


From ad7i at ad7i.net  Wed Jan 20 19:39:46 2021
From: ad7i at ad7i.net (ad7i)
Date: Wed, 20 Jan 2021 19:39:46 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] Model 15 Selector Magnets
In-Reply-To: <6008BB1A.6349.904A948@jim.w2jc.gmail.com>
References: <CANpP5D6xOFK+-Bd0zemo6=tG7UXmNvaEihp0cDOQBADST-dpBQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<6008BB1A.6349.904A948@jim.w2jc.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CANpP5D7MeJwGDenO-RFke+Sg3A8Na2uXO56f-+rOf5F93o1mjQ@mail.gmail.com>

Thank you Jim.  Now I understand.  I'll take a look to see what type I have.

Paul, ad7i



On Wed, Jan 20, 2021 at 6:22 PM Jim Cooper <jim.w2jc at gmail.com> wrote:

> On 20 Jan 2021 at 17:02, ad7i wrote:
>
> > causes current to be routed away
> > from the pulling magnet and to the
> > holding magnet,
>
> basic mis-understanding of the concept !!
>
> A machine has only ONE type of selector magnet...
> EITHER a pulling or a holding selector magnet.
>
> As described in other replies, you can tell by
> looking for the cam on the main shaft which
> PUSHES the selector armature against the
> selector magnet face -- that is the HOLDING
> type.  Without the cam, it's the pulling type.
>
> The holding magnet concept increased the
> useable range a lot, but also allowed the use
> of 20mA loop current rather than 60mA.
>
> w2jc
>
>
>
>
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From jhhaynes at earthlink.net  Wed Jan 20 20:03:55 2021
From: jhhaynes at earthlink.net (Jim Haynes)
Date: Wed, 20 Jan 2021 19:03:55 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [GreenKeys] ARRL Handbook TU Limiter Circuit wanted
In-Reply-To: <1502d459-70a0-612f-cfad-e5037aacf6d4@gmail.com>
References: <1502d459-70a0-612f-cfad-e5037aacf6d4@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <alpine.DEB.2.20.2101201858530.4848@Frances>

For the time frame you are talking about, the W2PAT converter
was originally published in January 1953 QST and is the same
as that later published in ARRL Handbook.

I'm attaching another one from the November 1944 issue of
Electronics, the article by Robert Sprague of Press Wireless.
 	---

 	"Ya can argue all ya wanna, but it's dif'rent than it was."
 	"No it ain't! No it ain't!  But ya gotta know the territory."
 		Meredith Willson, The Music Man
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From jhhaynes at earthlink.net  Wed Jan 20 20:24:00 2021
From: jhhaynes at earthlink.net (Jim Haynes)
Date: Wed, 20 Jan 2021 19:24:00 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [GreenKeys] ARRL Handbook TU Limiter Circuit wanted
In-Reply-To: <ef8dc7e0898404cc03633911ba103a16.squirrel@mai.hallikainen.org>
References: <1502d459-70a0-612f-cfad-e5037aacf6d4@gmail.com>
	<3e20cc0f0235d93e0b0ae3884b4b0b14.squirrel@mai.hallikainen.org>
	<002701d6ef70$f3b04740$db10d5c0$@net>
	<ef8dc7e0898404cc03633911ba103a16.squirrel@mai.hallikainen.org>
Message-ID: <alpine.DEB.2.20.2101201911500.4848@Frances>

We have to remember, too, some things about FM limiter theory
that were mentioned in the November 1944 Sprague article in
Electronics, but didn't really take hold in the amateur
community until Don Wiggins wrote about it in RTTY in 1960.

If you have a desired signal, and a weaker interfering signal,
putting that through a limiter will improve the signal/noise
ratio, but what comes out of the limiter is an FSK signal that
has spikes in the instantaneous frequency.  If the discriminator
is linear well beyond the mark and space frequencies the spikes
will average out.  Sprague noted the need for the widely-
linear discriminator, but didn't explain the reason for it.
So all the ham discriminators were built with the discriminator
peaks at the mark and space frequencies, and the spikes fail
to average out.

There was also some (non ham) work by Elie Baghdady at MIT around
1960 with positive feedback around the limiter, the optimum being
that the circuit weakly oscillates in the absence of signal.
I built a circuit like that at the time and I think it improved
FSK reception, but I didn't do any serious testing so I don't know
if it really did.  The neat thing about the Baghdady circuit is
that if you can get it to oscillate near the mark frequency
you get mark-hold for free.

Well then we discovered two-tone operation and the limiter
discriminator method of demodulation went into the dust bin
of history.

 	---

 	"Ya can argue all ya wanna, but it's dif'rent than it was."
 	"No it ain't! No it ain't!  But ya gotta know the territory."
 		Meredith Willson, The Music Man

From alffisher2 at gmail.com  Thu Jan 21 07:26:14 2021
From: alffisher2 at gmail.com (Alf Fisher)
Date: Thu, 21 Jan 2021 12:26:14 +0000
Subject: [GreenKeys] Teletype Model 14 page printer
Message-ID: <52b21026-cdae-f828-c8b0-451d9e6ec9a4@gmail.com>

Hi folks,

Please forgive my ignorance of these machines but I have question for you...

What type/size of paper roll does a Model 14 use?

Is it a normal size roll - is it sprocket feed or not?

TIA,

73,
Alf
G3WSD

From paul0926 at comcast.net  Thu Jan 21 09:30:01 2021
From: paul0926 at comcast.net (Paul Heller)
Date: Thu, 21 Jan 2021 15:30:01 +0100
Subject: [GreenKeys] =?utf-8?q?OT=3A_Henning=E2=80=99s_Flour_and_Mustard_M?=
	=?utf-8?q?ill?=
Message-ID: <BD27D565-83D8-4544-BD62-F53B43ACFA55@comcast.net>

OT means Off Topic.

One of our fellow Greenkeys members, Henning Treumann,  runs a flour mill along with his lovely wife Swantje. They are now making not just flour, but mustard as well in their mill.	I?ve tasted the mustard and it is very good. Some day when they have an online shop up and going and are able to ship worldwide, you should try some. Until then, you?ll have to visit them in Germany as soon we are able to travel again :-)

(For those who are new and don?t know Henning, he is a fellow ham, is very knowledgeable in teleprinters, is one of the main persons behind i-Telex and he has contributed many posts to our group).

I?ve posted about their mill before. They?ve now turned it into an on-going business. A few days ago their business was featured in a report of the German SAT1 television station. You can watch it here:

https://www.sat1regional.de/traditionelle-senf-herstellung-ehepaar-aus-edemissen-produziert-mit-kornmuehle/

Of course it is in German, but if you don?t understand German (most here probably do not) just turn off the sound and enjoy the visuals.

Sadly you don?t see any teletypes in the mill (actually there are, but not in the video. Come to think of it.... forget about the website. When they are ready, let?s order our mustard using our teleprinters!

Paul
W2TTY

ITTY: 		HTTP://INTERNET-TTY.NET:8000/ITTY
AUTOSTART: HTTP://INTERNET-TTY.NET:8030/AUTOSTART
EUROPE: 	HTTP://INTERNET-TTY.NET:8040/EUROPE
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From jim.w2jc at gmail.com  Thu Jan 21 17:04:39 2021
From: jim.w2jc at gmail.com (Jim Cooper)
Date: Thu, 21 Jan 2021 17:04:39 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] Even old tty pictures have value !!
Message-ID: <6009FA77.23112.38572B1@jim.w2jc.gmail.com>

Stumbled on this as I was browsing 
'the bay'  ...  people are even selling 
(trying to sell) old printouts of RTTY 
art !! 

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Vintage-Teletype-Poster-Toples
s-Lady-Computer-Paper-Printout-44-Inches-Long/19365595
2055

[too bad most of mine are on the yellow newsprint 
type paper and not in very good condition!]

w2jc 



From k1lky68 at gmail.com  Thu Jan 21 18:08:41 2021
From: k1lky68 at gmail.com (Roy Morgan)
Date: Thu, 21 Jan 2021 18:08:41 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] Even old tty pictures have value !!
In-Reply-To: <6009FA77.23112.38572B1@jim.w2jc.gmail.com>
References: <6009FA77.23112.38572B1@jim.w2jc.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <92DCCD10-D1DD-4FAA-91B1-B0D88DC5C535@gmail.com>

Got a "can't find that page"
Maybe your link got line-wrapped. 
Might work if enclosed in brackets: <....>

Roy Morgan
K1LKY Western Mass

> On Jan 21, 2021, at 6:05 PM, Jim Cooper <jim.w2jc at gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> ?Stumbled on this as I was browsing 
> 'the bay'  ...  people are even selling 
> (trying to sell) old printouts of RTTY 
> art !! 
> 
> https://www.ebay.com/itm/Vintage-Teletype-Poster-Toples
> s-Lady-Computer-Paper-Printout-44-Inches-Long/19365595
> 2055
> 
> [too bad most of mine are on the yellow newsprint 
> type paper and not in very good condition!]
> 
> w2jc 
> 
> 
> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
> 
>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
> 
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to k1lky68 at gmail.com

From k1lky68 at gmail.com  Thu Jan 21 18:11:16 2021
From: k1lky68 at gmail.com (Roy Morgan)
Date: Thu, 21 Jan 2021 18:11:16 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] Even old tty pictures have value !!
In-Reply-To: <6009FA77.23112.38572B1@jim.w2jc.gmail.com>
References: <6009FA77.23112.38572B1@jim.w2jc.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <48DF984E-FBA5-431C-BA6D-04A6ABD34519@gmail.com>

Try This:

<https://www.ebay.com/itm/Vintage-Teletype-Poster-Topless-Lady-Computer-Paper-Printout-44-Inches-Long/193655952055>

> On Jan 21, 2021, at 5:04 PM, Jim Cooper <jim.w2jc at gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> Stumbled on this as I was browsing 
> 'the bay'  ...  people are even selling 
> (trying to sell) old printouts of RTTY 
> art !! 
> 
> https://www.ebay.com/itm/Vintage-Teletype-Poster-Topless-Lady-Computer-Paper-Printout-44-Inches-Long/193655952055
> 
> [too bad most of mine are on the yellow newsprint 
> type paper and not in very good condition!]

Roy Morgan
K1LKY since 1958
k1lky68 at gmail.com
Western Mass






From w8roi at wowway.com  Thu Jan 21 18:40:23 2021
From: w8roi at wowway.com (Ralph Irish)
Date: Thu, 21 Jan 2021 18:40:23 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] Teletype Model 14 page printer
In-Reply-To: <52b21026-cdae-f828-c8b0-451d9e6ec9a4@gmail.com>
References: <52b21026-cdae-f828-c8b0-451d9e6ec9a4@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <522A2856-95A3-43E7-8650-EB2D35276802@wowway.com>

Alf

The width of the tape should be 11/16 inch wide.  In the process of punching
the holes for the characters, it also punches a 'feed hole' for the sprocket
device which feeds the tape into the machine.

As for the diameter of a roll, the one I have is just a few millimeters shy
of 8 inches.

Hope this helps.

73,

Ralph - 8ROI


On Jan 21, 2021, at 7:26 AM, Alf Fisher wrote:

> Hi folks,
> 
> Please forgive my ignorance of these machines but I have question for you...
> 
> What type/size of paper roll does a Model 14 use?
> 
> Is it a normal size roll - is it sprocket feed or not?
> 
> TIA,
> 
> 73,
> Alf
> G3WSD
> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
> 
>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
> 
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to w8roi at wowway.com

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From w9ddd at tapr.org  Thu Jan 21 19:11:48 2021
From: w9ddd at tapr.org (w9ddd at tapr.org)
Date: Thu, 21 Jan 2021 18:11:48 -0600
Subject: [GreenKeys] Teletype Model 14 page printer
In-Reply-To: <52b21026-cdae-f828-c8b0-451d9e6ec9a4@gmail.com>
References: <52b21026-cdae-f828-c8b0-451d9e6ec9a4@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4E98254A-B0FC-45F1-94AB-3501AF032AD4@tapr.org>

You might find this of interest.
http://navy-radio.com/manuals/tty/jh/bsps/bsp/pseries/P70.253.pdf

John, W9DDD


> On Jan 21, 2021, at 6:26 AM, Alf Fisher <alffisher2 at gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> Hi folks,
> 
> Please forgive my ignorance of these machines but I have question for you...
> 
> What type/size of paper roll does a Model 14 use?
> 
> Is it a normal size roll - is it sprocket feed or not?
> 
> TIA,
> 
> 73,
> Alf
> G3WSD
> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
> 
>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
> 
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to w9ddd at tapr.org


From jim.w2jc at gmail.com  Thu Jan 21 19:20:33 2021
From: jim.w2jc at gmail.com (Jim Cooper)
Date: Thu, 21 Jan 2021 19:20:33 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] Teletype Model 14 page printer
In-Reply-To: <522A2856-95A3-43E7-8650-EB2D35276802@wowway.com>
References: <52b21026-cdae-f828-c8b0-451d9e6ec9a4@gmail.com>,
	<522A2856-95A3-43E7-8650-EB2D35276802@wowway.com>
Message-ID: <600A1A51.18791.401DDE4@jim.w2jc.gmail.com>

To clarify Ralph's response, as far as I know 
THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS A Model 14 
PAGE Printer ...   only typing tape perforators, 
typing tape reperforators and non-typing tape 
punches. 

There is a very old Model 14 "strip printer" that 
used narrow tape to type messages (Western Union 
used tape with dry 'gum' adhesive on the back, so 
that the typed tape could be moistened and pasted 
onto a telegram form for delivery).  Non-gummed tape 
was often used when the Model 14 strip printer was used
by technicians as a "talk wire" between offices, etc. 

For the tape peforators and reperforators, Ralph's 
response is accurate.  If I recall correctly, there are 
different types of un-punched tape holders (for the 
tape source) that require different sized center holes -- 
so before purchasing fresh tape, one has to know what 
tape holder will be used on the Model 14.

Jim  w2jc 


On 21 Jan 2021 at 18:40, Ralph Irish wrote:

> Alf
> 
> The width of the tape should be
> 11/16 inch wide.  In the process of
> punching the holes for the
> characters, it also punches a 'feed
> hole' for the sprocket device which
> feeds the tape into the machine. 
> 
> As for the diameter of a roll, the
> one I have is just a few millimeters
> shy of 8 inches. 
> 
> Hope this helps.
> 
> 73,
> 
> Ralph - 8ROI
> 
> 
> On Jan 21, 2021, at 7:26 AM, Alf Fisher wrote:
> 
> > Hi folks,
> > 
> > Please forgive my ignorance of these machines but I have question
> for you...
> > 
> > What type/size of paper roll does a Model 14 use?
> > 
> > Is it a normal size roll - is it sprocket feed or not?
> > 
> > TIA,
> > 
> > 73,
> > Alf
> > G3WSD
> > ______________________________________________________________
> > GreenKeys mailing list
> > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> > Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
> > 
> >>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool:
> https://teletype.net/gksearch
> >>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive:
> http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
> >>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive:
> http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
> >>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool:
> http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
> > 
> > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> > Please help support this email list:
> http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> > Message delivered to w8roi at wowway.com
> 
> 



From jim.w2jc at gmail.com  Thu Jan 21 19:20:24 2021
From: jim.w2jc at gmail.com (Jim Cooper)
Date: Thu, 21 Jan 2021 19:20:24 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] 8-bit perforator tape
Message-ID: <600A1A48.15867.401BBC4@jim.w2jc.gmail.com>

A while ago, someone was asking about 
sourcing for 8-bit (1" wide) perforator tape -- 
I've lost the message but recall the question. 

I have come across a small quantity of tape 
originally used for Flexowriters (also 8-bit) 
if that person is still in need. 



Jim  w2jc 

I also now have several 1800rpm sync motors (for M-15, 
M-19, M-14 eqpt) tested and working ... 

Also one governed motor for same series eqpt, for 
a mere $5 + shipping (a disappointing $15). 



more stuff at   http://bit.ly/TTY-stuff 


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From dave at horsfall.org  Thu Jan 21 23:58:48 2021
From: dave at horsfall.org (Dave Horsfall)
Date: Fri, 22 Jan 2021 15:58:48 +1100 (EST)
Subject: [GreenKeys]
 =?iso-8859-7?q?OT=3A_Henning=A2s_Flour_and_Mustard_Mi?=
 =?iso-8859-7?q?ll?=
In-Reply-To: <BD27D565-83D8-4544-BD62-F53B43ACFA55@comcast.net>
References: <BD27D565-83D8-4544-BD62-F53B43ACFA55@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <alpine.BSF.2.21.9999.2101221545010.95135@aneurin.horsfall.org>

On Thu, 21 Jan 2021, Paul Heller wrote:

> OT means Off Topic.

Gosh...  Never on this hallowed site :-)

> One of our fellow Greenkeys members, Henning Treumann, ?runs a flour 
> mill along with his lovely wife Swantje. They are now making not just 
> flour, but mustard as well in their mill. I?ve tasted the mustard and it 
> is very good. Some day when they have an online shop up and going and 
> are able to ship worldwide, you should try some. Until then, you?ll have 
> to visit them in Germany as soon we are able to travel again :-) (For 
> those who are new and don?t know Henning, he is a fellow ham, is very 
> knowledgeable in teleprinters, is one of the main persons behind i-Telex 
> and he has contributed many posts to our group).

I love mustard!  And the hotter the better; I dare anyone to lick a spoon 
of Hot English (and I'll want to see the entire video, including the 
burning aftermath, including diving for the nearest tap (or faucet)).

Like a good curry, if it doesn't burn as much coming out as it did going 
in...

> I?ve posted about their mill before. They?ve now turned it into an 
> on-going business. A few days ago their business was featured in a 
> report of the German SAT1 television station. You can watch it here:
> 
> https://www.sat1regional.de/traditionelle-senf-herstellung-ehepaar-aus-edemissen-produziert-mit-kornmuehle/
> 
> Of course it is in German, but if you don?t understand German (most here 
> probably do not) just turn off the sound and enjoy the visuals.

Ah well...  I'll check anyway.

> Sadly you don?t see any teletypes in the mill (actually there are, but 
> not in the video.  Come to think of it.... forget about the website. 
> When they are ready, let?s order our mustard using our teleprinters!

Well, I'm still looking at designing my iPad RTTY...  No room here for
Real Iron [tm].

-- Dave

From navy.radio at gmail.com  Fri Jan 22 10:23:48 2021
From: navy.radio at gmail.com (Nick England)
Date: Fri, 22 Jan 2021 10:23:48 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] US Army teletype and relay procedures
Message-ID: <CAB55hNcg491ZOWXtv7F17zGMbm7CjD2mWTynVMVC_+12+_xPNQ@mail.gmail.com>

 Thanks to Jim Cooper, I've scanned some Army Comm Center Publications
http://www.navy-radio.com/tty-relay.htm#army
US Army Signal Center and School Information Sheets

   - SSTS 56000C - Introduction to Communications Center Operation
   <http://www.navy-radio.com/tty/relay/ssts-56000c-comm-center-ops.pdf>
   - SSTS 56001F - Message Preparation and Handling
   <http://www.navy-radio.com/tty/relay/ssts-56001f-message-prep.pdf>
   - SSTS 56002C - Communications Security (COMSEC)
   <http://www.navy-radio.com/tty/relay/ssts-56002a-comsec.pdf>
   - SSTS 56003C - Manual Teletypewriter Procedures
   <http://www.navy-radio.com/tty/relay/ssts-56003c-manual-tty-proc.pdf>
   - SSTS 56004A - Radiotelegraph Procedures
   <http://www.navy-radio.com/tty/relay/ssts-56004a-radiotelegraph-proc.pdf>
   - SSTS 56005C - Tape Relay Operations
   <http://www.navy-radio.com/tty/relay/ssts-56005c-tape-relay.pdf>
   - SSTS 56007A - Automatic Teletypewriter Switching Centers
   <http://www.navy-radio.com/tty/relay/ssts-56007a-auto-switch-centers.pdf>
   - SSTS 56008A - Communications Center Planning
   <http://www.navy-radio.com/tty/relay/ssts-56008a-commcenter-planning.pdf>
   - SSTS 56009B - Communications Center Management
   <http://www.navy-radio.com/tty/relay/ssts-56009b-commcenter-management.pdf>

Nick England K4NYW
www.navy-radio.com
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From nagle at animats.com  Thu Jan 21 20:10:57 2021
From: nagle at animats.com (John Nagle)
Date: Thu, 21 Jan 2021 17:10:57 -0800
Subject: [GreenKeys] Teletype Model 14 page printer
In-Reply-To: <mailman.19.1611274919.30879.greenkeys@mailman.qth.net>
References: <mailman.19.1611274919.30879.greenkeys@mailman.qth.net>
Message-ID: <54e9ac0a-428a-bd66-6033-d6718ca1f3f3@animats.com>

> To clarify Ralph's response, as far as I know
> THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS A Model 14
> PAGE Printer ...   only typing tape perforators,
> typing tape reperforators and non-typing tape
> punches.
> 
> There is a very old Model 14 "strip printer" that
> used narrow tape to type messages (Western Union
> used tape with dry 'gum' adhesive on the back, so
> that the typed tape could be moistened and pasted
> onto a telegram form for delivery).  Non-gummed tape
> was often used when the Model 14 strip printer was used
> by technicians as a "talk wire" between offices, etc.

Yes. I've restored three of those little Model 14 strip
printers from the 1920s. Here's a Model 14 tape printer.

http://aetherltd.com/refurbishing14.html

The Model 14 family includes

- the tape printer, available with or without
   keyboard ("RO", for Receive Only, without)

- the typing reperforator, which is the tape
   printer with a punch mechanism and wider tape,
   also available with or without keyboard,

- the transmitter-distributor, which is a paper
   tape reader

- the perforator, which is a keyboard and tape
   punch with no printer.

But there is no Model 14 page printer.
Here's Wikipedia's model list.

Most page printer Teletypes take un-punched
paper rolls. You can get them here:

https://www.nordisco.com/store/item.aspx?ItemId=73573

These are white paper; the classic yellow paper is not
available as new stock.

			John Nagle

From w9ddd at tapr.org  Fri Jan 22 10:52:31 2021
From: w9ddd at tapr.org (John, W9DDD)
Date: Fri, 22 Jan 2021 09:52:31 -0600
Subject: [GreenKeys] Teletype Model 14 page printer
In-Reply-To: <54e9ac0a-428a-bd66-6033-d6718ca1f3f3@animats.com>
References: <mailman.19.1611274919.30879.greenkeys@mailman.qth.net>
	<54e9ac0a-428a-bd66-6033-d6718ca1f3f3@animats.com>
Message-ID: <78ccd791-06e4-6d98-3d7b-b6f600058f73@tapr.org>

Would the FRXD fit in that list?  Predecessor to the 28 RT, built from 
14 parts more or less.  Mostly more.

John, W9DDD

On 1/21/2021 7:10 PM, John Nagle wrote:
>> To clarify Ralph's response, as far as I know
>> THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS A Model 14
>> PAGE Printer ...?? only typing tape perforators,
>> typing tape reperforators and non-typing tape
>> punches.
>>
>> There is a very old Model 14 "strip printer" that
>> used narrow tape to type messages (Western Union
>> used tape with dry 'gum' adhesive on the back, so
>> that the typed tape could be moistened and pasted
>> onto a telegram form for delivery).? Non-gummed tape
>> was often used when the Model 14 strip printer was used
>> by technicians as a "talk wire" between offices, etc.
> 
> Yes. I've restored three of those little Model 14 strip
> printers from the 1920s. Here's a Model 14 tape printer.
> 
> http://aetherltd.com/refurbishing14.html
> 
> The Model 14 family includes
> 
> - the tape printer, available with or without
>  ? keyboard ("RO", for Receive Only, without)
> 
> - the typing reperforator, which is the tape
>  ? printer with a punch mechanism and wider tape,
>  ? also available with or without keyboard,
> 
> - the transmitter-distributor, which is a paper
>  ? tape reader
> 
> - the perforator, which is a keyboard and tape
>  ? punch with no printer.
> 
> But there is no Model 14 page printer.
> Here's Wikipedia's model list.
> 
> Most page printer Teletypes take un-punched
> paper rolls. You can get them here:
> 
> https://www.nordisco.com/store/item.aspx?ItemId=73573
> 
> These are white paper; the classic yellow paper is not
> available as new stock.
> 
>  ??????????? John Nagle
> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
> 
>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: 
>>>> https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: 
>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: 
>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: 
>>>> http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
> 
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to w9ddd at tapr.org

From navy.radio at gmail.com  Fri Jan 22 17:26:52 2021
From: navy.radio at gmail.com (Nick England)
Date: Fri, 22 Jan 2021 17:26:52 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] Ham RTTY and military RATT
In-Reply-To: <CAB55hNfTPca2mPpfm6hJeNQq64tjM=y4a6aHF1hTDa0-GXy8kw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAB55hNfTPca2mPpfm6hJeNQq64tjM=y4a6aHF1hTDa0-GXy8kw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAB55hNcsG+3gu90TCuhAz93kZY9fHchmvnJg+Ad7qSKdEhb0Bw@mail.gmail.com>

Murphy?s Law says I have made some error that is intuitively obvious to
even the most casual observer, but here goes:

I operate my Navy RATT gear with no modifications to "ham standard". I work
850 shift military standard RATT and 170 shift ham standard RTTY with no
problems. So far no one has ever noticed or complained.
Here is my cheat sheet
----------------------
NOTE - This drives me crazy - Military specifies either USB suppressed
carrier frequency F (or sometimes the RF center frequency = F+2000Hz). Hams
*usually* specify the LSB suppressed carrier frequency F (or sometimes the
MARK frequency = F-2125Hz)
-----------------------
For 850 shift military standard - (USB, mark low, 2000 +/-425 Hz tone)
Receiver (USB or RATT mode) to desired frequency (F=7087.0 kHz for
clatternet)
Transmitter (USB or RATT mode) to desired frequency (F=7087.0 kHz for
clatter net)
CV-3510B Navy AFSK TU to HF receive, HF transmit (2000 +/-425 Hz)
----------------------------
For 170 shift ham standard (LSB, mark high, 2210 +/-85 Hz tone)
for example F=14086.0 kHz autostart channel
Receiver (LSB mode) to F-0.5 kHz (e.g. 14085.5 kHz)
Transmitter (LSB mode) to  F-0.5 kHz (e.g. 14085.5 kHz)
CV-3510B to MMF receive, MMF transmit (1700 +/-85 Hz)
NOTE - the resulting center tone is 1700+500=2200.
This center is 10 Hz off the ham standard but it makes no practical
difference. In practice the ham will either ignore it or more likely
slightly retune to your center frequency. Hams have 1Hz or 10Hz resolution.
Military gear has 100 Hz resolution.
-----------------------------------
NOTE - The R-1051 receivers use the same filters and circuitry for RATT and
USB - there is no difference. So do NOT use RATT for ham use.

GOOD LUCK!
Nick England K4NYW
www.navy-radio.com
-- 
Nick England K4NYW
www.navy-radio.com
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From harold at w6iwi.org  Fri Jan 22 17:47:43 2021
From: harold at w6iwi.org (Harold Hallikainen)
Date: Fri, 22 Jan 2021 14:47:43 -0800
Subject: [GreenKeys] Ham RTTY and military RATT
In-Reply-To: <CAB55hNcsG+3gu90TCuhAz93kZY9fHchmvnJg+Ad7qSKdEhb0Bw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAB55hNfTPca2mPpfm6hJeNQq64tjM=y4a6aHF1hTDa0-GXy8kw@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAB55hNcsG+3gu90TCuhAz93kZY9fHchmvnJg+Ad7qSKdEhb0Bw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <cfcf4085c1135543670fa52e9d5253ce.squirrel@mai.hallikainen.org>

Fun! I did a spreadsheet to keep track of it, but did not include the 2
kHz +/- 425 Hz tone frequencies. Perhaps I should add that... The
spreadsheet is at
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1b07dH6ZKoI_QeeG4l6Snz9WuRuN6Z1WqqE4y5t1WtQw/edit?usp=sharing
,

I then put the results at https://w6iwi.org/rtty/ .

On the equipment you have, what are the mark and space tone frequencies
for each shift (850 and 170)? I'll try to add that to the spreadsheet.

Also, THANKS again for the 15 printer and the 14 typing reperf. AND the
extensive collection of manuals. I'm currently using the 14 TD manual to
get my new 14 TD running. It's getting close!

Various mechanical parts were frozen (main shaft would not rotate after
the clutch). Cleaning lubrication, and exercise got that all running. The
tape advance also was not moving due to a frozen pawl. Now everything is
working mechanically. The contacts on the tight tape switch were dirty, so
someone had bypassed that switch. A solder connection from the front
toggle switch to the end of tape switch was bad. So now, the mechanics all
works!

But it looks like there is an open somewhere in the loop
switch/distributor wiring. The loop just runs open. The fact that it runs
open even when stopped (with distributor on stop bit) indicates to me that
it is not the hole sense switch wiring. Time to trace more wires! Having
the schematic really helps!

Harold
https://w6iwi.org


-- 
FCC Rules Updated Daily at http://www.hallikainen.com
Not sent from an iPhone.

From jhhaynes at earthlink.net  Fri Jan 22 19:27:12 2021
From: jhhaynes at earthlink.net (Jim Haynes)
Date: Fri, 22 Jan 2021 18:27:12 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [GreenKeys] Ham RTTY and military RATT
In-Reply-To: <CAB55hNcsG+3gu90TCuhAz93kZY9fHchmvnJg+Ad7qSKdEhb0Bw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAB55hNfTPca2mPpfm6hJeNQq64tjM=y4a6aHF1hTDa0-GXy8kw@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAB55hNcsG+3gu90TCuhAz93kZY9fHchmvnJg+Ad7qSKdEhb0Bw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <alpine.DEB.2.20.2101221820140.657@Frances>

Yeah.  Well in the early days we were just frequency shifting the 
transmitter VFO, nobody was using SSB, and mark was what you got
when you were not typing, so it made some sense to specify the mark
frequency as the operating frequency.  850 shift was chosen because
that's what most of the military and press and others were using.
Far wider than necessary, except that equipment was so drifty in those
days that it allowed you to copy without constantly retuning the receiver.
And of course separate transmitters and receivers that drifted
independently.

I suppose even then purists would specify a channel with a center 
frequency and a width, corresponding to FM for voice and music, but
for RTTY you never got the center frequency coming out so you couldn't
tune to it.

Once we got into SSB of course there is the frequency of the suppressed
carrier which you set on the radio, and then the matter of which tone
frequencies you put into and get out of the radio.  As long as we were
using analog filters the tone frequencies had to be pretty well 
standardized.

Now that we have DSP demodulation it's rather arbitrary what tone 
frequencies are used in SSB.

 	---

 	"Ya can argue all ya wanna, but it's dif'rent than it was."
 	"No it ain't! No it ain't!  But ya gotta know the territory."
 		Meredith Willson, The Music Man

From lfmarkley at gmail.com  Fri Jan 22 11:46:15 2021
From: lfmarkley at gmail.com (The Oracle)
Date: Fri, 22 Jan 2021 09:46:15 -0700
Subject: [GreenKeys] M33
Message-ID: <600b015a.1c69fb81.2cf41.fd3d@mx.google.com>

All,

Would anyone happen to have a schematic for theys two connectors coming out of my M33?





Thanks,
Mr. Lynn F Markley
K9LFM

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From jeffa at rodaw.com  Sat Jan 23 11:34:57 2021
From: jeffa at rodaw.com (Jeff Albrecht)
Date: Sat, 23 Jan 2021 09:34:57 -0700
Subject: [GreenKeys] M33
In-Reply-To: <600b015a.1c69fb81.2cf41.fd3d@mx.google.com>
References: <600b015a.1c69fb81.2cf41.fd3d@mx.google.com>
Message-ID: <dfbc1618-4b05-8074-1ec2-3fdf5302f2b3@rodaw.com>

Hi Lynn,

Looks like my Dad's KSR made it safe ehh?

Here are some notes on how dad had it apparently wired for current loop.

https://wiki.theretrowagon.com/wiki/Teletype_Model_33_SN_xyz

"I think it's called a "Function Pawl"/Section 574-122-100TC/" Although 
not documented on that wiki page, with Wayne's help we got that Function 
Pawl placed back in the '33.


 ? - Jeff


On 1/22/2021 9:46 AM, The Oracle wrote:
>
> All,
>
> Would anyone happen to have a schematic for theys two connectors 
> coming out of my M33?
>
> Thanks,
>
> *Mr. Lynn F Markley*
>
> *K9LFM*
>
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
>
>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to jeffa at rodaw.com

-- 
Jeff Albrecht KF7CRU @jhalbrecht /

When you are dead, you don't know you are dead. It's pain only for others.

It's the same thing when you are stupid.

/
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From mooreericnyc at gmail.com  Sat Jan 23 16:12:52 2021
From: mooreericnyc at gmail.com (Eric Moore)
Date: Sat, 23 Jan 2021 15:12:52 -0600
Subject: [GreenKeys] The last days of the serial terminal
Message-ID: <CAE1er54on5DOAE9tagcs4wvXCxP4sBW6y8nvNfyCozRwQ5GbHA@mail.gmail.com>

I wanted to share my video of a color graphics terminal from the 80s with
you all. I realized in some ways this was one of the final and most
advanced descendants of teletypes.

https://youtu.be/SvO5k9Cwt88

What killed the lineage largely was personal computers. Once you had
something that could act as a terminal emulator sitting on your desk, plus
it could help do the taxes and keep the kids entertained, the value of
standalone terminals declined.

Terminals remained a thing for a bit longer, acting as basically 3d
graphics cards on the end of a serial, DMA, or ethernet link, but by the
90s as graphics adapters improved and shrunk they were pretty much dead.

-Eric
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From dennis.hanley at gmail.com  Sat Jan 23 16:38:53 2021
From: dennis.hanley at gmail.com (Dennis Hanley)
Date: Sat, 23 Jan 2021 13:38:53 -0800
Subject: [GreenKeys] New To Group
Message-ID: <CAPyDOHTCSHRY++1PX9F66WzN25wtf9hy1qfk3WXnbfo8Kz8cpg@mail.gmail.com>

Good day everyone,

I have recently discovered this forum, and have finally got up the nerve to
post something.

My name is Dennis, KB6C.  I discovered ITTY a while back, and was wanting
to get my old Model 15, that's been in storage for over 40 years, up and
running on that service.  (I also have a 28ASR that's still in storage).  I
am looking forward to re-living the sounds and smells of these old beasts!

In the process of poking around on line, I stumbled across a simple
demodulator that was apparently made by Eric Volpe about 2010.  Can anyone
tell me if that device might still be available?  Or maybe a similar device
with similar capabilities?

Thank you in advance for any advice you may have.

73,

Dennis
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From tony.podrasky at gmail.com  Sat Jan 23 16:49:14 2021
From: tony.podrasky at gmail.com (tony.podrasky)
Date: Sat, 23 Jan 2021 13:49:14 -0800
Subject: [GreenKeys] New To Group
In-Reply-To: <CAPyDOHTCSHRY++1PX9F66WzN25wtf9hy1qfk3WXnbfo8Kz8cpg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAPyDOHTCSHRY++1PX9F66WzN25wtf9hy1qfk3WXnbfo8Kz8cpg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <600C99DA.4000909@gmail.com>


Hey Dennis;

Welcome to the group!

You might check eBay and Craig's List for an ST-6 or
some other demodulator.

UE,
K2EAA - TONY
NNNN
ZCZC

On 01/23/2021 01:38 PM, Dennis Hanley wrote:
> Good day everyone,
>
> I have recently discovered this forum, and have finally got up the nerve
> to post something.
>
> My name is Dennis, KB6C.  I discovered ITTY a while back, and was
> wanting to get my old Model 15, that's been in storage for over 40
> years, up and running on that service.  (I also have a 28ASR that's
> still in storage).  I am looking forward to re-living the sounds and
> smells of these old beasts!
>
> In the process of poking around on line, I stumbled across a simple
> demodulator that was apparently made by Eric Volpe about 2010.  Can
> anyone tell me if that device might still be available?  Or maybe a
> similar device with similar capabilities?
>
> Thank you in advance for any advice you may have.
>
> 73,
>
> Dennis
>


-- 
MicroSoft error messages written in Haiku:

              Serious error.
      All shortcuts have disappeared.
       Screen. Mind. Both are blank.

From teletypeparts at comcast.net  Sat Jan 23 17:11:47 2021
From: teletypeparts at comcast.net (WAYNE)
Date: Sat, 23 Jan 2021 17:11:47 -0500 (EST)
Subject: [GreenKeys] New To Group
In-Reply-To: <CAPyDOHTCSHRY++1PX9F66WzN25wtf9hy1qfk3WXnbfo8Kz8cpg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAPyDOHTCSHRY++1PX9F66WzN25wtf9hy1qfk3WXnbfo8Kz8cpg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <831291054.382107.1611439907803@connect.xfinity.com>

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From wcwuttke at att.net  Sat Jan 23 17:25:37 2021
From: wcwuttke at att.net (William Wuttke)
Date: Sat, 23 Jan 2021 14:25:37 -0800
Subject: [GreenKeys] New To Group
In-Reply-To: <CAPyDOHTCSHRY++1PX9F66WzN25wtf9hy1qfk3WXnbfo8Kz8cpg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAPyDOHTCSHRY++1PX9F66WzN25wtf9hy1qfk3WXnbfo8Kz8cpg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <8C5F7C5F-6ADE-4458-901F-5FBDFC9A877B@att.net>

Hi Dennis,

Welcome to the group!

Before I was able to find a reasonably priced TU, I built a simple FSK decoder based on the XR2211 chip. There are examples
on the XR2211 datasheet as well as numerous examples on the web. As long as you are only decoding ITTY, it works well.
Of course, you?ll also have to drive the loop - a simple solid state relay will do the trick.

Have fun and good luck!

73,
Bill
KE3BK

> On Jan 23, 2021, at 1:38 PM, Dennis Hanley <dennis.hanley at gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> Good day everyone,
> 
> I have recently discovered this forum, and have finally got up the nerve to post something
> 
> My name is Dennis, KB6C.  I discovered ITTY a while back, and was wanting to get my old Model 15, that's been in storage for over 40 years, up and running on that service.  (I also have a 28ASR that's still in storage).  I am looking forward to re-living the sounds and smells of these old beasts!
> 
> In the process of poking around on line, I stumbled across a simple demodulator that was apparently made by Eric Volpe about 2010.  Can anyone tell me if that device might still be available?  Or maybe a similar device with similar capabilities?
> 
> Thank you in advance for any advice you may have.
> 
> 73,
> 
> Dennis
> 
> 
> 
> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
> 
>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
> 
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to wcwuttke at att.net


From rmowery42 at charter.net  Sat Jan 23 17:39:52 2021
From: rmowery42 at charter.net (Ralph Mowery)
Date: Sat, 23 Jan 2021 17:39:52 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] The last days of the serial terminal
In-Reply-To: <CAE1er54on5DOAE9tagcs4wvXCxP4sBW6y8nvNfyCozRwQ5GbHA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAE1er54on5DOAE9tagcs4wvXCxP4sBW6y8nvNfyCozRwQ5GbHA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <002201d6f1d8$aa46e090$fed4a1b0$@net>

The PC killed off many dedicated graphics terminal.

 

Where I worked there were several industrial computer types, some called PLCs, and lab  test equipment. They needed a display and the terminal often had just certain dedicated keys for changing the data stream.   They were very expensive.  As the PC evolved they found out they could do away with the expensive hardware and just sell the companies expensive software.   

 

In the past 15 or so years the hams have found out that the PC can take the place of the hardware for RTTY and then other modes of ?written? communications.   The software can do things that are only dreamed about in hardware.  However, they do not get the pleasure of hearing and seeing the mechanical machinery work.  Instead of building things, it is just buy a computer and interface cable and you are on the air with the computer.

 

Ralph ku4pt

 

 

 

 

From: greenkeys-bounces at mailman.qth.net [mailto:greenkeys-bounces at mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Eric Moore
Sent: Saturday, January 23, 2021 4:13 PM
To: Greenkeys
Subject: [GreenKeys] The last days of the serial terminal

 

I wanted to share my video of a color graphics terminal from the 80s with you all. I realized in some ways this was one of the final and most advanced descendants of teletypes.

 

https://youtu.be/SvO5k9Cwt88

 

What killed the lineage largely was personal computers. Once you had something that could act as a terminal emulator sitting on your desk, plus it could help do the taxes and keep the kids entertained, the value of standalone terminals declined. 

 

Terminals remained a thing for a bit longer, acting as basically 3d graphics cards on the end of a serial, DMA, or ethernet link, but by the 90s as graphics adapters improved and shrunk they were pretty much dead.

 

-Eric

 

 

 

 

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From harold at w6iwi.org  Sat Jan 23 17:49:04 2021
From: harold at w6iwi.org (Harold Hallikainen)
Date: Sat, 23 Jan 2021 14:49:04 -0800
Subject: [GreenKeys] The last days of the serial terminal
In-Reply-To: <CAE1er54on5DOAE9tagcs4wvXCxP4sBW6y8nvNfyCozRwQ5GbHA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAE1er54on5DOAE9tagcs4wvXCxP4sBW6y8nvNfyCozRwQ5GbHA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <b09d9e58d1d46518a5670165e8c470af.squirrel@mai.hallikainen.org>

That's great! As I've mentioned previously, I used a Lear Siegler ADM-1
terminal in the early 1970s. It had a huge circuit board filled with small
scale ICs. I'm amazed they got it to work. I used the ADM-1 in a product
for radio stations (program logging system at
http://bh.hallikainen.org/wiki/index.php?pagename=HallikainenAndFriends ).
The program logging system eventually went to a less expensive terminal
whose name I don't remember. I also used the ADM-1 with a home brewed Bel
103 modem using XR2206 and XR2211 to talk to the Source time share
service.There I wrote assembly language 6800 code for my wire wrapped 6802
system. I'd download the hex file into a Sunrise Electronics EPROM
programmer, burn a chip, plug it in and try to figure out why stuff did
not work. Eventually it did. I still remember some of the MC6800 op codes
such as BD for gosub and 7E for jump. I got good at counting forwards and
backwards in hex for hand assembling branch instructions.

I later used a Fluke touchscreen terminal in a broadcast transmitter
remote control system for a network in Kansas. On the home screen, there
was a button for each site. The button would flash if there was an issue
at the site. The user could then touch the button to get a detailed view
of the site with "lit buttons" to control all the equipment there. This
was all done in Basic on the system I designed with communications with
the terminal at 9.6 kbps over RS232. To give the user feedback that stuff
was happening, the terminal would beep when an area was touched. My code
then sent a beep when the command was received. That way you could tell
stuff was working.

It was a fun project! Intersite communications was Bell 202 AFSK over UHF
radios. Since the FCC required CW ID on the radios, I wrote an ASCII to
Morse routine that would send the CW ID.

All this stuff was written on a Cromemco CP/M computer with 6800
crossassembler. Eventually I got a DOS 286 machine and ran Z80MU to
emulate CP/M on it. Z80MU also ran DBASE 2 which handled our inventory
control system. I still have that computer in the garage. Need to power it
up some day. The Cromemco had a Z19 terminal connected to it. I used
Dasoft software under CP/M to do schematic capture and board layout. Both
the schematic and PCB used graphics characters on the Z19 terminal. The
schematic and PCB were then plotted on a Houston Instruments plotter. I
still have that plotter in the garage.

So... ham radio RTTY got me into FSK data transmission which I then used
for the rest of my career (most recently for the closed caption equipment
at https://www.qsc.com/cinema/products/accessibility-solutions/ which uses
10 kbps FSK over IR to carry four languages of closed captions in movie
theaters).

Harold
https://w6iwi.org






-- 
FCC Rules Updated Daily at http://www.hallikainen.com
Not sent from an iPhone.

From jhhaynes at earthlink.net  Sat Jan 23 18:04:33 2021
From: jhhaynes at earthlink.net (Jim Haynes)
Date: Sat, 23 Jan 2021 17:04:33 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [GreenKeys] New To Group
In-Reply-To: <600C99DA.4000909@gmail.com>
References: <CAPyDOHTCSHRY++1PX9F66WzN25wtf9hy1qfk3WXnbfo8Kz8cpg@mail.gmail.com>
	<600C99DA.4000909@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <alpine.DEB.2.20.2101231703350.16492@Frances>

On Sat, 23 Jan 2021, tony.podrasky wrote:
> You might check eBay and Craig's List for an ST-6 or
> some other demodulator.

Yes, the Volpe circuit works great if you have good clean signals like
you get from ITTY, but if you want to do radio on the air RTTY you will
need something much better.

From kn7sfz at gmail.com  Sat Jan 23 18:07:07 2021
From: kn7sfz at gmail.com (kn7sfz)
Date: Sat, 23 Jan 2021 15:07:07 -0800
Subject: [GreenKeys] New To Group
In-Reply-To: <CAPyDOHTCSHRY++1PX9F66WzN25wtf9hy1qfk3WXnbfo8Kz8cpg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAPyDOHTCSHRY++1PX9F66WzN25wtf9hy1qfk3WXnbfo8Kz8cpg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <ce4b8a5c-bf36-6249-a8e0-f6a69d486f3d@gmail.com>

Welcome Dennis...this is a great part of our hobby!

I've collected demods (TUs) for many years, mostly off EBay, a great 
hunting ground.

You can see my collection here:

https://www.qrz.com/db/KN7SFZ

Impressive accumulation of knowledge on this list so ask lots of questions!

Take care,

Richard kn7sfz



On 1/23/2021 1:38 PM, Dennis Hanley wrote:
> Good day everyone,
>
> I have recently discovered this forum, and have finally?got up the 
> nerve to post something.
>
> My name is Dennis, KB6C.? I discovered ITTY a while back, and was 
> wanting to get my old Model 15, that's been in storage for over 40 
> years, up and running on that service.? (I also have a 28ASR that's 
> still in storage).? I am looking forward to re-living the sounds and 
> smells of these old beasts!
>
> In the process of poking around on line, I stumbled across a simple 
> demodulator that was apparently made by Eric Volpe about 2010.? Can 
> anyone tell me if that device might still be available?? Or maybe a 
> similar device with similar capabilities?
>
> Thank you in advance for any advice you may have.
>
> 73,
>
> Dennis
>
>
>
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
>
>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to kn7sfz at gmail.com

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From jhhaynes at earthlink.net  Sat Jan 23 18:38:34 2021
From: jhhaynes at earthlink.net (Jim Haynes)
Date: Sat, 23 Jan 2021 17:38:34 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [GreenKeys] The last days of the serial terminal
In-Reply-To: <CAE1er54on5DOAE9tagcs4wvXCxP4sBW6y8nvNfyCozRwQ5GbHA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAE1er54on5DOAE9tagcs4wvXCxP4sBW6y8nvNfyCozRwQ5GbHA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <alpine.DEB.2.20.2101231708270.16492@Frances>

Thanks for the article.

There were plain text CRT video terminals, and also some with graphics
capabilities.  I think this was something that came out of Bell Labs -
Teletype made the terminal, but Bell Labs still thinking of time shared
computing when we were on the threshold of personal computers.

One of the early CRT terminal makers was Datapoint, in San Antonio.
There is an interesting book about the company.  "Datapoint: the lost 
story of the Texans who invented the personal computer revolution" by
Lamont Wood.  A couple of aerospace engineers looking for something to
do after Apollo started the company.  They went to San Antonio because
that's where they found money for their enterprise.  The book notes
people asking them "Where in California is San Antonio?"  or "Does
San Antonio have an airport?"  So it is with the generation of
geograhically illiterate business people.

Their first product was model 3300, which the author suggests was chosen
because the terminal was 100 times as good as a Model 33 Teletype.  It
was plug-compatible with Model 33.  They had a booth at a computer show
and were getting very little traffic.  So they went around to other
exhibitors who were using Model 33 machines to demonstrate their products,
and offered to replace them with 3300s.  Suddenly they had everybody's
attention.

Later Vic Poor joined the company.  Vic had been with Frederick 
Electronics in Maryland, a company that manufactured all kinds of
TTY gadgets: radio receivers and FSK demodulators and code converters,
even a Morse-to-Teletype converter.  I never met Vic in person, but
corresponded with him during the period he was at Frederick and was
working on their RTTY equipment with some interaction with Irv Hoff
working on the ST-6 and Keith Petersen.  I guess Vic left Frederick
about the time the company was bought by Plantronics.

Vic designed their next-generation terminal, which was really a 
programmable computer.  The architecture was basically that of the
Intel 8008; but Intel wasn't ready to make the microprocessor so
Datapoint built it out of smaller scale TTL chips.  They also talked
to Texas Instruments about making the microprocessor and that didn't
fly either.

I guess the original idea for making the terminal programmable was just
so it could easily be adapted to whatever customer requirements came
along.  But it was programmable by the customers, who started using
them like PCs to do some of their business processing.  The book mentions
a company in Minnesota which had an operation in Arkansas and tried
to have the latter do their data processing over a wire from the company's
mainframe in MN.  They had a lot of trouble getting a satisfactory
connection.  Meanwhile the people in AR programmed the terminal to do
their work locally, bypassing the mainframe and wire connection.

There is an oral history interview with Vic Poor somewhere out on the 
web.

An interesting later development was that T.I. attempted to claim
proprietary rights to the microprocessor that Vic had proposed.  Someone
in Datapoint management had earlier decided that the company should have
a distinctive type font, so they had custom type balls made for their
Selectric typewriters.  During the dispute over the microprocessor
architecture Datapoint was able to show that all the documentation had
been produced using Datapoint typewriters and hence T.I. had no rights
to it.  And eventually Intel decided to go ahead with the 8008 micro
processor.

Eventually Datapoint grew to the point where they had to hire professional
management from outside the company.  And this led to some tricky
business such as booking orders they had not yet received to make the
financial figures look good.  Which along with some other factors caused
the company to go under.  But in San Antonio the company name lives
on in the Datapoint Taqueria restaurants, which was originally located
on Datapoint Drive.  Datapoint veteran David Monroe in San Antonio
founded a technology museum in that city, google for SAMSAT.

Vic Poor retired to Florida.  I almost met him once when I was in San
Antonio and he happened to be there visiting his daughter, but we just
couldn't get together.  And shortly afterward he died of cancer.

Jim W6JVE


 	---

 	"Ya can argue all ya wanna, but it's dif'rent than it was."
 	"No it ain't! No it ain't!  But ya gotta know the territory."
 		Meredith Willson, The Music Man

From hwhall at compuserve.com  Sat Jan 23 18:48:57 2021
From: hwhall at compuserve.com (hwhall at compuserve.com)
Date: Sat, 23 Jan 2021 23:48:57 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [GreenKeys] The last days of the serial terminal
In-Reply-To: <alpine.DEB.2.20.2101231708270.16492@Frances>
References: <CAE1er54on5DOAE9tagcs4wvXCxP4sBW6y8nvNfyCozRwQ5GbHA@mail.gmail.com>
	<alpine.DEB.2.20.2101231708270.16492@Frances>
Message-ID: <1743241506.4628389.1611445737014@mail.yahoo.com>

One of my first jobs out of college while awaiting USAF orders was for P&G, starting up & beginning production at a Pringles plant. Systems were semi-automated with UV erasable EPROM programmed process controllers. We used Datapoint dual-cassette computers to write & modify the programs & run the EPROM programming. An interesting time with fast developments in personal & kit computers.

WayneWB4OGM

-----Original Message-----
From: Jim Haynes <jhhaynes at earthlink.net>
To: Eric Moore <mooreericnyc at gmail.com>
Cc: Greenkeys <greenkeys at mailman.qth.net>
Sent: Sat, Jan 23, 2021 4:38 pm
Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] The last days of the serial terminal

Thanks for the article.

There were plain text CRT video terminals, and also some with graphics
capabilities.? I think this was something that came out of Bell Labs -
Teletype made the terminal, but Bell Labs still thinking of time shared
computing when we were on the threshold of personal computers.

One of the early CRT terminal makers was Datapoint, in San Antonio.
There is an interesting book about the company.? "Datapoint: the lost 
story of the Texans who invented the personal computer revolution" by
Lamont Wood.? A couple of aerospace engineers looking for something to
do after Apollo started the company.? They went to San Antonio because
that's where they found money for their enterprise.? The book notes
people asking them "Where in California is San Antonio?"? or "Does
San Antonio have an airport?"? So it is with the generation of
geograhically illiterate business people.

Their first product was model 3300, which the author suggests was chosen
because the terminal was 100 times as good as a Model 33 Teletype.? It
was plug-compatible with Model 33.? They had a booth at a computer show
and were getting very little traffic.? So they went around to other
exhibitors who were using Model 33 machines to demonstrate their products,
and offered to replace them with 3300s.? Suddenly they had everybody's
attention.

Later Vic Poor joined the company.? Vic had been with Frederick 
Electronics in Maryland, a company that manufactured all kinds of
TTY gadgets: radio receivers and FSK demodulators and code converters,
even a Morse-to-Teletype converter.? I never met Vic in person, but
corresponded with him during the period he was at Frederick and was
working on their RTTY equipment with some interaction with Irv Hoff
working on the ST-6 and Keith Petersen.? I guess Vic left Frederick
about the time the company was bought by Plantronics.

Vic designed their next-generation terminal, which was really a 
programmable computer.? The architecture was basically that of the
Intel 8008; but Intel wasn't ready to make the microprocessor so
Datapoint built it out of smaller scale TTL chips.? They also talked
to Texas Instruments about making the microprocessor and that didn't
fly either.

I guess the original idea for making the terminal programmable was just
so it could easily be adapted to whatever customer requirements came
along.? But it was programmable by the customers, who started using
them like PCs to do some of their business processing.? The book mentions
a company in Minnesota which had an operation in Arkansas and tried
to have the latter do their data processing over a wire from the company's
mainframe in MN.? They had a lot of trouble getting a satisfactory
connection.? Meanwhile the people in AR programmed the terminal to do
their work locally, bypassing the mainframe and wire connection.

There is an oral history interview with Vic Poor somewhere out on the 
web.

An interesting later development was that T.I. attempted to claim
proprietary rights to the microprocessor that Vic had proposed.? Someone
in Datapoint management had earlier decided that the company should have
a distinctive type font, so they had custom type balls made for their
Selectric typewriters.? During the dispute over the microprocessor
architecture Datapoint was able to show that all the documentation had
been produced using Datapoint typewriters and hence T.I. had no rights
to it.? And eventually Intel decided to go ahead with the 8008 micro
processor.

Eventually Datapoint grew to the point where they had to hire professional
management from outside the company.? And this led to some tricky
business such as booking orders they had not yet received to make the
financial figures look good.? Which along with some other factors caused
the company to go under.? But in San Antonio the company name lives
on in the Datapoint Taqueria restaurants, which was originally located
on Datapoint Drive.? Datapoint veteran David Monroe in San Antonio
founded a technology museum in that city, google for SAMSAT.

Vic Poor retired to Florida.? I almost met him once when I was in San
Antonio and he happened to be there visiting his daughter, but we just
couldn't get together.? And shortly afterward he died of cancer.

Jim W6JVE


 ??? ---

 ??? "Ya can argue all ya wanna, but it's dif'rent than it was."
 ??? "No it ain't! No it ain't!? But ya gotta know the territory."
 ??? ??? Meredith Willson, The Music Man
______________________________________________________________
GreenKeys mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net

>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to hwhall at compuserve.com
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From hwhall at compuserve.com  Sun Jan 24 00:31:43 2021
From: hwhall at compuserve.com (hwhall at compuserve.com)
Date: Sun, 24 Jan 2021 05:31:43 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [GreenKeys] XR2211 demodulator circuit boards?
References: <2072683957.4657899.1611466303451.ref@mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <2072683957.4657899.1611466303451@mail.yahoo.com>

Are there any printed circuit boards for building an XR2211 based RTTY demodulator? ?Google shows me all kinds of articles from complex to over-simplified but doesn't lead me to any PCB artwork or vendors.
I'm thinking I might build a demod to run a Model 15 from a laptop running MMTTY. The program only outputs tones (no on-off output to key a loop directly) so a PLL demod should be fine since noise won't be an issue. Or should I look at something even smaller/simpler?
Thanks!WayneWB4OGM
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From harold at w6iwi.org  Sun Jan 24 01:19:12 2021
From: harold at w6iwi.org (Harold Hallikainen)
Date: Sat, 23 Jan 2021 22:19:12 -0800
Subject: [GreenKeys] XR2211 demodulator circuit boards?
In-Reply-To: <2072683957.4657899.1611466303451@mail.yahoo.com>
References: <2072683957.4657899.1611466303451.ref@mail.yahoo.com>
	<2072683957.4657899.1611466303451@mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <88ade8cd0555b0e7615b2676c321242c.squirrel@mai.hallikainen.org>


> Are there any printed circuit boards for building an XR2211 based RTTY
> demodulator? ??Google shows me all kinds of articles from complex to
> over-simplified but doesn't lead me to any PCB artwork or vendors.
> I'm thinking I might build a demod to run a Model 15 from a laptop running
> MMTTY. The program only outputs tones (no on-off output to key a loop
> directly) so a PLL demod should be fine since noise won't be an issue. Or
> should I look at something even smaller/simpler?
> Thanks!WayneWB4OGM______________________________________________________________

There's an evaluation board at
https://media.digikey.com/pdf/Data%20Sheets/MaxLinear%20PDFs/XR-2206-11-12_Man.pdf
. I'd be tempted to wire wrap it, though.

Several products I did using the XR2211 are at

http://bh.hallikainen.org//wiki/uploads/HaroldHallikainen/20130416125339_Part5.pdf

http://bh.hallikainen.org//wiki/uploads/HaroldHallikainen/Harold_018.pdf

http://bh.hallikainen.org//wiki/uploads/HaroldHallikainen/20130416125339_Part1.pdf

http://bh.hallikainen.org//wiki/uploads/HaroldHallikainen/Harold_011.pdf

http://bh.hallikainen.org//wiki/uploads/HaroldHallikainen/20130416125553.pdf#page=11

The XR2211 is a fun chip. Before that, I used the NE565, but the XR2211
includes the data comparator, a carrier detect, etc. The XR2206 is also a
nice chip. It will generate a square wave, triangle wave, and sine waves.
It can do linear FM, AM (including double sideband suppressed carrier),
and FSK. The FSK circuit has a logic input that switches between two
timing resistors. But, during the transition, the frequency goes to zero
for a very short time. I'd probably use the linear FM circuit and drive it
with the data after running it through a low pass filter to limit
bandwidth. It IS a nice chip, though. I used it as an upconverter (local
oscillator and mixer) to upconvert subcarriers on FM broadcast stations to
455 kHz where the signal then went through ceramic filters, IF amplifier,
and a ceramic discriminator.

Fun stuff!

Harold
https://w6iwi.org


-- 
FCC Rules Updated Daily at http://www.hallikainen.com
Not sent from an iPhone.

From 1oldlens1 at ix.netcom.com  Sun Jan 24 02:52:54 2021
From: 1oldlens1 at ix.netcom.com (Richard Knoppow)
Date: Sat, 23 Jan 2021 23:52:54 -0800
Subject: [GreenKeys] The last days of the serial terminal
In-Reply-To: <b09d9e58d1d46518a5670165e8c470af.squirrel@mai.hallikainen.org>
References: <CAE1er54on5DOAE9tagcs4wvXCxP4sBW6y8nvNfyCozRwQ5GbHA@mail.gmail.com>
	<b09d9e58d1d46518a5670165e8c470af.squirrel@mai.hallikainen.org>
Message-ID: <7ed4ccfc-0348-9565-aeda-8a3fe07d92ac@ix.netcom.com>

 ?? Along the lines of this thread have a look at:
<https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KMLyKHFtcgg>
Early IBM stuff.

On 1/23/2021 2:49 PM, Harold Hallikainen wrote:
> That's great! As I've mentioned previously, I used a Lear Siegler ADM-1
>

-- 
Richard Knoppow
1oldlens1 at ix.netcom.com
WB6KBL


From hwhall at compuserve.com  Sun Jan 24 03:46:10 2021
From: hwhall at compuserve.com (hwhall at compuserve.com)
Date: Sun, 24 Jan 2021 08:46:10 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [GreenKeys] XR2211 demodulator circuit boards?
In-Reply-To: <88ade8cd0555b0e7615b2676c321242c.squirrel@mai.hallikainen.org>
References: <2072683957.4657899.1611466303451.ref@mail.yahoo.com>
	<2072683957.4657899.1611466303451@mail.yahoo.com>
	<88ade8cd0555b0e7615b2676c321242c.squirrel@mai.hallikainen.org>
Message-ID: <3820057.4675674.1611477970434@mail.yahoo.com>

I'd encountered some of those pages when I was googling but still no PCB artwork. If someone has already laid them out, I could skip reinventing it.

WayneWB4OGM

-----Original Message-----
From: Harold Hallikainen <harold at w6iwi.org>
To: greenkeys at mailman.qth.net
Sent: Sat, Jan 23, 2021 11:19 pm
Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] XR2211 demodulator circuit boards?


> Are there any printed circuit boards for building an XR2211 based RTTY
> demodulator? ??Google shows me all kinds of articles from complex to
> over-simplified but doesn't lead me to any PCB artwork or vendors.
> I'm thinking I might build a demod to run a Model 15 from a laptop running
> MMTTY. The program only outputs tones (no on-off output to key a loop
> directly) so a PLL demod should be fine since noise won't be an issue. Or
> should I look at something even smaller/simpler?
> Thanks!WayneWB4OGM______________________________________________________________

There's an evaluation board at
https://media.digikey.com/pdf/Data%20Sheets/MaxLinear%20PDFs/XR-2206-11-12_Man.pdf
. I'd be tempted to wire wrap it, though.

Several products I did using the XR2211 are at

http://bh.hallikainen.org//wiki/uploads/HaroldHallikainen/20130416125339_Part5.pdf

http://bh.hallikainen.org//wiki/uploads/HaroldHallikainen/Harold_018.pdf

http://bh.hallikainen.org//wiki/uploads/HaroldHallikainen/20130416125339_Part1.pdf

http://bh.hallikainen.org//wiki/uploads/HaroldHallikainen/Harold_011.pdf

http://bh.hallikainen.org//wiki/uploads/HaroldHallikainen/20130416125553.pdf#page=11

The XR2211 is a fun chip. Before that, I used the NE565, but the XR2211
includes the data comparator, a carrier detect, etc. The XR2206 is also a
nice chip. It will generate a square wave, triangle wave, and sine waves.
It can do linear FM, AM (including double sideband suppressed carrier),
and FSK. The FSK circuit has a logic input that switches between two
timing resistors. But, during the transition, the frequency goes to zero
for a very short time. I'd probably use the linear FM circuit and drive it
with the data after running it through a low pass filter to limit
bandwidth. It IS a nice chip, though. I used it as an upconverter (local
oscillator and mixer) to upconvert subcarriers on FM broadcast stations to
455 kHz where the signal then went through ceramic filters, IF amplifier,
and a ceramic discriminator.

Fun stuff!

Harold
https://w6iwi.org


-- 
FCC Rules Updated Daily at http://www.hallikainen.com
Not sent from an iPhone.
______________________________________________________________
GreenKeys mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net

>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to hwhall at compuserve.com
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From epvgk at limpoc.com  Sun Jan 24 03:58:15 2021
From: epvgk at limpoc.com (epvgk at limpoc.com)
Date: Sun, 24 Jan 2021 00:58:15 -0800
Subject: [GreenKeys] XR2211 demodulator circuit boards?
In-Reply-To: <3820057.4675674.1611477970434@mail.yahoo.com>
References: <2072683957.4657899.1611466303451.ref@mail.yahoo.com>
	<2072683957.4657899.1611466303451@mail.yahoo.com>
	<88ade8cd0555b0e7615b2676c321242c.squirrel@mai.hallikainen.org>
	<3820057.4675674.1611477970434@mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <20210124085815.GA17885@limpoc.com>

On Sun, Jan 24, 2021 at 08:46:10AM +0000, hwhall at compuserve.com wrote:
> I'd encountered some of those pages when I was googling but still no PCB artwork. If someone has already laid them out, I could skip reinventing it.
> 
> WayneWB4OGM

Here's the one I did that got manufactured that people on the list have a bunch of. 

https://www.heepy.net/index.php/RTTY_demodulator_using_NJM2211

I can dig up gerbers or whatever if you want!

eric

> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Harold Hallikainen <harold at w6iwi.org>
> To: greenkeys at mailman.qth.net
> Sent: Sat, Jan 23, 2021 11:19 pm
> Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] XR2211 demodulator circuit boards?
> 
> 
> > Are there any printed circuit boards for building an XR2211 based RTTY
> > demodulator? ??Google shows me all kinds of articles from complex to
> > over-simplified but doesn't lead me to any PCB artwork or vendors.
> > I'm thinking I might build a demod to run a Model 15 from a laptop running
> > MMTTY. The program only outputs tones (no on-off output to key a loop
> > directly) so a PLL demod should be fine since noise won't be an issue. Or
> > should I look at something even smaller/simpler?
> > Thanks!WayneWB4OGM______________________________________________________________
> 
> There's an evaluation board at
> https://media.digikey.com/pdf/Data%20Sheets/MaxLinear%20PDFs/XR-2206-11-12_Man.pdf
> . I'd be tempted to wire wrap it, though.
> 
> Several products I did using the XR2211 are at
> 
> http://bh.hallikainen.org//wiki/uploads/HaroldHallikainen/20130416125339_Part5.pdf
> 
> http://bh.hallikainen.org//wiki/uploads/HaroldHallikainen/Harold_018.pdf
> 
> http://bh.hallikainen.org//wiki/uploads/HaroldHallikainen/20130416125339_Part1.pdf
> 
> http://bh.hallikainen.org//wiki/uploads/HaroldHallikainen/Harold_011.pdf
> 
> http://bh.hallikainen.org//wiki/uploads/HaroldHallikainen/20130416125553.pdf#page=11
> 
> The XR2211 is a fun chip. Before that, I used the NE565, but the XR2211
> includes the data comparator, a carrier detect, etc. The XR2206 is also a
> nice chip. It will generate a square wave, triangle wave, and sine waves.
> It can do linear FM, AM (including double sideband suppressed carrier),
> and FSK. The FSK circuit has a logic input that switches between two
> timing resistors. But, during the transition, the frequency goes to zero
> for a very short time. I'd probably use the linear FM circuit and drive it
> with the data after running it through a low pass filter to limit
> bandwidth. It IS a nice chip, though. I used it as an upconverter (local
> oscillator and mixer) to upconvert subcarriers on FM broadcast stations to
> 455 kHz where the signal then went through ceramic filters, IF amplifier,
> and a ceramic discriminator.
> 
> Fun stuff!
> 
> Harold
> https://w6iwi.org
> 
> 
> -- 
> FCC Rules Updated Daily at http://www.hallikainen.com
> Not sent from an iPhone.
> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
> 
> >>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
> >>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
> >>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
> >>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
> 
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to hwhall at compuserve.com

> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
> 
> >>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
> >>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
> >>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
> >>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
> 
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to epvgk at limpoc.com

From steve.n4tty at gmail.com  Sun Jan 24 05:31:51 2021
From: steve.n4tty at gmail.com (Steve Garrison)
Date: Sun, 24 Jan 2021 05:31:51 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] XR2211 demodulator circuit boards?
In-Reply-To: <20210124085815.GA17885@limpoc.com>
References: <2072683957.4657899.1611466303451.ref@mail.yahoo.com>	<2072683957.4657899.1611466303451@mail.yahoo.com>	<88ade8cd0555b0e7615b2676c321242c.squirrel@mai.hallikainen.org>	<3820057.4675674.1611477970434@mail.yahoo.com>
	<20210124085815.GA17885@limpoc.com>
Message-ID: <104101d6f23c$20fbf0f0$62f3d2d0$@gmail.com>

Eric,

If you wouldn't mind sending the gerber files or any other files I'd
appreciate it.  I've been having several other boards that I have designed
for robot project I'm involved with made, so I could add the demod board to
the list.  Is the 2211 still readily available?

Steve G./N4TTY

-----Original Message-----
From: greenkeys-bounces at mailman.qth.net <greenkeys-bounces at mailman.qth.net>
On Behalf Of epvgk at limpoc.com
Sent: Sunday, January 24, 2021 3:58 AM
To: hwhall at compuserve.com
Cc: greenkeys at mailman.qth.net
Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] XR2211 demodulator circuit boards?

On Sun, Jan 24, 2021 at 08:46:10AM +0000, hwhall at compuserve.com wrote:
> I'd encountered some of those pages when I was googling but still no PCB
artwork. If someone has already laid them out, I could skip reinventing it.
> 
> WayneWB4OGM

Here's the one I did that got manufactured that people on the list have a
bunch of. 

https://www.heepy.net/index.php/RTTY_demodulator_using_NJM2211

I can dig up gerbers or whatever if you want!

eric

> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Harold Hallikainen <harold at w6iwi.org>
> To: greenkeys at mailman.qth.net
> Sent: Sat, Jan 23, 2021 11:19 pm
> Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] XR2211 demodulator circuit boards?
> 
> 
> > Are there any printed circuit boards for building an XR2211 based 
> > RTTY demodulator? ??Google shows me all kinds of articles from 
> > complex to over-simplified but doesn't lead me to any PCB artwork or
vendors.
> > I'm thinking I might build a demod to run a Model 15 from a laptop 
> > running MMTTY. The program only outputs tones (no on-off output to 
> > key a loop
> > directly) so a PLL demod should be fine since noise won't be an 
> > issue. Or should I look at something even smaller/simpler?
> > Thanks!WayneWB4OGM__________________________________________________
> > ____________
> 
> There's an evaluation board at
> https://media.digikey.com/pdf/Data%20Sheets/MaxLinear%20PDFs/XR-2206-1
> 1-12_Man.pdf . I'd be tempted to wire wrap it, though.
> 
> Several products I did using the XR2211 are at
> 
> http://bh.hallikainen.org//wiki/uploads/HaroldHallikainen/201304161253
> 39_Part5.pdf
> 
> http://bh.hallikainen.org//wiki/uploads/HaroldHallikainen/Harold_018.p
> df
> 
> http://bh.hallikainen.org//wiki/uploads/HaroldHallikainen/201304161253
> 39_Part1.pdf
> 
> http://bh.hallikainen.org//wiki/uploads/HaroldHallikainen/Harold_011.p
> df
> 
> http://bh.hallikainen.org//wiki/uploads/HaroldHallikainen/201304161255
> 53.pdf#page=11
> 
> The XR2211 is a fun chip. Before that, I used the NE565, but the 
> XR2211 includes the data comparator, a carrier detect, etc. The XR2206 
> is also a nice chip. It will generate a square wave, triangle wave, and
sine waves.
> It can do linear FM, AM (including double sideband suppressed 
> carrier), and FSK. The FSK circuit has a logic input that switches 
> between two timing resistors. But, during the transition, the 
> frequency goes to zero for a very short time. I'd probably use the 
> linear FM circuit and drive it with the data after running it through 
> a low pass filter to limit bandwidth. It IS a nice chip, though. I 
> used it as an upconverter (local oscillator and mixer) to upconvert 
> subcarriers on FM broadcast stations to
> 455 kHz where the signal then went through ceramic filters, IF 
> amplifier, and a ceramic discriminator.
> 
> Fun stuff!
> 
> Harold
> https://w6iwi.org
> 
> 
> --
> FCC Rules Updated Daily at http://www.hallikainen.com Not sent from an 
> iPhone.
> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
> 
> >>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: 
> >>> https://teletype.net/gksearch 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: 
> >>> http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
> >>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: 
> >>> http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
> >>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: 
> >>> http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
> 
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email 
> list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to 
> hwhall at compuserve.com

> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
> 
> >>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: 
> >>> https://teletype.net/gksearch 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: 
> >>> http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
> >>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: 
> >>> http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
> >>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: 
> >>> http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
> 
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email 
> list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to 
> epvgk at limpoc.com
______________________________________________________________
GreenKeys mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net

>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: 
>>> https://teletype.net/gksearch 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: 
>>> http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: 
>>> http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: 
>>> http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message
delivered to steve.n4tty at gmail.com


From donc at martineer.net  Sun Jan 24 09:52:56 2021
From: donc at martineer.net (Don Cunningam)
Date: Sun, 24 Jan 2021 08:52:56 -0600
Subject: [GreenKeys] XR2211 demodulator circuit boards?
In-Reply-To: <104101d6f23c$20fbf0f0$62f3d2d0$@gmail.com>
References: <2072683957.4657899.1611466303451.ref@mail.yahoo.com>
	<2072683957.4657899.1611466303451@mail.yahoo.com>
	<88ade8cd0555b0e7615b2676c321242c.squirrel@mai.hallikainen.org>
	<3820057.4675674.1611477970434@mail.yahoo.com>
	<20210124085815.GA17885@limpoc.com>
	<104101d6f23c$20fbf0f0$62f3d2d0$@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <af2896b1-1570-e5ca-c978-30a6145bed5a@martineer.net>

Steve,

I have a set of boards (TU and power supply) that was sold by a company 
called PEMCO, if my old memory is correct for the ST-5A which was Irv 
Hoff's ST-5 with autostart added.? I would donate them if you think you 
have somewhere that could duplicate them so others could build that.? I 
also have the old Hoff articles from an early QST that talks about 
tuning toroid coils and if followed on this TU, it is nearly as good as 
the HAL ST-6 was!!!? If that cant be done, Eric you can have these 
boards and I'll dig up some toroids to build it.? I don't have a TON of 
the toroids, but I have some left from MANY years of building TU's for 
Navy MARS folks back in the 70's,? I found this set of Pemco boards and 
info for sale and bought it a few years back to share with someone.? If 
you can do this, Steve, let me know and I'll ship the boards to you.

73,

Don, WB5HAK

On 1/24/2021 4:31 AM, Steve Garrison wrote:
> Eric,
>
> If you wouldn't mind sending the gerber files or any other files I'd
> appreciate it.  I've been having several other boards that I have designed
> for robot project I'm involved with made, so I could add the demod board to
> the list.  Is the 2211 still readily available?
>
> Steve G./N4TTY
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: greenkeys-bounces at mailman.qth.net <greenkeys-bounces at mailman.qth.net>
> On Behalf Of epvgk at limpoc.com
> Sent: Sunday, January 24, 2021 3:58 AM
> To: hwhall at compuserve.com
> Cc: greenkeys at mailman.qth.net
> Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] XR2211 demodulator circuit boards?
>
> On Sun, Jan 24, 2021 at 08:46:10AM +0000, hwhall at compuserve.com wrote:
>> I'd encountered some of those pages when I was googling but still no PCB
> artwork. If someone has already laid them out, I could skip reinventing it.
>> WayneWB4OGM
> Here's the one I did that got manufactured that people on the list have a
> bunch of.
>
> https://www.heepy.net/index.php/RTTY_demodulator_using_NJM2211
>
> I can dig up gerbers or whatever if you want!
>
> eric
>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Harold Hallikainen <harold at w6iwi.org>
>> To: greenkeys at mailman.qth.net
>> Sent: Sat, Jan 23, 2021 11:19 pm
>> Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] XR2211 demodulator circuit boards?
>>
>>
>>> Are there any printed circuit boards for building an XR2211 based
>>> RTTY demodulator? ??Google shows me all kinds of articles from
>>> complex to over-simplified but doesn't lead me to any PCB artwork or
> vendors.
>>> I'm thinking I might build a demod to run a Model 15 from a laptop
>>> running MMTTY. The program only outputs tones (no on-off output to
>>> key a loop
>>> directly) so a PLL demod should be fine since noise won't be an
>>> issue. Or should I look at something even smaller/simpler?
>>> Thanks!WayneWB4OGM__________________________________________________
>>> ____________
>> There's an evaluation board at
>> https://media.digikey.com/pdf/Data%20Sheets/MaxLinear%20PDFs/XR-2206-1
>> 1-12_Man.pdf . I'd be tempted to wire wrap it, though.
>>
>> Several products I did using the XR2211 are at
>>
>> http://bh.hallikainen.org//wiki/uploads/HaroldHallikainen/201304161253
>> 39_Part5.pdf
>>
>> http://bh.hallikainen.org//wiki/uploads/HaroldHallikainen/Harold_018.p
>> df
>>
>> http://bh.hallikainen.org//wiki/uploads/HaroldHallikainen/201304161253
>> 39_Part1.pdf
>>
>> http://bh.hallikainen.org//wiki/uploads/HaroldHallikainen/Harold_011.p
>> df
>>
>> http://bh.hallikainen.org//wiki/uploads/HaroldHallikainen/201304161255
>> 53.pdf#page=11
>>
>> The XR2211 is a fun chip. Before that, I used the NE565, but the
>> XR2211 includes the data comparator, a carrier detect, etc. The XR2206
>> is also a nice chip. It will generate a square wave, triangle wave, and
> sine waves.
>> It can do linear FM, AM (including double sideband suppressed
>> carrier), and FSK. The FSK circuit has a logic input that switches
>> between two timing resistors. But, during the transition, the
>> frequency goes to zero for a very short time. I'd probably use the
>> linear FM circuit and drive it with the data after running it through
>> a low pass filter to limit bandwidth. It IS a nice chip, though. I
>> used it as an upconverter (local oscillator and mixer) to upconvert
>> subcarriers on FM broadcast stations to
>> 455 kHz where the signal then went through ceramic filters, IF
>> amplifier, and a ceramic discriminator.
>>
>> Fun stuff!
>>
>> Harold
>> https://w6iwi.org
>>
>>
>> --
>> FCC Rules Updated Daily at http://www.hallikainen.com Not sent from an
>> iPhone.
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> GreenKeys mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
>>
>>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool:
>>>>> https://teletype.net/gksearch 2002-to-present greenkeys archive:
>>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive:
>>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool:
>>>>> http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email
>> list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to
>> hwhall at compuserve.com
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> GreenKeys mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
>>
>>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool:
>>>>> https://teletype.net/gksearch 2002-to-present greenkeys archive:
>>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive:
>>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool:
>>>>> http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email
>> list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to
>> epvgk at limpoc.com
> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
>
>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool:
>>>> https://teletype.net/gksearch 2002-to-present greenkeys archive:
>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive:
>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool:
>>>> http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message
> delivered to steve.n4tty at gmail.com
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
>
>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to wb5hak at arrl.net

-- 
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
https://www.avast.com/antivirus


From donc at martineer.net  Sun Jan 24 09:57:28 2021
From: donc at martineer.net (Don Cunningam)
Date: Sun, 24 Jan 2021 08:57:28 -0600
Subject: [GreenKeys] XR2211 demodulator circuit boards?
In-Reply-To: <104101d6f23c$20fbf0f0$62f3d2d0$@gmail.com>
References: <2072683957.4657899.1611466303451.ref@mail.yahoo.com>
	<2072683957.4657899.1611466303451@mail.yahoo.com>
	<88ade8cd0555b0e7615b2676c321242c.squirrel@mai.hallikainen.org>
	<3820057.4675674.1611477970434@mail.yahoo.com>
	<20210124085815.GA17885@limpoc.com>
	<104101d6f23c$20fbf0f0$62f3d2d0$@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <6b42e1cc-7632-5799-5bdb-c4bc53ba9267@martineer.net>

By the way, the ST-5AS does NOT use the 2211, but uses 741 Op Amps and 
descrete components that are easily sourced except maybe the toroids.

73 Don, WB5HAK

On 1/24/2021 4:31 AM, Steve Garrison wrote:
> Eric,
>
> If you wouldn't mind sending the gerber files or any other files I'd
> appreciate it.  I've been having several other boards that I have designed
> for robot project I'm involved with made, so I could add the demod board to
> the list.  Is the 2211 still readily available?
>
> Steve G./N4TTY
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: greenkeys-bounces at mailman.qth.net <greenkeys-bounces at mailman.qth.net>
> On Behalf Of epvgk at limpoc.com
> Sent: Sunday, January 24, 2021 3:58 AM
> To: hwhall at compuserve.com
> Cc: greenkeys at mailman.qth.net
> Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] XR2211 demodulator circuit boards?
>
> On Sun, Jan 24, 2021 at 08:46:10AM +0000, hwhall at compuserve.com wrote:
>> I'd encountered some of those pages when I was googling but still no PCB
> artwork. If someone has already laid them out, I could skip reinventing it.
>> WayneWB4OGM
> Here's the one I did that got manufactured that people on the list have a
> bunch of.
>
> https://www.heepy.net/index.php/RTTY_demodulator_using_NJM2211
>
> I can dig up gerbers or whatever if you want!
>
> eric
>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Harold Hallikainen <harold at w6iwi.org>
>> To: greenkeys at mailman.qth.net
>> Sent: Sat, Jan 23, 2021 11:19 pm
>> Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] XR2211 demodulator circuit boards?
>>
>>
>>> Are there any printed circuit boards for building an XR2211 based
>>> RTTY demodulator? ??Google shows me all kinds of articles from
>>> complex to over-simplified but doesn't lead me to any PCB artwork or
> vendors.
>>> I'm thinking I might build a demod to run a Model 15 from a laptop
>>> running MMTTY. The program only outputs tones (no on-off output to
>>> key a loop
>>> directly) so a PLL demod should be fine since noise won't be an
>>> issue. Or should I look at something even smaller/simpler?
>>> Thanks!WayneWB4OGM__________________________________________________
>>> ____________
>> There's an evaluation board at
>> https://media.digikey.com/pdf/Data%20Sheets/MaxLinear%20PDFs/XR-2206-1
>> 1-12_Man.pdf . I'd be tempted to wire wrap it, though.
>>
>> Several products I did using the XR2211 are at
>>
>> http://bh.hallikainen.org//wiki/uploads/HaroldHallikainen/201304161253
>> 39_Part5.pdf
>>
>> http://bh.hallikainen.org//wiki/uploads/HaroldHallikainen/Harold_018.p
>> df
>>
>> http://bh.hallikainen.org//wiki/uploads/HaroldHallikainen/201304161253
>> 39_Part1.pdf
>>
>> http://bh.hallikainen.org//wiki/uploads/HaroldHallikainen/Harold_011.p
>> df
>>
>> http://bh.hallikainen.org//wiki/uploads/HaroldHallikainen/201304161255
>> 53.pdf#page=11
>>
>> The XR2211 is a fun chip. Before that, I used the NE565, but the
>> XR2211 includes the data comparator, a carrier detect, etc. The XR2206
>> is also a nice chip. It will generate a square wave, triangle wave, and
> sine waves.
>> It can do linear FM, AM (including double sideband suppressed
>> carrier), and FSK. The FSK circuit has a logic input that switches
>> between two timing resistors. But, during the transition, the
>> frequency goes to zero for a very short time. I'd probably use the
>> linear FM circuit and drive it with the data after running it through
>> a low pass filter to limit bandwidth. It IS a nice chip, though. I
>> used it as an upconverter (local oscillator and mixer) to upconvert
>> subcarriers on FM broadcast stations to
>> 455 kHz where the signal then went through ceramic filters, IF
>> amplifier, and a ceramic discriminator.
>>
>> Fun stuff!
>>
>> Harold
>> https://w6iwi.org
>>
>>
>> --
>> FCC Rules Updated Daily at http://www.hallikainen.com Not sent from an
>> iPhone.
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> GreenKeys mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
>>
>>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool:
>>>>> https://teletype.net/gksearch 2002-to-present greenkeys archive:
>>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive:
>>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool:
>>>>> http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email
>> list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to
>> hwhall at compuserve.com
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> GreenKeys mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
>>
>>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool:
>>>>> https://teletype.net/gksearch 2002-to-present greenkeys archive:
>>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive:
>>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool:
>>>>> http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email
>> list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to
>> epvgk at limpoc.com
> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
>
>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool:
>>>> https://teletype.net/gksearch 2002-to-present greenkeys archive:
>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive:
>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool:
>>>> http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message
> delivered to steve.n4tty at gmail.com
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
>
>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to wb5hak at arrl.net

-- 
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
https://www.avast.com/antivirus


From steve.n4tty at gmail.com  Sun Jan 24 12:18:44 2021
From: steve.n4tty at gmail.com (Steve Garrison)
Date: Sun, 24 Jan 2021 12:18:44 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] XR2211 demodulator circuit boards?
In-Reply-To: <af2896b1-1570-e5ca-c978-30a6145bed5a@martineer.net>
References: <2072683957.4657899.1611466303451.ref@mail.yahoo.com>	<2072683957.4657899.1611466303451@mail.yahoo.com>	<88ade8cd0555b0e7615b2676c321242c.squirrel@mai.hallikainen.org>	<3820057.4675674.1611477970434@mail.yahoo.com>	<20210124085815.GA17885@limpoc.com>	<104101d6f23c$20fbf0f0$62f3d2d0$@gmail.com>
	<af2896b1-1570-e5ca-c978-30a6145bed5a@martineer.net>
Message-ID: <10c301d6f274$f8549830$e8fdc890$@gmail.com>

Well, right now I wouldn't be able to tackle that.  That is why I sent the note to Eric about the Gerber files.  Those I might be able to squeeze in with a shoehorn.

Steve G./N4TTY0

-----Original Message-----
From: greenkeys-bounces at mailman.qth.net <greenkeys-bounces at mailman.qth.net> On Behalf Of Don Cunningam
Sent: Sunday, January 24, 2021 9:53 AM
To: greenkeys at mailman.qth.net
Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] XR2211 demodulator circuit boards?

Steve,

I have a set of boards (TU and power supply) that was sold by a company called PEMCO, if my old memory is correct for the ST-5A which was Irv Hoff's ST-5 with autostart added.  I would donate them if you think you have somewhere that could duplicate them so others could build that.  I also have the old Hoff articles from an early QST that talks about tuning toroid coils and if followed on this TU, it is nearly as good as the HAL ST-6 was!!!  If that cant be done, Eric you can have these boards and I'll dig up some toroids to build it.  I don't have a TON of the toroids, but I have some left from MANY years of building TU's for Navy MARS folks back in the 70's,  I found this set of Pemco boards and info for sale and bought it a few years back to share with someone.  If you can do this, Steve, let me know and I'll ship the boards to you.

73,

Don, WB5HAK

On 1/24/2021 4:31 AM, Steve Garrison wrote:
> Eric,
>
> If you wouldn't mind sending the gerber files or any other files I'd 
> appreciate it.  I've been having several other boards that I have 
> designed for robot project I'm involved with made, so I could add the 
> demod board to the list.  Is the 2211 still readily available?
>
> Steve G./N4TTY
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: greenkeys-bounces at mailman.qth.net 
> <greenkeys-bounces at mailman.qth.net>
> On Behalf Of epvgk at limpoc.com
> Sent: Sunday, January 24, 2021 3:58 AM
> To: hwhall at compuserve.com
> Cc: greenkeys at mailman.qth.net
> Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] XR2211 demodulator circuit boards?
>
> On Sun, Jan 24, 2021 at 08:46:10AM +0000, hwhall at compuserve.com wrote:
>> I'd encountered some of those pages when I was googling but still no 
>> PCB
> artwork. If someone has already laid them out, I could skip reinventing it.
>> WayneWB4OGM
> Here's the one I did that got manufactured that people on the list 
> have a bunch of.
>
> https://www.heepy.net/index.php/RTTY_demodulator_using_NJM2211
>
> I can dig up gerbers or whatever if you want!
>
> eric
>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Harold Hallikainen <harold at w6iwi.org>
>> To: greenkeys at mailman.qth.net
>> Sent: Sat, Jan 23, 2021 11:19 pm
>> Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] XR2211 demodulator circuit boards?
>>
>>
>>> Are there any printed circuit boards for building an XR2211 based 
>>> RTTY demodulator? ? Google shows me all kinds of articles from 
>>> complex to over-simplified but doesn't lead me to any PCB artwork or
> vendors.
>>> I'm thinking I might build a demod to run a Model 15 from a laptop 
>>> running MMTTY. The program only outputs tones (no on-off output to 
>>> key a loop
>>> directly) so a PLL demod should be fine since noise won't be an 
>>> issue. Or should I look at something even smaller/simpler?
>>> Thanks!WayneWB4OGM__________________________________________________
>>> ____________
>> There's an evaluation board at
>> https://media.digikey.com/pdf/Data%20Sheets/MaxLinear%20PDFs/XR-2206-
>> 1 1-12_Man.pdf . I'd be tempted to wire wrap it, though.
>>
>> Several products I did using the XR2211 are at
>>
>> http://bh.hallikainen.org//wiki/uploads/HaroldHallikainen/20130416125
>> 3
>> 39_Part5.pdf
>>
>> http://bh.hallikainen.org//wiki/uploads/HaroldHallikainen/Harold_018.
>> p
>> df
>>
>> http://bh.hallikainen.org//wiki/uploads/HaroldHallikainen/20130416125
>> 3
>> 39_Part1.pdf
>>
>> http://bh.hallikainen.org//wiki/uploads/HaroldHallikainen/Harold_011.
>> p
>> df
>>
>> http://bh.hallikainen.org//wiki/uploads/HaroldHallikainen/20130416125
>> 5
>> 53.pdf#page=11
>>
>> The XR2211 is a fun chip. Before that, I used the NE565, but the
>> XR2211 includes the data comparator, a carrier detect, etc. The 
>> XR2206 is also a nice chip. It will generate a square wave, triangle 
>> wave, and
> sine waves.
>> It can do linear FM, AM (including double sideband suppressed 
>> carrier), and FSK. The FSK circuit has a logic input that switches 
>> between two timing resistors. But, during the transition, the 
>> frequency goes to zero for a very short time. I'd probably use the 
>> linear FM circuit and drive it with the data after running it through 
>> a low pass filter to limit bandwidth. It IS a nice chip, though. I 
>> used it as an upconverter (local oscillator and mixer) to upconvert 
>> subcarriers on FM broadcast stations to
>> 455 kHz where the signal then went through ceramic filters, IF 
>> amplifier, and a ceramic discriminator.
>>
>> Fun stuff!
>>
>> Harold
>> https://w6iwi.org
>>
>>
>> --
>> FCC Rules Updated Daily at http://www.hallikainen.com Not sent from 
>> an iPhone.
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> GreenKeys mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
>>
>>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool:
>>>>> https://teletype.net/gksearch 2002-to-present greenkeys archive:
>>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive:
>>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool:
>>>>> http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this 
>> email
>> list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to 
>> hwhall at compuserve.com 
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> GreenKeys mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
>>
>>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool:
>>>>> https://teletype.net/gksearch 2002-to-present greenkeys archive:
>>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive:
>>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool:
>>>>> http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this 
>> email
>> list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to 
>> epvgk at limpoc.com
> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
>
>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool:
>>>> https://teletype.net/gksearch 2002-to-present greenkeys archive:
>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive:
>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool:
>>>> http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email 
> list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to 
> steve.n4tty at gmail.com
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
>
>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: 
>>>> https://teletype.net/gksearch 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: 
>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: 
>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: 
>>>> http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email 
> list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to 
> wb5hak at arrl.net

--
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
https://www.avast.com/antivirus

______________________________________________________________
GreenKeys mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net

>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: 
>>> https://teletype.net/gksearch 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: 
>>> http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: 
>>> http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: 
>>> http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to steve.n4tty at gmail.com


From w9ddd at tapr.org  Sun Jan 24 12:33:32 2021
From: w9ddd at tapr.org (John, W9DDD)
Date: Sun, 24 Jan 2021 11:33:32 -0600
Subject: [GreenKeys] XR2211 demodulator circuit boards?
In-Reply-To: <10c301d6f274$f8549830$e8fdc890$@gmail.com>
References: <2072683957.4657899.1611466303451.ref@mail.yahoo.com>
	<2072683957.4657899.1611466303451@mail.yahoo.com>
	<88ade8cd0555b0e7615b2676c321242c.squirrel@mai.hallikainen.org>
	<3820057.4675674.1611477970434@mail.yahoo.com>
	<20210124085815.GA17885@limpoc.com>
	<104101d6f23c$20fbf0f0$62f3d2d0$@gmail.com>
	<af2896b1-1570-e5ca-c978-30a6145bed5a@martineer.net>
	<10c301d6f274$f8549830$e8fdc890$@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <8818601b-8f62-e04e-3bb4-82745078c00d@tapr.org>

Not volunteering, but there are CAD programs that can take an image 
(e.g.jpeg), import it and create gerbers.  Not automatically, you need 
to place pads and traces over the imported image that is a layer behind 
the active layer.



John, W9DDD

On 1/24/2021 11:18 AM, Steve Garrison wrote:
> Well, right now I wouldn't be able to tackle that.  That is why I sent the note to Eric about the Gerber files.  Those I might be able to squeeze in with a shoehorn.
> 
> Steve G./N4TTY0
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: greenkeys-bounces at mailman.qth.net <greenkeys-bounces at mailman.qth.net> On Behalf Of Don Cunningam
> Sent: Sunday, January 24, 2021 9:53 AM
> To: greenkeys at mailman.qth.net
> Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] XR2211 demodulator circuit boards?
> 
> Steve,
> 
> I have a set of boards (TU and power supply) that was sold by a company called PEMCO, if my old memory is correct for the ST-5A which was Irv Hoff's ST-5 with autostart added.  I would donate them if you think you have somewhere that could duplicate them so others could build that.  I also have the old Hoff articles from an early QST that talks about tuning toroid coils and if followed on this TU, it is nearly as good as the HAL ST-6 was!!!  If that cant be done, Eric you can have these boards and I'll dig up some toroids to build it.  I don't have a TON of the toroids, but I have some left from MANY years of building TU's for Navy MARS folks back in the 70's,  I found this set of Pemco boards and info for sale and bought it a few years back to share with someone.  If you can do this, Steve, let me know and I'll ship the boards to you.
> 
> 73,
> 
> Don, WB5HAK
> 
> On 1/24/2021 4:31 AM, Steve Garrison wrote:
>> Eric,
>>
>> If you wouldn't mind sending the gerber files or any other files I'd
>> appreciate it.  I've been having several other boards that I have
>> designed for robot project I'm involved with made, so I could add the
>> demod board to the list.  Is the 2211 still readily available?
>>
>> Steve G./N4TTY
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: greenkeys-bounces at mailman.qth.net
>> <greenkeys-bounces at mailman.qth.net>
>> On Behalf Of epvgk at limpoc.com
>> Sent: Sunday, January 24, 2021 3:58 AM
>> To: hwhall at compuserve.com
>> Cc: greenkeys at mailman.qth.net
>> Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] XR2211 demodulator circuit boards?
>>
>> On Sun, Jan 24, 2021 at 08:46:10AM +0000, hwhall at compuserve.com wrote:
>>> I'd encountered some of those pages when I was googling but still no
>>> PCB
>> artwork. If someone has already laid them out, I could skip reinventing it.
>>> WayneWB4OGM
>> Here's the one I did that got manufactured that people on the list
>> have a bunch of.
>>
>> https://www.heepy.net/index.php/RTTY_demodulator_using_NJM2211
>>
>> I can dig up gerbers or whatever if you want!
>>
>> eric
>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: Harold Hallikainen <harold at w6iwi.org>
>>> To: greenkeys at mailman.qth.net
>>> Sent: Sat, Jan 23, 2021 11:19 pm
>>> Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] XR2211 demodulator circuit boards?
>>>
>>>
>>>> Are there any printed circuit boards for building an XR2211 based
>>>> RTTY demodulator? ? Google shows me all kinds of articles from
>>>> complex to over-simplified but doesn't lead me to any PCB artwork or
>> vendors.
>>>> I'm thinking I might build a demod to run a Model 15 from a laptop
>>>> running MMTTY. The program only outputs tones (no on-off output to
>>>> key a loop
>>>> directly) so a PLL demod should be fine since noise won't be an
>>>> issue. Or should I look at something even smaller/simpler?
>>>> Thanks!WayneWB4OGM__________________________________________________
>>>> ____________
>>> There's an evaluation board at
>>> https://media.digikey.com/pdf/Data%20Sheets/MaxLinear%20PDFs/XR-2206-
>>> 1 1-12_Man.pdf . I'd be tempted to wire wrap it, though.
>>>
>>> Several products I did using the XR2211 are at
>>>
>>> http://bh.hallikainen.org//wiki/uploads/HaroldHallikainen/20130416125
>>> 3
>>> 39_Part5.pdf
>>>
>>> http://bh.hallikainen.org//wiki/uploads/HaroldHallikainen/Harold_018.
>>> p
>>> df
>>>
>>> http://bh.hallikainen.org//wiki/uploads/HaroldHallikainen/20130416125
>>> 3
>>> 39_Part1.pdf
>>>
>>> http://bh.hallikainen.org//wiki/uploads/HaroldHallikainen/Harold_011.
>>> p
>>> df
>>>
>>> http://bh.hallikainen.org//wiki/uploads/HaroldHallikainen/20130416125
>>> 5
>>> 53.pdf#page=11
>>>
>>> The XR2211 is a fun chip. Before that, I used the NE565, but the
>>> XR2211 includes the data comparator, a carrier detect, etc. The
>>> XR2206 is also a nice chip. It will generate a square wave, triangle
>>> wave, and
>> sine waves.
>>> It can do linear FM, AM (including double sideband suppressed
>>> carrier), and FSK. The FSK circuit has a logic input that switches
>>> between two timing resistors. But, during the transition, the
>>> frequency goes to zero for a very short time. I'd probably use the
>>> linear FM circuit and drive it with the data after running it through
>>> a low pass filter to limit bandwidth. It IS a nice chip, though. I
>>> used it as an upconverter (local oscillator and mixer) to upconvert
>>> subcarriers on FM broadcast stations to
>>> 455 kHz where the signal then went through ceramic filters, IF
>>> amplifier, and a ceramic discriminator.
>>>
>>> Fun stuff!
>>>
>>> Harold
>>> https://w6iwi.org
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> FCC Rules Updated Daily at http://www.hallikainen.com Not sent from
>>> an iPhone.
>>> ______________________________________________________________
>>> GreenKeys mailing list
>>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
>>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>>> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
>>>
>>>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool:
>>>>>> https://teletype.net/gksearch 2002-to-present greenkeys archive:
>>>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive:
>>>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool:
>>>>>> http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
>>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this
>>> email
>>> list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to
>>> hwhall at compuserve.com
>>> ______________________________________________________________
>>> GreenKeys mailing list
>>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
>>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>>> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
>>>
>>>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool:
>>>>>> https://teletype.net/gksearch 2002-to-present greenkeys archive:
>>>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive:
>>>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool:
>>>>>> http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
>>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this
>>> email
>>> list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to
>>> epvgk at limpoc.com
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> GreenKeys mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
>>
>>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool:
>>>>> https://teletype.net/gksearch 2002-to-present greenkeys archive:
>>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive:
>>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool:
>>>>> http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email
>> list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to
>> steve.n4tty at gmail.com
>>
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> GreenKeys mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
>>
>>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool:
>>>>> https://teletype.net/gksearch 2002-to-present greenkeys archive:
>>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive:
>>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool:
>>>>> http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email
>> list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to
>> wb5hak at arrl.net
> 
> --
> This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
> https://www.avast.com/antivirus
> 
> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
> 
>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool:
>>>> https://teletype.net/gksearch 2002-to-present greenkeys archive:
>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive:
>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool:
>>>> http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
> 
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to steve.n4tty at gmail.com
> 
> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
> 
>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
> 
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to w9ddd at tapr.org
> 

From wcwuttke at att.net  Sun Jan 24 12:41:27 2021
From: wcwuttke at att.net (William Wuttke)
Date: Sun, 24 Jan 2021 09:41:27 -0800
Subject: [GreenKeys] ARRL RTTY Roundup Jan 2-3 2021 the old fashioned way.
References: <F2FC7F05-11D8-46FB-9E12-D26F45573651.ref@att.net>
Message-ID: <F2FC7F05-11D8-46FB-9E12-D26F45573651@att.net>

It took me entirely too long to put this video together. Model 28 ASR in the RTTY Roundup.

https://youtu.be/O4iKeK9Py1Y <https://youtu.be/O4iKeK9Py1Y>

Enjoy.

Bill
KE3BK
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From steve.n4tty at gmail.com  Sun Jan 24 13:12:37 2021
From: steve.n4tty at gmail.com (Steve Garrison)
Date: Sun, 24 Jan 2021 13:12:37 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] XR2211 demodulator circuit boards?
In-Reply-To: <8818601b-8f62-e04e-3bb4-82745078c00d@tapr.org>
References: <2072683957.4657899.1611466303451.ref@mail.yahoo.com>
	<2072683957.4657899.1611466303451@mail.yahoo.com>
	<88ade8cd0555b0e7615b2676c321242c.squirrel@mai.hallikainen.org>
	<3820057.4675674.1611477970434@mail.yahoo.com>
	<20210124085815.GA17885@limpoc.com>
	<104101d6f23c$20fbf0f0$62f3d2d0$@gmail.com>
	<af2896b1-1570-e5ca-c978-30a6145bed5a@martineer.net>
	<10c301d6f274$f8549830$e8fdc890$@gmail.com>
	<8818601b-8f62-e04e-3bb4-82745078c00d@tapr.org>
Message-ID: <10d901d6f27c$7f680bc0$7e382340$@gmail.com>

Dang, thought you might be volunteering John!  It's the part that isn't
automatic that won't fit the schedule right now!

Steve G./N4TTY
-----Original Message-----
From: John, W9DDD <w9ddd at tapr.org> 
Sent: Sunday, January 24, 2021 12:34 PM
To: N4TTY at ARRL.NET; Green Keys <greenkeys at mailman.qth.net>
Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] XR2211 demodulator circuit boards?

Not volunteering, but there are CAD programs that can take an image
(e.g.jpeg), import it and create gerbers.  Not automatically, you need to
place pads and traces over the imported image that is a layer behind the
active layer.



John, W9DDD

On 1/24/2021 11:18 AM, Steve Garrison wrote:
> Well, right now I wouldn't be able to tackle that.  That is why I sent the
note to Eric about the Gerber files.  Those I might be able to squeeze in
with a shoehorn.
> 
> Steve G./N4TTY0
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: greenkeys-bounces at mailman.qth.net 
> <greenkeys-bounces at mailman.qth.net> On Behalf Of Don Cunningam
> Sent: Sunday, January 24, 2021 9:53 AM
> To: greenkeys at mailman.qth.net
> Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] XR2211 demodulator circuit boards?
> 
> Steve,
> 
> I have a set of boards (TU and power supply) that was sold by a company
called PEMCO, if my old memory is correct for the ST-5A which was Irv Hoff's
ST-5 with autostart added.  I would donate them if you think you have
somewhere that could duplicate them so others could build that.  I also have
the old Hoff articles from an early QST that talks about tuning toroid coils
and if followed on this TU, it is nearly as good as the HAL ST-6 was!!!  If
that cant be done, Eric you can have these boards and I'll dig up some
toroids to build it.  I don't have a TON of the toroids, but I have some
left from MANY years of building TU's for Navy MARS folks back in the 70's,
I found this set of Pemco boards and info for sale and bought it a few years
back to share with someone.  If you can do this, Steve, let me know and I'll
ship the boards to you.
> 
> 73,
> 
> Don, WB5HAK
> 
> On 1/24/2021 4:31 AM, Steve Garrison wrote:
>> Eric,
>>
>> If you wouldn't mind sending the gerber files or any other files I'd 
>> appreciate it.  I've been having several other boards that I have 
>> designed for robot project I'm involved with made, so I could add the 
>> demod board to the list.  Is the 2211 still readily available?
>>
>> Steve G./N4TTY
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: greenkeys-bounces at mailman.qth.net 
>> <greenkeys-bounces at mailman.qth.net>
>> On Behalf Of epvgk at limpoc.com
>> Sent: Sunday, January 24, 2021 3:58 AM
>> To: hwhall at compuserve.com
>> Cc: greenkeys at mailman.qth.net
>> Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] XR2211 demodulator circuit boards?
>>
>> On Sun, Jan 24, 2021 at 08:46:10AM +0000, hwhall at compuserve.com wrote:
>>> I'd encountered some of those pages when I was googling but still no 
>>> PCB
>> artwork. If someone has already laid them out, I could skip reinventing
it.
>>> WayneWB4OGM
>> Here's the one I did that got manufactured that people on the list 
>> have a bunch of.
>>
>> https://www.heepy.net/index.php/RTTY_demodulator_using_NJM2211
>>
>> I can dig up gerbers or whatever if you want!
>>
>> eric
>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: Harold Hallikainen <harold at w6iwi.org>
>>> To: greenkeys at mailman.qth.net
>>> Sent: Sat, Jan 23, 2021 11:19 pm
>>> Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] XR2211 demodulator circuit boards?
>>>
>>>
>>>> Are there any printed circuit boards for building an XR2211 based 
>>>> RTTY demodulator? ? Google shows me all kinds of articles from 
>>>> complex to over-simplified but doesn't lead me to any PCB artwork 
>>>> or
>> vendors.
>>>> I'm thinking I might build a demod to run a Model 15 from a laptop 
>>>> running MMTTY. The program only outputs tones (no on-off output to 
>>>> key a loop
>>>> directly) so a PLL demod should be fine since noise won't be an 
>>>> issue. Or should I look at something even smaller/simpler?
>>>> Thanks!WayneWB4OGM_________________________________________________
>>>> _
>>>> ____________
>>> There's an evaluation board at
>>> https://media.digikey.com/pdf/Data%20Sheets/MaxLinear%20PDFs/XR-2206
>>> -
>>> 1 1-12_Man.pdf . I'd be tempted to wire wrap it, though.
>>>
>>> Several products I did using the XR2211 are at
>>>
>>> http://bh.hallikainen.org//wiki/uploads/HaroldHallikainen/2013041612
>>> 5
>>> 3
>>> 39_Part5.pdf
>>>
>>> http://bh.hallikainen.org//wiki/uploads/HaroldHallikainen/Harold_018.
>>> p
>>> df
>>>
>>> http://bh.hallikainen.org//wiki/uploads/HaroldHallikainen/2013041612
>>> 5
>>> 3
>>> 39_Part1.pdf
>>>
>>> http://bh.hallikainen.org//wiki/uploads/HaroldHallikainen/Harold_011.
>>> p
>>> df
>>>
>>> http://bh.hallikainen.org//wiki/uploads/HaroldHallikainen/2013041612
>>> 5
>>> 5
>>> 53.pdf#page=11
>>>
>>> The XR2211 is a fun chip. Before that, I used the NE565, but the
>>> XR2211 includes the data comparator, a carrier detect, etc. The
>>> XR2206 is also a nice chip. It will generate a square wave, triangle 
>>> wave, and
>> sine waves.
>>> It can do linear FM, AM (including double sideband suppressed 
>>> carrier), and FSK. The FSK circuit has a logic input that switches 
>>> between two timing resistors. But, during the transition, the 
>>> frequency goes to zero for a very short time. I'd probably use the 
>>> linear FM circuit and drive it with the data after running it 
>>> through a low pass filter to limit bandwidth. It IS a nice chip, 
>>> though. I used it as an upconverter (local oscillator and mixer) to 
>>> upconvert subcarriers on FM broadcast stations to
>>> 455 kHz where the signal then went through ceramic filters, IF 
>>> amplifier, and a ceramic discriminator.
>>>
>>> Fun stuff!
>>>
>>> Harold
>>> https://w6iwi.org
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> FCC Rules Updated Daily at http://www.hallikainen.com Not sent from 
>>> an iPhone.
>>> ______________________________________________________________
>>> GreenKeys mailing list
>>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
>>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>>> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
>>>
>>>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool:
>>>>>> https://teletype.net/gksearch 2002-to-present greenkeys archive:
>>>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive:
>>>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool:
>>>>>> http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
>>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this 
>>> email
>>> list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to 
>>> hwhall at compuserve.com 
>>> ______________________________________________________________
>>> GreenKeys mailing list
>>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
>>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>>> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
>>>
>>>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool:
>>>>>> https://teletype.net/gksearch 2002-to-present greenkeys archive:
>>>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive:
>>>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool:
>>>>>> http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
>>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this 
>>> email
>>> list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to 
>>> epvgk at limpoc.com
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> GreenKeys mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
>>
>>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool:
>>>>> https://teletype.net/gksearch 2002-to-present greenkeys archive:
>>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive:
>>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool:
>>>>> http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this 
>> email
>> list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to 
>> steve.n4tty at gmail.com
>>
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> GreenKeys mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
>>
>>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool:
>>>>> https://teletype.net/gksearch 2002-to-present greenkeys archive:
>>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive:
>>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool:
>>>>> http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this 
>> email
>> list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to 
>> wb5hak at arrl.net
> 
> --
> This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
> https://www.avast.com/antivirus
> 
> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
> 
>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool:
>>>> https://teletype.net/gksearch 2002-to-present greenkeys archive:
>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive:
>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool:
>>>> http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
> 
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email 
> list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to 
> steve.n4tty at gmail.com
> 
> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
> 
>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: 
>>>> https://teletype.net/gksearch 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: 
>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: 
>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: 
>>>> http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
> 
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email 
> list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to 
> w9ddd at tapr.org
> 


From jim.w2jc at gmail.com  Sun Jan 24 13:29:28 2021
From: jim.w2jc at gmail.com (Jim Cooper)
Date: Sun, 24 Jan 2021 13:29:28 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] ARRL RTTY Roundup Jan 2-3 2021 the old fashioned
	way.
In-Reply-To: <F2FC7F05-11D8-46FB-9E12-D26F45573651@att.net>
References: <F2FC7F05-11D8-46FB-9E12-D26F45573651.ref@att.net>,
	<F2FC7F05-11D8-46FB-9E12-D26F45573651@att.net>
Message-ID: <600DBC88.6357.1233864E@jim.w2jc.gmail.com>

On 24 Jan 2021 at 9:41, William Wuttke wrote:

> It took me entirely too long to put
> this video together. Model 28 ASR in
> the RTTY Roundup. 

really great show!!  worth the time it took you.  :))
thanks for sharing. 

Jim  w2jc 




From paul0926 at comcast.net  Sun Jan 24 13:40:53 2021
From: paul0926 at comcast.net (Paul Heller)
Date: Sun, 24 Jan 2021 19:40:53 +0100
Subject: [GreenKeys] ARRL RTTY Roundup Jan 2-3 2021 the old fashioned
	way.
In-Reply-To: <F2FC7F05-11D8-46FB-9E12-D26F45573651@att.net>
References: <F2FC7F05-11D8-46FB-9E12-D26F45573651@att.net>
Message-ID: <9D8CA269-D1ED-4225-87D6-1D1A98300719@comcast.net>

Fantastic, Bill!! Thanks for posting. Look great.

73,
Paul
W2TTY


> On Jan 24, 2021, at 6:41 PM, William Wuttke <wcwuttke at att.net> wrote:
> 
> ?It took me entirely too long to put this video together. Model 28 ASR in the RTTY Roundup.
> 
> https://youtu.be/O4iKeK9Py1Y
> 
> Enjoy.
> 
> Bill
> KE3BK
> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
> 
>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
> 
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to paul0926 at comcast.net
-------------- next part --------------
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From harold at w6iwi.org  Sun Jan 24 14:18:24 2021
From: harold at w6iwi.org (Harold Hallikainen)
Date: Sun, 24 Jan 2021 11:18:24 -0800
Subject: [GreenKeys] ARRL RTTY Roundup Jan 2-3 2021 the old fashioned
 way.
In-Reply-To: <F2FC7F05-11D8-46FB-9E12-D26F45573651@att.net>
References: <F2FC7F05-11D8-46FB-9E12-D26F45573651.ref@att.net>
	<F2FC7F05-11D8-46FB-9E12-D26F45573651@att.net>
Message-ID: <50cbf95907f187bca4ad0fd40f2584a6.squirrel@mai.hallikainen.org>


> It took me entirely too long to put this video together. Model 28 ASR in
> the RTTY Roundup.
>
> https://youtu.be/O4iKeK9Py1Y <https://youtu.be/O4iKeK9Py1Y>
>
> Enjoy.
>
> Bill
> KE3BK______________________________________________________________

Nice! How did you splice the tape?

Harold





-- 
FCC Rules Updated Daily at http://www.hallikainen.com
Not sent from an iPhone.

From kg5ylg at austin.rr.com  Sun Jan 24 14:21:22 2021
From: kg5ylg at austin.rr.com (John Hargett)
Date: Sun, 24 Jan 2021 13:21:22 -0600
Subject: [GreenKeys] XR2211 demodulator circuit boards?
In-Reply-To: <8818601b-8f62-e04e-3bb4-82745078c00d@tapr.org>
References: <2072683957.4657899.1611466303451.ref@mail.yahoo.com>
	<2072683957.4657899.1611466303451@mail.yahoo.com>
	<88ade8cd0555b0e7615b2676c321242c.squirrel@mai.hallikainen.org>
	<3820057.4675674.1611477970434@mail.yahoo.com>
	<20210124085815.GA17885@limpoc.com>
	<104101d6f23c$20fbf0f0$62f3d2d0$@gmail.com>
	<af2896b1-1570-e5ca-c978-30a6145bed5a@martineer.net>
	<10c301d6f274$f8549830$e8fdc890$@gmail.com>
	<8818601b-8f62-e04e-3bb4-82745078c00d@tapr.org>
Message-ID: <ea50e55a-4c72-14e3-3105-18b245199cbc@austin.rr.com>

Might be volunteering,

I have a program that I use to convert pdf and other files to a DXF to 
import into autocad for running parts on a cnc punch or plasma, I dont 
see why I couldnt do the same with the boards, scan them as a PDF or 
JPEG and convert , import and then be able to create the Gerber files.? 
Plus we just added Fusion 360? to our cad systems, which includes full 
version of EAGLE-Premium, so would give me something to try on it. ? 
Would be willing to attempt this if you would like.?? Never can have too 
many TU around.


John

KG5YLG


On 1/24/2021 11:33 AM, John, W9DDD wrote:
> Not volunteering, but there are CAD programs that can take an image 
> (e.g.jpeg), import it and create gerbers.? Not automatically, you need 
> to place pads and traces over the imported image that is a layer 
> behind the active layer.
>
>
>
> John, W9DDD
>
> On 1/24/2021 11:18 AM, Steve Garrison wrote:
>> Well, right now I wouldn't be able to tackle that.? That is why I 
>> sent the note to Eric about the Gerber files.? Those I might be able 
>> to squeeze in with a shoehorn.
>>
>> Steve G./N4TTY0
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: greenkeys-bounces at mailman.qth.net 
>> <greenkeys-bounces at mailman.qth.net> On Behalf Of Don Cunningam
>> Sent: Sunday, January 24, 2021 9:53 AM
>> To: greenkeys at mailman.qth.net
>> Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] XR2211 demodulator circuit boards?
>>
>> Steve,
>>
>> I have a set of boards (TU and power supply) that was sold by a 
>> company called PEMCO, if my old memory is correct for the ST-5A which 
>> was Irv Hoff's ST-5 with autostart added.? I would donate them if you 
>> think you have somewhere that could duplicate them so others could 
>> build that.? I also have the old Hoff articles from an early QST that 
>> talks about tuning toroid coils and if followed on this TU, it is 
>> nearly as good as the HAL ST-6 was!!!? If that cant be done, Eric you 
>> can have these boards and I'll dig up some toroids to build it.? I 
>> don't have a TON of the toroids, but I have some left from MANY years 
>> of building TU's for Navy MARS folks back in the 70's,? I found this 
>> set of Pemco boards and info for sale and bought it a few years back 
>> to share with someone.? If you can do this, Steve, let me know and 
>> I'll ship the boards to you.
>>
>> 73,
>>
>> Don, WB5HAK
>>
>> On 1/24/2021 4:31 AM, Steve Garrison wrote:
>>> Eric,
>>>
>>> If you wouldn't mind sending the gerber files or any other files I'd
>>> appreciate it.? I've been having several other boards that I have
>>> designed for robot project I'm involved with made, so I could add the
>>> demod board to the list.? Is the 2211 still readily available?
>>>
>>> Steve G./N4TTY
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: greenkeys-bounces at mailman.qth.net
>>> <greenkeys-bounces at mailman.qth.net>
>>> On Behalf Of epvgk at limpoc.com
>>> Sent: Sunday, January 24, 2021 3:58 AM
>>> To: hwhall at compuserve.com
>>> Cc: greenkeys at mailman.qth.net
>>> Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] XR2211 demodulator circuit boards?
>>>
>>> On Sun, Jan 24, 2021 at 08:46:10AM +0000, hwhall at compuserve.com wrote:
>>>> I'd encountered some of those pages when I was googling but still no
>>>> PCB
>>> artwork. If someone has already laid them out, I could skip 
>>> reinventing it.
>>>> WayneWB4OGM
>>> Here's the one I did that got manufactured that people on the list
>>> have a bunch of.
>>>
>>> https://www.heepy.net/index.php/RTTY_demodulator_using_NJM2211
>>>
>>> I can dig up gerbers or whatever if you want!
>>>
>>> eric
>>>
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: Harold Hallikainen <harold at w6iwi.org>
>>>> To: greenkeys at mailman.qth.net
>>>> Sent: Sat, Jan 23, 2021 11:19 pm
>>>> Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] XR2211 demodulator circuit boards?
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> Are there any printed circuit boards for building an XR2211 based
>>>>> RTTY demodulator? ? Google shows me all kinds of articles from
>>>>> complex to over-simplified but doesn't lead me to any PCB artwork or
>>> vendors.
>>>>> I'm thinking I might build a demod to run a Model 15 from a laptop
>>>>> running MMTTY. The program only outputs tones (no on-off output to
>>>>> key a loop
>>>>> directly) so a PLL demod should be fine since noise won't be an
>>>>> issue. Or should I look at something even smaller/simpler?
>>>>> Thanks!WayneWB4OGM__________________________________________________
>>>>> ____________
>>>> There's an evaluation board at
>>>> https://media.digikey.com/pdf/Data%20Sheets/MaxLinear%20PDFs/XR-2206-
>>>> 1 1-12_Man.pdf . I'd be tempted to wire wrap it, though.
>>>>
>>>> Several products I did using the XR2211 are at
>>>>
>>>> http://bh.hallikainen.org//wiki/uploads/HaroldHallikainen/20130416125
>>>> 3
>>>> 39_Part5.pdf
>>>>
>>>> http://bh.hallikainen.org//wiki/uploads/HaroldHallikainen/Harold_018.
>>>> p
>>>> df
>>>>
>>>> http://bh.hallikainen.org//wiki/uploads/HaroldHallikainen/20130416125
>>>> 3
>>>> 39_Part1.pdf
>>>>
>>>> http://bh.hallikainen.org//wiki/uploads/HaroldHallikainen/Harold_011.
>>>> p
>>>> df
>>>>
>>>> http://bh.hallikainen.org//wiki/uploads/HaroldHallikainen/20130416125
>>>> 5
>>>> 53.pdf#page=11
>>>>
>>>> The XR2211 is a fun chip. Before that, I used the NE565, but the
>>>> XR2211 includes the data comparator, a carrier detect, etc. The
>>>> XR2206 is also a nice chip. It will generate a square wave, triangle
>>>> wave, and
>>> sine waves.
>>>> It can do linear FM, AM (including double sideband suppressed
>>>> carrier), and FSK. The FSK circuit has a logic input that switches
>>>> between two timing resistors. But, during the transition, the
>>>> frequency goes to zero for a very short time. I'd probably use the
>>>> linear FM circuit and drive it with the data after running it through
>>>> a low pass filter to limit bandwidth. It IS a nice chip, though. I
>>>> used it as an upconverter (local oscillator and mixer) to upconvert
>>>> subcarriers on FM broadcast stations to
>>>> 455 kHz where the signal then went through ceramic filters, IF
>>>> amplifier, and a ceramic discriminator.
>>>>
>>>> Fun stuff!
>>>>
>>>> Harold
>>>> https://w6iwi.org
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> -- 
>>>> FCC Rules Updated Daily at http://www.hallikainen.com Not sent from
>>>> an iPhone.
>>>> ______________________________________________________________
>>>> GreenKeys mailing list
>>>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
>>>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>>>> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
>>>>
>>>>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool:
>>>>>>> https://teletype.net/gksearch 2002-to-present greenkeys archive:
>>>>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive:
>>>>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool:
>>>>>>> http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
>>>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this
>>>> email
>>>> list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to
>>>> hwhall at compuserve.com
>>>> ______________________________________________________________
>>>> GreenKeys mailing list
>>>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
>>>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>>>> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
>>>>
>>>>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool:
>>>>>>> https://teletype.net/gksearch 2002-to-present greenkeys archive:
>>>>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive:
>>>>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool:
>>>>>>> http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
>>>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this
>>>> email
>>>> list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to
>>>> epvgk at limpoc.com
>>> ______________________________________________________________
>>> GreenKeys mailing list
>>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
>>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>>> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
>>>
>>>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool:
>>>>>> https://teletype.net/gksearch 2002-to-present greenkeys archive:
>>>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive:
>>>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool:
>>>>>> http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
>>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email
>>> list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to
>>> steve.n4tty at gmail.com
>>>
>>> ______________________________________________________________
>>> GreenKeys mailing list
>>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
>>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>>> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
>>>
>>>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool:
>>>>>> https://teletype.net/gksearch 2002-to-present greenkeys archive:
>>>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive:
>>>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool:
>>>>>> http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
>>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email
>>> list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to
>>> wb5hak at arrl.net
>>
>> -- 
>> This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
>> https://www.avast.com/antivirus
>>
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> GreenKeys mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
>>
>>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool:
>>>>> https://teletype.net/gksearch 2002-to-present greenkeys archive:
>>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive:
>>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool:
>>>>> http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
>>
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html 
>> Message delivered to steve.n4tty at gmail.com
>>
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> GreenKeys mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
>>
>>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: 
>>>>> https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: 
>>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: 
>>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: 
>>>>> http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
>>
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>> Message delivered to w9ddd at tapr.org
>>
> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
>
>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: 
>>>> https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: 
>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: 
>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: 
>>>> http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to kg5ylg at austin.rr.com

-- 
This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
https://www.avg.com


From epvgk at limpoc.com  Sun Jan 24 14:28:11 2021
From: epvgk at limpoc.com (epvgk at limpoc.com)
Date: Sun, 24 Jan 2021 11:28:11 -0800
Subject: [GreenKeys] XR2211 demodulator circuit boards?
In-Reply-To: <104101d6f23c$20fbf0f0$62f3d2d0$@gmail.com>
References: <2072683957.4657899.1611466303451.ref@mail.yahoo.com>
	<2072683957.4657899.1611466303451@mail.yahoo.com>
	<88ade8cd0555b0e7615b2676c321242c.squirrel@mai.hallikainen.org>
	<3820057.4675674.1611477970434@mail.yahoo.com>
	<20210124085815.GA17885@limpoc.com>
	<104101d6f23c$20fbf0f0$62f3d2d0$@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20210124192811.GA23587@limpoc.com>

On Sun, Jan 24, 2021 at 05:31:51AM -0500, Steve Garrison wrote:
> Eric,
> 
> If you wouldn't mind sending the gerber files or any other files I'd
> appreciate it.  I've been having several other boards that I have designed
> for robot project I'm involved with made, so I could add the demod board to
> the list.  Is the 2211 still readily available?
> 
> Steve G./N4TTY
> 

Here are the gerbers and associated stuff for the 2211-based demod that was sold 
on the list a few years back. I believe the 2211 is still available at least in 
smallish quantities. 

This board was designed to be easy to hand assemble and it's single-layer with
no tight tolerances so you can even DIY etch it if you're bored.  Attaching the
digikey parts list too. 

eric



> -----Original Message-----
> From: greenkeys-bounces at mailman.qth.net <greenkeys-bounces at mailman.qth.net>
> On Behalf Of epvgk at limpoc.com
> Sent: Sunday, January 24, 2021 3:58 AM
> To: hwhall at compuserve.com
> Cc: greenkeys at mailman.qth.net
> Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] XR2211 demodulator circuit boards?
> 
> On Sun, Jan 24, 2021 at 08:46:10AM +0000, hwhall at compuserve.com wrote:
> > I'd encountered some of those pages when I was googling but still no PCB
> artwork. If someone has already laid them out, I could skip reinventing it.
> > 
> > WayneWB4OGM
> 
> Here's the one I did that got manufactured that people on the list have a
> bunch of. 
> 
> https://www.heepy.net/index.php/RTTY_demodulator_using_NJM2211
> 
> I can dig up gerbers or whatever if you want!
> 
> eric
> 
> > 
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Harold Hallikainen <harold at w6iwi.org>
> > To: greenkeys at mailman.qth.net
> > Sent: Sat, Jan 23, 2021 11:19 pm
> > Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] XR2211 demodulator circuit boards?
> > 
> > 
> > > Are there any printed circuit boards for building an XR2211 based 
> > > RTTY demodulator? ??Google shows me all kinds of articles from 
> > > complex to over-simplified but doesn't lead me to any PCB artwork or
> vendors.
> > > I'm thinking I might build a demod to run a Model 15 from a laptop 
> > > running MMTTY. The program only outputs tones (no on-off output to 
> > > key a loop
> > > directly) so a PLL demod should be fine since noise won't be an 
> > > issue. Or should I look at something even smaller/simpler?
> > > Thanks!WayneWB4OGM__________________________________________________
> > > ____________
> > 
> > There's an evaluation board at
> > https://media.digikey.com/pdf/Data%20Sheets/MaxLinear%20PDFs/XR-2206-1
> > 1-12_Man.pdf . I'd be tempted to wire wrap it, though.
> > 
> > Several products I did using the XR2211 are at
> > 
> > http://bh.hallikainen.org//wiki/uploads/HaroldHallikainen/201304161253
> > 39_Part5.pdf
> > 
> > http://bh.hallikainen.org//wiki/uploads/HaroldHallikainen/Harold_018.p
> > df
> > 
> > http://bh.hallikainen.org//wiki/uploads/HaroldHallikainen/201304161253
> > 39_Part1.pdf
> > 
> > http://bh.hallikainen.org//wiki/uploads/HaroldHallikainen/Harold_011.p
> > df
> > 
> > http://bh.hallikainen.org//wiki/uploads/HaroldHallikainen/201304161255
> > 53.pdf#page=11
> > 
> > The XR2211 is a fun chip. Before that, I used the NE565, but the 
> > XR2211 includes the data comparator, a carrier detect, etc. The XR2206 
> > is also a nice chip. It will generate a square wave, triangle wave, and
> sine waves.
> > It can do linear FM, AM (including double sideband suppressed 
> > carrier), and FSK. The FSK circuit has a logic input that switches 
> > between two timing resistors. But, during the transition, the 
> > frequency goes to zero for a very short time. I'd probably use the 
> > linear FM circuit and drive it with the data after running it through 
> > a low pass filter to limit bandwidth. It IS a nice chip, though. I 
> > used it as an upconverter (local oscillator and mixer) to upconvert 
> > subcarriers on FM broadcast stations to
> > 455 kHz where the signal then went through ceramic filters, IF 
> > amplifier, and a ceramic discriminator.
> > 
> > Fun stuff!
> > 
> > Harold
> > https://w6iwi.org
> > 
> > 
> > --
> > FCC Rules Updated Daily at http://www.hallikainen.com Not sent from an 
> > iPhone.
> > ______________________________________________________________
> > GreenKeys mailing list
> > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> > Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
> > 
> > >>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: 
> > >>> https://teletype.net/gksearch 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: 
> > >>> http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
> > >>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: 
> > >>> http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
> > >>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: 
> > >>> http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
> > 
> > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email 
> > list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to 
> > hwhall at compuserve.com
> 
> > ______________________________________________________________
> > GreenKeys mailing list
> > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> > Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
> > 
> > >>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: 
> > >>> https://teletype.net/gksearch 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: 
> > >>> http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
> > >>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: 
> > >>> http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
> > >>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: 
> > >>> http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
> > 
> > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email 
> > list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to 
> > epvgk at limpoc.com
> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
> 
> >>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: 
> >>> https://teletype.net/gksearch 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: 
> >>> http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
> >>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: 
> >>> http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
> >>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: 
> >>> http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
> 
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message
> delivered to steve.n4tty at gmail.com
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From duncanancy at earthlink.net  Sun Jan 24 14:29:58 2021
From: duncanancy at earthlink.net (Duncan Brown)
Date: Sun, 24 Jan 2021 14:29:58 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] ARRL RTTY Roundup Jan 2-3 2021 the old fashioned
	way.
In-Reply-To: <50cbf95907f187bca4ad0fd40f2584a6.squirrel@mai.hallikainen.org>
References: <F2FC7F05-11D8-46FB-9E12-D26F45573651.ref@att.net>
	<F2FC7F05-11D8-46FB-9E12-D26F45573651@att.net>
	<50cbf95907f187bca4ad0fd40f2584a6.squirrel@mai.hallikainen.org>
Message-ID: <0e8c10cf-cd59-5da4-1c8d-64cff906684c@earthlink.net>

You use a Teletype Corp. 99214 tape splicer:

Have fun,

Duncan
K2OEQ



On 24-Jan-21 14:18, Harold Hallikainen wrote:
>> It took me entirely too long to put this video together. Model 28 ASR in
>> the RTTY Roundup.
>>
>> https://youtu.be/O4iKeK9Py1Y <https://youtu.be/O4iKeK9Py1Y>
>>
>> Enjoy.
>>
>> Bill
>> KE3BK______________________________________________________________
> Nice! How did you splice the tape?
>
> Harold
>
>
>
>
>


From jdangus at att.net  Sun Jan 24 14:33:53 2021
From: jdangus at att.net (Jeffrey Angus)
Date: Sun, 24 Jan 2021 13:33:53 -0600
Subject: [GreenKeys] PC board work.
References: <bcf9f5ba-5e9e-1be7-3337-02b674b46660.ref@att.net>
Message-ID: <bcf9f5ba-5e9e-1be7-3337-02b674b46660@att.net>

This is what I do in my spare time now that I'm retired.
I use Express PCB software.
A few years back I designed a two speed motor controller
for my Lorenz Lo-15c.
Last year I did a signal converter for Sen Williams to go
from on/off keying to bi-polar for his Creed TTYs.

All I need is a schematic.
And you get the PC Board schematic redrawn for ExpressPCB
and the PC Board layouts.

And no, I don't charge for this.
Although, I'm not too proud to accept donations, if you're
feeling guilty about it.

-- 
"I am a river to my people."
Jeff-1.0
WA6FWI
www.foxsmercantile.com

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From w8roi at wowway.com  Sun Jan 24 14:46:14 2021
From: w8roi at wowway.com (Ralph Irish)
Date: Sun, 24 Jan 2021 14:46:14 -0500 (EST)
Subject: [GreenKeys] Tape loops
In-Reply-To: <1922116308.4228648.1611517541179.JavaMail.zimbra@wowway.com>
Message-ID: <870465994.4229128.1611517574905.JavaMail.zimbra@wowway.com>

Making tape loops can also be done with the TD, if one is careful and cautious 
to 'bump' the tape forward, one character at a time. Tape loops were made before 
the Tape Splicer was available. 

A few LTRS characters at each end of the tape, carefully overlapped and 
cautiously put into the TD, then 'bump' the TD forward, one character at a 
time until the chads seat themselves into the holes comfortably. Maybe 
a tiny amount of glue at the 'overlap point' to reduce the chances of the 'loose 
ends' getting snagged on something. 

We made lots of loop tapes when I was in the Navy and I never saw a splicer 
until I'd been into Teletype as a ham, for a decade or more. We had a 14KTR 
monitoring the Fleet Broadcast, along with two 28KSRs and we had few 
problems keeping up with incoming traffic. 

The tape loops got used in other aspects of communications operations on the 
USS Hancock. (aka NWLD and "Rampage") 

Later on we had a 28KTR available which made things a lot easier to keep up 
with incoming traffic. 

73, 

Ralph 


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From navy.radio at gmail.com  Sun Jan 24 14:45:12 2021
From: navy.radio at gmail.com (Nick England)
Date: Sun, 24 Jan 2021 14:45:12 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] ARRL RTTY Roundup Jan 2-3 2021 the old fashioned
	way.
In-Reply-To: <0e8c10cf-cd59-5da4-1c8d-64cff906684c@earthlink.net>
References: <F2FC7F05-11D8-46FB-9E12-D26F45573651.ref@att.net>
	<F2FC7F05-11D8-46FB-9E12-D26F45573651@att.net>
	<50cbf95907f187bca4ad0fd40f2584a6.squirrel@mai.hallikainen.org>
	<0e8c10cf-cd59-5da4-1c8d-64cff906684c@earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <CAB55hNdXOERuf40zUPLu-_44Ocb5e1t09Hap=fy7_GqyvC2Hhw@mail.gmail.com>

TP 99214 also known as Bell 1A and TT-54/FG
http://www.navy-radio.com/tty/misc/splicer-tt54-fg-1407-01.jpg
http://www.navy-radio.com/tty/misc/splicer-bsp-02.jpg
More at
http://www.navy-radio.com/rtty-misc.htm

Nick England K4NYW
www.navy-radio.com


On Sun, Jan 24, 2021 at 2:30 PM Duncan Brown <duncanancy at earthlink.net>
wrote:

> You use a Teletype Corp. 99214 tape splicer:
> Have fun,
> Duncan
> K2OEQ
>
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From wcwuttke at att.net  Sun Jan 24 14:51:34 2021
From: wcwuttke at att.net (William Wuttke)
Date: Sun, 24 Jan 2021 11:51:34 -0800
Subject: [GreenKeys] ARRL RTTY Roundup Jan 2-3 2021 the old fashioned
	way.
In-Reply-To: <CAB55hNdXOERuf40zUPLu-_44Ocb5e1t09Hap=fy7_GqyvC2Hhw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <F2FC7F05-11D8-46FB-9E12-D26F45573651.ref@att.net>
	<F2FC7F05-11D8-46FB-9E12-D26F45573651@att.net>
	<50cbf95907f187bca4ad0fd40f2584a6.squirrel@mai.hallikainen.org>
	<0e8c10cf-cd59-5da4-1c8d-64cff906684c@earthlink.net>
	<CAB55hNdXOERuf40zUPLu-_44Ocb5e1t09Hap=fy7_GqyvC2Hhw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <E55628D2-EDAA-459F-A8B6-8C0A32BB4263@att.net>

That?s exactly the one. These things occasionally show up on ebay. They work great.

BIll
KE3BK

> On Jan 24, 2021, at 11:45 AM, Nick England <navy.radio at gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> TP 99214 also known as Bell 1A and TT-54/FG
> http://www.navy-radio.com/tty/misc/splicer-tt54-fg-1407-01.jpg <http://www.navy-radio.com/tty/misc/splicer-tt54-fg-1407-01.jpg>
> http://www.navy-radio.com/tty/misc/splicer-bsp-02.jpg <http://www.navy-radio.com/tty/misc/splicer-bsp-02.jpg>
> More at
> http://www.navy-radio.com/rtty-misc.htm <http://www.navy-radio.com/rtty-misc.htm>
> 
> Nick England K4NYW
> www.navy-radio.com <http://www.navy-radio.com/>
> 
> 
> On Sun, Jan 24, 2021 at 2:30 PM Duncan Brown <duncanancy at earthlink.net <mailto:duncanancy at earthlink.net>> wrote:
> You use a Teletype Corp. 99214 tape splicer:
> Have fun,
> Duncan
> K2OEQ
> _____________________________________________________________

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From harold at w6iwi.org  Sun Jan 24 15:04:33 2021
From: harold at w6iwi.org (Harold Hallikainen)
Date: Sun, 24 Jan 2021 12:04:33 -0800
Subject: [GreenKeys] ARRL RTTY Roundup Jan 2-3 2021 the old fashioned
 way.
In-Reply-To: <E55628D2-EDAA-459F-A8B6-8C0A32BB4263@att.net>
References: <F2FC7F05-11D8-46FB-9E12-D26F45573651.ref@att.net>
	<F2FC7F05-11D8-46FB-9E12-D26F45573651@att.net>
	<50cbf95907f187bca4ad0fd40f2584a6.squirrel@mai.hallikainen.org>
	<0e8c10cf-cd59-5da4-1c8d-64cff906684c@earthlink.net>
	<CAB55hNdXOERuf40zUPLu-_44Ocb5e1t09Hap=fy7_GqyvC2Hhw@mail.gmail.com>
	<E55628D2-EDAA-459F-A8B6-8C0A32BB4263@att.net>
Message-ID: <ff8d510af8e20041b176e05c8a59d5aa.squirrel@mai.hallikainen.org>

The chadless tape splicer is VERY CLEVER!


-- 
http://w6iwi.org

From steve.n4tty at gmail.com  Sun Jan 24 15:04:39 2021
From: steve.n4tty at gmail.com (Steve Garrison)
Date: Sun, 24 Jan 2021 15:04:39 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] XR2211 demodulator circuit boards?
In-Reply-To: <20210124192811.GA23587@limpoc.com>
References: <2072683957.4657899.1611466303451.ref@mail.yahoo.com>
	<2072683957.4657899.1611466303451@mail.yahoo.com>
	<88ade8cd0555b0e7615b2676c321242c.squirrel@mai.hallikainen.org>
	<3820057.4675674.1611477970434@mail.yahoo.com>
	<20210124085815.GA17885@limpoc.com>
	<104101d6f23c$20fbf0f0$62f3d2d0$@gmail.com>
	<20210124192811.GA23587@limpoc.com>
Message-ID: <114d01d6f28c$267fa0d0$737ee270$@gmail.com>

Thanks Eric!

Steve G./N4TTY

-----Original Message-----
From: epvgk at limpoc.com <epvgk at limpoc.com> 
Sent: Sunday, January 24, 2021 2:28 PM
To: N4TTY at ARRL.NET
Cc: epvgk at limpoc.com; hwhall at compuserve.com; greenkeys at mailman.qth.net
Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] XR2211 demodulator circuit boards?

On Sun, Jan 24, 2021 at 05:31:51AM -0500, Steve Garrison wrote:
> Eric,
> 
> If you wouldn't mind sending the gerber files or any other files I'd 
> appreciate it.  I've been having several other boards that I have 
> designed for robot project I'm involved with made, so I could add the 
> demod board to the list.  Is the 2211 still readily available?
> 
> Steve G./N4TTY
> 

Here are the gerbers and associated stuff for the 2211-based demod that was
sold on the list a few years back. I believe the 2211 is still available at
least in smallish quantities. 

This board was designed to be easy to hand assemble and it's single-layer
with no tight tolerances so you can even DIY etch it if you're bored.
Attaching the digikey parts list too. 

eric



> -----Original Message-----
> From: greenkeys-bounces at mailman.qth.net 
> <greenkeys-bounces at mailman.qth.net>
> On Behalf Of epvgk at limpoc.com
> Sent: Sunday, January 24, 2021 3:58 AM
> To: hwhall at compuserve.com
> Cc: greenkeys at mailman.qth.net
> Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] XR2211 demodulator circuit boards?
> 
> On Sun, Jan 24, 2021 at 08:46:10AM +0000, hwhall at compuserve.com wrote:
> > I'd encountered some of those pages when I was googling but still no 
> > PCB
> artwork. If someone has already laid them out, I could skip reinventing
it.
> > 
> > WayneWB4OGM
> 
> Here's the one I did that got manufactured that people on the list 
> have a bunch of.
> 
> https://www.heepy.net/index.php/RTTY_demodulator_using_NJM2211
> 
> I can dig up gerbers or whatever if you want!
> 
> eric
> 
> > 
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Harold Hallikainen <harold at w6iwi.org>
> > To: greenkeys at mailman.qth.net
> > Sent: Sat, Jan 23, 2021 11:19 pm
> > Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] XR2211 demodulator circuit boards?
> > 
> > 
> > > Are there any printed circuit boards for building an XR2211 based 
> > > RTTY demodulator? ??Google shows me all kinds of articles from 
> > > complex to over-simplified but doesn't lead me to any PCB artwork 
> > > or
> vendors.
> > > I'm thinking I might build a demod to run a Model 15 from a laptop 
> > > running MMTTY. The program only outputs tones (no on-off output to 
> > > key a loop
> > > directly) so a PLL demod should be fine since noise won't be an 
> > > issue. Or should I look at something even smaller/simpler?
> > > Thanks!WayneWB4OGM________________________________________________
> > > __
> > > ____________
> > 
> > There's an evaluation board at
> > https://media.digikey.com/pdf/Data%20Sheets/MaxLinear%20PDFs/XR-2206
> > -1 1-12_Man.pdf . I'd be tempted to wire wrap it, though.
> > 
> > Several products I did using the XR2211 are at
> > 
> > http://bh.hallikainen.org//wiki/uploads/HaroldHallikainen/2013041612
> > 53
> > 39_Part5.pdf
> > 
> > http://bh.hallikainen.org//wiki/uploads/HaroldHallikainen/Harold_018
> > .p
> > df
> > 
> > http://bh.hallikainen.org//wiki/uploads/HaroldHallikainen/2013041612
> > 53
> > 39_Part1.pdf
> > 
> > http://bh.hallikainen.org//wiki/uploads/HaroldHallikainen/Harold_011
> > .p
> > df
> > 
> > http://bh.hallikainen.org//wiki/uploads/HaroldHallikainen/2013041612
> > 55
> > 53.pdf#page=11
> > 
> > The XR2211 is a fun chip. Before that, I used the NE565, but the
> > XR2211 includes the data comparator, a carrier detect, etc. The 
> > XR2206 is also a nice chip. It will generate a square wave, triangle 
> > wave, and
> sine waves.
> > It can do linear FM, AM (including double sideband suppressed 
> > carrier), and FSK. The FSK circuit has a logic input that switches 
> > between two timing resistors. But, during the transition, the 
> > frequency goes to zero for a very short time. I'd probably use the 
> > linear FM circuit and drive it with the data after running it 
> > through a low pass filter to limit bandwidth. It IS a nice chip, 
> > though. I used it as an upconverter (local oscillator and mixer) to 
> > upconvert subcarriers on FM broadcast stations to
> > 455 kHz where the signal then went through ceramic filters, IF 
> > amplifier, and a ceramic discriminator.
> > 
> > Fun stuff!
> > 
> > Harold
> > https://w6iwi.org
> > 
> > 
> > --
> > FCC Rules Updated Daily at http://www.hallikainen.com Not sent from 
> > an iPhone.
> > ______________________________________________________________
> > GreenKeys mailing list
> > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> > Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
> > 
> > >>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: 
> > >>> https://teletype.net/gksearch 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: 
> > >>> http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
> > >>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: 
> > >>> http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
> > >>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: 
> > >>> http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
> > 
> > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this 
> > email
> > list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to 
> > hwhall at compuserve.com
> 
> > ______________________________________________________________
> > GreenKeys mailing list
> > Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> > Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> > Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
> > 
> > >>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: 
> > >>> https://teletype.net/gksearch 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: 
> > >>> http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
> > >>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: 
> > >>> http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
> > >>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: 
> > >>> http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
> > 
> > This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this 
> > email
> > list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to 
> > epvgk at limpoc.com
> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
> 
> >>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: 
> >>> https://teletype.net/gksearch 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: 
> >>> http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
> >>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: 
> >>> http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
> >>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: 
> >>> http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
> 
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email 
> list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to 
> steve.n4tty at gmail.com


From jim.w2jc at gmail.com  Sun Jan 24 15:07:48 2021
From: jim.w2jc at gmail.com (Jim Cooper)
Date: Sun, 24 Jan 2021 15:07:48 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] ARRL RTTY Roundup Jan 2-3 2021 the old fashioned
	way.
In-Reply-To: <0e8c10cf-cd59-5da4-1c8d-64cff906684c@earthlink.net>
References: <F2FC7F05-11D8-46FB-9E12-D26F45573651.ref@att.net>,
	<50cbf95907f187bca4ad0fd40f2584a6.squirrel@mai.hallikainen.org>,
	<0e8c10cf-cd59-5da4-1c8d-64cff906684c@earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <600DD394.18457.128D8BCC@jim.w2jc.gmail.com>

On 24 Jan 2021 at 14:29, Duncan Brown wrote:

> You use a Teletype Corp. 99214 tape splicer:

with chadless tape, the splicer pushes the 
chads from one layer into the holes of the 
chads in the bottom layer and they lock together. 

You punch a length of LTRS at the ends to 
be spliced, so that all holes are punched. 

w2jc 



From navy.radio at gmail.com  Sun Jan 24 15:53:17 2021
From: navy.radio at gmail.com (Nick England)
Date: Sun, 24 Jan 2021 15:53:17 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] FWIW Soviet ST-35 machine
Message-ID: <CAB55hNcJZTHecnqggtZwjeJ55ZFa__ko-1BJ9e5cZMjMsxtU0Q@mail.gmail.com>

Nice photos of a machine you don't see everyday (around here anyways)
https://www.ebay.com/itm/224326290528

As usual, not mine, no connection, etc.
Nick England K4NYW
www.navy-radio.com
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From df3oe.henning at googlemail.com  Sun Jan 24 16:04:18 2021
From: df3oe.henning at googlemail.com (Henning Treumann)
Date: Sun, 24 Jan 2021 22:04:18 +0100
Subject: [GreenKeys] FWIW Soviet ST-35 machine
In-Reply-To: <CAB55hNcJZTHecnqggtZwjeJ55ZFa__ko-1BJ9e5cZMjMsxtU0Q@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAB55hNcJZTHecnqggtZwjeJ55ZFa__ko-1BJ9e5cZMjMsxtU0Q@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAGcpzth76c8-RPtB_k1hzEDSGxvNNs3956TPK1gg6jGQig+GuQ@mail.gmail.com>

This is a clone of a clone.

It is a clone of the Lorenz T36Lo WW2 machine.
The Lorenz T36Lo is a licensed copy of the model 14 strip printer version.

It is assumed that the Russians took the manufacturing facilities from
Berlin after WW2 and brought them to Russia for production of teleprinters

Henning DF3OE
www.teleprinter.net
www.i-telex.net


Nick England <navy.radio at gmail.com> schrieb am So., 24. Jan. 2021, 21:54:

> Nice photos of a machine you don't see everyday (around here anyways)
> https://www.ebay.com/itm/224326290528
>
> As usual, not mine, no connection, etc.
> Nick England K4NYW
> www.navy-radio.com
> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
>
> >>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool:
> https://teletype.net/gksearch
> >>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive:
> http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
> >>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive:
> http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
> >>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool:
> http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to df3oe.henning at googlemail.com
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From vlaarom at gmail.com  Sun Jan 24 16:37:54 2021
From: vlaarom at gmail.com (Vladimir Romanov)
Date: Mon, 25 Jan 2021 00:37:54 +0300
Subject: [GreenKeys] FWIW Soviet ST-35 machine
In-Reply-To: <CAGcpzth76c8-RPtB_k1hzEDSGxvNNs3956TPK1gg6jGQig+GuQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAB55hNcJZTHecnqggtZwjeJ55ZFa__ko-1BJ9e5cZMjMsxtU0Q@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAGcpzth76c8-RPtB_k1hzEDSGxvNNs3956TPK1gg6jGQig+GuQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <17C73C31-0052-418E-BCB4-99567AFE288B@gmail.com>

This is not a ??-35 machine. It is more ?modern? machine from 1970s called ???-?67?( x - is different versions with different additional capabilities, for example ???-?67A). It is highly available here in Russia for about 100$ in shipping wooden crate.

Here is photos of mine different ???-?67? machines.



> This is a clone of a clone.
> 
> It is a clone of the Lorenz T36Lo WW2 machine. 
> The Lorenz T36Lo is a licensed copy of the model 14 strip printer version. 
> 
> It is assumed that the Russians took the manufacturing facilities from Berlin after WW2 and brought them to Russia for production of teleprinters 

Based on book about Russian telegraph machines from 1939:
??-35 is an early machine from 1935 derived from Morkrum-Kleinschmidt Corp model ?14. It is using ITA1 code(???-?67? is using ITA2 code). I have never seen it in person. Very rare here in Russia.



Thank you
Vladimir

> On 25 Jan 2021, at 00:04, Henning Treumann via GreenKeys <greenkeys at mailman.qth.net> wrote:
> 
> This is a clone of a clone.
> 
> It is a clone of the Lorenz T36Lo WW2 machine. 
> The Lorenz T36Lo is a licensed copy of the model 14 strip printer version. 
> 
> It is assumed that the Russians took the manufacturing facilities from Berlin after WW2 and brought them to Russia for production of teleprinters 
> 
> Henning DF3OE 
> www.teleprinter.net <http://www.teleprinter.net/>
> www.i-telex.net <http://www.i-telex.net/> 
> 
> 
> Nick England <navy.radio at gmail.com <mailto:navy.radio at gmail.com>> schrieb am So., 24. Jan. 2021, 21:54:
> Nice photos of a machine you don't see everyday (around here anyways)
> https://www.ebay.com/itm/224326290528 <https://www.ebay.com/itm/224326290528>
> 
> As usual, not mine, no connection, etc.
> Nick England K4NYW
> www.navy-radio.com <http://www.navy-radio.com/>
> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys <http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys>
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm <http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm>
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net <mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net>
> 
> >>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch <https://teletype.net/gksearch>
> >>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/ <http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/>
> >>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html <http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html>
> >>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html <http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html>
> 
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net <http://www.qsl.net/>
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html <http://www.qsl.net/donate.html>
> Message delivered to df3oe.henning at googlemail.com <mailto:df3oe.henning at googlemail.com>______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys <http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys>
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm <http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm>
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net <mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net>
> 
>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch <https://teletype.net/gksearch>
>>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/ <http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/>
>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html <http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html>
>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html <http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html>
> 
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net <http://www.qsl.net/>
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html <http://www.qsl.net/donate.html>
> Message delivered to vlaarom at gmail.com <mailto:vlaarom at gmail.com>
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From dennis.hanley at gmail.com  Sun Jan 24 16:46:33 2021
From: dennis.hanley at gmail.com (Dennis Hanley)
Date: Sun, 24 Jan 2021 13:46:33 -0800
Subject: [GreenKeys] New To Group
In-Reply-To: <CAPyDOHTCSHRY++1PX9F66WzN25wtf9hy1qfk3WXnbfo8Kz8cpg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAPyDOHTCSHRY++1PX9F66WzN25wtf9hy1qfk3WXnbfo8Kz8cpg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAPyDOHQUzjeM_w74+CN0Mm4RxS5FqJpaepJZFSCocjcNVk2Rcg@mail.gmail.com>

Thank you all to everyone for welcoming me, and for the pointers!

I've been reading the messages, and will try to keep the silly questions to
a minimum :-)

Dennis



On Sat, Jan 23, 2021 at 1:38 PM Dennis Hanley <dennis.hanley at gmail.com>
wrote:

> Good day everyone,
>
> I have recently discovered this forum, and have finally got up the nerve
> to post something.
>
> My name is Dennis, KB6C.  I discovered ITTY a while back, and was wanting
> to get my old Model 15, that's been in storage for over 40 years, up and
> running on that service.  (I also have a 28ASR that's still in storage).  I
> am looking forward to re-living the sounds and smells of these old beasts!
>
> In the process of poking around on line, I stumbled across a simple
> demodulator that was apparently made by Eric Volpe about 2010.  Can anyone
> tell me if that device might still be available?  Or maybe a similar device
> with similar capabilities?
>
> Thank you in advance for any advice you may have.
>
> 73,
>
> Dennis
>
>
>
>
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From w8roi at wowway.com  Sun Jan 24 16:56:06 2021
From: w8roi at wowway.com (Ralph Irish)
Date: Sun, 24 Jan 2021 16:56:06 -0500 (EST)
Subject: [GreenKeys] New To Group
In-Reply-To: <CAPyDOHQUzjeM_w74+CN0Mm4RxS5FqJpaepJZFSCocjcNVk2Rcg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAPyDOHTCSHRY++1PX9F66WzN25wtf9hy1qfk3WXnbfo8Kz8cpg@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAPyDOHQUzjeM_w74+CN0Mm4RxS5FqJpaepJZFSCocjcNVk2Rcg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <1111104289.4303182.1611525366141.JavaMail.zimbra@wowway.com>

Dennis 

The only time questions are 'silly' is when you ask them repeatedly. Same goes 
fof 'dumb questions'. Until you see a clear explanation, it is just 'unexplored 
territory'. Ask away! That's what we are here for. 

Welcome aboard! 

73, 

Ralph - W8ROI 

- - - - - - - - 

From: "Dennis Hanley" <dennis.hanley at gmail.com> 
To: greenkeys at mailman.qth.net 
Sent: Sunday, January 24, 2021 4:46:33 PM 
Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] New To Group 

Thank you all to everyone for welcoming me, and for the pointers! 

I've been reading the messages, and will try to keep the silly questions to a minimum :-) 

Dennis 



On Sat, Jan 23, 2021 at 1:38 PM Dennis Hanley < dennis.hanley at gmail.com > wrote: 



Good day everyone, 

I have recently discovered this forum, and have finally got up the nerve to post something. 

My name is Dennis, KB6C. I discovered ITTY a while back, and was wanting to get my old Model 15, that's been in storage for over 40 years, up and running on that service. (I also have a 28ASR that's still in storage). I am looking forward to re-living the sounds and smells of these old beasts! 

In the process of poking around on line, I stumbled across a simple demodulator that was apparently made by Eric Volpe about 2010. Can anyone tell me if that device might still be available? Or maybe a similar device with similar capabilities? 

Thank you in advance for any advice you may have. 

73, 

Dennis 







______________________________________________________________ 
GreenKeys mailing list 
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys 
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm 
Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net 

>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch 
>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/ 
>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html 
>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html 

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From deramp5113 at yahoo.com  Sun Jan 24 18:20:37 2021
From: deramp5113 at yahoo.com (Mike Douglas)
Date: Sun, 24 Jan 2021 17:20:37 -0600
Subject: [GreenKeys] New To Group
In-Reply-To: <CAPyDOHQUzjeM_w74+CN0Mm4RxS5FqJpaepJZFSCocjcNVk2Rcg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAPyDOHQUzjeM_w74+CN0Mm4RxS5FqJpaepJZFSCocjcNVk2Rcg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <8960233A-A962-4209-ABEF-526E79F68936@yahoo.com>

Hi Dennis,

I'm presently finishing up a low power, regenerative loop driver that provides a 60ma interface to a Model 15 with both RS-232 and ITTY audio input connections. The RS-232 port provides bi-directional ASCII/Baudot conversion as well as baud rate conversion so the computer can use a common baud rate like 9600. The audio input demodulates clean FSK as provided by ITTY and sends it out the loop.

The loop driver is unique in that it does not require a high voltage supply, nor does the board include a switching supply to generate a high voltage. Instead, a regenerative approach is used in which the snubber circuit for the selector magnet coil captures the energy from the mark to space transition onto a high-voltage capacitor, and then dumps that energy back into the selector magnet during a space to mark transition. The dump from the high voltage built up across the snubber capacitor rapidly builds the inductor current which is then topped off and held by the low voltage supply.

I currently have the first version of the PCB in my hands and hope to find time very soon to stuff the board and begin testing. If this sounds like something that might be useful to you, stay in touch with me by email.

Mike

> On Jan 24, 2021, at 3:47 PM, Dennis Hanley <dennis.hanley at gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> ?
> Thank you all to everyone for welcoming me, and for the pointers!
> 
> I've been reading the messages, and will try to keep the silly questions to a minimum :-)
> 
> Dennis
> 
> 
> 
>> On Sat, Jan 23, 2021 at 1:38 PM Dennis Hanley <dennis.hanley at gmail.com> wrote:
>> Good day everyone,
>> 
>> I have recently discovered this forum, and have finally got up the nerve to post something.
>> 
>> My name is Dennis, KB6C.  I discovered ITTY a while back, and was wanting to get my old Model 15, that's been in storage for over 40 years, up and running on that service.  (I also have a 28ASR that's still in storage).  I am looking forward to re-living the sounds and smells of these old beasts!
>> 
>> In the process of poking around on line, I stumbled across a simple demodulator that was apparently made by Eric Volpe about 2010.  Can anyone tell me if that device might still be available?  Or maybe a similar device with similar capabilities?
>> 
>> Thank you in advance for any advice you may have.
>> 
>> 73,
>> 
>> Dennis
>> 
>> 
>> 
> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
> 
>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
> 
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to deramp5113 at yahoo.com
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From donc at martineer.net  Sun Jan 24 12:56:26 2021
From: donc at martineer.net (Don Cunningam)
Date: Sun, 24 Jan 2021 11:56:26 -0600
Subject: [GreenKeys] XR2211 demodulator circuit boards?
In-Reply-To: <8818601b-8f62-e04e-3bb4-82745078c00d@tapr.org>
References: <2072683957.4657899.1611466303451.ref@mail.yahoo.com>
	<2072683957.4657899.1611466303451@mail.yahoo.com>
	<88ade8cd0555b0e7615b2676c321242c.squirrel@mai.hallikainen.org>
	<3820057.4675674.1611477970434@mail.yahoo.com>
	<20210124085815.GA17885@limpoc.com>
	<104101d6f23c$20fbf0f0$62f3d2d0$@gmail.com>
	<af2896b1-1570-e5ca-c978-30a6145bed5a@martineer.net>
	<10c301d6f274$f8549830$e8fdc890$@gmail.com>
	<8818601b-8f62-e04e-3bb4-82745078c00d@tapr.org>
Message-ID: <bb0c3d0d-9cb3-79a3-daa3-ad28fdcf3a52@martineer.net>

John,

I don't have the computer skills and these are NOT professionally made 
boards, likely stick on pads and some hand drawing, but they work quite 
well.

I would offer the boards to whoever has the capability, but keep in mind 
what I said about the boards above, and the "building information/parts 
list" is on 1970's copies, so not professionally done either.??? The 
only two I ever used that were provided by hams, and not commercial that 
might have been a bit better were the ST-6 and the DT-600 Navy MARS 
project that was sold by another ham "business" called DataPro, long 
gone.? It was basically an ST-6 on one board and you had to provide your 
own power supply. NO loop voltages on either, so those caveats all 
apply.? The keying transistor in the ST-5AS was capable of handling loop 
voltage/current, and if the DT-600 wasn't a quick sub of that transistor 
would make it work.? My mind remembers MJE-340, but that mind is 73 
also.? If the group is not interested in this type of TU and prefers the 
XR2211, I'll just keep them for nostalgia like my other RTTY stuff, HI.

Don, WB5HAK

On 1/24/2021 11:33 AM, John, W9DDD wrote:
> Not volunteering, but there are CAD programs that can take an image 
> (e.g.jpeg), import it and create gerbers.? Not automatically, you need 
> to place pads and traces over the imported image that is a layer 
> behind the active layer.
>
>
>
> John, W9DDD
>
> On 1/24/2021 11:18 AM, Steve Garrison wrote:
>> Well, right now I wouldn't be able to tackle that.? That is why I 
>> sent the note to Eric about the Gerber files.? Those I might be able 
>> to squeeze in with a shoehorn.
>>
>> Steve G./N4TTY0
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: greenkeys-bounces at mailman.qth.net 
>> <greenkeys-bounces at mailman.qth.net> On Behalf Of Don Cunningam
>> Sent: Sunday, January 24, 2021 9:53 AM
>> To: greenkeys at mailman.qth.net
>> Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] XR2211 demodulator circuit boards?
>>
>> Steve,
>>
>> I have a set of boards (TU and power supply) that was sold by a 
>> company called PEMCO, if my old memory is correct for the ST-5A which 
>> was Irv Hoff's ST-5 with autostart added.? I would donate them if you 
>> think you have somewhere that could duplicate them so others could 
>> build that.? I also have the old Hoff articles from an early QST that 
>> talks about tuning toroid coils and if followed on this TU, it is 
>> nearly as good as the HAL ST-6 was!!!? If that cant be done, Eric you 
>> can have these boards and I'll dig up some toroids to build it.? I 
>> don't have a TON of the toroids, but I have some left from MANY years 
>> of building TU's for Navy MARS folks back in the 70's,? I found this 
>> set of Pemco boards and info for sale and bought it a few years back 
>> to share with someone.? If you can do this, Steve, let me know and 
>> I'll ship the boards to you.
>>
>> 73,
>>
>> Don, WB5HAK
>>
>> On 1/24/2021 4:31 AM, Steve Garrison wrote:
>>> Eric,
>>>
>>> If you wouldn't mind sending the gerber files or any other files I'd
>>> appreciate it.? I've been having several other boards that I have
>>> designed for robot project I'm involved with made, so I could add the
>>> demod board to the list.? Is the 2211 still readily available?
>>>
>>> Steve G./N4TTY
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: greenkeys-bounces at mailman.qth.net
>>> <greenkeys-bounces at mailman.qth.net>
>>> On Behalf Of epvgk at limpoc.com
>>> Sent: Sunday, January 24, 2021 3:58 AM
>>> To: hwhall at compuserve.com
>>> Cc: greenkeys at mailman.qth.net
>>> Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] XR2211 demodulator circuit boards?
>>>
>>> On Sun, Jan 24, 2021 at 08:46:10AM +0000, hwhall at compuserve.com wrote:
>>>> I'd encountered some of those pages when I was googling but still no
>>>> PCB
>>> artwork. If someone has already laid them out, I could skip 
>>> reinventing it.
>>>> WayneWB4OGM
>>> Here's the one I did that got manufactured that people on the list
>>> have a bunch of.
>>>
>>> https://www.heepy.net/index.php/RTTY_demodulator_using_NJM2211
>>>
>>> I can dig up gerbers or whatever if you want!
>>>
>>> eric
>>>
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: Harold Hallikainen <harold at w6iwi.org>
>>>> To: greenkeys at mailman.qth.net
>>>> Sent: Sat, Jan 23, 2021 11:19 pm
>>>> Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] XR2211 demodulator circuit boards?
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> Are there any printed circuit boards for building an XR2211 based
>>>>> RTTY demodulator? ? Google shows me all kinds of articles from
>>>>> complex to over-simplified but doesn't lead me to any PCB artwork or
>>> vendors.
>>>>> I'm thinking I might build a demod to run a Model 15 from a laptop
>>>>> running MMTTY. The program only outputs tones (no on-off output to
>>>>> key a loop
>>>>> directly) so a PLL demod should be fine since noise won't be an
>>>>> issue. Or should I look at something even smaller/simpler?
>>>>> Thanks!WayneWB4OGM__________________________________________________
>>>>> ____________
>>>> There's an evaluation board at
>>>> https://media.digikey.com/pdf/Data%20Sheets/MaxLinear%20PDFs/XR-2206-
>>>> 1 1-12_Man.pdf . I'd be tempted to wire wrap it, though.
>>>>
>>>> Several products I did using the XR2211 are at
>>>>
>>>> http://bh.hallikainen.org//wiki/uploads/HaroldHallikainen/20130416125
>>>> 3
>>>> 39_Part5.pdf
>>>>
>>>> http://bh.hallikainen.org//wiki/uploads/HaroldHallikainen/Harold_018.
>>>> p
>>>> df
>>>>
>>>> http://bh.hallikainen.org//wiki/uploads/HaroldHallikainen/20130416125
>>>> 3
>>>> 39_Part1.pdf
>>>>
>>>> http://bh.hallikainen.org//wiki/uploads/HaroldHallikainen/Harold_011.
>>>> p
>>>> df
>>>>
>>>> http://bh.hallikainen.org//wiki/uploads/HaroldHallikainen/20130416125
>>>> 5
>>>> 53.pdf#page=11
>>>>
>>>> The XR2211 is a fun chip. Before that, I used the NE565, but the
>>>> XR2211 includes the data comparator, a carrier detect, etc. The
>>>> XR2206 is also a nice chip. It will generate a square wave, triangle
>>>> wave, and
>>> sine waves.
>>>> It can do linear FM, AM (including double sideband suppressed
>>>> carrier), and FSK. The FSK circuit has a logic input that switches
>>>> between two timing resistors. But, during the transition, the
>>>> frequency goes to zero for a very short time. I'd probably use the
>>>> linear FM circuit and drive it with the data after running it through
>>>> a low pass filter to limit bandwidth. It IS a nice chip, though. I
>>>> used it as an upconverter (local oscillator and mixer) to upconvert
>>>> subcarriers on FM broadcast stations to
>>>> 455 kHz where the signal then went through ceramic filters, IF
>>>> amplifier, and a ceramic discriminator.
>>>>
>>>> Fun stuff!
>>>>
>>>> Harold
>>>> https://w6iwi.org
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> -- 
>>>> FCC Rules Updated Daily at http://www.hallikainen.com Not sent from
>>>> an iPhone.
>>>> ______________________________________________________________
>>>> GreenKeys mailing list
>>>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
>>>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>>>> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
>>>>
>>>>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool:
>>>>>>> https://teletype.net/gksearch 2002-to-present greenkeys archive:
>>>>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive:
>>>>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool:
>>>>>>> http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
>>>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this
>>>> email
>>>> list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to
>>>> hwhall at compuserve.com
>>>> ______________________________________________________________
>>>> GreenKeys mailing list
>>>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
>>>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>>>> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
>>>>
>>>>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool:
>>>>>>> https://teletype.net/gksearch 2002-to-present greenkeys archive:
>>>>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive:
>>>>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool:
>>>>>>> http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
>>>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this
>>>> email
>>>> list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to
>>>> epvgk at limpoc.com
>>> ______________________________________________________________
>>> GreenKeys mailing list
>>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
>>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>>> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
>>>
>>>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool:
>>>>>> https://teletype.net/gksearch 2002-to-present greenkeys archive:
>>>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive:
>>>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool:
>>>>>> http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
>>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email
>>> list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to
>>> steve.n4tty at gmail.com
>>>
>>> ______________________________________________________________
>>> GreenKeys mailing list
>>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
>>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>>> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
>>>
>>>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool:
>>>>>> https://teletype.net/gksearch 2002-to-present greenkeys archive:
>>>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive:
>>>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool:
>>>>>> http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
>>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net Please help support this email
>>> list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html Message delivered to
>>> wb5hak at arrl.net
>>
>> -- 
>> This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
>> https://www.avast.com/antivirus
>>
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> GreenKeys mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
>>
>>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool:
>>>>> https://teletype.net/gksearch 2002-to-present greenkeys archive:
>>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive:
>>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool:
>>>>> http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
>>
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html 
>> Message delivered to steve.n4tty at gmail.com
>>
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> GreenKeys mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
>>
>>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: 
>>>>> https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: 
>>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: 
>>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: 
>>>>> http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
>>
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>> Message delivered to w9ddd at tapr.org
>>
> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
>
>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: 
>>>> https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: 
>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: 
>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: 
>>>> http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to wb5hak at arrl.net

From gil at baudot.net  Sun Jan 24 20:09:33 2021
From: gil at baudot.net (Gil Smith)
Date: Sun, 24 Jan 2021 18:09:33 -0700
Subject: [GreenKeys] PC board work.
Message-ID: <20210124180933.617ae442d0f8f631a9b3312d6b10cde7.431affa68d.wbe@email27.godaddy.com>

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From donc at martineer.net  Sun Jan 24 20:32:19 2021
From: donc at martineer.net (Don Cunningam)
Date: Sun, 24 Jan 2021 19:32:19 -0600
Subject: [GreenKeys] PC Boards for TU's
Message-ID: <b245b330-9458-f4db-b6ae-ab40b767b47d@martineer.net>

Guys,

Two gentlemen on the list have offered to take my PC board schematics 
and building information and producing board layouts so they can be 
produced.? I don't want to have them waste their time if there isn't any 
interest in doing this.? I have gotten NO emails asking about this and I 
by mistake "hijacked" a thread about XR2211 boards and should have 
re-titled it.

I can easily provide the schematic and building information so that one 
of these guys can make the layouts and I would have some made, but I 
need to know if anyone is even interested.? I put a new computer online 
yesterday and didn't realize that it would make a difference on sites 
and lists, but I have spent a good part of the day fixing site problems 
and subscriptions to things.? I'm obviously not computer literate enough 
to do what needs doing, but I would do the legwork necessary to make 
them available to builders.

Let me know as I can easily provide information for the ST-5AS I 
mentioned, the DT-600 (ST-6 on one board), and maybe others.? I could 
have some other types that were in magazines, but these two are the best 
non-commercial ones I have used.? In both, there is a requirement for 
the old Bell System 88mh toroid coils (non-potted) so the mark and space 
filters can be tuned properly.? Otherwise parts are common.? I do have a 
stash of toroids, likely several pairs for each one built, but we may 
need to find more, or find some of the old variable coils like we used 
to use in the very early SSTV converters and units of that era too.

Anyway, if any interest please email me with your choice of units. I'll 
dig out a couple of pictures of either built units I still have or will 
search to see if there is an easy site for you to see what I'm talking 
about.? Both of these units were in Ham Radio magazine, as Irv Hoff did 
all the early designs, and maybe I can locate those articles and post links.
Thanks,
Don, WB5HAK

-- 
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
https://www.avast.com/antivirus


From gblock at sbcglobal.net  Sun Jan 24 20:46:10 2021
From: gblock at sbcglobal.net (Gerry Block)
Date: Mon, 25 Jan 2021 01:46:10 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [GreenKeys] PC board work.
In-Reply-To: <20210124180933.617ae442d0f8f631a9b3312d6b10cde7.431affa68d.wbe@email27.godaddy.com>
References: <20210124180933.617ae442d0f8f631a9b3312d6b10cde7.431affa68d.wbe@email27.godaddy.com>
Message-ID: <1352508929.2992438.1611539170226@mail.yahoo.com>

 Gil,
? What layout program do you use?
GerryAD6MC

    On Sunday, January 24, 2021, 5:10:00 PM PST, Gil Smith <gil at baudot.net> wrote:  
 
 Hey Jeff:
Where do you get your boards?? For the last few years I have been using pcbway in China:https://www.pcbway.com/
They have been awesome and I have done dozens of 2- and 4-layer boards there.? About a week turn plus a a few days shipping (get DHL, not fedex).? Instant quote on the home page.? Best prices I have found (though I sometimes get hit with a 25% tariff fee).? Variety of soldermask colors avail (some cost extra).? I like red, blue, and black -- the yellow is gross.? Arrays are easy.? Routing and V-groove not too costly.
They do full-turn assembly though I have not used that service.
thx, gil

gil smith, AF7EZ
greenkeys moderator
gil at baudot.net


-------- Original Message --------
Subject: [GreenKeys] PC board work.
From: Jeffrey Angus <jdangus at att.net>
Date: Sun, January 24, 2021 12:33 pm
To: greenkeys <greenkeys at mailman.qth.net>

This is what I do in my spare time now that I'm retired.
I use Express PCB software.
A few years back I designed a two speed motor controller
for my Lorenz Lo-15c.
Last year I did a signal converter for Sen Williams to go
from on/off keying to bi-polar for his Creed TTYs.

All I need is a schematic.
And you get the PC Board schematic redrawn for ExpressPCB
and the PC Board layouts.

And no, I don't charge for this.
Although, I'm not too proud to accept donations, if you're
feeling guilty about it.

-- 
"I am a river to my people."
Jeff-1.0
WA6FWI
www.foxsmercantile.com

______________________________________________________________
GreenKeys mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net

>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to gil at baudot.net
______________________________________________________________
GreenKeys mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net

>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to gblock at sbcglobal.net  
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From jdangus at att.net  Sun Jan 24 20:54:10 2021
From: jdangus at att.net (Jeffrey Angus)
Date: Sun, 24 Jan 2021 19:54:10 -0600
Subject: [GreenKeys] PC Boards for TU's
In-Reply-To: <b245b330-9458-f4db-b6ae-ab40b767b47d@martineer.net>
References: <b245b330-9458-f4db-b6ae-ab40b767b47d@martineer.net>
Message-ID: <fc433aa8-22b0-26aa-ef12-77a55a50dd62@att.net>

On 1/24/21 7:32 PM, Don Cunningam wrote:
> Two gentlemen on the list have offered to take my PC board
> schematics and building information and producing board
> layouts so they can be produced.
It's not wasting my time.
Besides, it keeps me off the porn sites. ;-)


-- 
"I am a river to my people."
Jeff-1.0
WA6FWI
www.foxsmercantile.com


From highpwr at bellsouth.net  Sun Jan 24 21:04:56 2021
From: highpwr at bellsouth.net (highpwr at bellsouth.net)
Date: Sun, 24 Jan 2021 21:04:56 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] MICRODEC MD200
References: <00c101d6f2be$7b43fe90$71cbfbb0$.ref@bellsouth.net>
Message-ID: <00c101d6f2be$7b43fe90$71cbfbb0$@bellsouth.net>

Anybody have any info on the Somerset Electronics MICRODEC MD200 decoder?

I picked one up and its companion VP50 Video / Printer interface module out
of a guys $1.00 box back in 2019.

I'm looking for any info , and in particular manuals if some one has them.

Haven't been able to find too much of anything on these units, ant and all
assistance greatly appreciated.

Steve
KM4V


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From w2hx at w2hx.com  Sun Jan 24 21:17:46 2021
From: w2hx at w2hx.com (W2HX)
Date: Mon, 25 Jan 2021 02:17:46 +0000
Subject: [GreenKeys] ARRL RTTY Roundup Jan 2-3 2021 the old fashioned
	way.
In-Reply-To: <F2FC7F05-11D8-46FB-9E12-D26F45573651@att.net>
References: <F2FC7F05-11D8-46FB-9E12-D26F45573651.ref@att.net>
	<F2FC7F05-11D8-46FB-9E12-D26F45573651@att.net>
Message-ID: <acd9fd2d544749b48d3b89b2824e9cff@EXBE015SV3.NA02.MSEXCHANGEOUTLOOK.COM>

Great to watch. I haven't operated RTTY in a long while, but I always had to flip a switch between receiving and transmitting. I suspect that was because I was using a 51J-4 receiver and a 100V transmitter. Perhaps your flexradio just switches to transmit when it sees activity on the loop.

Very cool
Eugene


From: greenkeys-bounces at mailman.qth.net <greenkeys-bounces at mailman.qth.net> On Behalf Of William Wuttke
Sent: Sunday, January 24, 2021 12:41 PM
To: Green Keys <greenkeys at mailman.qth.net>
Subject: [GreenKeys] ARRL RTTY Roundup Jan 2-3 2021 the old fashioned way.

It took me entirely too long to put this video together. Model 28 ASR in the RTTY Roundup.

https://youtu.be/O4iKeK9Py1Y

Enjoy.

Bill
KE3BK

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From jim.w2jc at gmail.com  Sun Jan 24 21:46:34 2021
From: jim.w2jc at gmail.com (Jim Cooper)
Date: Sun, 24 Jan 2021 21:46:34 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] PC Boards for TU's
In-Reply-To: <b245b330-9458-f4db-b6ae-ab40b767b47d@martineer.net>
References: <b245b330-9458-f4db-b6ae-ab40b767b47d@martineer.net>
Message-ID: <600E310A.22857.13FAA175@jim.w2jc.gmail.com>

On 24 Jan 2021 at 19:32, Don Cunningam wrote:

>  I do have a stash of toroids, likely
> several pairs for each one built,
> but we may need to find more, 

I have a moderate 'stash' 
from "the old days" 

Jim  W2JC 




From gil at baudot.net  Sun Jan 24 21:48:15 2021
From: gil at baudot.net (Gil Smith)
Date: Sun, 24 Jan 2021 19:48:15 -0700
Subject: [GreenKeys] PC board work.
Message-ID: <20210124194815.617ae442d0f8f631a9b3312d6b10cde7.3dd9cf33e1.wbe@email27.godaddy.com>

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From gil at baudot.net  Sun Jan 24 21:48:15 2021
From: gil at baudot.net (Gil Smith)
Date: Sun, 24 Jan 2021 19:48:15 -0700
Subject: [GreenKeys] PC board work.
Message-ID: <20210124194815.617ae442d0f8f631a9b3312d6b10cde7.3dd9cf33e1.wbe@email27.godaddy.com>

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From donc at martineer.net  Sun Jan 24 22:10:54 2021
From: donc at martineer.net (Don Cunningam)
Date: Sun, 24 Jan 2021 21:10:54 -0600
Subject: [GreenKeys] PC Boards for TU's
In-Reply-To: <600E310A.22857.13FAA175@jim.w2jc.gmail.com>
References: <b245b330-9458-f4db-b6ae-ab40b767b47d@martineer.net>
	<600E310A.22857.13FAA175@jim.w2jc.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <a02c977e-0d89-6531-f50a-cf9887f4e4b5@martineer.net>

Thanks for that info, Jim.? If we do this project, some of the guys may 
need some.? I did find that something similar is still made by the same 
company that made all those, but encased now and might not work for this 
use.? I will contact them and find out if turns can be removed from 
these and they are not too expensive to consider for this use.? I have 
not received any emails looking for boards, so it may not happen.? I 
have a lifetime supply for me, HI.
Don

On 1/24/2021 8:46 PM, Jim Cooper wrote:
> On 24 Jan 2021 at 19:32, Don Cunningam wrote:
>
>>   I do have a stash of toroids, likely
>> several pairs for each one built,
>> but we may need to find more,
> I have a moderate 'stash'
> from "the old days"
>
> Jim  W2JC
>
>
>


-- 
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
https://www.avast.com/antivirus


From w8roi at wowway.com  Sun Jan 24 22:20:19 2021
From: w8roi at wowway.com (Ralph Irish)
Date: Sun, 24 Jan 2021 22:20:19 -0500 (EST)
Subject: [GreenKeys] What ever happened to  "Pot Cores"?
In-Reply-To: <1894749546.4398452.1611544663386.JavaMail.zimbra@wowway.com>
Message-ID: <1149094568.4398659.1611544819643.JavaMail.zimbra@wowway.com>

G/K 

I have a vague memory of Pot Cores being mentioned for RTTY TUs back around 
the time the DT-600 was getting a lot of attention. 

I guess they were more stable than toroids, if that is possible, and perhaps tuning 
them was easier? Never saw one nor any specs about them, nor where they could 
be obtained. 

Any one else recognize this component name? 

Just curious. 

Thanks, 

Ralph - W8ROI 


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From jeflowersrn at hotmail.com  Sun Jan 24 22:25:49 2021
From: jeflowersrn at hotmail.com (james)
Date: Mon, 25 Jan 2021 03:25:49 +0000
Subject: [GreenKeys] Tape loops
In-Reply-To: <870465994.4229128.1611517574905.JavaMail.zimbra@wowway.com>
References: <1922116308.4228648.1611517541179.JavaMail.zimbra@wowway.com>,
	<870465994.4229128.1611517574905.JavaMail.zimbra@wowway.com>
Message-ID: <BYAPR13MB277361998AF839A191606AB4AABD9@BYAPR13MB2773.namprd13.prod.outlook.com>

So true. I made many tapes that way.
Jim Flowers, Radioman 2nd
USS Ozbourn DD 846
NBCC
WB7RKK

Sent from my iPhone

On Jan 24, 2021, at 11:46, Ralph Irish <w8roi at wowway.com<mailto:w8roi at wowway.com>> wrote:

Making tape loops can also be done with the TD, if one is careful and cautious
to 'bump' the tape forward, one character at a time.  Tape loops were made before
the Tape Splicer was available.

A few LTRS characters at each end of the tape, carefully overlapped and
cautiously put into the TD, then 'bump' the TD forward, one character at a
time until the chads seat themselves into the holes comfortably.  Maybe
a tiny amount of glue at the 'overlap point' to reduce the chances of the 'loose
ends' getting snagged on something.

We made lots of loop tapes when I was in the Navy and I never saw a splicer
until I'd been into Teletype as a ham, for a decade or more.  We had a 14KTR
monitoring the Fleet Broadcast, along with two 28KSRs and we had few
problems keeping up with incoming traffic.

The tape loops got used in other aspects of communications operations on the
USS Hancock.  (aka  NWLD  and "Rampage")

Later on we had a 28KTR available which made things a lot easier to keep up
with incoming traffic.

73,

Ralph


______________________________________________________________
GreenKeys mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net

Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
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From harold at w6iwi.org  Sun Jan 24 22:31:48 2021
From: harold at w6iwi.org (Harold Hallikainen)
Date: Sun, 24 Jan 2021 19:31:48 -0800
Subject: [GreenKeys] What ever happened to  "Pot Cores"?
In-Reply-To: <1149094568.4398659.1611544819643.JavaMail.zimbra@wowway.com>
References: <1149094568.4398659.1611544819643.JavaMail.zimbra@wowway.com>
Message-ID: <0a4d8fc84e9fade3353c10e4816f39a7.squirrel@mai.hallikainen.org>

I believe pot cores are still used in switching power supplies. They are a
lot easier to wind than toroids since the windings are on a small plastic
bobbin. The center pin length can also be adjusted in manufacturing to add
a specific magnetic gap to reduce the chance of core saturation. There is
also a small gap around the outside of the core. These gaps vary in length
with the amount of pressure holding the two sides together. As this
pressure varies with age, the inductance can vary.

But, other than that, I don't know about use of pot cores in audio filters!

Harold
https://w6iwi.org


-- 
FCC Rules Updated Daily at http://www.hallikainen.com
Not sent from an iPhone.

From donc at martineer.net  Sun Jan 24 22:33:36 2021
From: donc at martineer.net (Don Cunningam)
Date: Sun, 24 Jan 2021 21:33:36 -0600
Subject: [GreenKeys] What ever happened to "Pot Cores"?
In-Reply-To: <1149094568.4398659.1611544819643.JavaMail.zimbra@wowway.com>
References: <1149094568.4398659.1611544819643.JavaMail.zimbra@wowway.com>
Message-ID: <dcde9661-cfe6-d214-81d0-ebc0e4e6563a@martineer.net>

Yes, those were mentioned in depth in the DT-600 literature.? That is 
available here, by the way: 
http://rtty.com/development/tu/dt-600/dt-600.htm .? He has the 
schematics and the building information on this site too.? Nice read.? I 
have searched the internet, but the larger ones seem to be a lost art, 
far as I can see so far.
73,
Don, WB5HAK

On 1/24/2021 9:20 PM, Ralph Irish wrote:
> G/K
>
> I have a vague memory of Pot Cores being mentioned for RTTY TUs back 
> around
> the time the DT-600 was getting a lot of attention.
>
> I guess they were more stable than toroids, if that is possible, and 
> perhaps tuning
> them was easier? ?Never saw one nor any specs about them, nor where 
> they could
> be obtained.
>
> Any one else recognize this component name?
>
> Just curious.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Ralph - W8ROI
>
>
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
>
>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to donc at martineer.net



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From donc at martineer.net  Sun Jan 24 22:38:12 2021
From: donc at martineer.net (Don Cunningam)
Date: Sun, 24 Jan 2021 21:38:12 -0600
Subject: [GreenKeys] Tape loops
In-Reply-To: <BYAPR13MB277361998AF839A191606AB4AABD9@BYAPR13MB2773.namprd13.prod.outlook.com>
References: <1922116308.4228648.1611517541179.JavaMail.zimbra@wowway.com>
	<870465994.4229128.1611517574905.JavaMail.zimbra@wowway.com>
	<BYAPR13MB277361998AF839A191606AB4AABD9@BYAPR13MB2773.namprd13.prod.outlook.com>
Message-ID: <35468825-40a0-2c09-aed5-1b5d30e391d6@martineer.net>

Jim,
Boy, that brings back memories.? We did many loops like that on USS 
Edson DD 946 too. I was RM2 on that for some time. ? A loop of line 
feeds would often get an answer from the shore station if you had been 
trying for a LONG time trying to get them the normal way and they were 
obviously ignoring you :-)
Don, WB5HAK

On 1/24/2021 9:25 PM, james wrote:
> So true. I made many tapes that way.
> Jim Flowers, Radioman 2nd
> USS Ozbourn DD 846
> NBCC
> WB7RKK
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Jan 24, 2021, at 11:46, Ralph Irish <w8roi at wowway.com 
> <mailto:w8roi at wowway.com>> wrote:
>
>> Making tape loops can also be done with the TD, if one is careful and 
>> cautious
>> to 'bump' the tape forward, one character at a time. ?Tape loops were 
>> made before
>> the Tape Splicer was available.
>>
>> A few LTRS characters at each end of the tape, carefully overlapped and
>> cautiously put into the TD, then 'bump' the TD forward, one character 
>> at a
>> time until the chads seat themselves into the holes comfortably. ?Maybe
>> a tiny amount of glue at the 'overlap point' to reduce the chances of 
>> the 'loose
>> ends' getting snagged on something.
>>
>> We made lots of loop tapes when I was in the Navy and I never saw a 
>> splicer
>> until I'd been into Teletype as a ham, for a decade or more. ?We had 
>> a 14KTR
>> monitoring the Fleet Broadcast, along with two 28KSRs and we had few
>> problems keeping up with incoming traffic.
>>
>> The tape loops got used in other aspects of communications operations 
>> on the
>> USS Hancock. ?(aka ?NWLD ?and "Rampage")
>>
>> Later on we had a 28KTR available which made things a lot easier to 
>> keep up
>> with incoming traffic.
>>
>> 73,
>>
>> Ralph
>>
>>
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> GreenKeys mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys 
>> <http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys>
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm <http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm>
>> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net <mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net>
>>
>>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: 
>>>>> https://teletype.net/gksearch <https://teletype.net/gksearch>
>>>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: 
>>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/ 
>>>>> <http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/>
>>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: 
>>>>> http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html 
>>>>> <http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html>
>>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: 
>>>>> http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html 
>>>>> <http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html>
>>
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net <http://www.qsl.net>
>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html 
>> <http://www.qsl.net/donate.html>
>> Message delivered to jeflowersrn at hotmail.com 
>> <mailto:jeflowersrn at hotmail.com>
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
>
>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to donc at martineer.net



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From douglas-w-jones at uiowa.edu  Sun Jan 24 23:09:43 2021
From: douglas-w-jones at uiowa.edu (Jones, Douglas W)
Date: Mon, 25 Jan 2021 04:09:43 +0000
Subject: [GreenKeys] What ever happened to "Pot Cores"?
In-Reply-To: <dcde9661-cfe6-d214-81d0-ebc0e4e6563a@martineer.net>
References: <1149094568.4398659.1611544819643.JavaMail.zimbra@wowway.com>,
	<dcde9661-cfe6-d214-81d0-ebc0e4e6563a@martineer.net>
Message-ID: <DM6PR04MB5003EEDC8E2C29C71E2BD06BA8BD9@DM6PR04MB5003.namprd04.prod.outlook.com>


I did an image search on pot cores and got piles of pictures of familiar looking cores -- think of a chunk of ferrite shaped like a pot with lump sticking up through the center, and a slot in the side where the pot handle would have been attached.  Wind a simple coil and sandwich it between two such pots and you have a ferrite core inductor.  You can get them with the two halves dead flat, designed to meet with no air gap.  A few have the central boss replaced by a third part, a ferrite cylinder that, if attached to a screw, can be screwed in and out to tune the pot.  Even the ones with no air gap and no movable center can be tuned a bit by rotating one half relative to the other half so the cut-outs in the side align more (higher inductance) or less.

Then I did an eBay search on "pot core" and got piles of them.  You can get piles and piles of new pots dirt cheap.  Kits with two pots and a plastic bobbin cost more, and pre-wound pot cores cost more.  There are new old-stock pot cores and brand new ones, fresh from some ferrite factory somewhere.

         Doug Jones
         jones at cs.uiowa.edu

From hwhall at compuserve.com  Sun Jan 24 23:11:05 2021
From: hwhall at compuserve.com (hwhall at compuserve.com)
Date: Mon, 25 Jan 2021 04:11:05 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [GreenKeys] What ever happened to  "Pot Cores"?
In-Reply-To: <0a4d8fc84e9fade3353c10e4816f39a7.squirrel@mai.hallikainen.org>
References: <1149094568.4398659.1611544819643.JavaMail.zimbra@wowway.com>
	<0a4d8fc84e9fade3353c10e4816f39a7.squirrel@mai.hallikainen.org>
Message-ID: <2096839892.4850383.1611547865747@mail.yahoo.com>

Messed around a very little a long time ago with some pot cores extracted from some kind of telephone filter units obtained surplus (think they might have been part of some MUX gear). They had air gaps in the center 'pin' with a little screwdriver adjustable ferrite slug that went into that gap for fine-tuning. Seemed like a good thing to build with at the time but then it seemed everyone was working with toroids instead so I dropped the tinkering.

WayneWB4OGM

-----Original Message-----
From: Harold Hallikainen <harold at w6iwi.org>
To: greenkeys at mailman.qth.net
Sent: Sun, Jan 24, 2021 8:31 pm
Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] What ever happened to "Pot Cores"?

I believe pot cores are still used in switching power supplies. They are a
lot easier to wind than toroids since the windings are on a small plastic
bobbin. The center pin length can also be adjusted in manufacturing to add
a specific magnetic gap to reduce the chance of core saturation. There is
also a small gap around the outside of the core. These gaps vary in length
with the amount of pressure holding the two sides together. As this
pressure varies with age, the inductance can vary.

But, other than that, I don't know about use of pot cores in audio filters!

Harold
https://w6iwi.org


-- 
FCC Rules Updated Daily at http://www.hallikainen.com
Not sent from an iPhone.
______________________________________________________________
GreenKeys mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net

>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to hwhall at compuserve.com
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From wcwuttke at att.net  Sun Jan 24 23:16:45 2021
From: wcwuttke at att.net (William Wuttke)
Date: Sun, 24 Jan 2021 20:16:45 -0800
Subject: [GreenKeys] ARRL RTTY Roundup Jan 2-3 2021 the old fashioned
	way.
In-Reply-To: <acd9fd2d544749b48d3b89b2824e9cff@EXBE015SV3.NA02.MSEXCHANGEOUTLOOK.COM>
References: <F2FC7F05-11D8-46FB-9E12-D26F45573651.ref@att.net>
	<F2FC7F05-11D8-46FB-9E12-D26F45573651@att.net>
	<acd9fd2d544749b48d3b89b2824e9cff@EXBE015SV3.NA02.MSEXCHANGEOUTLOOK.COM>
Message-ID: <30DECFFE-731E-49AD-B46A-8260F83BCAEA@att.net>

Ha! What you didn?t see was the footswitch.

Actually I have any number of ways to key the radio - KEY lever on the M28, KOS or PTT button in my homebrew
?Modem - Teletype Interface Unit? software, KOS or TX switch in TU?s. If I?m hand typing, I find the footswitch
works best for me. If I use KOS and pause too long between characters, it makes things flakey on the receiving
end. If I wanted to I could use the VOX on the Flexradio, but I like positive key control and sometimes VOX doesn?t
do what you want it to do and has the same problem with long pauses.

73,
Bill
KE3BK

> On Jan 24, 2021, at 6:17 PM, W2HX <w2hx at w2hx.com> wrote:
> 
> Great to watch. I haven?t operated RTTY in a long while, but I always had to flip a switch between receiving and transmitting. I suspect that was because I was using a 51J-4 receiver and a 100V transmitter. Perhaps your flexradio just switches to transmit when it sees activity on the loop.
>  
> Very cool
> Eugene
>  
>  
> From: greenkeys-bounces at mailman.qth.net <greenkeys-bounces at mailman.qth.net> On Behalf Of William Wuttke
> Sent: Sunday, January 24, 2021 12:41 PM
> To: Green Keys <greenkeys at mailman.qth.net>
> Subject: [GreenKeys] ARRL RTTY Roundup Jan 2-3 2021 the old fashioned way.
>  
> It took me entirely too long to put this video together. Model 28 ASR in the RTTY Roundup.
>  
> https://youtu.be/O4iKeK9Py1Y <https://youtu.be/O4iKeK9Py1Y>
>  
> Enjoy.
>  
> Bill
> KE3BK

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From gblock at sbcglobal.net  Mon Jan 25 01:59:55 2021
From: gblock at sbcglobal.net (Gerry)
Date: Sun, 24 Jan 2021 22:59:55 -0800
Subject: [GreenKeys] PC board work.
In-Reply-To: <20210124194815.617ae442d0f8f631a9b3312d6b10cde7.3dd9cf33e1.wbe@email27.godaddy.com>
References: <20210124194815.617ae442d0f8f631a9b3312d6b10cde7.3dd9cf33e1.wbe@email27.godaddy.com>
Message-ID: <6181960A-5B86-4770-AD3E-86EEF7F23C1F@sbcglobal.net>

Unbelievable. 
Thanks for update. 
Takes skill to deal with 0402!

Gerry

Sent from my iPhone

> On Jan 24, 2021, at 6:49 PM, Gil Smith <gil at baudot.net> wrote:
> 
> ?
> I have used Eagle since 2006 when I splurged and bought the full-up 16-layer version with the auto-router.  The autorouter was only kinda useful to me on one really dense digital board, and I never renewed that option when I upgraded.  I have never gone beyond six layers;  I mostly do 4 layers, but sometimes 2 or 6. 
> 
> <rant>
> Then Eagle was bought out by Autocad, and it went to a subscription plan, which I hate.  So I will happily use my several-year-old version forever.  I have the final non-subscription versions of photoshop and illustrator as well, so bite me Adobe.  This subscription software stuff really pisses me off.
> </rant>
> 
> Eagle has its quirks, but I can do anything I want or need with it.  I do a lot of mixed-signal stuff:  analog conditioning, 24bit adcs, micros...  I regularly hand-assemble down to 0.5mm pitch and 0402 -- just me, two pairs of reading glasses, and quality solder wick :}
> 
> gil
> 
> 
> gil smith, AF7EZ
> greenkeys moderator
> gil at baudot.net
> 
> 
> -------- Original Message --------
> Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] PC board work.
> From: Gerry Block <gblock at sbcglobal.net>
> Date: Sun, January 24, 2021 6:46 pm
> To: Jeffrey Angus <jdangus at att.net>, Gil Smith <gil at baudot.net>
> Cc: greenkeys <greenkeys at mailman.qth.net>
> 
> Gil,
> 
>   What layout program do you use?
> 
> Gerry
> AD6MC
> 
> On Sunday, January 24, 2021, 5:10:00 PM PST, Gil Smith <gil at baudot.net> wrote:
> 
> 
> Hey Jeff:
> 
> Where do you get your boards?  For the last few years I have been using pcbway in China:
> https://www.pcbway.com/
> 
> They have been awesome and I have done dozens of 2- and 4-layer boards there.  About a week turn plus a a few days shipping (get DHL, not fedex).  Instant quote on the home page.  Best prices I have found (though I sometimes get hit with a 25% tariff fee).  Variety of soldermask colors avail (some cost extra).  I like red, blue, and black -- the yellow is gross.  Arrays are easy.  Routing and V-groove not too costly.
> 
> They do full-turn assembly though I have not used that service.
> 
> thx, gil
> 
> 
> gil smith, AF7EZ
> greenkeys moderator
> gil at baudot.net
> 
> 
> -------- Original Message --------
> Subject: [GreenKeys] PC board work.
> From: Jeffrey Angus <jdangus at att.net>
> Date: Sun, January 24, 2021 12:33 pm
> To: greenkeys <greenkeys at mailman.qth.net>
> 
> This is what I do in my spare time now that I'm retired.
> I use Express PCB software.
> A few years back I designed a two speed motor controller
> for my Lorenz Lo-15c.
> Last year I did a signal converter for Sen Williams to go
> from on/off keying to bi-polar for his Creed TTYs.
> 
> All I need is a schematic.
> And you get the PC Board schematic redrawn for ExpressPCB
> and the PC Board layouts.
> 
> And no, I don't charge for this.
> Although, I'm not too proud to accept donations, if you're
> feeling guilty about it.
> 
> -- 
> "I am a river to my people."
> Jeff-1.0
> WA6FWI
> www.foxsmercantile.com
> 
> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
> 
> >>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
> >>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
> >>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
> >>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
> 
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to gil at baudot.net
> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
> 
> >>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
> >>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
> >>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
> >>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
> 
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to gblock at sbcglobal.net
> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
> 
>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
> 
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to gblock at sbcglobal.net
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From steve.n4tty at gmail.com  Mon Jan 25 06:04:07 2021
From: steve.n4tty at gmail.com (Steve Garrison)
Date: Mon, 25 Jan 2021 06:04:07 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] PC board work.
In-Reply-To: <6181960A-5B86-4770-AD3E-86EEF7F23C1F@sbcglobal.net>
References: <20210124194815.617ae442d0f8f631a9b3312d6b10cde7.3dd9cf33e1.wbe@email27.godaddy.com>
	<6181960A-5B86-4770-AD3E-86EEF7F23C1F@sbcglobal.net>
Message-ID: <F1226B76-CA7D-493A-92CF-6A5068FFAABD@gmail.com>

For you folks that haven't used layout software and dislike paid and/or subscription software as much as Eric and I do, might I suggest KiCad.

They will soon be releasing v6 and I'm currently trying out the nightly builds of v5.99 which will become v6 when it's ready for prime time.

Have been using and learned KiCad on v5.  It is free, very widely used, and its main support comes from CERN. The folks with that big particle accelerator in Switzerland.  There is a paid version if you just have to have a paid version, or you can make donations to help support the free version.

At least check it out.

Steve G./N4TTY
Sent from my iPhone

> On Jan 25, 2021, at 1:59 AM, Gerry <gblock at sbcglobal.net> wrote:
> 
> Unbelievable. 
> Thanks for update. 
> Takes skill to deal with 0402!
> 
> Gerry
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>> On Jan 24, 2021, at 6:49 PM, Gil Smith <gil at baudot.net> wrote:
>> 
>> ?
>> I have used Eagle since 2006 when I splurged and bought the full-up 16-layer version with the auto-router.  The autorouter was only kinda useful to me on one really dense digital board, and I never renewed that option when I upgraded.  I have never gone beyond six layers;  I mostly do 4 layers, but sometimes 2 or 6. 
>> 
>> <rant>
>> Then Eagle was bought out by Autocad, and it went to a subscription plan, which I hate.  So I will happily use my several-year-old version forever.  I have the final non-subscription versions of photoshop and illustrator as well, so bite me Adobe.  This subscription software stuff really pisses me off.
>> </rant>
>> 
>> Eagle has its quirks, but I can do anything I want or need with it.  I do a lot of mixed-signal stuff:  analog conditioning, 24bit adcs, micros...  I regularly hand-assemble down to 0.5mm pitch and 0402 -- just me, two pairs of reading glasses, and quality solder wick :}
>> 
>> gil
>> 
>> 
>> gil smith, AF7EZ
>> greenkeys moderator
>> gil at baudot.net
>> 
>> 
>> -------- Original Message --------
>> Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] PC board work.
>> From: Gerry Block <gblock at sbcglobal.net>
>> Date: Sun, January 24, 2021 6:46 pm
>> To: Jeffrey Angus <jdangus at att.net>, Gil Smith <gil at baudot.net>
>> Cc: greenkeys <greenkeys at mailman.qth.net>
>> 
>> Gil,
>> 
>>   What layout program do you use?
>> 
>> Gerry
>> AD6MC
>> 
>> On Sunday, January 24, 2021, 5:10:00 PM PST, Gil Smith <gil at baudot.net> wrote:
>> 
>> 
>> Hey Jeff:
>> 
>> Where do you get your boards?  For the last few years I have been using pcbway in China:
>> https://www.pcbway.com/
>> 
>> They have been awesome and I have done dozens of 2- and 4-layer boards there.  About a week turn plus a a few days shipping (get DHL, not fedex).  Instant quote on the home page.  Best prices I have found (though I sometimes get hit with a 25% tariff fee).  Variety of soldermask colors avail (some cost extra).  I like red, blue, and black -- the yellow is gross.  Arrays are easy.  Routing and V-groove not too costly.
>> 
>> They do full-turn assembly though I have not used that service.
>> 
>> thx, gil
>> 
>> 
>> gil smith, AF7EZ
>> greenkeys moderator
>> gil at baudot.net
>> 
>> 
>> -------- Original Message --------
>> Subject: [GreenKeys] PC board work.
>> From: Jeffrey Angus <jdangus at att.net>
>> Date: Sun, January 24, 2021 12:33 pm
>> To: greenkeys <greenkeys at mailman.qth.net>
>> 
>> This is what I do in my spare time now that I'm retired.
>> I use Express PCB software.
>> A few years back I designed a two speed motor controller
>> for my Lorenz Lo-15c.
>> Last year I did a signal converter for Sen Williams to go
>> from on/off keying to bi-polar for his Creed TTYs.
>> 
>> All I need is a schematic.
>> And you get the PC Board schematic redrawn for ExpressPCB
>> and the PC Board layouts.
>> 
>> And no, I don't charge for this.
>> Although, I'm not too proud to accept donations, if you're
>> feeling guilty about it.
>> 
>> -- 
>> "I am a river to my people."
>> Jeff-1.0
>> WA6FWI
>> www.foxsmercantile.com
>> 
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> GreenKeys mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
>> 
>> >>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
>> >>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>> >>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>> >>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
>> 
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>> Message delivered to gil at baudot.net
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> GreenKeys mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
>> 
>> >>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
>> >>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>> >>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>> >>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
>> 
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>> Message delivered to gblock at sbcglobal.net
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> GreenKeys mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
>> 
>>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
>> 
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>> Message delivered to gblock at sbcglobal.net
> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
> 
>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
> 
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to steve.n4tty at gmail.com
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From john at toebes.com  Mon Jan 25 07:58:25 2021
From: john at toebes.com (john at toebes.com)
Date: Mon, 25 Jan 2021 07:58:25 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] PC board work.
In-Reply-To: <F1226B76-CA7D-493A-92CF-6A5068FFAABD@gmail.com>
References: <20210124194815.617ae442d0f8f631a9b3312d6b10cde7.3dd9cf33e1.wbe@email27.godaddy.com>	<6181960A-5B86-4770-AD3E-86EEF7F23C1F@sbcglobal.net>
	<F1226B76-CA7D-493A-92CF-6A5068FFAABD@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <087d01d6f319$c4e4a8a0$4eadf9e0$@toebes.com>

I have to second Steve?s recommendation on KiCad.  For our Christmas trees, we had long been commercial users of Eagle but their updates by Autocad caused us to rethink our strategy and we have been pretty happy with KiCad.  One really surprising feature of KiCad is the ability to generate 3D images of the populated board.

 

From: greenkeys-bounces at mailman.qth.net <greenkeys-bounces at mailman.qth.net> On Behalf Of Steve Garrison
Sent: Monday, January 25, 2021 6:04 AM
To: Gerry <gblock at sbcglobal.net>
Cc: greenkeys <greenkeys at mailman.qth.net>
Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] PC board work.

 

For you folks that haven't used layout software and dislike paid and/or subscription software as much as Eric and I do, might I suggest KiCad.

 

They will soon be releasing v6 and I'm currently trying out the nightly builds of v5.99 which will become v6 when it's ready for prime time.

 

Have been using and learned KiCad on v5.  It is free, very widely used, and its main support comes from CERN. The folks with that big particle accelerator in Switzerland.  There is a paid version if you just have to have a paid version, or you can make donations to help support the free version.

 

At least check it out.

Steve G./N4TTY

Sent from my iPhone


On Jan 25, 2021, at 1:59 AM, Gerry <gblock at sbcglobal.net <mailto:gblock at sbcglobal.net> > wrote:

Unbelievable. 

Thanks for update. 

Takes skill to deal with 0402!

 

Gerry

Sent from my iPhone





On Jan 24, 2021, at 6:49 PM, Gil Smith <gil at baudot.net <mailto:gil at baudot.net> > wrote:

?

I have used Eagle since 2006 when I splurged and bought the full-up 16-layer version with the auto-router.  The autorouter was only kinda useful to me on one really dense digital board, and I never renewed that option when I upgraded.  I have never gone beyond six layers;  I mostly do 4 layers, but sometimes 2 or 6.  

 

<rant>

Then Eagle was bought out by Autocad, and it went to a subscription plan, which I hate.  So I will happily use my several-year-old version forever.  I have the final non-subscription versions of photoshop and illustrator as well, so bite me Adobe.  This subscription software stuff really pisses me off.

</rant>

 

Eagle has its quirks, but I can do anything I want or need with it.  I do a lot of mixed-signal stuff:  analog conditioning, 24bit adcs, micros...  I regularly hand-assemble down to 0.5mm pitch and 0402 -- just me, two pairs of reading glasses, and quality solder wick :}

 

gil

 

 

gil smith, AF7EZ
greenkeys moderator
gil at baudot.net <mailto:gil at baudot.net> 

 

-------- Original Message --------
Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] PC board work.
From: Gerry Block <gblock at sbcglobal.net <mailto:gblock at sbcglobal.net> >
Date: Sun, January 24, 2021 6:46 pm
To: Jeffrey Angus <jdangus at att.net <mailto:jdangus at att.net> >, Gil Smith <gil at baudot.net <mailto:gil at baudot.net> >
Cc: greenkeys <greenkeys at mailman.qth.net <mailto:greenkeys at mailman.qth.net> >

Gil,

 

  What layout program do you use?

 

Gerry

AD6MC

 

On Sunday, January 24, 2021, 5:10:00 PM PST, Gil Smith <gil at baudot.net <mailto:gil at baudot.net> > wrote: 

 

 

Hey Jeff:

 

Where do you get your boards?  For the last few years I have been using pcbway in China:

https://www.pcbway.com/

 

They have been awesome and I have done dozens of 2- and 4-layer boards there.  About a week turn plus a a few days shipping (get DHL, not fedex).  Instant quote on the home page.  Best prices I have found (though I sometimes get hit with a 25% tariff fee).  Variety of soldermask colors avail (some cost extra).  I like red, blue, and black -- the yellow is gross.  Arrays are easy.  Routing and V-groove not too costly.

 

They do full-turn assembly though I have not used that service.

 

thx, gil

 

 

gil smith, AF7EZ
greenkeys moderator
gil at baudot.net <mailto:gil at baudot.net> 

 

-------- Original Message --------
Subject: [GreenKeys] PC board work.
From: Jeffrey Angus <jdangus at att.net <mailto:jdangus at att.net> >
Date: Sun, January 24, 2021 12:33 pm
To: greenkeys <greenkeys at mailman.qth.net <mailto:greenkeys at mailman.qth.net> >

This is what I do in my spare time now that I'm retired.
I use Express PCB software.
A few years back I designed a two speed motor controller
for my Lorenz Lo-15c.
Last year I did a signal converter for Sen Williams to go
from on/off keying to bi-polar for his Creed TTYs.

All I need is a schematic.
And you get the PC Board schematic redrawn for ExpressPCB
and the PC Board layouts.

And no, I don't charge for this.
Although, I'm not too proud to accept donations, if you're
feeling guilty about it.

-- 
"I am a river to my people."
Jeff-1.0
WA6FWI
www.foxsmercantile.com <http://www.foxsmercantile.com> 


  _____  


______________________________________________________________
GreenKeys mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net

>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to gil at baudot.net <mailto:gil at baudot.net>  

______________________________________________________________
GreenKeys mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net <mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net> 

>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to gblock at sbcglobal.net <mailto:gblock at sbcglobal.net> 

______________________________________________________________
GreenKeys mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net




Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch

2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/

1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html

Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html


This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to gblock at sbcglobal.net <mailto:gblock at sbcglobal.net> 

______________________________________________________________
GreenKeys mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net




Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch

2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/

1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html

Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html


This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to steve.n4tty at gmail.com <mailto:steve.n4tty at gmail.com> 

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From kb8tq at n1k.org  Mon Jan 25 09:19:11 2021
From: kb8tq at n1k.org (Bob kb8tq)
Date: Mon, 25 Jan 2021 09:19:11 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] PC board work.
In-Reply-To: <087d01d6f319$c4e4a8a0$4eadf9e0$@toebes.com>
References: <20210124194815.617ae442d0f8f631a9b3312d6b10cde7.3dd9cf33e1.wbe@email27.godaddy.com>
	<6181960A-5B86-4770-AD3E-86EEF7F23C1F@sbcglobal.net>
	<F1226B76-CA7D-493A-92CF-6A5068FFAABD@gmail.com>
	<087d01d6f319$c4e4a8a0$4eadf9e0$@toebes.com>
Message-ID: <EE41AA00-619E-4E2C-9ABF-8B1F173D1B2E@n1k.org>

Hi

KiCad has it?s quirks but it works very well. The price (free) is right 
and will stay that way. As long as CERN is backing the development 
process, it should keep getting better. With budgets always an 
unknown, that part of it is very much ?we?ll see ?.?.

Bob

> On Jan 25, 2021, at 7:58 AM, john at toebes.com wrote:
> 
> I have to second Steve?s recommendation on KiCad.  For our Christmas trees, we had long been commercial users of Eagle but their updates by Autocad caused us to rethink our strategy and we have been pretty happy with KiCad.  One really surprising feature of KiCad is the ability to generate 3D images of the populated board.
>  
> From: greenkeys-bounces at mailman.qth.net <greenkeys-bounces at mailman.qth.net> On Behalf Of Steve Garrison
> Sent: Monday, January 25, 2021 6:04 AM
> To: Gerry <gblock at sbcglobal.net>
> Cc: greenkeys <greenkeys at mailman.qth.net>
> Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] PC board work.
>  
> For you folks that haven't used layout software and dislike paid and/or subscription software as much as Eric and I do, might I suggest KiCad.
>  
> They will soon be releasing v6 and I'm currently trying out the nightly builds of v5.99 which will become v6 when it's ready for prime time.
>  
> Have been using and learned KiCad on v5.  It is free, very widely used, and its main support comes from CERN. The folks with that big particle accelerator in Switzerland.  There is a paid version if you just have to have a paid version, or you can make donations to help support the free version.
>  
> At least check it out.
> 
> Steve G./N4TTY
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
> On Jan 25, 2021, at 1:59 AM, Gerry <gblock at sbcglobal.net <mailto:gblock at sbcglobal.net>> wrote:
> 
>> Unbelievable. 
>> Thanks for update. 
>> Takes skill to deal with 0402!
>>  
>> Gerry
>> 
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>> 
>>> On Jan 24, 2021, at 6:49 PM, Gil Smith <gil at baudot.net <mailto:gil at baudot.net>> wrote:
>>> 
>>> ?
>>> I have used Eagle since 2006 when I splurged and bought the full-up 16-layer version with the auto-router.  The autorouter was only kinda useful to me on one really dense digital board, and I never renewed that option when I upgraded.  I have never gone beyond six layers;  I mostly do 4 layers, but sometimes 2 or 6. 
>>>  
>>> <rant>
>>> Then Eagle was bought out by Autocad, and it went to a subscription plan, which I hate.  So I will happily use my several-year-old version forever.  I have the final non-subscription versions of photoshop and illustrator as well, so bite me Adobe.  This subscription software stuff really pisses me off.
>>> </rant>
>>>  
>>> Eagle has its quirks, but I can do anything I want or need with it.  I do a lot of mixed-signal stuff:  analog conditioning, 24bit adcs, micros...  I regularly hand-assemble down to 0.5mm pitch and 0402 -- just me, two pairs of reading glasses, and quality solder wick :}
>>>  
>>> gil
>>>  
>>>  
>>> gil smith, AF7EZ
>>> greenkeys moderator
>>> gil at baudot.net <mailto:gil at baudot.net>
>>>  
>>> 
>>>> -------- Original Message --------
>>>> Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] PC board work.
>>>> From: Gerry Block <gblock at sbcglobal.net <mailto:gblock at sbcglobal.net>>
>>>> Date: Sun, January 24, 2021 6:46 pm
>>>> To: Jeffrey Angus <jdangus at att.net <mailto:jdangus at att.net>>, Gil Smith <gil at baudot.net <mailto:gil at baudot.net>>
>>>> Cc: greenkeys <greenkeys at mailman.qth.net <mailto:greenkeys at mailman.qth.net>>
>>>> 
>>>> Gil,
>>>>  
>>>>   What layout program do you use?
>>>>  
>>>> Gerry
>>>> AD6MC
>>>>  
>>>> On Sunday, January 24, 2021, 5:10:00 PM PST, Gil Smith <gil at baudot.net <mailto:gil at baudot.net>> wrote:
>>>>  
>>>>  
>>>> Hey Jeff:
>>>>  
>>>> Where do you get your boards?  For the last few years I have been using pcbway in China:
>>>> https://www.pcbway.com <https://www.pcbway.com/>/
>>>>  
>>>> They have been awesome and I have done dozens of 2- and 4-layer boards there.  About a week turn plus a a few days shipping (get DHL, not fedex).  Instant quote on the home page.  Best prices I have found (though I sometimes get hit with a 25% tariff fee).  Variety of soldermask colors avail (some cost extra).  I like red, blue, and black -- the yellow is gross.  Arrays are easy.  Routing and V-groove not too costly.
>>>>  
>>>> They do full-turn assembly though I have not used that service.
>>>>  
>>>> thx, gil
>>>>  
>>>>  
>>>> gil smith, AF7EZ
>>>> greenkeys moderator
>>>> gil at baudot.net <mailto:gil at baudot.net>
>>>>  
>>>> 
>>>>> -------- Original Message --------
>>>>> Subject: [GreenKeys] PC board work.
>>>>> From: Jeffrey Angus <jdangus at att.net <mailto:jdangus at att.net>>
>>>>> Date: Sun, January 24, 2021 12:33 pm
>>>>> To: greenkeys <greenkeys at mailman.qth.net <mailto:greenkeys at mailman.qth.net>>
>>>>> 
>>>>> This is what I do in my spare time now that I'm retired.
>>>>> I use Express PCB software.
>>>>> A few years back I designed a two speed motor controller
>>>>> for my Lorenz Lo-15c.
>>>>> Last year I did a signal converter for Sen Williams to go
>>>>> from on/off keying to bi-polar for his Creed TTYs.
>>>>> 
>>>>> All I need is a schematic.
>>>>> And you get the PC Board schematic redrawn for ExpressPCB
>>>>> and the PC Board layouts.
>>>>> 
>>>>> And no, I don't charge for this.
>>>>> Although, I'm not too proud to accept donations, if you're
>>>>> feeling guilty about it.
>>>>> 
>>>>> -- 
>>>>> "I am a river to my people."
>>>>> Jeff-1.0
>>>>> WA6FWI
>>>>> www.foxsmercantile.com <http://www.foxsmercantile.com/>
>>>>> ______________________________________________________________
>>>>> GreenKeys mailing list
>>>>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys <http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys>
>>>>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm <http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm>
>>>>> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net <mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net>
>>>>> 
>>>>> >>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch <https://teletype.net/gksearch>
>>>>> >>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys <http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys>/
>>>>> >>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html <http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html>
>>>>> >>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html <http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html>
>>>>> 
>>>>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net <http://www.qsl.net/>
>>>>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html <http://www.qsl.net/donate.html>
>>>>> Message delivered to gil at baudot.net <mailto:gil at baudot.net>
>>>> ______________________________________________________________
>>>> GreenKeys mailing list
>>>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys <http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys>
>>>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm <http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm>
>>>> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net <mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net>
>>>> 
>>>> >>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch <https://teletype.net/gksearch>
>>>> >>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/ <http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/>
>>>> >>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html <http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html>
>>>> >>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html <http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html>
>>>> 
>>>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net <http://www.qsl.net/>
>>>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html <http://www.qsl.net/donate.html>
>>>> Message delivered to gblock at sbcglobal.net <mailto:gblock at sbcglobal.net>______________________________________________________________
>>> GreenKeys mailing list
>>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys <http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys>
>>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm <http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm>
>>> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net <mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net>
>>> 
>>> 
>>>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch <https://teletype.net/gksearch>2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/ <http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/>1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html <http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html>Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html <http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html>
>>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net <http://www.qsl.net/>
>>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html <http://www.qsl.net/donate.html>
>>> Message delivered to gblock at sbcglobal.net <mailto:gblock at sbcglobal.net>______________________________________________________________
>> GreenKeys mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys <http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys>
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm <http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm>
>> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net <mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net>
>> 
>> 
>>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch <https://teletype.net/gksearch>2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/ <http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/>1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html <http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html>Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html <http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html>
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net <http://www.qsl.net/>
>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html <http://www.qsl.net/donate.html>
>> Message delivered to steve.n4tty at gmail.com <mailto:steve.n4tty at gmail.com>______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
> 
>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
> 
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to kb8tq at n1k.org

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From w2hx at w2hx.com  Mon Jan 25 09:59:28 2021
From: w2hx at w2hx.com (W2HX)
Date: Mon, 25 Jan 2021 14:59:28 +0000
Subject: [GreenKeys] neat ebay item
Message-ID: <bcd8cc7cb92a42d18b10a9ed71f64ad4@EXBE015SV3.NA02.MSEXCHANGEOUTLOOK.COM>

https://www.ebay.com/itm/184629889584

not mine, just interesting enough to share

73 Eugene W2HX


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From paul0926 at comcast.net  Mon Jan 25 10:29:35 2021
From: paul0926 at comcast.net (Paul Heller)
Date: Mon, 25 Jan 2021 16:29:35 +0100
Subject: [GreenKeys] neat ebay item
In-Reply-To: <bcd8cc7cb92a42d18b10a9ed71f64ad4@EXBE015SV3.NA02.MSEXCHANGEOUTLOOK.COM>
References: <bcd8cc7cb92a42d18b10a9ed71f64ad4@EXBE015SV3.NA02.MSEXCHANGEOUTLOOK.COM>
Message-ID: <98E5AFDF-5F8D-4548-B381-17C189B1AEDD@comcast.net>

I?ll say. Way cool. 

Paul
W2TTY

> On Jan 25, 2021, at 4:08 PM, W2HX <w2hx at w2hx.com> wrote:
> 
> ?
> https://www.ebay.com/itm/184629889584
>  
> not mine, just interesting enough to share
>  
> 73 Eugene W2HX
>  
> 
> 
> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
> 
>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
> 
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to paul0926 at comcast.net
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From navy.radio at gmail.com  Mon Jan 25 10:37:09 2021
From: navy.radio at gmail.com (Nick England)
Date: Mon, 25 Jan 2021 10:37:09 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] neat ebay item
In-Reply-To: <98E5AFDF-5F8D-4548-B381-17C189B1AEDD@comcast.net>
References: <bcd8cc7cb92a42d18b10a9ed71f64ad4@EXBE015SV3.NA02.MSEXCHANGEOUTLOOK.COM>
	<98E5AFDF-5F8D-4548-B381-17C189B1AEDD@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <CAB55hNe2hGQ9+wWqp35Gu39vSxs_NvY-1pZy4MQ1HhxdO5ynow@mail.gmail.com>

Discussion of the TT-63 repeater at the bottom of this page
http://www.navy-radio.com/rtty-misc.htm

-- 
Nick England K4NYW
www.navy-radio.com
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From go4retro at go4retro.com  Mon Jan 25 10:48:46 2021
From: go4retro at go4retro.com (RETRO Innovations)
Date: Mon, 25 Jan 2021 09:48:46 -0600
Subject: [GreenKeys] PC board work.
In-Reply-To: <EE41AA00-619E-4E2C-9ABF-8B1F173D1B2E@n1k.org>
References: <20210124194815.617ae442d0f8f631a9b3312d6b10cde7.3dd9cf33e1.wbe@email27.godaddy.com>
	<6181960A-5B86-4770-AD3E-86EEF7F23C1F@sbcglobal.net>
	<F1226B76-CA7D-493A-92CF-6A5068FFAABD@gmail.com>
	<087d01d6f319$c4e4a8a0$4eadf9e0$@toebes.com>
	<EE41AA00-619E-4E2C-9ABF-8B1F173D1B2E@n1k.org>
Message-ID: <d5fe8441-732a-373a-2bcc-4db9608b2703@go4retro.com>

On 1/25/2021 8:19 AM, Bob kb8tq wrote:
> Hi
>
> KiCad has it?s quirks but it works very well. The price (free) is right
> and will stay that way. As long as CERN is backing the development
> process, it should keep getting better. With budgets always an
> unknown, that part of it is very much ?we?ll see ?.?.
>
> Bob


EAGLE has it's quirks as well :-)

For many years, CADSOFT's EAGLE was more feature complete that gEDA and 
KiCAD, and you could open any size board in the free EAGLE software to 
create gerbers, which made it ideal for open source projects.? That's 
why many of us started using it. For small boards and non commercial 
uses, EAGLE's free price tag for their entry level option was indeed a 
draw, but many of us had no issues paying for capability, within reason 
(ORCAD, PROTEL, were just so expensive at the time, while EAGLE was much 
more reasonable).? It was the free "viewer" option coupled with the 
overall capability that made the suite a powerful force. So, I started 
using it in 2005 or so and have become extremely proficient at board 
design (I think I actually bought the expensive autorouter, but there 
are two kinds of autorouters, in my opinion: useless and crappy, so I 
don't use it).

But, like Gil, I had significant issues with the AutoDesk move to 
subscription licensing for the tool.? And, so I share Steve and John's 
recommendation to try KiCAD.? I've downloaded it many times over the 
years, and I can do a bit with it, but I am just so much more productive 
in EAGLE at this time, and it's always a hard decision to take precious 
hobby time away from new designs to learn a new tool.? Still, I think 
KiCAD is reasonably feature complete now (I still wait for complete back 
annotation, which is a piece I use all the time in EAGLE). Like Gil, I 
continue to soldier on with my v7.7 of EAGLE, which works fine, and work 
to become proficient in KiCAD.

For PCBs, if jlcpcb.com has not been suggested, please consider them. 
Quite frankly, the great options for inexpensive PCB manufacturing now 
are almost overwhelming.? oshpark and batchpcb for incredibly quick 
protos; elecrow, pcbway, jlcpcb, etc for flexible colors and quick 
turnaround; and others for larger runs. V scoring, hard gold, immersion 
gold plating, immersion silver plating, 4 layer, panelization, etc. all 
seem to be a single checkbox click.

I don't use this much anymore, since I typically just head to batchpcb 
for super cheap protos and elecrow/jlcpcb for regular stuff in colors I 
want, but folks can use this shopping tool to find an ideal service:

https://pcbshopper.com/

I also have used PCB assembly services since about 2006 or so, but those 
are harder to recommend.? The one I use is much less web automated, but 
so much more flexible than the current web quoting companies online. I'm 
sure the PCBA online options are very good, but once you're spoiled with 
a PCBA firm that does not require you to pick from their stock, it's 
hard to migrate away...

Jim



From kb8tq at n1k.org  Mon Jan 25 11:01:56 2021
From: kb8tq at n1k.org (Bob kb8tq)
Date: Mon, 25 Jan 2021 11:01:56 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] PC board work.
In-Reply-To: <d5fe8441-732a-373a-2bcc-4db9608b2703@go4retro.com>
References: <20210124194815.617ae442d0f8f631a9b3312d6b10cde7.3dd9cf33e1.wbe@email27.godaddy.com>
	<6181960A-5B86-4770-AD3E-86EEF7F23C1F@sbcglobal.net>
	<F1226B76-CA7D-493A-92CF-6A5068FFAABD@gmail.com>
	<087d01d6f319$c4e4a8a0$4eadf9e0$@toebes.com>
	<EE41AA00-619E-4E2C-9ABF-8B1F173D1B2E@n1k.org>
	<d5fe8441-732a-373a-2bcc-4db9608b2703@go4retro.com>
Message-ID: <9EA76A01-C1EE-4E12-9257-DDCBB5581FCD@n1k.org>

Hi

I also have an old copy of Eagle sitting here. I made the decision to mothball it 
and force myself to learn KiCAD. After a few dozen boards, I can do at least as 
well with it as I could with Eagle. Neither one is as good as the $50K ?pro? stuff
I used at work. I?m happy with free vs $50K :) 

With JLPCB, be careful about parts availability. What you see on their list today
may not be what you see a month from now. I?ve done a couple of designs with 
therm where I ran their inventory of this or that to zero. They have never restocked
those parts and the designs are now ?on hold? in terms of building any more boards.

For the most part this only applies to ?exotic? IC?s ( like 1 GHz BW op amps). 
Normal resistors / capacitors / diodes / logic IC?s all seem to be kept in stock. 
For the price they charge, there is no alternative. You simply can?t get a board
built that cheap any other way. If you are looking for a couple of boards, the price
delta ( them vs next cheapest) could be massive.

Bob

> On Jan 25, 2021, at 10:48 AM, RETRO Innovations <go4retro at go4retro.com> wrote:
> 
> On 1/25/2021 8:19 AM, Bob kb8tq wrote:
>> Hi
>> 
>> KiCad has it?s quirks but it works very well. The price (free) is right
>> and will stay that way. As long as CERN is backing the development
>> process, it should keep getting better. With budgets always an
>> unknown, that part of it is very much ?we?ll see ?.?.
>> 
>> Bob
> 
> 
> EAGLE has it's quirks as well :-)
> 
> For many years, CADSOFT's EAGLE was more feature complete that gEDA and KiCAD, and you could open any size board in the free EAGLE software to create gerbers, which made it ideal for open source projects.  That's why many of us started using it. For small boards and non commercial uses, EAGLE's free price tag for their entry level option was indeed a draw, but many of us had no issues paying for capability, within reason (ORCAD, PROTEL, were just so expensive at the time, while EAGLE was much more reasonable).  It was the free "viewer" option coupled with the overall capability that made the suite a powerful force. So, I started using it in 2005 or so and have become extremely proficient at board design (I think I actually bought the expensive autorouter, but there are two kinds of autorouters, in my opinion: useless and crappy, so I don't use it).
> 
> But, like Gil, I had significant issues with the AutoDesk move to subscription licensing for the tool.  And, so I share Steve and John's recommendation to try KiCAD.  I've downloaded it many times over the years, and I can do a bit with it, but I am just so much more productive in EAGLE at this time, and it's always a hard decision to take precious hobby time away from new designs to learn a new tool.  Still, I think KiCAD is reasonably feature complete now (I still wait for complete back annotation, which is a piece I use all the time in EAGLE). Like Gil, I continue to soldier on with my v7.7 of EAGLE, which works fine, and work to become proficient in KiCAD.
> 
> For PCBs, if jlcpcb.com has not been suggested, please consider them. Quite frankly, the great options for inexpensive PCB manufacturing now are almost overwhelming.  oshpark and batchpcb for incredibly quick protos; elecrow, pcbway, jlcpcb, etc for flexible colors and quick turnaround; and others for larger runs. V scoring, hard gold, immersion gold plating, immersion silver plating, 4 layer, panelization, etc. all seem to be a single checkbox click.
> 
> I don't use this much anymore, since I typically just head to batchpcb for super cheap protos and elecrow/jlcpcb for regular stuff in colors I want, but folks can use this shopping tool to find an ideal service:
> 
> https://pcbshopper.com/
> 
> I also have used PCB assembly services since about 2006 or so, but those are harder to recommend.  The one I use is much less web automated, but so much more flexible than the current web quoting companies online. I'm sure the PCBA online options are very good, but once you're spoiled with a PCBA firm that does not require you to pick from their stock, it's hard to migrate away...
> 
> Jim
> 
> 
> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
> 
>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
> 
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to kb8tq at n1k.org


From jp at cs.unc.edu  Mon Jan 25 11:13:11 2021
From: jp at cs.unc.edu (John Poulton)
Date: Mon, 25 Jan 2021 11:13:11 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] neat ebay item
In-Reply-To: <bcd8cc7cb92a42d18b10a9ed71f64ad4@EXBE015SV3.NA02.MSEXCHANGEOUTLOOK.COM>
References: <bcd8cc7cb92a42d18b10a9ed71f64ad4@EXBE015SV3.NA02.MSEXCHANGEOUTLOOK.COM>
Message-ID: <CAKtz7fdvRwJTgw7XX=13r3emtPs9s26o5Eugd1bV0U0FF74n1Q@mail.gmail.com>

TMC built these Teletype Repeaters as well, essentially identical to the
Stelma units.  The TMC version was the "SFO".. see:

http://tmchistory.org/tmc_ssb_cats/ssb_db/tmc.ssb_103.pdf

And, note the company address at the bottom of the bulletin, 121 Spenser
Place in Mamaroneck, TMC's very first manufacturing site.  TMC was building
these at least as early as 1952.

73, John K4OZY




On Mon, Jan 25, 2021 at 10:04 AM W2HX <w2hx at w2hx.com> wrote:

> https://www.ebay.com/itm/184629889584
>
>
>
> not mine, just interesting enough to share
>
>
>
> 73 Eugene W2HX
>
>
>
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
>
> >>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool:
> https://teletype.net/gksearch
> >>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive:
> http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
> >>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive:
> http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
> >>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool:
> http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to jp at cs.unc.edu
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From kb8tq at n1k.org  Mon Jan 25 11:21:53 2021
From: kb8tq at n1k.org (Bob kb8tq)
Date: Mon, 25 Jan 2021 11:21:53 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] neat ebay item
In-Reply-To: <bcd8cc7cb92a42d18b10a9ed71f64ad4@EXBE015SV3.NA02.MSEXCHANGEOUTLOOK.COM>
References: <bcd8cc7cb92a42d18b10a9ed71f64ad4@EXBE015SV3.NA02.MSEXCHANGEOUTLOOK.COM>
Message-ID: <A4CFFC06-8915-4AB1-8AD4-C354C926C23B@n1k.org>

Hi

Lots of empty tube sockets on that beast?..

Looks like the ?tone? option is on/off keying of the tone ( = not AFSK )

Bob

> On Jan 25, 2021, at 9:59 AM, W2HX <w2hx at w2hx.com> wrote:
> 
> https://www.ebay.com/itm/184629889584 <https://www.ebay.com/itm/184629889584>
>  
> not mine, just interesting enough to share
>  
> 73 Eugene W2HX
>  
> 
> 
> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
> 
>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
> 
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to kb8tq at n1k.org

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From gblock at sbcglobal.net  Mon Jan 25 11:54:26 2021
From: gblock at sbcglobal.net (Gerry Block)
Date: Mon, 25 Jan 2021 16:54:26 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [GreenKeys] PC board work.
In-Reply-To: <9EA76A01-C1EE-4E12-9257-DDCBB5581FCD@n1k.org>
References: <20210124194815.617ae442d0f8f631a9b3312d6b10cde7.3dd9cf33e1.wbe@email27.godaddy.com>
	<6181960A-5B86-4770-AD3E-86EEF7F23C1F@sbcglobal.net>
	<F1226B76-CA7D-493A-92CF-6A5068FFAABD@gmail.com>
	<087d01d6f319$c4e4a8a0$4eadf9e0$@toebes.com>
	<EE41AA00-619E-4E2C-9ABF-8B1F173D1B2E@n1k.org>
	<d5fe8441-732a-373a-2bcc-4db9608b2703@go4retro.com>
	<9EA76A01-C1EE-4E12-9257-DDCBB5581FCD@n1k.org>
Message-ID: <965050270.3573135.1611593666504@mail.yahoo.com>

 Bob thanks for info.GerryAD6MC

    On Monday, January 25, 2021, 8:04:41 AM PST, Bob kb8tq <kb8tq at n1k.org> wrote:  
 
 Hi

I also have an old copy of Eagle sitting here. I made the decision to mothball it 
and force myself to learn KiCAD. After a few dozen boards, I can do at least as 
well with it as I could with Eagle. Neither one is as good as the $50K ?pro? stuff
I used at work. I?m happy with free vs $50K :) 

With JLPCB, be careful about parts availability. What you see on their list today
may not be what you see a month from now. I?ve done a couple of designs with 
therm where I ran their inventory of this or that to zero. They have never restocked
those parts and the designs are now ?on hold? in terms of building any more boards.

For the most part this only applies to ?exotic? IC?s ( like 1 GHz BW op amps). 
Normal resistors / capacitors / diodes / logic IC?s all seem to be kept in stock. 
For the price they charge, there is no alternative. You simply can?t get a board
built that cheap any other way. If you are looking for a couple of boards, the price
delta ( them vs next cheapest) could be massive.

Bob

> On Jan 25, 2021, at 10:48 AM, RETRO Innovations <go4retro at go4retro.com> wrote:
> 
> On 1/25/2021 8:19 AM, Bob kb8tq wrote:
>> Hi
>> 
>> KiCad has it?s quirks but it works very well. The price (free) is right
>> and will stay that way. As long as CERN is backing the development
>> process, it should keep getting better. With budgets always an
>> unknown, that part of it is very much ?we?ll see ?.?.
>> 
>> Bob
> 
> 
> EAGLE has it's quirks as well :-)
> 
> For many years, CADSOFT's EAGLE was more feature complete that gEDA and KiCAD, and you could open any size board in the free EAGLE software to create gerbers, which made it ideal for open source projects.? That's why many of us started using it. For small boards and non commercial uses, EAGLE's free price tag for their entry level option was indeed a draw, but many of us had no issues paying for capability, within reason (ORCAD, PROTEL, were just so expensive at the time, while EAGLE was much more reasonable).? It was the free "viewer" option coupled with the overall capability that made the suite a powerful force. So, I started using it in 2005 or so and have become extremely proficient at board design (I think I actually bought the expensive autorouter, but there are two kinds of autorouters, in my opinion: useless and crappy, so I don't use it).
> 
> But, like Gil, I had significant issues with the AutoDesk move to subscription licensing for the tool.? And, so I share Steve and John's recommendation to try KiCAD.? I've downloaded it many times over the years, and I can do a bit with it, but I am just so much more productive in EAGLE at this time, and it's always a hard decision to take precious hobby time away from new designs to learn a new tool.? Still, I think KiCAD is reasonably feature complete now (I still wait for complete back annotation, which is a piece I use all the time in EAGLE). Like Gil, I continue to soldier on with my v7.7 of EAGLE, which works fine, and work to become proficient in KiCAD.
> 
> For PCBs, if jlcpcb.com has not been suggested, please consider them. Quite frankly, the great options for inexpensive PCB manufacturing now are almost overwhelming.? oshpark and batchpcb for incredibly quick protos; elecrow, pcbway, jlcpcb, etc for flexible colors and quick turnaround; and others for larger runs. V scoring, hard gold, immersion gold plating, immersion silver plating, 4 layer, panelization, etc. all seem to be a single checkbox click.
> 
> I don't use this much anymore, since I typically just head to batchpcb for super cheap protos and elecrow/jlcpcb for regular stuff in colors I want, but folks can use this shopping tool to find an ideal service:
> 
> https://pcbshopper.com/
> 
> I also have used PCB assembly services since about 2006 or so, but those are harder to recommend.? The one I use is much less web automated, but so much more flexible than the current web quoting companies online. I'm sure the PCBA online options are very good, but once you're spoiled with a PCBA firm that does not require you to pick from their stock, it's hard to migrate away...
> 
> Jim
> 
> 
> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
> 
>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
> 
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to kb8tq at n1k.org

______________________________________________________________
GreenKeys mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net

>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to gblock at sbcglobal.net  
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From jdangus at att.net  Mon Jan 25 12:58:41 2021
From: jdangus at att.net (Jeffrey Angus)
Date: Mon, 25 Jan 2021 11:58:41 -0600
Subject: [GreenKeys] PC board work.
In-Reply-To: <965050270.3573135.1611593666504@mail.yahoo.com>
References: <20210124194815.617ae442d0f8f631a9b3312d6b10cde7.3dd9cf33e1.wbe@email27.godaddy.com>
	<6181960A-5B86-4770-AD3E-86EEF7F23C1F@sbcglobal.net>
	<F1226B76-CA7D-493A-92CF-6A5068FFAABD@gmail.com>
	<087d01d6f319$c4e4a8a0$4eadf9e0$@toebes.com>
	<EE41AA00-619E-4E2C-9ABF-8B1F173D1B2E@n1k.org>
	<d5fe8441-732a-373a-2bcc-4db9608b2703@go4retro.com>
	<9EA76A01-C1EE-4E12-9257-DDCBB5581FCD@n1k.org>
	<965050270.3573135.1611593666504@mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <14705449-7f5c-1ce4-5267-0fd29d5a40db@att.net>

Okies, I guess I have a new project to do.
I downloaded KiCAD.
Unlearn ExpressPCB and learn KiCAD.

It will import files from Eagle but not from ExpressPCB.
That's the first thing I learned. ;-)



-- 
"I am a river to my people."
Jeff-1.0
WA6FWI
www.foxsmercantile.com


From go4retro at go4retro.com  Mon Jan 25 13:01:09 2021
From: go4retro at go4retro.com (RETRO Innovations)
Date: Mon, 25 Jan 2021 12:01:09 -0600
Subject: [GreenKeys] PC board work.
In-Reply-To: <14705449-7f5c-1ce4-5267-0fd29d5a40db@att.net>
References: <20210124194815.617ae442d0f8f631a9b3312d6b10cde7.3dd9cf33e1.wbe@email27.godaddy.com>
	<6181960A-5B86-4770-AD3E-86EEF7F23C1F@sbcglobal.net>
	<F1226B76-CA7D-493A-92CF-6A5068FFAABD@gmail.com>
	<087d01d6f319$c4e4a8a0$4eadf9e0$@toebes.com>
	<EE41AA00-619E-4E2C-9ABF-8B1F173D1B2E@n1k.org>
	<d5fe8441-732a-373a-2bcc-4db9608b2703@go4retro.com>
	<9EA76A01-C1EE-4E12-9257-DDCBB5581FCD@n1k.org>
	<965050270.3573135.1611593666504@mail.yahoo.com>
	<14705449-7f5c-1ce4-5267-0fd29d5a40db@att.net>
Message-ID: <85f67752-1061-a40d-4bb9-b2e6f6cdc1dc@go4retro.com>

On 1/25/2021 11:58 AM, Jeffrey Angus wrote:
> Okies, I guess I have a new project to do.
> I downloaded KiCAD.
> Unlearn ExpressPCB and learn KiCAD.
>
> It will import files from Eagle but not from ExpressPCB.
> That's the first thing I learned. ;-)
>
>
>
 From what I understand, ExpressPCB is, unfortunately, a walled off 
garden of sorts.? I think you can generate gerbers with a paid version 
of it, but little else is possible.

FOr that reason alone, I stayed away.

And yes, KiCAD consumes EAGLE files, at least those in v6+ that are the 
XML variant.

Jim

-- 
RETRO Innovations, Contemporary Gear for Classic Systems
www.go4retro.com
store.go4retro.com

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From ad7i at ad7i.net  Mon Jan 25 13:10:36 2021
From: ad7i at ad7i.net (ad7i)
Date: Mon, 25 Jan 2021 13:10:36 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] PC board work.
In-Reply-To: <85f67752-1061-a40d-4bb9-b2e6f6cdc1dc@go4retro.com>
References: <20210124194815.617ae442d0f8f631a9b3312d6b10cde7.3dd9cf33e1.wbe@email27.godaddy.com>
	<6181960A-5B86-4770-AD3E-86EEF7F23C1F@sbcglobal.net>
	<F1226B76-CA7D-493A-92CF-6A5068FFAABD@gmail.com>
	<087d01d6f319$c4e4a8a0$4eadf9e0$@toebes.com>
	<EE41AA00-619E-4E2C-9ABF-8B1F173D1B2E@n1k.org>
	<d5fe8441-732a-373a-2bcc-4db9608b2703@go4retro.com>
	<9EA76A01-C1EE-4E12-9257-DDCBB5581FCD@n1k.org>
	<965050270.3573135.1611593666504@mail.yahoo.com>
	<14705449-7f5c-1ce4-5267-0fd29d5a40db@att.net>
	<85f67752-1061-a40d-4bb9-b2e6f6cdc1dc@go4retro.com>
Message-ID: <CANpP5D4Cei9FtWBH258DLqDZTYo4WE=Wq039mkGJ=xxrsyjC+Q@mail.gmail.com>

For those interested in KiCad, I found this video series very helpful.
Probably no need for anyone in GreenKeys to see Episode 1 as that's very
basic.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c2niS9ZRBHo&t

Paul, ad7i



On Mon, Jan 25, 2021 at 1:03 PM RETRO Innovations <go4retro at go4retro.com>
wrote:

> On 1/25/2021 11:58 AM, Jeffrey Angus wrote:
>
> Okies, I guess I have a new project to do.
> I downloaded KiCAD.
> Unlearn ExpressPCB and learn KiCAD.
>
> It will import files from Eagle but not from ExpressPCB.
> That's the first thing I learned. ;-)
>
>
>
> From what I understand, ExpressPCB is, unfortunately, a walled off garden
> of sorts.  I think you can generate gerbers with a paid version of it, but
> little else is possible.
>
> FOr that reason alone, I stayed away.
>
> And yes, KiCAD consumes EAGLE files, at least those in v6+ that are the
> XML variant.
>
> Jim
>
> --
> RETRO Innovations, Contemporary Gear for Classic Systemswww.go4retro.comstore.go4retro.com
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
>
> >>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool:
> https://teletype.net/gksearch
> >>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive:
> http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
> >>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive:
> http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
> >>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool:
> http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to ad7i at ad7i.net
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From sean at rustyradios.org.uk  Mon Jan 25 13:26:11 2021
From: sean at rustyradios.org.uk (sean)
Date: Mon, 25 Jan 2021 18:26:11 +0000
Subject: [GreenKeys] PC board work.
In-Reply-To: <14705449-7f5c-1ce4-5267-0fd29d5a40db@att.net>
Message-ID: <mailman.8.1611599189.30876.greenkeys@mailman.qth.net>

Yes Jeff, KiCad is the way to go, outputs direct to Gerber!73SeanM1ECYSent from my Galaxy
-------- Original message --------From: Jeffrey Angus <jdangus at att.net> Date: 25/01/2021  17:59  (GMT+00:00) To: greenkeys at mailman.qth.net Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] PC board work. Okies, I guess I have a new project to do.I downloaded KiCAD.Unlearn ExpressPCB and learn KiCAD.It will import files from Eagle but not from ExpressPCB.That's the first thing I learned. ;-)-- "I am a river to my people."Jeff-1.0WA6FWIwww.foxsmercantile.com______________________________________________________________GreenKeys mailing listHome: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeysHelp: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htmPost: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.htmlThis list hosted by: http://www.qsl.netPlease help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.htmlMessage delivered to sean at rustyradios.org.uk
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From kb8tq at n1k.org  Mon Jan 25 13:34:17 2021
From: kb8tq at n1k.org (Bob kb8tq)
Date: Mon, 25 Jan 2021 13:34:17 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] PC board work.
In-Reply-To: <CANpP5D4Cei9FtWBH258DLqDZTYo4WE=Wq039mkGJ=xxrsyjC+Q@mail.gmail.com>
References: <20210124194815.617ae442d0f8f631a9b3312d6b10cde7.3dd9cf33e1.wbe@email27.godaddy.com>
	<6181960A-5B86-4770-AD3E-86EEF7F23C1F@sbcglobal.net>
	<F1226B76-CA7D-493A-92CF-6A5068FFAABD@gmail.com>
	<087d01d6f319$c4e4a8a0$4eadf9e0$@toebes.com>
	<EE41AA00-619E-4E2C-9ABF-8B1F173D1B2E@n1k.org>
	<d5fe8441-732a-373a-2bcc-4db9608b2703@go4retro.com>
	<9EA76A01-C1EE-4E12-9257-DDCBB5581FCD@n1k.org>
	<965050270.3573135.1611593666504@mail.yahoo.com>
	<14705449-7f5c-1ce4-5267-0fd29d5a40db@att.net>
	<85f67752-1061-a40d-4bb9-b2e6f6cdc1dc@go4retro.com>
	<CANpP5D4Cei9FtWBH258DLqDZTYo4WE=Wq039mkGJ=xxrsyjC+Q@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <00CDE22F-D69F-425B-89B8-95B492C4C5FA@n1k.org>

Hi

Eagle and KiCAD both have a lot of videos to show you this and that.
I will not claim that they all are *good* videos :) There also are lists /
forums / and a whole lot of blogs showing you what?s what. 

With either program, pick a simple project. Maybe a loop supply with
a couple of connectors on it. A full up TU, probably not. The idea is
to do something somewhat useful and to do it quickly. It?s the only way
to work out just how all the steps lock in to each other ?.

Start with schematic entry. Fill in the parts list. Do the layout. Do the checks 
on the layout. Generate Gerbers. Send the Gerbers to JLPCB (or any board 
house). See what their design checks say about the layout. You want to
go through it all each time. That keeps you from having a disaster when 
you do that next step for the first time. 

Do that for maybe three designs. You don?t have to order them, but as cheap
as boards are ? why not? I?d wait until all three are done to place the order.
Shipping will cost as much as the boards will, even done as a group. 

Each design you do will ?teach? you this or that. As you run into gotcha?s
you will correct your process. Go back and check that first design once 
the third one is done :) :)

The world out there is metric. 10 cm x 10 cm is the ?magic? board size 
these days. Stay at (or below) that size and things are cheap cheap 
cheap. It may not be ideal for every project, but understand the cost 
if you go bigger. 

You *will* need shelf space to store all those boards ?.. I have evidence
to support that :)

Bob

> On Jan 25, 2021, at 1:10 PM, ad7i <ad7i at ad7i.net> wrote:
> 
> For those interested in KiCad, I found this video series very helpful.  Probably no need for anyone in GreenKeys to see Episode 1 as that's very basic.
> 
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c2niS9ZRBHo&t <https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c2niS9ZRBHo&t> 
> 
> Paul, ad7i
> 
> 
> 
> On Mon, Jan 25, 2021 at 1:03 PM RETRO Innovations <go4retro at go4retro.com <mailto:go4retro at go4retro.com>> wrote:
> On 1/25/2021 11:58 AM, Jeffrey Angus wrote:
>> Okies, I guess I have a new project to do. 
>> I downloaded KiCAD. 
>> Unlearn ExpressPCB and learn KiCAD. 
>> 
>> It will import files from Eagle but not from ExpressPCB. 
>> That's the first thing I learned. ;-) 
>> 
>> 
>> 
> From what I understand, ExpressPCB is, unfortunately, a walled off garden of sorts.  I think you can generate gerbers with a paid version of it, but little else is possible.
> 
> FOr that reason alone, I stayed away.
> 
> And yes, KiCAD consumes EAGLE files, at least those in v6+ that are the XML variant.
> 
> Jim
> 
> -- 
> RETRO Innovations, Contemporary Gear for Classic Systems
> www.go4retro.com <http://www.go4retro.com/>
> store.go4retro.com <http://store.go4retro.com/>______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys <http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys>
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm <http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm>
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net <mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net>
> 
> >>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch <https://teletype.net/gksearch>
> >>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/ <http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/>
> >>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html <http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html>
> >>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html <http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html>
> 
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net <http://www.qsl.net/>
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html <http://www.qsl.net/donate.html>
> Message delivered to ad7i at ad7i.net <mailto:ad7i at ad7i.net>______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
> 
>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
> 
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to kb8tq at n1k.org

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From highpwr at bellsouth.net  Mon Jan 25 13:37:08 2021
From: highpwr at bellsouth.net (highpwr at bellsouth.net)
Date: Mon, 25 Jan 2021 13:37:08 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] MICRODEC MD200
In-Reply-To: <00c101d6f2be$7b43fe90$71cbfbb0$@bellsouth.net>
References: <00c101d6f2be$7b43fe90$71cbfbb0$.ref@bellsouth.net>
	<00c101d6f2be$7b43fe90$71cbfbb0$@bellsouth.net>
Message-ID: <036801d6f349$1736d540$45a47fc0$@bellsouth.net>

BTW, you all have been discussing the XR2211, opened the MICRODEC up and one
of the ICs in it is an XR2211CP.

 

Steve

KM4V 

 

From: greenkeys-bounces at mailman.qth.net <greenkeys-bounces at mailman.qth.net>
On Behalf Of highpwr at bellsouth.net
Sent: Sunday, January 24, 2021 9:05 PM
To: greenkeys at mailman.qth.net
Subject: [GreenKeys] MICRODEC MD200

 

Anybody have any info on the Somerset Electronics MICRODEC MD200 decoder?

I picked one up and its companion VP50 Video / Printer interface module out
of a guys $1.00 box back in 2019.

I'm looking for any info , and in particular manuals if some one has them.

Haven't been able to find too much of anything on these units, ant and all
assistance greatly appreciated.

Steve

KM4V

 

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From go4retro at go4retro.com  Mon Jan 25 14:23:27 2021
From: go4retro at go4retro.com (RETRO Innovations)
Date: Mon, 25 Jan 2021 13:23:27 -0600
Subject: [GreenKeys] PC board work.
In-Reply-To: <00CDE22F-D69F-425B-89B8-95B492C4C5FA@n1k.org>
References: <20210124194815.617ae442d0f8f631a9b3312d6b10cde7.3dd9cf33e1.wbe@email27.godaddy.com>
	<6181960A-5B86-4770-AD3E-86EEF7F23C1F@sbcglobal.net>
	<F1226B76-CA7D-493A-92CF-6A5068FFAABD@gmail.com>
	<087d01d6f319$c4e4a8a0$4eadf9e0$@toebes.com>
	<EE41AA00-619E-4E2C-9ABF-8B1F173D1B2E@n1k.org>
	<d5fe8441-732a-373a-2bcc-4db9608b2703@go4retro.com>
	<9EA76A01-C1EE-4E12-9257-DDCBB5581FCD@n1k.org>
	<965050270.3573135.1611593666504@mail.yahoo.com>
	<14705449-7f5c-1ce4-5267-0fd29d5a40db@att.net>
	<85f67752-1061-a40d-4bb9-b2e6f6cdc1dc@go4retro.com>
	<CANpP5D4Cei9FtWBH258DLqDZTYo4WE=Wq039mkGJ=xxrsyjC+Q@mail.gmail.com>
	<00CDE22F-D69F-425B-89B8-95B492C4C5FA@n1k.org>
Message-ID: <42bb0013-d5c2-a27d-b32c-636c972231e1@go4retro.com>

On 1/25/2021 12:34 PM, Bob kb8tq wrote:
> Hi
>
> Eagle and KiCAD both have a lot of videos to show you this and that.
> I will not claim that they all are *good* videos :) There also are lists /
> forums / and a whole lot of blogs showing you what?s what.

I'd also suggest grabbing PCB files from open source projects to play 
with and see how things were done.



From wa3frp at gmail.com  Mon Jan 25 15:03:01 2021
From: wa3frp at gmail.com (Russ Miller)
Date: Mon, 25 Jan 2021 15:03:01 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] Collins KY-45/FRT-5 Needs a new home
Message-ID: <CAMVk04CjrdPMLinWTyxVs4nTsNPdH9-HsQEHNNGyLECfjCfiEQ@mail.gmail.com>

Here is the Cloonins KY-45/FRT-5 Frequency Shift Kyer that needs a new
home.  The technical details are here:

http://www.navy-radio.com/manuals/ky45-pages.pdf

The unit is new in the original shipping crate.  The cost is zero, the
original price that I paid when I received this unit a number of years
ago.  The terms are "as is - where is".  The first person to come by, gets
the unit. I will not be able to ship this gear and the price to ship would
be too high anyway.

I'm in Eastern Pennsylvania, about 30 miles west of Philadelphia and close
to both the Pennsylvania Turnpike and US--202.

Pictures attached as well. Please send me a private message to discuss this
great piece of Collins FSK gear and arrange for pickup.

Thanks,

Russ WA3FRP
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From macbax1 at gmail.com  Mon Jan 25 15:52:41 2021
From: macbax1 at gmail.com (Joe Clanin)
Date: Mon, 25 Jan 2021 14:52:41 -0600
Subject: [GreenKeys] Small Tins For Storing 11/16" Tape
Message-ID: <CAK1UwOZo4XYdt-6s6By0LFn6CNwAgYCKuXe7AHdzPuHWr7R8SQ@mail.gmail.com>

Hi All,

I thought I would pass along that the "2 oz. Shallow Seamless Tin Silver"
found here:
https://www.containerstore.com/s/shallow-seamless-tins/d?q=Tin&productId=10030953
is
the perfect size for storing a modest length of punched 11/16" tape. They
are $1.19 each.

Perhaps other folks have better solutions but I find that they work quite
well. Picture attached.

-Joe
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From harold at w6iwi.org  Mon Jan 25 16:04:27 2021
From: harold at w6iwi.org (Harold Hallikainen)
Date: Mon, 25 Jan 2021 13:04:27 -0800
Subject: [GreenKeys] Small Tins For Storing 11/16" Tape
In-Reply-To: <CAK1UwOZo4XYdt-6s6By0LFn6CNwAgYCKuXe7AHdzPuHWr7R8SQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAK1UwOZo4XYdt-6s6By0LFn6CNwAgYCKuXe7AHdzPuHWr7R8SQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <8fd2b14856516b0a916ba71d6476cbf7.squirrel@mai.hallikainen.org>


> Hi All,
>
> I thought I would pass along that the "2 oz. Shallow Seamless Tin Silver"
> found here:
> https://www.containerstore.com/s/shallow-seamless-tins/d?q=Tin&productId=10030953
> is
> the perfect size for storing a modest length of punched 11/16" tape. They
> are $1.19 each.
>
> Perhaps other folks have better solutions but I find that they work quite
> well. Picture attached.
>
> -Joe

I'm thinking of using some sort of box with dividers 1 inch apart, like an
index card box. So far I have a shoebox with index cards taped across
every inch. But, so far I only have two tapes!

Harold



-- 
FCC Rules Updated Daily at http://www.hallikainen.com
Not sent from an iPhone.

From jdangus at att.net  Mon Jan 25 17:31:09 2021
From: jdangus at att.net (Jeffrey Angus)
Date: Mon, 25 Jan 2021 16:31:09 -0600
Subject: [GreenKeys] PC board work.
In-Reply-To: <85f67752-1061-a40d-4bb9-b2e6f6cdc1dc@go4retro.com>
References: <20210124194815.617ae442d0f8f631a9b3312d6b10cde7.3dd9cf33e1.wbe@email27.godaddy.com>
	<6181960A-5B86-4770-AD3E-86EEF7F23C1F@sbcglobal.net>
	<F1226B76-CA7D-493A-92CF-6A5068FFAABD@gmail.com>
	<087d01d6f319$c4e4a8a0$4eadf9e0$@toebes.com>
	<EE41AA00-619E-4E2C-9ABF-8B1F173D1B2E@n1k.org>
	<d5fe8441-732a-373a-2bcc-4db9608b2703@go4retro.com>
	<9EA76A01-C1EE-4E12-9257-DDCBB5581FCD@n1k.org>
	<965050270.3573135.1611593666504@mail.yahoo.com>
	<14705449-7f5c-1ce4-5267-0fd29d5a40db@att.net>
	<85f67752-1061-a40d-4bb9-b2e6f6cdc1dc@go4retro.com>
Message-ID: <53a243a8-fbd0-21fd-8151-e35635fbd9fb@att.net>

On 1/25/21 12:01 PM, RETRO Innovations wrote:
> From what I understand, ExpressPCB is, unfortunately,
> a walled off garden of sorts.? I think you can generate
> gerbers with a paid version of it, but little else is
> possible.
While I had gotten very proficient at ExpressPCB, having to go
through a 3rd party vendor to generate the Gerber files was an
issue.


-- 
"I am a river to my people."
Jeff-1.0
WA6FWI
www.foxsmercantile.com

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From John at tubetestingpros.com  Mon Jan 25 18:02:58 2021
From: John at tubetestingpros.com (John)
Date: Mon, 25 Jan 2021 15:02:58 -0800
Subject: [GreenKeys] Design Software
Message-ID: <618b7f30-679e-eed1-492a-e923ba45c32d@tubetestingpros.com>


 ?To further indulge in (sort-of) off-topicness [topicality? ] -

I typically use Ki-Cad and PCB123.

Also I have a great amount of fun with MicroCap-12, a very elaborate 
design and simulator package by www.spectrum-soft.com. They are no 
longer in business (after nearly 40 years) but the Software is available 
for free download along with all the documentation, and there are also 
plenty of resources on their website.

For us Old Guys (and the Old at heart...) it has a /huge/ library of 
devices, including many, many vacuum tubes, both specific types (ie. 
'6146') and generics (ie. 'pentode').

I like it much better than LTSpice, and I've delivered several projects 
done entirely in MicroCap, then finished by just "plugging in" the parts....


So you can put away that Deci Log-Log Duplex Trig slide rule and K+E 
Logarithmic Graph Paper, and download MicroCap!


Cheers

John KB6SCO

Carson City NV


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From epvgk at limpoc.com  Mon Jan 25 18:56:11 2021
From: epvgk at limpoc.com (eric)
Date: Mon, 25 Jan 2021 15:56:11 -0800
Subject: [GreenKeys] XR2211 demodulator circuit boards?
In-Reply-To: <1642323008.4862425.1611548114350@mail.yahoo.com>
References: <2072683957.4657899.1611466303451.ref@mail.yahoo.com>
	<2072683957.4657899.1611466303451@mail.yahoo.com>
	<88ade8cd0555b0e7615b2676c321242c.squirrel@mai.hallikainen.org>
	<3820057.4675674.1611477970434@mail.yahoo.com>
	<20210124085815.GA17885@limpoc.com>
	<1642323008.4862425.1611548114350@mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <464ba2f44c24c993b6fafc6ba80e24e7@limpoc.com>

On 2021-01-24 20:15, hwhall at compuserve.com wrote:

> So, those were available for sale but no longer, correct? Is there perhaps a photoetch mask available for making one or two the DIY way?
> 
> Wayne 
> WB4OGM

Hi Wayne - 

I made a bunch of them and distributed them on the list in (i think)
2016. The run I did sold out a while ago, 
but some other people may have made some or have extras they would part
with. If you only need one 
I may still have an extra unpopulated board or even an assembled one
lying around. 

If my copy of Eagle still functions I can see if I can export a
postscript file of the copper layer for 
photo etching, though my confidence in getting the size/scale exactly
right isn't 100%.  I think Steve Garrison is converting it to KiCad,
too. 

You're also welcome to the Eagle files themselves and/or the gerbers
generated from it of course. Nothing proprietary here! 

Since that design there's been some turnover in parts availability - the
original optoisolator/solid state relay is no longer made, but there are
some quite superior ones sharing the same pinouts and with better
parameters now. Just a quick parametric search on DigiKey's part
selector shows these as likely good candidates, but note I haven't
actually tested these. 

https://www.digikey.com/en/products/detail/toshiba-semiconductor-and-storage/TLP797J-F/1823640
https://www.digikey.com/en/products/detail/vishay-semiconductor-opto-division/LH1550AT1/4072654
https://www.digikey.com/en/products/detail/vishay-semiconductor-opto-division/VOR1121A6/8023026


eric 

-----Original Message-----
From: epvgk at limpoc.com
To: hwhall at compuserve.com
Cc: greenkeys at mailman.qth.net <greenkeys at mailman.qth.net>
Sent: Sun, Jan 24, 2021 1:58 am
Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] XR2211 demodulator circuit boards?

On Sun, Jan 24, 2021 at 08:46:10AM +0000, hwhall at compuserve.com wrote:
> I'd encountered some of those pages when I was googling but still no PCB artwork. If someone has already laid them out, I could skip reinventing it.
> 
> WayneWB4OGM

Here's the one I did that got manufactured that people on the list have
a bunch of. 

https://www.heepy.net/index.php/RTTY_demodulator_using_NJM2211

I can dig up gerbers or whatever if you want!

eric

> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Harold Hallikainen <harold at w6iwi.org>
> To: greenkeys at mailman.qth.net
> Sent: Sat, Jan 23, 2021 11:19 pm
> Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] XR2211 demodulator circuit boards?
> 
> 
> > Are there any printed circuit boards for building an XR2211 based RTTY
> > demodulator? ? Google shows me all kinds of articles from complex to
> > over-simplified but doesn't lead me to any PCB artwork or vendors.
> > I'm thinking I might build a demod to run a Model 15 from a laptop running
> > MMTTY. The program only outputs tones (no on-off output to key a loop
> > directly) so a PLL demod should be fine since noise won't be an issue. Or
> > should I look at something even smaller/simpler?
> > Thanks!WayneWB4OGM______________________________________________________________
> 
> There's an evaluation board at
> https://media.digikey.com/pdf/Data%20Sheets/MaxLinear%20PDFs/XR-2206-11-12_Man.pdf [1]
> . I'd be tempted to wire wrap it, though.
> 
> Several products I did using the XR2211 are at
> 
> http://bh.hallikainen.org//wiki/uploads/HaroldHallikainen/20130416125339_Part5.pdf
> 
> http://bh.hallikainen.org//wiki/uploads/HaroldHallikainen/Harold_018.pdf
> 
> http://bh.hallikainen.org//wiki/uploads/HaroldHallikainen/20130416125339_Part1.pdf
> 
> http://bh.hallikainen.org//wiki/uploads/HaroldHallikainen/Harold_011.pdf
> 
> http://bh.hallikainen.org//wiki/uploads/HaroldHallikainen/20130416125553.pdf#page=11
> 
> The XR2211 is a fun chip. Before that, I used the NE565, but the XR2211
> includes the data comparator, a carrier detect, etc. The XR2206 is also a
> nice chip. It will generate a square wave, triangle wave, and sine waves.
> It can do linear FM, AM (including double sideband suppressed carrier),
> and FSK. The FSK circuit has a logic input that switches between two
> timing resistors. But, during the transition, the frequency goes to zero
> for a very short time. I'd probably use the linear FM circuit and drive it
> with the data after running it through a low pass filter to limit
> bandwidth. It IS a nice chip, though. I used it as an upconverter (local
> oscillator and mixer) to upconvert subcarriers on FM broadcast stations to
> 455 kHz where the signal then went through ceramic filters, IF amplifier,
> and a ceramic discriminator.
> 
> Fun stuff!
> 
> Harold
> https://w6iwi.org [2]
> 
> 
> -- 
> FCC Rules Updated Daily at http://www.hallikainen.com [3]
> Not sent from an iPhone.
> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
> 
> >>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
> >>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
> >>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
> >>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
> 
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net [4]
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to hwhall at compuserve.com

> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
> 
> >>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
> >>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
> >>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
> >>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
> 
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net [4]
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to epvgk at limpoc.com 

______________________________________________________________
GreenKeys mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net

>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net [4]
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to hwhall at compuserve.com 

 

Links:
------
[1]
https://media.digikey.com/pdf/Data%2520Sheets/MaxLinear%2520PDFs/XR-2206-11-12_Man.pdf
[2] https://w6iwi.org/
[3] http://www.hallikainen.com/
[4] http://www.qsl.net/
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From epvgk at limpoc.com  Mon Jan 25 19:05:39 2021
From: epvgk at limpoc.com (eric)
Date: Mon, 25 Jan 2021 16:05:39 -0800
Subject: [GreenKeys] XR2211 demodulator circuit boards?
In-Reply-To: <464ba2f44c24c993b6fafc6ba80e24e7@limpoc.com>
References: <2072683957.4657899.1611466303451.ref@mail.yahoo.com>
	<2072683957.4657899.1611466303451@mail.yahoo.com>
	<88ade8cd0555b0e7615b2676c321242c.squirrel@mai.hallikainen.org>
	<3820057.4675674.1611477970434@mail.yahoo.com>
	<20210124085815.GA17885@limpoc.com>
	<1642323008.4862425.1611548114350@mail.yahoo.com>
	<464ba2f44c24c993b6fafc6ba80e24e7@limpoc.com>
Message-ID: <fcf76e54a198572c48b4d16bffe6e44a@limpoc.com>

Just thought I'd pack up all the stuff I have for what people called the
"volpe demod board" in case anyone wants to re-use some of my work,
since I've told a few people I'd send it over. 

Here's a zip file with the Eagle (v7.7) design files, the Gerbers
generated from them (layer descriptions in "layers.txt") and some parts
lists with DigiKey part numbers. Note you'll need to substitute a more
up to date solid state relay part, see my last email. 

eric
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From gblock at sbcglobal.net  Mon Jan 25 19:47:55 2021
From: gblock at sbcglobal.net (Gerry Block)
Date: Tue, 26 Jan 2021 00:47:55 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [GreenKeys] PC board work.
In-Reply-To: <F1226B76-CA7D-493A-92CF-6A5068FFAABD@gmail.com>
References: <20210124194815.617ae442d0f8f631a9b3312d6b10cde7.3dd9cf33e1.wbe@email27.godaddy.com>
	<6181960A-5B86-4770-AD3E-86EEF7F23C1F@sbcglobal.net>
	<F1226B76-CA7D-493A-92CF-6A5068FFAABD@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <1797042226.18618.1611622075783@mail.yahoo.com>

 Great.? Thanks.? Will look into it.
GerryAD6MC

    On Monday, January 25, 2021, 3:05:42 AM PST, Steve Garrison <steve.n4tty at gmail.com> wrote:  
 
 For you folks that haven't used layout software and dislike paid and/or subscription software as much as Eric and I do, might I suggest KiCad.
They will soon be releasing v6 and I'm currently trying out the nightly builds of v5.99 which will become v6 when it's ready for prime time.
Have been using and learned KiCad on v5. ?It is free, very widely used, and its main support comes from CERN. The folks with that big particle accelerator in Switzerland. ?There is a paid version if you just have to have a paid version, or you can make donations to help support the free version.
At least check it out.

Steve G./N4TTYSent from my iPhone
On Jan 25, 2021, at 1:59 AM, Gerry <gblock at sbcglobal.net> wrote:



Unbelievable.?Thanks for update.?Takes skill to deal with 0402!
Gerry

Sent from my iPhone

On Jan 24, 2021, at 6:49 PM, Gil Smith <gil at baudot.net> wrote:



?I have used Eagle since 2006 when I splurged and bought the full-up 16-layer version with the auto-router.? The autorouter was only kinda useful to me on one really dense digital board, and I never renewed that option when I upgraded.? I have never gone beyond six layers;? I mostly do 4 layers, but sometimes 2 or 6.? 
<rant>Then Eagle was bought out by Autocad, and it went to a subscription plan, which I hate.? So I will happily use my several-year-old version forever.? I have the final non-subscription versions of photoshop and illustrator as well, so bite me Adobe.? This subscription software stuff really pisses me off.</rant>
Eagle has its quirks, but I can do anything I want or need with it.? I do a lot of mixed-signal stuff:? analog conditioning, 24bit adcs, micros...? I regularly hand-assemble down to 0.5mm pitch and 0402 -- just me, two pairs of reading glasses, and quality solder wick :}
gil

gil smith, AF7EZ
greenkeys moderator
gil at baudot.net


-------- Original Message --------
Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] PC board work.
From: Gerry Block <gblock at sbcglobal.net>
Date: Sun, January 24, 2021 6:46 pm
To: Jeffrey Angus <jdangus at att.net>, Gil Smith <gil at baudot.net>
Cc: greenkeys <greenkeys at mailman.qth.net>

 Gil,
? What layout program do you use?
GerryAD6MC

    On Sunday, January 24, 2021, 5:10:00 PM PST, Gil Smith <gil at baudot.net> wrote:  
 
 Hey Jeff:
Where do you get your boards?? For the last few years I have been using pcbway in China:https://www.pcbway.com/
They have been awesome and I have done dozens of 2- and 4-layer boards there.? About a week turn plus a a few days shipping (get DHL, not fedex).? Instant quote on the home page.? Best prices I have found (though I sometimes get hit with a 25% tariff fee).? Variety of soldermask colors avail (some cost extra).? I like red, blue, and black -- the yellow is gross.? Arrays are easy.? Routing and V-groove not too costly.
They do full-turn assembly though I have not used that service.
thx, gil

gil smith, AF7EZ
greenkeys moderator
gil at baudot.net

 
  -------- Original Message --------
 Subject: [GreenKeys] PC board work.
 From: Jeffrey Angus <jdangus at att.net>
 Date: Sun, January 24, 2021 12:33 pm
 To: greenkeys <greenkeys at mailman.qth.net>
 
 This is what I do in my spare time now that I'm retired.
 I use Express PCB software.
 A few years back I designed a two speed motor controller
 for my Lorenz Lo-15c.
 Last year I did a signal converter for Sen Williams to go
 from on/off keying to bi-polar for his Creed TTYs.
 
 All I need is a schematic.
 And you get the PC Board schematic redrawn for ExpressPCB
 and the PC Board layouts.
 
 And no, I don't charge for this.
 Although, I'm not too proud to accept donations, if you're
 feeling guilty about it.
 
 -- 
 "I am a river to my people."
 Jeff-1.0
 WA6FWI
 www.foxsmercantile.com
 
 ______________________________________________________________
 GreenKeys mailing list
 Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
 Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
 Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
 
 >>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
 >>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
 >>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
 >>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
 
 This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
 Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
 Message delivered to gil at baudot.net  
 ______________________________________________________________
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Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net

>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
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______________________________________________________________
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Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net




Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch






2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/






1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html






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2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/






1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html






Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html




This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to steve.n4tty at gmail.com
______________________________________________________________
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Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
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>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html

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From jim.w2jc at gmail.com  Mon Jan 25 23:36:43 2021
From: jim.w2jc at gmail.com (Jim Cooper)
Date: Mon, 25 Jan 2021 23:36:43 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] 88mH Toroides
Message-ID: <600F9C5B.29621.1985D79F@jim.w2jc.gmail.com>

hmmm...  I'm starting to feel like the 
group peddler ... but I've been protecting 
all this stuff for decades -- time to start 
supplying you guys!! 

There's been discussion of 88mH toroids 
recently, so IF anyone is going to build the 
audio filters like we did back in the 50s and 
60s, here's your chance with genuine, 'the 
real thing' toroids!

I used to build, tune and sell mark and space 
filters back when I was in high school, and 
these are from then ... 



If the graphic doesn't come thru with the email, 
check out page 5 at   http://bit.ly/TTY-stuff

Jim  W2JC 

ps:  if you need any particular value of capacitors, 
let me know and I'll include them as a gift.   ;)) 




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From harold at w6iwi.org  Mon Jan 25 23:59:53 2021
From: harold at w6iwi.org (Harold Hallikainen)
Date: Mon, 25 Jan 2021 20:59:53 -0800
Subject: [GreenKeys] 88mH Toroides
In-Reply-To: <600F9C5B.29621.1985D79F@jim.w2jc.gmail.com>
References: <600F9C5B.29621.1985D79F@jim.w2jc.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <afd9ca501a99398c3941587510a8d8cd.squirrel@mai.hallikainen.org>


> hmmm...  I'm starting to feel like the
> group peddler ... but I've been protecting
> all this stuff for decades -- time to start
> supplying you guys!!
>
> There's been discussion of 88mH toroids
> recently, so IF anyone is going to build the
> audio filters like we did back in the 50s and
> 60s, here's your chance with genuine, 'the
> real thing' toroids!
>
> I used to build, tune and sell mark and space
> filters back when I was in high school, and
> these are from then ...
>

Here's some stuff on the origin of those toroids:

http://bh.hallikainen.org/thg/monitor/Monitor_1919-05.pdf#page=37

http://bh.hallikainen.org/thg/monitor/Monitor_1926-04.pdf#page=17

http://bh.hallikainen.org/thg/monitor/Monitor_1924-11.pdf#page=16 wrapping
magnetic material around the wire to create a "loading coil"

Harold
https://w6iwi.org






-- 
FCC Rules Updated Daily at http://www.hallikainen.com
Not sent from an iPhone.

From gil at baudot.net  Tue Jan 26 01:24:17 2021
From: gil at baudot.net (Gil Smith)
Date: Mon, 25 Jan 2021 23:24:17 -0700
Subject: [GreenKeys] PC board work.
Message-ID: <20210125232417.617ae442d0f8f631a9b3312d6b10cde7.b54a87220b.wbe@email27.godaddy.com>

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From steve.n4tty at gmail.com  Tue Jan 26 05:31:47 2021
From: steve.n4tty at gmail.com (Steve Garrison)
Date: Tue, 26 Jan 2021 05:31:47 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] PC board work.
In-Reply-To: <20210125232417.617ae442d0f8f631a9b3312d6b10cde7.b54a87220b.wbe@email27.godaddy.com>
References: <20210125232417.617ae442d0f8f631a9b3312d6b10cde7.b54a87220b.wbe@email27.godaddy.com>
Message-ID: <154501d6f3ce$73ec3200$5bc49600$@gmail.com>

Can?t answer all your questions Gil as I have never used Eagle.

 

The netlist question I can answer, I think.  In the current version, v5.1.x, you have to manually generate the netlist when you make changes in the schematic, then import those changes into the PCB layout.  They are soon to release v6.0 and that becomes more like what you describe for Eagle.  I?m currently trying out what is referred to as v5.99 nightly builds which will become 6.0 when it is ready for prime time.  I?m just now working on the schematic for Volpe?s Demod board, my first project in v5.99, and have not reached the ?netlist? stage.  I?ll let you know how it works in a short while.  I plan to order 5 boards from PCBWay when I complete the setup and see how well I made out with the new version.

 

Give it a shot and see what you think.  It?s free so it is just your time on the learning curve you?ve got to lose.  And since you are well versed in Eagle maybe the learning curve won?t be quite as steep as it was for me.  I?d say go ahead and try 5.99, but then there aren?t any ?tutor? YouTube videos available yet.

 

Steve G./N4TTY

 

From: Gil Smith <gil at baudot.net> 
Sent: Tuesday, January 26, 2021 1:24 AM
To: Steve Garrison <steve.n4tty at gmail.com>; Gerry <gblock at sbcglobal.net>
Cc: greenkeys <greenkeys at mailman.qth.net>
Subject: RE: [GreenKeys] PC board work.

 

I also have hear good things about kicad, but never tried it.  Interesting that it can import eagle files -- does it keep the schematic and board layout netlists in sync like eagle?  

 

What about importing eagle libraries?  In any pcb program, your constantly-evolving library is your life-blood.  The library is not simply a collection of schematic symbols and physical footprints, but needs to allow for selecting different physical parts with just a click -- Ahh, my layout is getting too tight for that opa2376 in the soic8 so I need to change to the vssop...  There are other subtle things like being able to manually define say four small square solderpaste openings for the ground pad under some chips and not the entire pad, since that would be way too much solder under there.  The library editor needs to give you control like that when you are building parts.

 

Can kicad do things like swell soldermask a couple of mils, and shrink the solderpaste also, as needed?  Pad in via?  Tented vias?  

 

It is also handy in eagle to have the drc checker on the board -- I define the rules I want to enforce (copper-to-copper min spacing...) and save a named drc rules set.  Then check against it before generating gerbers.  I usually have a few clearance errors to fix.  The erc in the schematic module is less handy, though it has caught an occasion or two where a net didn't actually connect to a pin.

 

Speaking of gerbers, I like gerberlogix for peeking at them before sending them off to fab.  Import the exellon drill file and all the layers and then turn on or off the layers you want to look at (top-copper-only, then add solderpaste, then soldermask...).  You can zoom and check out the gerbers to ensure everything looks decent before buying the boards.  https://www.easylogix.de/products_detail.php?prog_id=1

 

gil

 

 

gil smith, AF7EZ
greenkeys moderator
gil at baudot.net <mailto:gil at baudot.net> 

 

-------- Original Message --------
Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] PC board work.
From: Steve Garrison <steve.n4tty at gmail.com <mailto:steve.n4tty at gmail.com> >
Date: Mon, January 25, 2021 4:04 am
To: Gerry <gblock at sbcglobal.net <mailto:gblock at sbcglobal.net> >
Cc: Gil Smith <gil at baudot.net <mailto:gil at baudot.net> >, greenkeys <greenkeys at mailman.qth.net>

For you folks that haven't used layout software and dislike paid and/or subscription software as much as Eric and I do, might I suggest KiCad.

 

They will soon be releasing v6 and I'm currently trying out the nightly builds of v5.99 which will become v6 when it's ready for prime time.

 

Have been using and learned KiCad on v5.  It is free, very widely used, and its main support comes from CERN. The folks with that big particle accelerator in Switzerland.  There is a paid version if you just have to have a paid version, or you can make donations to help support the free version.

 

At least check it out.

Steve G./N4TTY

Sent from my iPhone


On Jan 25, 2021, at 1:59 AM, Gerry <gblock at sbcglobal.net <mailto:gblock at sbcglobal.net> > wrote:

Unbelievable. 

Thanks for update. 

Takes skill to deal with 0402!

 

Gerry

Sent from my iPhone





On Jan 24, 2021, at 6:49 PM, Gil Smith <gil at baudot.net <mailto:gil at baudot.net> > wrote:

?

I have used Eagle since 2006 when I splurged and bought the full-up 16-layer version with the auto-router.  The autorouter was only kinda useful to me on one really dense digital board, and I never renewed that option when I upgraded.  I have never gone beyond six layers;  I mostly do 4 layers, but sometimes 2 or 6.  

 

<rant>

Then Eagle was bought out by Autocad, and it went to a subscription plan, which I hate.  So I will happily use my several-year-old version forever.  I have the final non-subscription versions of photoshop and illustrator as well, so bite me Adobe.  This subscription software stuff really pisses me off.

</rant>

 

Eagle has its quirks, but I can do anything I want or need with it.  I do a lot of mixed-signal stuff:  analog conditioning, 24bit adcs, micros...  I regularly hand-assemble down to 0.5mm pitch and 0402 -- just me, two pairs of reading glasses, and quality solder wick :}

 

gil

 

 

gil smith, AF7EZ
greenkeys moderator
gil at baudot.net <mailto:gil at baudot.net> 

 

-------- Original Message --------
Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] PC board work.
From: Gerry Block <gblock at sbcglobal.net <mailto:gblock at sbcglobal.net> >
Date: Sun, January 24, 2021 6:46 pm
To: Jeffrey Angus <jdangus at att.net <mailto:jdangus at att.net> >, Gil Smith <gil at baudot.net <mailto:gil at baudot.net> >
Cc: greenkeys <greenkeys at mailman.qth.net <mailto:greenkeys at mailman.qth.net> >

Gil,

 

  What layout program do you use?

 

Gerry

AD6MC

 

On Sunday, January 24, 2021, 5:10:00 PM PST, Gil Smith <gil at baudot.net <mailto:gil at baudot.net> > wrote: 

 

 

Hey Jeff:

 

Where do you get your boards?  For the last few years I have been using pcbway in China:

https://www.pcbway.com/

 

They have been awesome and I have done dozens of 2- and 4-layer boards there.  About a week turn plus a a few days shipping (get DHL, not fedex).  Instant quote on the home page.  Best prices I have found (though I sometimes get hit with a 25% tariff fee).  Variety of soldermask colors avail (some cost extra).  I like red, blue, and black -- the yellow is gross.  Arrays are easy.  Routing and V-groove not too costly.

 

They do full-turn assembly though I have not used that service.

 

thx, gil

 

 

gil smith, AF7EZ
greenkeys moderator
gil at baudot.net <mailto:gil at baudot.net> 

 

-------- Original Message --------
Subject: [GreenKeys] PC board work.
From: Jeffrey Angus <jdangus at att.net <mailto:jdangus at att.net> >
Date: Sun, January 24, 2021 12:33 pm
To: greenkeys <greenkeys at mailman.qth.net <mailto:greenkeys at mailman.qth.net> >

This is what I do in my spare time now that I'm retired.
I use Express PCB software.
A few years back I designed a two speed motor controller
for my Lorenz Lo-15c.
Last year I did a signal converter for Sen Williams to go
from on/off keying to bi-polar for his Creed TTYs.

All I need is a schematic.
And you get the PC Board schematic redrawn for ExpressPCB
and the PC Board layouts.

And no, I don't charge for this.
Although, I'm not too proud to accept donations, if you're
feeling guilty about it.

-- 
"I am a river to my people."
Jeff-1.0
WA6FWI
www.foxsmercantile.com <http://www.foxsmercantile.com> 


  _____  


______________________________________________________________
GreenKeys mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net

>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
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Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net <mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net> 

>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
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Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net




Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch

2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/

1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html

Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html


This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to gblock at sbcglobal.net <mailto:gblock at sbcglobal.net> 

______________________________________________________________
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Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net




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2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/

1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html

Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html


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From kb8tq at n1k.org  Tue Jan 26 09:29:00 2021
From: kb8tq at n1k.org (Bob kb8tq)
Date: Tue, 26 Jan 2021 09:29:00 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] PC board work.
In-Reply-To: <20210125232417.617ae442d0f8f631a9b3312d6b10cde7.b54a87220b.wbe@email27.godaddy.com>
References: <20210125232417.617ae442d0f8f631a9b3312d6b10cde7.b54a87220b.wbe@email27.godaddy.com>
Message-ID: <FE229422-5DC5-4360-99C7-8740B1BAA262@n1k.org>

Hi

One of the strong and weak points in KiCAD is the libraries. Their
system for organizing and searching them needs help. So did the 
system we used at work on a much more expensive suite. 

The range of parts that you can get in KiCAD format is amazing. 
There are lots and lots of free sources that will provide you with
library entries for a ton of stuff. Is it all done exactly ?your way?? 
? maybe not. For a quick project they seem to work just fine. 
I would quick check *any* third party library entry before using it. 

The normal fiddle the solder mask / change the solder paste (and
blocking zones and ?.) all is in there along with the usual controls
on via types as they go through many layers. 

DRC is there in KiCAD. It will do the basics. We had *much* more
extensive rules on boards with the stuff at work. It?s the one area
of KiCAD that I think needs the most help. That said, what they
have is (barely) adequate. 

I go back far enough to remember the era of ?spend a couple of 
days checking the Gerbers? on any fancy board. It?s been a *long*
time since that was the case with any program I would use. There
are now enough good programs out there at many price levels.
You don?t have to limp along anymore. 

I use a third party Gerber checker these days simply to catch the *really*
dumb stuff ( I seem to have labeled layer 5 as layer 6 ?.. it happens ..).
If the third party program does not show what the view in the layout
program shows, time to switch out one program or the other. 

With a good board house, your layout (even on a cheap board) is
going to go through some fairly fancy checking on their end. You
likely will get an email (or phone call) as a result if you are doing 
something crazy / non-standard. I would never *depend* on that 
review, but it is there. Having a 5 mil spacing come up as a fault at
4.998 mils is ok, having it come up at 4 mils is not ?.

Fun !!!

Bob





> On Jan 26, 2021, at 1:24 AM, Gil Smith <gil at baudot.net> wrote:
> 
> I also have hear good things about kicad, but never tried it.  Interesting that it can import eagle files -- does it keep the schematic and board layout netlists in sync like eagle? 
> 
> What about importing eagle libraries?  In any pcb program, your constantly-evolving library is your life-blood.  The library is not simply a collection of schematic symbols and physical footprints, but needs to allow for selecting different physical parts with just a click -- Ahh, my layout is getting too tight for that opa2376 in the soic8 so I need to change to the vssop...  There are other subtle things like being able to manually define say four small square solderpaste openings for the ground pad under some chips and not the entire pad, since that would be way too much solder under there.  The library editor needs to give you control like that when you are building parts.
> 
> Can kicad do things like swell soldermask a couple of mils, and shrink the solderpaste also, as needed?  Pad in via?  Tented vias?  
> 
> It is also handy in eagle to have the drc checker on the board -- I define the rules I want to enforce (copper-to-copper min spacing...) and save a named drc rules set.  Then check against it before generating gerbers.  I usually have a few clearance errors to fix.  The erc in the schematic module is less handy, though it has caught an occasion or two where a net didn't actually connect to a pin.
> 
> Speaking of gerbers, I like gerberlogix for peeking at them before sending them off to fab.  Import the exellon drill file and all the layers and then turn on or off the layers you want to look at (top-copper-only, then add solderpaste, then soldermask...).  You can zoom and check out the gerbers to ensure everything looks decent before buying the boards.  https://www.easylogix.de/products_detail.php?prog_id=1 <https://www.easylogix.de/products_detail.php?prog_id=1>
> 
> gil
> 
> 
> gil smith, AF7EZ
> greenkeys moderator
> gil at baudot.net <mailto:gil at baudot.net>
> 
> 
> -------- Original Message --------
> Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] PC board work.
> From: Steve Garrison <steve.n4tty at gmail.com <mailto:steve.n4tty at gmail.com>>
> Date: Mon, January 25, 2021 4:04 am
> To: Gerry <gblock at sbcglobal.net <mailto:gblock at sbcglobal.net>>
> Cc: Gil Smith <gil at baudot.net <mailto:gil at baudot.net>>, greenkeys <greenkeys at mailman.qth.net <mailto:greenkeys at mailman.qth.net>>
> 
> For you folks that haven't used layout software and dislike paid and/or subscription software as much as Eric and I do, might I suggest KiCad.
> 
> They will soon be releasing v6 and I'm currently trying out the nightly builds of v5.99 which will become v6 when it's ready for prime time.
> 
> Have been using and learned KiCad on v5.  It is free, very widely used, and its main support comes from CERN. The folks with that big particle accelerator in Switzerland.  There is a paid version if you just have to have a paid version, or you can make donations to help support the free version.
> 
> At least check it out.
> 
> Steve G./N4TTY
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
> On Jan 25, 2021, at 1:59 AM, Gerry <gblock at sbcglobal.net <mailto:gblock at sbcglobal.net>> wrote:
> 
>> Unbelievable. 
>> Thanks for update. 
>> Takes skill to deal with 0402!
>> 
>> Gerry
>> 
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>>> On Jan 24, 2021, at 6:49 PM, Gil Smith <gil at baudot.net <mailto:gil at baudot.net>> wrote:
>>> 
>>> ?
>>> I have used Eagle since 2006 when I splurged and bought the full-up 16-layer version with the auto-router.  The autorouter was only kinda useful to me on one really dense digital board, and I never renewed that option when I upgraded.  I have never gone beyond six layers;  I mostly do 4 layers, but sometimes 2 or 6. 
>>> 
>>> <rant>
>>> Then Eagle was bought out by Autocad, and it went to a subscription plan, which I hate.  So I will happily use my several-year-old version forever.  I have the final non-subscription versions of photoshop and illustrator as well, so bite me Adobe.  This subscription software stuff really pisses me off.
>>> </rant>
>>> 
>>> Eagle has its quirks, but I can do anything I want or need with it.  I do a lot of mixed-signal stuff:  analog conditioning, 24bit adcs, micros...  I regularly hand-assemble down to 0.5mm pitch and 0402 -- just me, two pairs of reading glasses, and quality solder wick :}
>>> 
>>> gil
>>> 
>>> 
>>> gil smith, AF7EZ
>>> greenkeys moderator
>>> gil at baudot.net <mailto:gil at baudot.net>
>>> 
>>> 
>>> -------- Original Message --------
>>> Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] PC board work.
>>> From: Gerry Block <gblock at sbcglobal.net <mailto:gblock at sbcglobal.net>>
>>> Date: Sun, January 24, 2021 6:46 pm
>>> To: Jeffrey Angus <jdangus at att.net <mailto:jdangus at att.net>>, Gil Smith <gil at baudot.net <mailto:gil at baudot.net>>
>>> Cc: greenkeys <greenkeys at mailman.qth.net <mailto:greenkeys at mailman.qth.net>>
>>> 
>>> Gil,
>>> 
>>>   What layout program do you use?
>>> 
>>> Gerry
>>> AD6MC
>>> 
>>> On Sunday, January 24, 2021, 5:10:00 PM PST, Gil Smith <gil at baudot.net <mailto:gil at baudot.net>> wrote:
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Hey Jeff:
>>> 
>>> Where do you get your boards?  For the last few years I have been using pcbway in China:
>>> https://www.pcbway.com <https://www.pcbway.com/>/
>>> 
>>> They have been awesome and I have done dozens of 2- and 4-layer boards there.  About a week turn plus a a few days shipping (get DHL, not fedex).  Instant quote on the home page.  Best prices I have found (though I sometimes get hit with a 25% tariff fee).  Variety of soldermask colors avail (some cost extra).  I like red, blue, and black -- the yellow is gross.  Arrays are easy.  Routing and V-groove not too costly.
>>> 
>>> They do full-turn assembly though I have not used that service.
>>> 
>>> thx, gil
>>> 
>>> 
>>> gil smith, AF7EZ
>>> greenkeys moderator
>>> gil at baudot.net <mailto:gil at baudot.net>
>>> 
>>> 
>>> -------- Original Message --------
>>> Subject: [GreenKeys] PC board work.
>>> From: Jeffrey Angus <jdangus at att.net <mailto:jdangus at att.net>>
>>> Date: Sun, January 24, 2021 12:33 pm
>>> To: greenkeys <greenkeys at mailman.qth.net <mailto:greenkeys at mailman.qth.net>>
>>> 
>>> This is what I do in my spare time now that I'm retired.
>>> I use Express PCB software.
>>> A few years back I designed a two speed motor controller
>>> for my Lorenz Lo-15c.
>>> Last year I did a signal converter for Sen Williams to go
>>> from on/off keying to bi-polar for his Creed TTYs.
>>> 
>>> All I need is a schematic.
>>> And you get the PC Board schematic redrawn for ExpressPCB
>>> and the PC Board layouts.
>>> 
>>> And no, I don't charge for this.
>>> Although, I'm not too proud to accept donations, if you're
>>> feeling guilty about it.
>>> 
>>> -- 
>>> "I am a river to my people."
>>> Jeff-1.0
>>> WA6FWI
>>> www.foxsmercantile.com <http://www.foxsmercantile.com/>
>>> 
>>> ______________________________________________________________
>>> GreenKeys mailing list
>>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys <http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys>
>>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm <http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm>
>>> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net <mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net>
>>> 
>>> >>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch <https://teletype.net/gksearch>
>>> >>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys <http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys>/
>>> >>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html <http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html>
>>> >>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html <http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html>
>>> 
>>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net <http://www.qsl.net/>
>>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html <http://www.qsl.net/donate.html>
>>> Message delivered to gil at baudot.net <mailto:gil at baudot.net>______________________________________________________________
>>> GreenKeys mailing list
>>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys <http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys>
>>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm <http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm>
>>> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net <mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net>
>>> 
>>> >>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch <https://teletype.net/gksearch>
>>> >>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/ <http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/>
>>> >>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html <http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html>
>>> >>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html <http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html>
>>> 
>>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net <http://www.qsl.net/>
>>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html <http://www.qsl.net/donate.html>
>>> Message delivered to gblock at sbcglobal.net <mailto:gblock at sbcglobal.net>______________________________________________________________
>>> GreenKeys mailing list
>>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys <http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys>
>>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm <http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm>
>>> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net <mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net>
>>> 
>>>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch <https://teletype.net/gksearch>
>>>>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/ <http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/>
>>>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html <http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html>
>>>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html <http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html>
>>> 
>>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net <http://www.qsl.net/>
>>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html <http://www.qsl.net/donate.html>
>>> Message delivered to gblock at sbcglobal.net <mailto:gblock at sbcglobal.net>______________________________________________________________
>> GreenKeys mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys <http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys>
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm <http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm>
>> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net <mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net>
>> 
>>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch <https://teletype.net/gksearch>
>>>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/ <http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/>
>>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html <http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html>
>>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html <http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html>
>> 
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net <http://www.qsl.net/>
>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html <http://www.qsl.net/donate.html>
>> Message delivered to steve.n4tty at gmail.com <mailto:steve.n4tty at gmail.com>______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
> 
>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
> 
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to kb8tq at n1k.org

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From highpwr at bellsouth.net  Tue Jan 26 11:28:51 2021
From: highpwr at bellsouth.net (highpwr at bellsouth.net)
Date: Tue, 26 Jan 2021 11:28:51 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] MICRODEC MD200
In-Reply-To: <CA+cKHAfKSGpWffbqAqT5_rcR23KhEAF-JiGLP9nxeoL+O_KszQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <00c101d6f2be$7b43fe90$71cbfbb0$.ref@bellsouth.net>
	<00c101d6f2be$7b43fe90$71cbfbb0$@bellsouth.net>
	<CA+cKHAfKSGpWffbqAqT5_rcR23KhEAF-JiGLP9nxeoL+O_KszQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <029d01d6f400$55b06810$01113830$@bellsouth.net>

Thanks Greg,  

 

I dloaded it, and its helped  understand it a little better.  The MD200 I have there are some submenu setting in RTTY mode,  they work on all speedS, I can use the F2 button to select the following IN THE 60 wpm mode:

 

R60-I S

R60-I D

R60-I B

 

Haven?t figure them out yet, and can cycle between the above items with the F2 button but no action under any one of them with other button pushes,  (except each buttons normal functions.

 

 

Per the section in the PNG file attached, and reading old Somerset adds the MD200 is often referred to as the MD200 PLUS, mines not marked that way but I believe it is one, I think the above submenu items might refer to:

 

R60-I S, maybe someway to select Shift

 

R60-I D, ??? don?t have a clue.

 

R60-I B, possibly the Bandwidth mentioned in the PNG

 

Anyway like you no joy in decoding ITTY so far.

 

Anybody else know about these things jump in!

 

Steve

KM4V

 

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From gil at baudot.net  Tue Jan 26 12:33:00 2021
From: gil at baudot.net (Gil Smith)
Date: Tue, 26 Jan 2021 10:33:00 -0700
Subject: [GreenKeys] PC board work.
Message-ID: <20210126103300.617ae442d0f8f631a9b3312d6b10cde7.4e1addd68a.wbe@email27.godaddy.com>

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From gil at baudot.net  Tue Jan 26 12:35:20 2021
From: gil at baudot.net (Gil Smith)
Date: Tue, 26 Jan 2021 10:35:20 -0700
Subject: [GreenKeys] PC board work.
Message-ID: <20210126103520.617ae442d0f8f631a9b3312d6b10cde7.7af1ac3e4e.wbe@email27.godaddy.com>

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From kb8tq at n1k.org  Tue Jan 26 13:18:14 2021
From: kb8tq at n1k.org (Bob kb8tq)
Date: Tue, 26 Jan 2021 13:18:14 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] PC board work.
In-Reply-To: <20210126103300.617ae442d0f8f631a9b3312d6b10cde7.4e1addd68a.wbe@email27.godaddy.com>
References: <20210126103300.617ae442d0f8f631a9b3312d6b10cde7.4e1addd68a.wbe@email27.godaddy.com>
Message-ID: <C4B5A4E2-D652-4476-906E-86F89668FBB0@n1k.org>

Hi

KiCAD also has tools for making library parts. Indeed that way you know
what you have. Regardless of how great the tool is, brewing up the 
?stuff? for a part with a few hundred pins/ balls on it will take a while. 
Being able to go ?click? and download it from the outfit that made the
part can be helpful ?.

Bob

> On Jan 26, 2021, at 12:33 PM, Gil Smith <gil at baudot.net> wrote:
> 
> I don't waste time looking for 3rd-party library parts that I likely won't like and need to tweak anyway.  It is faster to just make the part myself.
> 
> The eagle library manager provides the needed functions of drawing the schematic symbol with labeled pins for connecting to nets, creating the physical footprints with labeled pads for the board, and creating a device that connects the pins on the schematic symbol to one or more board package footprints.
> 
> It may seem daunting to create a footprint.  Something as simple as a dip or soic is easy enough as you are working with pads on a simple grid, but many parts today are randomishly-dimensioned nightmares at first glance.  But, the grid is your friend.  An example:  let's say you have a 4-pin smt oscillator with 1.2 x 2.1 mm (X,Y) pads, on 6.2mm centers horizontally, and 4.9mm centers vertically.  The easy way:
> - plop an smt pad, 1.2mm wide by 2.1mm high in the center 0,0 point
> - set grid to 3.1mm (half of 6.2)
> - drag the pad to the left by 3.1mm
> - clone that pad and plop it two grid spaces to the right.
> - set grid to 2.45mm (half of 4.9)
> - drag the two pads down by 2.45mm
> - clone those two pads and plop them two grid spaces up.
> - then number them properly
> - add your silk etc.
> - boom.  done.  easy-peasy.
> 
> You are correct about the board houses performing a full drc -- they have to do it so it won't violate their process for min trace/space etc.  I still run drc to catch my stupid errors, and still peek at gerbers to ensure they look ok.  I found a bug in an older eagle version that I caught in the gerbers.  Even today, I manually edit the excellon file to add a line that says INCH, since the cam generator does not insert it, and my hole sizes are inch and not mm.  It needs to be explicit when it goes offshore (even though they will usually presume inch and substitute holes in the nearest 0.5mm size).
> 
> One thing that is cleaned up by the board house without any interaction is to remove any silk that would end up on pads, so if my footprint accidentally had silk crossing where solder should go, they just quietly roll their eyes up and fix it.
> 
> There is another eagle bug that I look for in the gerbers:  I often use a bottom-layer ground fill plane that is hatched (a habit from the old days of thermal control for wave solder).  Anyway, I also use vias that are smaller than the holes opened in the hatch, and eagle does not always connect them with thermals if they are the same net (gnd, dgn, agnd, whatever).  If I see that, I nudge those vias over a tad and regen the gerbers.  Silly stupid things likely fixed in the current version, but I am a few years behind on a 7.something version.
> 
> fwiw, gil
> 
> 
> gil smith, AF7EZ
> greenkeys moderator
> gil at baudot.net <mailto:gil at baudot.net>
> 
> 
> -------- Original Message --------
> Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] PC board work.
> From: Bob kb8tq <kb8tq at n1k.org <mailto:kb8tq at n1k.org>>
> Date: Tue, January 26, 2021 7:29 am
> To: Gil Smith <gil at baudot.net <mailto:gil at baudot.net>>
> Cc: Steve Garrison <steve.n4tty at gmail.com <mailto:steve.n4tty at gmail.com>>, Gerry
> <gblock at sbcglobal.net <mailto:gblock at sbcglobal.net>>, greenkeys <greenkeys at mailman.qth.net <mailto:greenkeys at mailman.qth.net>>
> 
> Hi
> 
> One of the strong and weak points in KiCAD is the libraries. Their
> system for organizing and searching them needs help. So did the 
> system we used at work on a much more expensive suite. 
> 
> The range of parts that you can get in KiCAD format is amazing. 
> There are lots and lots of free sources that will provide you with
> library entries for a ton of stuff. Is it all done exactly ?your way?? 
> ? maybe not. For a quick project they seem to work just fine. 
> I would quick check *any* third party library entry before using it. 
> 
> The normal fiddle the solder mask / change the solder paste (and
> blocking zones and ?.) all is in there along with the usual controls
> on via types as they go through many layers. 
> 
> DRC is there in KiCAD. It will do the basics. We had *much* more
> extensive rules on boards with the stuff at work. It?s the one area
> of KiCAD that I think needs the most help. That said, what they
> have is (barely) adequate. 
> 
> I go back far enough to remember the era of ?spend a couple of 
> days checking the Gerbers? on any fancy board. It?s been a *long*
> time since that was the case with any program I would use. There
> are now enough good programs out there at many price levels.
> You don?t have to limp along anymore. 
> 
> I use a third party Gerber checker these days simply to catch the *really*
> dumb stuff ( I seem to have labeled layer 5 as layer 6 ?.. it happens ..).
> If the third party program does not show what the view in the layout
> program shows, time to switch out one program or the other. 
> 
> With a good board house, your layout (even on a cheap board) is
> going to go through some fairly fancy checking on their end. You
> likely will get an email (or phone call) as a result if you are doing 
> something crazy / non-standard. I would never *depend* on that 
> review, but it is there. Having a 5 mil spacing come up as a fault at
> 4.998 mils is ok, having it come up at 4 mils is not ?.
> 
> Fun !!!
> 
> Bob
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>> On Jan 26, 2021, at 1:24 AM, Gil Smith <gil at baudot.net <mailto:gil at baudot.net>> wrote:
>> 
>> I also have hear good things about kicad, but never tried it.  Interesting that it can import eagle files -- does it keep the schematic and board layout netlists in sync like eagle? 
>> 
>> What about importing eagle libraries?  In any pcb program, your constantly-evolving library is your life-blood.  The library is not simply a collection of schematic symbols and physical footprints, but needs to allow for selecting different physical parts with just a click -- Ahh, my layout is getting too tight for that opa2376 in the soic8 so I need to change to the vssop...  There are other subtle things like being able to manually define say four small square solderpaste openings for the ground pad under some chips and not the entire pad, since that would be way too much solder under there.  The library editor needs to give you control like that when you are building parts.
>> 
>> Can kicad do things like swell soldermask a couple of mils, and shrink the solderpaste also, as needed?  Pad in via?  Tented vias?  
>> 
>> It is also handy in eagle to have the drc checker on the board -- I define the rules I want to enforce (copper-to-copper min spacing...) and save a named drc rules set.  Then check against it before generating gerbers.  I usually have a few clearance errors to fix.  The erc in the schematic module is less handy, though it has caught an occasion or two where a net didn't actually connect to a pin.
>> 
>> Speaking of gerbers, I like gerberlogix for peeking at them before sending them off to fab.  Import the exellon drill file and all the layers and then turn on or off the layers you want to look at (top-copper-only, then add solderpaste, then soldermask...).  You can zoom and check out the gerbers to ensure everything looks decent before buying the boards.  https://www.easylogix.de/products_detail.php?prog_id=1 <https://www.easylogix.de/products_detail.php?prog_id=1>
>> 
>> gil
>> 
>> 
>> gil smith, AF7EZ
>> greenkeys moderator
>> gil at baudot.net <mailto:gil at baudot.net>
>> 
>> 
>> -------- Original Message --------
>> Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] PC board work.
>> From: Steve Garrison <steve.n4tty at gmail.com <mailto:steve.n4tty at gmail.com>>
>> Date: Mon, January 25, 2021 4:04 am
>> To: Gerry <gblock at sbcglobal.net <mailto:gblock at sbcglobal.net>>
>> Cc: Gil Smith <gil at baudot.net <mailto:gil at baudot.net>>, greenkeys <greenkeys at mailman.qth.net <mailto:greenkeys at mailman.qth.net>>
>> 
>> For you folks that haven't used layout software and dislike paid and/or subscription software as much as Eric and I do, might I suggest KiCad.
>> 
>> They will soon be releasing v6 and I'm currently trying out the nightly builds of v5.99 which will become v6 when it's ready for prime time.
>> 
>> Have been using and learned KiCad on v5.  It is free, very widely used, and its main support comes from CERN. The folks with that big particle accelerator in Switzerland.  There is a paid version if you just have to have a paid version, or you can make donations to help support the free version.
>> 
>> At least check it out.
>> 
>> Steve G./N4TTY
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>> On Jan 25, 2021, at 1:59 AM, Gerry <gblock at sbcglobal.net <mailto:gblock at sbcglobal.net>> wrote:
>> 
>>> Unbelievable. 
>>> Thanks for update. 
>>> Takes skill to deal with 0402!
>>> 
>>> Gerry
>>> 
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>> 
>>>> On Jan 24, 2021, at 6:49 PM, Gil Smith <gil at baudot.net <mailto:gil at baudot.net>> wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> ?
>>>> I have used Eagle since 2006 when I splurged and bought the full-up 16-layer version with the auto-router.  The autorouter was only kinda useful to me on one really dense digital board, and I never renewed that option when I upgraded.  I have never gone beyond six layers;  I mostly do 4 layers, but sometimes 2 or 6. 
>>>> 
>>>> <rant>
>>>> Then Eagle was bought out by Autocad, and it went to a subscription plan, which I hate.  So I will happily use my several-year-old version forever.  I have the final non-subscription versions of photoshop and illustrator as well, so bite me Adobe.  This subscription software stuff really pisses me off.
>>>> </rant>
>>>> 
>>>> Eagle has its quirks, but I can do anything I want or need with it.  I do a lot of mixed-signal stuff:  analog conditioning, 24bit adcs, micros...  I regularly hand-assemble down to 0.5mm pitch and 0402 -- just me, two pairs of reading glasses, and quality solder wick :}
>>>> 
>>>> gil
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> gil smith, AF7EZ
>>>> greenkeys moderator
>>>> gil at baudot.net <mailto:gil at baudot.net>
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> -------- Original Message --------
>>>> Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] PC board work.
>>>> From: Gerry Block <gblock at sbcglobal.net <mailto:gblock at sbcglobal.net>>
>>>> Date: Sun, January 24, 2021 6:46 pm
>>>> To: Jeffrey Angus <jdangus at att.net <mailto:jdangus at att.net>>, Gil Smith <gil at baudot.net <mailto:gil at baudot.net>>
>>>> Cc: greenkeys <greenkeys at mailman.qth.net <mailto:greenkeys at mailman.qth.net>>
>>>> 
>>>> Gil,
>>>> 
>>>>   What layout program do you use?
>>>> 
>>>> Gerry
>>>> AD6MC
>>>> 
>>>> On Sunday, January 24, 2021, 5:10:00 PM PST, Gil Smith <gil at baudot.net <mailto:gil at baudot.net>> wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> Hey Jeff:
>>>> 
>>>> Where do you get your boards?  For the last few years I have been using pcbway in China:
>>>> https://www.pcbway.com <https://www.pcbway.com/>/
>>>> 
>>>> They have been awesome and I have done dozens of 2- and 4-layer boards there.  About a week turn plus a a few days shipping (get DHL, not fedex).  Instant quote on the home page.  Best prices I have found (though I sometimes get hit with a 25% tariff fee).  Variety of soldermask colors avail (some cost extra).  I like red, blue, and black -- the yellow is gross.  Arrays are easy.  Routing and V-groove not too costly.
>>>> 
>>>> They do full-turn assembly though I have not used that service.
>>>> 
>>>> thx, gil
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> gil smith, AF7EZ
>>>> greenkeys moderator
>>>> gil at baudot.net <mailto:gil at baudot.net>
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> -------- Original Message --------
>>>> Subject: [GreenKeys] PC board work.
>>>> From: Jeffrey Angus <jdangus at att.net <mailto:jdangus at att.net>>
>>>> Date: Sun, January 24, 2021 12:33 pm
>>>> To: greenkeys <greenkeys at mailman.qth.net <mailto:greenkeys at mailman.qth.net>>
>>>> 
>>>> This is what I do in my spare time now that I'm retired.
>>>> I use Express PCB software.
>>>> A few years back I designed a two speed motor controller
>>>> for my Lorenz Lo-15c.
>>>> Last year I did a signal converter for Sen Williams to go
>>>> from on/off keying to bi-polar for his Creed TTYs.
>>>> 
>>>> All I need is a schematic.
>>>> And you get the PC Board schematic redrawn for ExpressPCB
>>>> and the PC Board layouts.
>>>> 
>>>> And no, I don't charge for this.
>>>> Although, I'm not too proud to accept donations, if you're
>>>> feeling guilty about it.
>>>> 
>>>> -- 
>>>> "I am a river to my people."
>>>> Jeff-1.0
>>>> WA6FWI
>>>> www.foxsmercantile.com <http://www.foxsmercantile.com/>
>>>> 
>>>> ______________________________________________________________
>>>> GreenKeys mailing list
>>>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys <http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys>
>>>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm <http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm>
>>>> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net <mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net>
>>>> 
>>>> >>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch <https://teletype.net/gksearch>
>>>> >>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys <http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys>/
>>>> >>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html <http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html>
>>>> >>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html <http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html>
>>>> 
>>>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net <http://www.qsl.net/>
>>>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html <http://www.qsl.net/donate.html>
>>>> Message delivered to gil at baudot.net <mailto:gil at baudot.net>______________________________________________________________
>>>> GreenKeys mailing list
>>>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys <http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys>
>>>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm <http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm>
>>>> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net <mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net>
>>>> 
>>>> >>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch <https://teletype.net/gksearch>
>>>> >>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/ <http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/>
>>>> >>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html <http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html>
>>>> >>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html <http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html>
>>>> 
>>>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net <http://www.qsl.net/>
>>>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html <http://www.qsl.net/donate.html>
>>>> Message delivered to gblock at sbcglobal.net <mailto:gblock at sbcglobal.net>______________________________________________________________
>>>> GreenKeys mailing list
>>>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys <http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys>
>>>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm <http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm>
>>>> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net <mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net>
>>>> 
>>>>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch <https://teletype.net/gksearch>
>>>>>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/ <http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/>
>>>>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html <http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html>
>>>>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html <http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html>
>>>> 
>>>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net <http://www.qsl.net/>
>>>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html <http://www.qsl.net/donate.html>
>>>> Message delivered to gblock at sbcglobal.net <mailto:gblock at sbcglobal.net>______________________________________________________________
>>> GreenKeys mailing list
>>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys <http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys>
>>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm <http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm>
>>> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net <mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net>
>>> 
>>>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch <https://teletype.net/gksearch>
>>>>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/ <http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/>
>>>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html <http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html>
>>>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html <http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html>
>>> 
>>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net <http://www.qsl.net/>
>>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html <http://www.qsl.net/donate.html>
>>> Message delivered to steve.n4tty at gmail.com <mailto:steve.n4tty at gmail.com>______________________________________________________________
>> GreenKeys mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys <http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys>
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm <http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm>
>> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net <mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net>
>> 
>>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch <https://teletype.net/gksearch>
>>>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/ <http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/>
>>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html <http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html>
>>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html <http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html>
>> 
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net <http://www.qsl.net/>
>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html <http://www.qsl.net/donate.html>
>> Message delivered to kb8tq at n1k.org <mailto:kb8tq at n1k.org>

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From k2gtm1 at gmail.com  Tue Jan 26 09:36:18 2021
From: k2gtm1 at gmail.com (Greg Miller)
Date: Tue, 26 Jan 2021 09:36:18 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] MICRODEC MD200
In-Reply-To: <00c101d6f2be$7b43fe90$71cbfbb0$@bellsouth.net>
References: <00c101d6f2be$7b43fe90$71cbfbb0$.ref@bellsouth.net>
	<00c101d6f2be$7b43fe90$71cbfbb0$@bellsouth.net>
Message-ID: <CA+cKHAfKSGpWffbqAqT5_rcR23KhEAF-JiGLP9nxeoL+O_KszQ@mail.gmail.com>

Hi Steve,

I have an MD100, MD300, and the VIP50.  They're neat little devices, but
I've only had luck with it copying morse.  I purchased a photocopy of the
manual for the MD100 on eBay years ago, scanned it, and uploaded it to the
BAMA site.

You can download it here: https://bama.edebris.com/manuals/somerset/md100/

I think the MD series are all pretty much the same - at least my MD100 and
MD300 are virtually identical.

73,
Greg K2GTM


On Sun, Jan 24, 2021 at 9:10 PM <highpwr at bellsouth.net> wrote:

> Anybody have any info on the Somerset Electronics MICRODEC MD200 decoder?
>
> I picked one up and its companion VP50 Video / Printer interface module
> out of a guys $1.00 box back in 2019.
>
> I?m looking for any info , and in particular manuals if some one has them.
>
> Haven?t been able to find too much of anything on these units, ant and
> all assistance greatly appreciated.
>
> Steve
>
> KM4V
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
>
> >>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool:
> https://teletype.net/gksearch
> >>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive:
> http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
> >>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive:
> http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
> >>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool:
> http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to k2gtm1 at gmail.com
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From k2gtm1 at gmail.com  Tue Jan 26 12:05:23 2021
From: k2gtm1 at gmail.com (Greg Miller)
Date: Tue, 26 Jan 2021 12:05:23 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] MICRODEC MD200
In-Reply-To: <029d01d6f400$55b06810$01113830$@bellsouth.net>
References: <00c101d6f2be$7b43fe90$71cbfbb0$.ref@bellsouth.net>
	<00c101d6f2be$7b43fe90$71cbfbb0$@bellsouth.net>
	<CA+cKHAfKSGpWffbqAqT5_rcR23KhEAF-JiGLP9nxeoL+O_KszQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<029d01d6f400$55b06810$01113830$@bellsouth.net>
Message-ID: <CA+cKHAe2gc68uyddWccUtnyAGje3BA+OJL+SZuwH3B+vX0Xf6A@mail.gmail.com>

Glad that helped!  I have also found it difficult to find documentation on
these units.  I experimented with mine and here's what I got...

MD100:
Firmware (c) 1989
Mode options are morse, RTTY at 60, 67, 75 and 100 wpm, and 110 or 300 baud
ASCII
Does not have F1 or F2 buttons, only display intensity up and down.
Has an internal rechargeable battery.
Decodes 60 wpm ITTY fine.

MD300:
Firmware (c) 1991
Mode options are morse, RTTY at 60, 67, 75 and 100 wpm, 110 and 300 baud
ASCII, and AM-SITOR
Does have the F1 and F2 buttons.
Also has the R60-I B/D/S options, but won't decode ITTY in any of those
modes.  It *will *decode ITTY when selecting just "60 WPM", however.
The B/D/S modes are also available in 110 and 300 baud ASCII.  No clue
about what the B/D/S options are.
Options for SITOR are A-ARQ F or L, and B-FEC F or L.  I know nothing about
SITOR so I have no idea what any of that means.  Does anyone use SITOR
anymore?
Does not have the internal battery.

Try pressing select until you get to RTTY.  If it doesn't decode ITTY, try
pressing F2 until you see just 60 WPM on the display...

BTW, I did hookup the VIP50 to a monitor and I got a bootup message.
Haven't hooked it to the MD100 or 300 yet to see if it will actually
display the data coming in yet.

73,
G



On Tue, Jan 26, 2021 at 11:28 AM <highpwr at bellsouth.net> wrote:

> Thanks Greg,
>
>
>
> I dloaded it, and its helped  understand it a little better.  The MD200 I
> have there are some submenu setting in RTTY mode,  they work on all speedS,
> I can use the F2 button to select the following IN THE 60 wpm mode:
>
>
>
> R60-I S
>
> R60-I D
>
> R60-I B
>
>
>
> Haven?t figure them out yet, and can cycle between the above items with
> the F2 button but no action under any one of them with other button
> pushes,  (except each buttons normal functions.
>
>
>
>
>
> Per the section in the PNG file attached, and reading old Somerset adds
> the MD200 is often referred to as the MD200 PLUS, mines not marked that way
> but I believe it is one, I think the above submenu items might refer to:
>
>
>
> R60-I S, maybe someway to select Shift
>
>
>
> R60-I D, ??? don?t have a clue.
>
>
>
> R60-I B, possibly the Bandwidth mentioned in the PNG
>
>
>
> Anyway like you no joy in decoding ITTY so far.
>
>
>
> Anybody else know about these things jump in!
>
>
>
> Steve
>
> KM4V
>
>
>
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From k2gtm1 at gmail.com  Tue Jan 26 12:16:41 2021
From: k2gtm1 at gmail.com (Greg Miller)
Date: Tue, 26 Jan 2021 12:16:41 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] MICRODEC MD200
In-Reply-To: <029d01d6f400$55b06810$01113830$@bellsouth.net>
References: <00c101d6f2be$7b43fe90$71cbfbb0$.ref@bellsouth.net>
	<00c101d6f2be$7b43fe90$71cbfbb0$@bellsouth.net>
	<CA+cKHAfKSGpWffbqAqT5_rcR23KhEAF-JiGLP9nxeoL+O_KszQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<029d01d6f400$55b06810$01113830$@bellsouth.net>
Message-ID: <CA+cKHAdxeypvuLiKhyjF0-0+BWmn9FxAQsi4Jw-7dKhAf0SMQg@mail.gmail.com>

Here is an ad for the Microdec from Popular Communications magazine, Dec.
1991.  Seems that the B/D/S options are for bit inversion.  Still not sure
what setting means what, however.

It makes sense that I got the VIP50 with the MD300, since that seems to be
the combo you'd get when buying the MD300.

73,
G

On Tue, Jan 26, 2021 at 11:28 AM <highpwr at bellsouth.net> wrote:

> Thanks Greg,
>
>
>
> I dloaded it, and its helped  understand it a little better.  The MD200 I
> have there are some submenu setting in RTTY mode,  they work on all speedS,
> I can use the F2 button to select the following IN THE 60 wpm mode:
>
>
>
> R60-I S
>
> R60-I D
>
> R60-I B
>
>
>
> Haven?t figure them out yet, and can cycle between the above items with
> the F2 button but no action under any one of them with other button
> pushes,  (except each buttons normal functions.
>
>
>
>
>
> Per the section in the PNG file attached, and reading old Somerset adds
> the MD200 is often referred to as the MD200 PLUS, mines not marked that way
> but I believe it is one, I think the above submenu items might refer to:
>
>
>
> R60-I S, maybe someway to select Shift
>
>
>
> R60-I D, ??? don?t have a clue.
>
>
>
> R60-I B, possibly the Bandwidth mentioned in the PNG
>
>
>
> Anyway like you no joy in decoding ITTY so far.
>
>
>
> Anybody else know about these things jump in!
>
>
>
> Steve
>
> KM4V
>
>
>
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From nagle at animats.com  Tue Jan 26 01:31:29 2021
From: nagle at animats.com (John Nagle)
Date: Mon, 25 Jan 2021 22:31:29 -0800
Subject: [GreenKeys] Very unusual Russian Model 14 variant on ebay
In-Reply-To: <mailman.545.1611608043.30879.greenkeys@mailman.qth.net>
References: <mailman.545.1611608043.30879.greenkeys@mailman.qth.net>
Message-ID: <a9dae47c-dbb2-7ef1-2d01-b1de6aa0d36f@animats.com>

Now this is really unusual. It's some kind of Russian knock off of
a Teletype Model 14 tape printer.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Teletype-Machine-ST-35-New-Old-Stock-Very-Rare-Antique-USSR/224326290528

It's roughly the same typing mechanism and selector as a Model 14
tape printer, but there are many other differences.
There seems to be a tape reader on the right of the keyboard, and
what looks like a punch on the left. It's not a
reperf; the punched tape parts seem independent of the tape printer.
The keyboard is 4-row, and the typebars seem to have three letters
each, so this is probably a 3-shift machine. It's all Cyrillic, of course.

I've never heard of or seen anything like this.

I have no use for it, and I'm not the seller.

				John Nagle

From gil at baudot.net  Tue Jan 26 14:35:01 2021
From: gil at baudot.net (Gil Smith)
Date: Tue, 26 Jan 2021 12:35:01 -0700
Subject: [GreenKeys] PC board work.
Message-ID: <20210126123501.617ae442d0f8f631a9b3312d6b10cde7.dfbe3ddc8c.wbe@email27.godaddy.com>

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From dave at horsfall.org  Tue Jan 26 22:18:02 2021
From: dave at horsfall.org (Dave Horsfall)
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 2021 14:18:02 +1100 (EST)
Subject: [GreenKeys] 88mH Toroides
In-Reply-To: <600F9C5B.29621.1985D79F@jim.w2jc.gmail.com>
References: <600F9C5B.29621.1985D79F@jim.w2jc.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <alpine.BSF.2.21.9999.2101271415430.36435@aneurin.horsfall.org>

Now there's a blast from the past...  I used to have a box of 'em picked 
up at a field day for a song.

AT&T Long Lines, wasn't it?

-- Dave

From gblock at sbcglobal.net  Tue Jan 26 23:55:31 2021
From: gblock at sbcglobal.net (Gerry Block)
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 2021 04:55:31 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [GreenKeys] PC board work.
In-Reply-To: <20210126103300.617ae442d0f8f631a9b3312d6b10cde7.4e1addd68a.wbe@email27.godaddy.com>
References: <20210126103300.617ae442d0f8f631a9b3312d6b10cde7.4e1addd68a.wbe@email27.godaddy.com>
Message-ID: <650129455.389056.1611723331426@mail.yahoo.com>

 Gil I agree completely with what you are saying.?? My experience always was that the component library (i.e. the design rules for component soldering) had the maximum effect of any other single thing as regards manufacturability and reliability.? This was not just true for high pin count parts,? but lowly passives too.? For instance, there is not one 'good size' for chip ceramic capacitor pads - it all depends on how high the component's terminal is, which varies with the capacitance, chip size, etc.? The toughest parts to deal with were always DFN/QFN, and I would say that we never actually followed the manufacturers recommended pad size - recommended footprints were always optimized for reduction of area and basically you always wanted more solder on the pads when all was said and done.? Usually this was accompished by making the outboard side of the pad a little longer.? This extra solder would wick over to the pad itself and form a better (higher) fillet.
The manufacturing integrity is actually more important when building small lots.? You don't have the benefit of laser solder scanners and other QA capabilities which can provide a feedback loop in a real manufacturing environment.? Instead, your device just works - or not.
Some of the new SMT lines have a software feedback loop from the laser scanner? back to the screen printer!

GerryAD6MC

    On Tuesday, January 26, 2021, 9:33:40 AM PST, Gil Smith <gil at baudot.net> wrote:  
 
 I don't waste time looking for 3rd-party library parts that I likely won't like and need to tweak anyway.? It is faster to just make the part myself.
The eagle library manager provides the needed functions of drawing the schematic symbol with labeled pins for connecting to nets, creating the physical footprints with labeled pads for the board, and creating a device that connects the pins on the schematic symbol to one or more board package footprints.
It may seem daunting to create a footprint.? Something as simple as a dip or soic is easy enough as you are working with pads on a simple grid, but many parts today are randomishly-dimensioned nightmares at first glance.? But, the grid is your friend.? An example:? let's say you have a 4-pin smt oscillator with 1.2 x 2.1 mm (X,Y) pads, on 6.2mm centers horizontally, and 4.9mm centers vertically.? The easy way:- plop an smt pad, 1.2mm wide by 2.1mm high in the center 0,0 point- set grid to 3.1mm (half of 6.2)- drag the pad to the left by 3.1mm- clone that pad and plop it two grid spaces to the right.- set grid to 2.45mm (half of 4.9)- drag the two pads down by 2.45mm- clone those two pads and plop them two grid spaces up.- then number them properly- add your silk etc.- boom.? done.? easy-peasy.
You are correct about the board houses performing a full drc -- they have to do it so it won't violate their process for min trace/space etc.? I still run drc to catch my stupid errors, and still peek at gerbers to ensure they look ok.? I found a bug in an older eagle version that I caught in the gerbers.? Even today, I manually edit the excellon file to add a line that says INCH, since the cam generator does not insert it, and my hole sizes are inch and not mm.? It needs to be explicit when it goes offshore (even though they will usually presume inch and substitute holes in the nearest 0.5mm size).
One thing that is cleaned up by the board house without any interaction is to remove any silk that would end up on pads, so if my footprint accidentally had silk crossing where solder should go, they just quietly roll their eyes up and fix it.
There is another eagle bug that I look for in the gerbers:? I often use a bottom-layer ground fill plane that is hatched (a habit from the old days of thermal control for wave solder).? Anyway, I also use vias that are smaller than the holes opened in the hatch, and eagle does not always connect them with thermals if they are the same net (gnd, dgn, agnd, whatever).? If I see that, I nudge those vias over a tad and regen the gerbers.? Silly stupid things likely fixed in the current version, but I am a few years behind on a 7.something version.
fwiw, gil

gil smith, AF7EZ
greenkeys moderator
gil at baudot.net


-------- Original Message --------
Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] PC board work.
From: Bob kb8tq <kb8tq at n1k.org>
Date: Tue, January 26, 2021 7:29 am
To: Gil Smith <gil at baudot.net>
Cc: Steve Garrison <steve.n4tty at gmail.com>, Gerry
<gblock at sbcglobal.net>, greenkeys <greenkeys at mailman.qth.net>

Hi
One of the strong and weak points in KiCAD is the libraries. Theirsystem for organizing and searching them needs help. So did the?system we used at work on a much more expensive suite.?
The range of parts that you can get in KiCAD format is amazing.?There are lots and lots of free sources that will provide you withlibrary entries for a ton of stuff. Is it all done exactly ?your way???? maybe not. For a quick project they seem to work just fine.?I would quick check *any* third party library entry before using it.?
The normal fiddle the solder mask / change the solder paste (andblocking zones and ?.) all is in there along with the usual controlson via types as they go through many layers.?
DRC is there in KiCAD. It will do the basics. We had *much* moreextensive rules on boards with the stuff at work. It?s the one areaof KiCAD that I think needs the most help. That said, what theyhave is (barely) adequate.?
I go back far enough to remember the era of ?spend a couple of?days checking the Gerbers? on any fancy board. It?s been a *long*time since that was the case with any program I would use. Thereare now enough good programs out there at many price levels.You don?t have to limp along anymore.?
I use a third party Gerber checker these days simply to catch the *really*dumb stuff ( I seem to have labeled layer 5 as layer 6 ?.. it happens ..).If the third party program does not show what the view in the layoutprogram shows, time to switch out one program or the other.?
With a good board house, your layout (even on a cheap board) isgoing to go through some fairly fancy checking on their end. Youlikely will get an email (or phone call) as a result if you are doing?something crazy / non-standard. I would never *depend* on that?review, but it is there. Having a 5 mil spacing come up as a fault at4.998 mils is ok, having it come up at 4 mils is not ?.
Fun !!!
Bob





On Jan 26, 2021, at 1:24 AM, Gil Smith <gil at baudot.net> wrote:
I also have hear good things about kicad, but never tried it.? Interesting that it can import eagle files -- does it keep the schematic and board layout netlists in sync like eagle?? 
What about importing eagle libraries?? In any pcb program, your constantly-evolving library is your life-blood.? The library is not simply a collection of schematic symbols and physical footprints, but needs to allow for selecting different physical parts with just a click -- Ahh, my layout is getting too tight for that opa2376 in the soic8 so I need to change to the vssop...? There are other subtle things like being able to manually define say four small square solderpaste openings for the ground pad under some chips and not the entire pad, since that would be way too much solder under there.? The library editor needs to give you control like that when you are building parts.
Can kicad do things like swell soldermask a couple of mils, and shrink the solderpaste also, as needed?? Pad in via?? Tented vias???
It is also handy in eagle to have the drc checker on the board -- I define the rules I want to enforce (copper-to-copper min spacing...) and save a named drc rules set.? Then check against it before generating gerbers.? I usually have a few clearance errors to fix.? The erc in the schematic module is less handy, though it has caught an occasion or two where a net didn't actually connect to a pin.
Speaking of gerbers, I like gerberlogix for peeking at them before sending them off to fab.? Import the exellon drill file and all the layers and then turn on or off the layers you want to look at (top-copper-only, then add solderpaste, then soldermask...).? You can zoom and check out the gerbers to ensure everything looks decent before buying the boards.??https://www.easylogix.de/products_detail.php?prog_id=1
gil

gil smith, AF7EZ
greenkeys moderator
gil at baudot.net

 
  -------- Original Message --------
 Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] PC board work.
 From: Steve Garrison <steve.n4tty at gmail.com>
 Date: Mon, January 25, 2021 4:04 am
 To: Gerry <gblock at sbcglobal.net>
 Cc: Gil Smith <gil at baudot.net>, greenkeys <greenkeys at mailman.qth.net>
 
 For you folks that haven't used layout software and dislike paid and/or subscription software as much as Eric and I do, might I suggest KiCad.
They will soon be releasing v6 and I'm currently trying out the nightly builds of v5.99 which will become v6 when it's ready for prime time.
Have been using and learned KiCad on v5. ?It is free, very widely used, and its main support comes from CERN. The folks with that big particle accelerator in Switzerland. ?There is a paid version if you just have to have a paid version, or you can make donations to help support the free version.
At least check it out.

Steve G./N4TTYSent from my iPhone
On Jan 25, 2021, at 1:59 AM, Gerry <gblock at sbcglobal.net> wrote:


Unbelievable.?Thanks for update.?Takes skill to deal with 0402!
Gerry

Sent from my iPhone

On Jan 24, 2021, at 6:49 PM, Gil Smith <gil at baudot.net> wrote:



?I have used Eagle since 2006 when I splurged and bought the full-up 16-layer version with the auto-router.? The autorouter was only kinda useful to me on one really dense digital board, and I never renewed that option when I upgraded.? I have never gone beyond six layers;? I mostly do 4 layers, but sometimes 2 or 6.? 
<rant>Then Eagle was bought out by Autocad, and it went to a subscription plan, which I hate.? So I will happily use my several-year-old version forever.? I have the final non-subscription versions of photoshop and illustrator as well, so bite me Adobe.? This subscription software stuff really pisses me off.</rant>
Eagle has its quirks, but I can do anything I want or need with it.? I do a lot of mixed-signal stuff:? analog conditioning, 24bit adcs, micros...? I regularly hand-assemble down to 0.5mm pitch and 0402 -- just me, two pairs of reading glasses, and quality solder wick :}
gil

gil smith, AF7EZ
greenkeys moderator
gil at baudot.net

 
  -------- Original Message --------
 Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] PC board work.
 From: Gerry Block <gblock at sbcglobal.net>
 Date: Sun, January 24, 2021 6:46 pm
 To: Jeffrey Angus <jdangus at att.net>, Gil Smith <gil at baudot.net>
 Cc: greenkeys <greenkeys at mailman.qth.net>
 
  Gil,
? What layout program do you use?
GerryAD6MC

    On Sunday, January 24, 2021, 5:10:00 PM PST, Gil Smith <gil at baudot.net> wrote:  
 
 Hey Jeff:
Where do you get your boards?? For the last few years I have been using pcbway in China:https://www.pcbway.com/
They have been awesome and I have done dozens of 2- and 4-layer boards there.? About a week turn plus a a few days shipping (get DHL, not fedex).? Instant quote on the home page.? Best prices I have found (though I sometimes get hit with a 25% tariff fee).? Variety of soldermask colors avail (some cost extra).? I like red, blue, and black -- the yellow is gross.? Arrays are easy.? Routing and V-groove not too costly.
They do full-turn assembly though I have not used that service.
thx, gil

gil smith, AF7EZ
greenkeys moderator
gil at baudot.net

 
  -------- Original Message --------
 Subject: [GreenKeys] PC board work.
 From: Jeffrey Angus <jdangus at att.net>
 Date: Sun, January 24, 2021 12:33 pm
 To: greenkeys <greenkeys at mailman.qth.net>
 
 This is what I do in my spare time now that I'm retired.
 I use Express PCB software.
 A few years back I designed a two speed motor controller
 for my Lorenz Lo-15c.
 Last year I did a signal converter for Sen Williams to go
 from on/off keying to bi-polar for his Creed TTYs.
 
 All I need is a schematic.
 And you get the PC Board schematic redrawn for ExpressPCB
 and the PC Board layouts.
 
 And no, I don't charge for this.
 Although, I'm not too proud to accept donations, if you're
 feeling guilty about it.
 
 -- 
 "I am a river to my people."
 Jeff-1.0
 WA6FWI
 www.foxsmercantile.com
 
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 Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
 
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2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/






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2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
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>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
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From hanyou at xsmail.com  Wed Jan 27 00:15:16 2021
From: hanyou at xsmail.com (E.)
Date: Tue, 26 Jan 2021 23:15:16 -0600
Subject: [GreenKeys] Offutt Bunker 28 sighting...
Message-ID: <3AAF21A1-679F-4A20-8365-804DEF0DF7A1@xsmail.com>


Hey all, I live not roughly an hour away from Offutt AFB? was looking through a few photos of the old bunker and behind the Airmen, I see at least two 28?s :) .  Hate to be the one Airman to back into one of these 28 keyboards and warp the thing ;p .  No affiliation to the linked website below:

https://atomic-annhilation.blogspot.com/2018/11/strategic-air-command-command-offutt-afb.html

From cramcram at gmail.com  Wed Jan 27 01:14:07 2021
From: cramcram at gmail.com (Marc Howard)
Date: Tue, 26 Jan 2021 22:14:07 -0800
Subject: [GreenKeys] Offutt Bunker 28 sighting...
In-Reply-To: <3AAF21A1-679F-4A20-8365-804DEF0DF7A1@xsmail.com>
References: <3AAF21A1-679F-4A20-8365-804DEF0DF7A1@xsmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAC20j8R93PFGO0aZ6cOYGW3u-93GPziVBqvP=wcTKBQ1FaT_ng@mail.gmail.com>

Clicking the video image yields:

"Video unavailable
This video is no longer available because the YouTube account associated
with this video has been terminated."

Doesn't take much to piss off youtube these days.

Marc

On Tue, Jan 26, 2021 at 9:15 PM E. <hanyou at xsmail.com> wrote:

>
> Hey all, I live not roughly an hour away from Offutt AFB? was looking
> through a few photos of the old bunker and behind the Airmen, I see at
> least two 28?s :) .  Hate to be the one Airman to back into one of these 28
> keyboards and warp the thing ;p .  No affiliation to the linked website
> below:
>
>
> https://atomic-annhilation.blogspot.com/2018/11/strategic-air-command-command-offutt-afb.html
> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
>
> >>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool:
> https://teletype.net/gksearch
> >>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive:
> http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
> >>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive:
> http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
> >>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool:
> http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to marc.howard at ieee.org
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From vlaarom at gmail.com  Wed Jan 27 02:48:19 2021
From: vlaarom at gmail.com (Vladimir Romanov)
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 2021 10:48:19 +0300
Subject: [GreenKeys] Very unusual Russian Model 14 variant on ebay
In-Reply-To: <a9dae47c-dbb2-7ef1-2d01-b1de6aa0d36f@animats.com>
References: <mailman.545.1611608043.30879.greenkeys@mailman.qth.net>
	<a9dae47c-dbb2-7ef1-2d01-b1de6aa0d36f@animats.com>
Message-ID: <22498ABD-56CE-4542-8CDC-493BB5BB1489@gmail.com>

It was in different post. I will put it here again

This is not a ??-35 machine. It is more ?modern? machine from 1970s called ???-?67?( x - is different versions with different additional capabilities, for example ???-?67A). It is highly available here in Russia for about 100$ in shipping wooden crate.

Here is photos of mine different ???-?67? machines.


Based on book about Russian telegraph machines from 1939:
??-35 is an early machine from 1935 derived from Morkrum-Kleinschmidt Corp model ?14. It is using ITA1 code(???-?67? is using ITA2 code). I have never seen it in person. Very rare here in Russia.


Thank you
Vladimir

> On 26 Jan 2021, at 09:31, John Nagle <nagle at animats.com> wrote:
> 
> Now this is really unusual. It's some kind of Russian knock off of
> a Teletype Model 14 tape printer.
> 
> https://www.ebay.com/itm/Teletype-Machine-ST-35-New-Old-Stock-Very-Rare-Antique-USSR/224326290528
> 
> It's roughly the same typing mechanism and selector as a Model 14
> tape printer, but there are many other differences.
> There seems to be a tape reader on the right of the keyboard, and
> what looks like a punch on the left. It's not a
> reperf; the punched tape parts seem independent of the tape printer.
> The keyboard is 4-row, and the typebars seem to have three letters
> each, so this is probably a 3-shift machine. It's all Cyrillic, of course.
> 
> I've never heard of or seen anything like this.
> 
> I have no use for it, and I'm not the seller.
> 
> 				John Nagle
> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
> 
>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
> 
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to vlaarom at gmail.com

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From pbirkel at gmail.com  Wed Jan 27 05:54:32 2021
From: pbirkel at gmail.com (Paul Birkel)
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 2021 05:54:32 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] M15 with Polar Relay -- Configuration
Message-ID: <09ec01d6f49a$cc00be30$64023a90$@gmail.com>

Good morning all;

 

I seek some guidance/experience with setting up an M15 that came equipped
with a polar relay and otherwise essentially  "factory fresh" wiring
harness.  My basic question is whether I can swap the relay for a non-polar
one and then use the M15 "conventionally" . and if so, what would be the
substitute relay?  And then . does anyone have such a substitute available
for employment in this endeavor :->?

 

Alternatively, I do have another polar relay and definitely have more than a
"passing interest" in leaving the M15 as received and instead setting up a
local polar circuit to drive it that would in turn be patched into a normal
local loop.  There's not been much discussion of practical setup/employment
of polar circuits here AFAIK; I enjoyed reading the AT&T Long Lines book on
"Principles of Electricity" back in 2019 and intend to refer to it again
before I proceed.

 

I originally received the M15 from an ex-MARS guy who eventually used it as
an office printer with an early microcomputer system before putting it into
storage a few decades ago.  He kept it well lubricated, thank goodness.  It
appears to be configured using a standard 60 mA pulling magnet (no S/P
switch nor a 3-position terminal block; the rangefinder does NOT have an HM
marking; and the magnet definitely has round windings).  I haven't yet
checked the resistance on the loop to be triply sure.

 

My main terminal block appears to be physically different from that shown at
http://www.baudot.net/gil/tty-machines/pics/M15-KSR-Gil-Iface-Terminals.jpg
I don't know whether that's significant.  It appears to be configured to
separate the KBD from the PTR circuits.  The M15 wiring appears to be
entirely original excepting one modification at the polar relay - which is a
coaxial-cable stub (clipped off after ~2" and left hanging) attached to the
rearmost pair of polar relay terminals that appear to have been otherwise
unused (but can't quite be sure of that, although there are no telltale
snips that I can spot).  Possibly that's a remnant of the earlier MARS use,
and the separated KBD/PTR circuits reflect the later office-printer use.

 

Possibly the use a M15-polar configuration is documented in some RTTY
publication?  At the moment I'm using the "New RTTY Handbook" as my starting
point, but I imagine that there are other specific how-to articles .

 

Your various and sundry thoughts and observations will be much appreciated,
thank you.

 

Good Health to You and Yours,

paul

 

 

 

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From hwhall at compuserve.com  Wed Jan 27 06:15:46 2021
From: hwhall at compuserve.com (hwhall at compuserve.com)
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 2021 11:15:46 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [GreenKeys] M15 with Polar Relay -- Configuration
In-Reply-To: <09ec01d6f49a$cc00be30$64023a90$@gmail.com>
References: <09ec01d6f49a$cc00be30$64023a90$@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <410631575.468016.1611746146535@mail.yahoo.com>

Sounds as though you think you must drive your machine with a polar circuit because your machine is equipped with a polar relay. Is that right?
My previous Model 15 which I ran for years had a polar relay installed but I simply never used it & drove the machine via a 60ma local loop to the selector magnets. ?If I recall correctly, the terminal block has enough connections there to allow one to reconfigure the machine to use or not use the polar relay (and other features).
WayneWB4OGM

-----Original Message-----
From: Paul Birkel <pbirkel at gmail.com>
To: greenkeys at mailman.qth.net
Sent: Wed, Jan 27, 2021 3:54 am
Subject: [GreenKeys] M15 with Polar Relay -- Configuration

<!--#yiv0344673806 _filtered {}#yiv0344673806 #yiv0344673806 p.yiv0344673806MsoNormal, #yiv0344673806 li.yiv0344673806MsoNormal, #yiv0344673806 div.yiv0344673806MsoNormal {margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri", "sans-serif";}#yiv0344673806 a:link, #yiv0344673806 span.yiv0344673806MsoHyperlink {color:blue;text-decoration:underline;}#yiv0344673806 a:visited, #yiv0344673806 span.yiv0344673806MsoHyperlinkFollowed {color:purple;text-decoration:underline;}#yiv0344673806 span.yiv0344673806EmailStyle17 {font-family:"Arial", "sans-serif";color:windowtext;font-weight:normal;font-style:normal;}#yiv0344673806 p.yiv0344673806msonormal, #yiv0344673806 li.yiv0344673806msonormal, #yiv0344673806 div.yiv0344673806msonormal {margin-right:0in;margin-left:0in;font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman", "serif";}#yiv0344673806 .yiv0344673806MsoChpDefault {font-family:"Calibri", "sans-serif";} _filtered {}#yiv0344673806 div.yiv0344673806WordSection1 {}-->Good morning all; ?I seek some guidance/experience with setting up an M15 that came equipped with a polar relay and otherwise essentially ??factory fresh? wiring harness.? My basic question is whether I can swap the relay for a non-polar one and then use the M15 ?conventionally? ? and if so, what would be the substitute relay?? And then ? does anyone have such a substitute available for employment in this endeavor :->? ?Alternatively, I do have another polar relay and definitely have more than a ?passing interest? in leaving the M15 as received and instead setting up a local polar circuit to drive it that would in turn be patched into a normal local loop.? There?s not been much discussion of practical setup/employment of polar circuits here AFAIK; I enjoyed reading the AT&T Long Lines book on ?Principles of Electricity? back in 2019 and intend to refer to it again before I proceed. ?I originally received the M15 from an ex-MARS guy who eventually used it as an office printer with an early microcomputer system before putting it into storage a few decades ago.? He kept it well lubricated, thank goodness.? It appears to be configured using a standard 60 mA pulling magnet (no S/P switch nor a 3-position terminal block; the rangefinder does NOT have an HM marking; and the magnet definitely has round windings).? I haven?t yet checked the resistance on the loop to be triply sure. ?My main terminal block appears to be physically different from that shown at http://www.baudot.net/gil/tty-machines/pics/M15-KSR-Gil-Iface-Terminals.jpg? I don?t know whether that?s significant.? It appears to be configured to separate the KBD from the PTR circuits.? The M15 wiring appears to be entirely original excepting one modification at the polar relay ? which is a coaxial-cable stub (clipped off after ~2? and left hanging) attached to the rearmost pair of polar relay terminals that appear to have been otherwise unused (but can?t quite be sure of that, although there are no telltale snips that I can spot).? Possibly that?s a remnant of the earlier MARS use, and the separated KBD/PTR circuits reflect the later office-printer use. ?Possibly the use a M15-polar configuration is documented in some RTTY publication?? At the moment I?m using the ?New RTTY Handbook? as my starting point, but I imagine that there are other specific how-to articles ? ?Your various and sundry thoughts and observations will be much appreciated, thank you. ?Good Health to You and Yours,paul ? ? ?______________________________________________________________
GreenKeys mailing list
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Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net

>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to hwhall at compuserve.com
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From navy.radio at gmail.com  Wed Jan 27 16:24:57 2021
From: navy.radio at gmail.com (Nick England)
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 2021 16:24:57 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] FTGH - Army Teletype manuals
Message-ID: <CAB55hNcpJidj=7FT+Ea=8F3npcRiNh_9Ext7eXmt_unqcugrQw@mail.gmail.com>

As usual, in the event of multiple requests, I don't necessarily send
something to the first to respond with "I want it".
Priority goes to people who:
 -  have done me a favor
 -  have done other greenkeyers a favor
 -  are willing to scan and post the manual if not already on line somewhere
 -  have an amusing and/or heartwarming story about why you want/need it.

Decision of the judges is final, void where prohibited by law, no purchase
necessary to enter, current employees of Teletype Corp. are not eligible,
the state of California has determined that these manuals should not be
read by pregnant rats.....Use at Your Own Risk.

TM 11-352 Printer TG-7-A and TTY TG-7-B and TG-37-B
TM 11-2201 TC-16 & TC-17 reperf sets
TM 11-2223 Model 14 Typing and Nontyping Reperfs
TM 11-2223 Model 14 Typing and Nontyping Reperfs
TM 11-2225 TT-76/GGC & TT-76A/GGC Reperforator-Transmitters
TM 11-2230 AN/FGC-20, FGC-20X, FGC-21
TM 11-2230 AN/FGC-20, FGC-20X, FGC-21
TM 11-2246 AN/FGC-25 & AN/FGC-25X TTY sets
TM 11-5815-200-35 (copy) AN/FGC-20, FGC-20X, FGC-21, & UGC-4 TTY sets

Cheers,
Nick England K4NYW
www.navy-radio.com
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From hanyou at xsmail.com  Wed Jan 27 16:33:02 2021
From: hanyou at xsmail.com (E.)
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 2021 15:33:02 -0600
Subject: [GreenKeys] Jordan Spencer Cunningham...
Message-ID: <77925EEC-4027-4D97-9477-045C2C0731F4@xsmail.com>


Except for Christmas, has anyone heard from Jordan Spencer Cunningham lately ;o ???  I sent him a message to his SMS-TTY as well, but haven?t heard back ;o ~

From w2hx at w2hx.com  Wed Jan 27 16:57:43 2021
From: w2hx at w2hx.com (W2HX)
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 2021 21:57:43 +0000
Subject: [GreenKeys] FTGH - Army Teletype manuals
In-Reply-To: <CAB55hNcpJidj=7FT+Ea=8F3npcRiNh_9Ext7eXmt_unqcugrQw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAB55hNcpJidj=7FT+Ea=8F3npcRiNh_9Ext7eXmt_unqcugrQw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <9ca5253a46754ff7ba3443bdc14c18fa@EXBE015SV3.NA02.MSEXCHANGEOUTLOOK.COM>

Action figures sold separately, batteries not included

From: greenkeys-bounces at mailman.qth.net <greenkeys-bounces at mailman.qth.net> On Behalf Of Nick England
Sent: Wednesday, January 27, 2021 4:25 PM
To: Greenkeys <greenkeys at mailman.qth.net>
Subject: [GreenKeys] FTGH - Army Teletype manuals

As usual, in the event of multiple requests, I don't necessarily send something to the first to respond with "I want it".
Priority goes to people who:
 -  have done me a favor
 -  have done other greenkeyers a favor
 -  are willing to scan and post the manual if not already on line somewhere
 -  have an amusing and/or heartwarming story about why you want/need it.

Decision of the judges is final, void where prohibited by law, no purchase necessary to enter, current employees of Teletype Corp. are not eligible, the state of California has determined that these manuals should not be read by pregnant rats.....Use at Your Own Risk.

TM 11-352 Printer TG-7-A and TTY TG-7-B and TG-37-B
TM 11-2201 TC-16 & TC-17 reperf sets
TM 11-2223 Model 14 Typing and Nontyping Reperfs
TM 11-2223 Model 14 Typing and Nontyping Reperfs
TM 11-2225 TT-76/GGC & TT-76A/GGC Reperforator-Transmitters
TM 11-2230 AN/FGC-20, FGC-20X, FGC-21
TM 11-2230 AN/FGC-20, FGC-20X, FGC-21
TM 11-2246 AN/FGC-25 & AN/FGC-25X TTY sets
TM 11-5815-200-35 (copy) AN/FGC-20, FGC-20X, FGC-21, & UGC-4 TTY sets

Cheers,
Nick England K4NYW
www.navy-radio.com<http://www.navy-radio.com>
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From highpwr at bellsouth.net  Wed Jan 27 18:38:01 2021
From: highpwr at bellsouth.net (highpwr at bellsouth.net)
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 2021 18:38:01 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] Real in person Hamfest
References: <021901d6f505$74613ea0$5d23bbe0$.ref@bellsouth.net>
Message-ID: <021901d6f505$74613ea0$5d23bbe0$@bellsouth.net>

Real In Person Hamfest, it's a small one but pretty good, Saturday only
February 27 Dalton GA

Not going to Covid Cancel, $5 to get in and tailgate, new vendors

2021 Dalton Hamfest (w4drc.com) <http://w4drc.com/event/hamfest.html> 

Steve
KM4V


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From lfmarkley at gmail.com  Wed Jan 27 18:53:25 2021
From: lfmarkley at gmail.com (The Oracle)
Date: Wed, 27 Jan 2021 16:53:25 -0700
Subject: [GreenKeys] M33 Data Set Coupler
Message-ID: <6011fcf6.1c69fb81.61f9c.f363@mx.google.com>

All,
I?m looking to install the 198420 Modification Kit ? To connect TELETYPE terminal apparatus to 103 series data sets.
Parts I?m looking for:
198420 Modification Kit:
1 x 146420 Cord, Power
2 x 182539 Connector
30 x 182644 Terminal
1 x 312418 Data Set Coupler


Thanks,
Mr. Lynn F Markley II
K9LFM
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From pbirkel at gmail.com  Thu Jan 28 05:16:00 2021
From: pbirkel at gmail.com (Paul Birkel)
Date: Thu, 28 Jan 2021 05:16:00 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] Bell System Practices P31.402
Message-ID: <0be501d6f55e$94256d20$bc704760$@gmail.com>

100A TTY Test Distributor - Description, Use, Maintenance, Wiring Diagram

 

I see that this is listed at http://www.navy-radio.com/tty/tty-wd-list.htm
(an amazing resource!)  as "to be scanned".

 

Does anyone else have it available?

 

I did find 108-804-100-5806.pdf at that site; light but readable.  Is that
the same thing as BSP P31.402?

 

Thanks.

 

-----

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From pbirkel at gmail.com  Thu Jan 28 07:39:40 2021
From: pbirkel at gmail.com (Paul Birkel)
Date: Thu, 28 Jan 2021 07:39:40 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] M15 with Polar Relay -- Configuration
In-Reply-To: <410631575.468016.1611746146535@mail.yahoo.com>
References: <09ec01d6f49a$cc00be30$64023a90$@gmail.com>
	<410631575.468016.1611746146535@mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <0c3701d6f572$a5ed5680$f1c80380$@gmail.com>

I see that http://www.k7tty.com/development/teletype/model-15/index.html has useful material, including the following claim:

 

?If a polar relay has been installed, it is necessary to connect one of the coil lead from the selector magnet which was connected to terminal 65 and move it to terminal 66. This lead goes to terminal 42. Next remove the lead which goes to the polar relay socket from terminal 61, and tape up. Then move the other selector magnet lead which was on terminal 62 and connect it to terminal 61 which goes to terminal 41.?

 

However that page also includes a labelled photo indicating a big-button switch front-n-center identified as ?POLAR NEUTRAL KEY?, which I do have.  Perhaps The Teletype Corporation has ?already thought of everything? :->.  Note that it?s located on the Keyboard subunit, not the Base ? which seems like an odd placement to me in terms of functional allocation.  It?s more clearly visible in Figures 19 and 22 of tm11-2215-teletypewriter-tt5-model-15-20pct-of600dpi-main.pdf.

 

I think that I have either a Base A or Base B, but haven?t yet confirmed which.  Those directions appear to apply in either case, but presumably only when one is operating a printer-only unit.

 

Nick England and Jim Haynes both point out that I could simply bias the existing polar relay properly.  Figure 45 (page 41) of tm11-2215-teletypewriter-tt5-model-15-20pct-of600dpi-main.pdf documents exactly this implementation in the lower-left along with Note 1 ?Polar Neutral Key in Neutral Position?.  The bias winding is fed in series with a pair of 2K ohm resistors from the nominal 110 VDC line.  If I understand the wiring of the table correctly then the same supply can be used to bias the polar relay *and* supply the loop.  While I do have the table and a REC-11 I?m missing this intermediate wiring (?Electrical Service Assembly?).  Having the pair of ?Test Jacks? to establish a local loop would be quite handy.

 

Figure 56 (page 51) illustrates a pair of interconnected teletypewriters, making clear the role of this key/switch in the end-to-end circuit.

 

The Polar-Neutral Key is described in Section 111 (pp 141-143).

 

Like all Teletype equipment there are a bevy of possible configurations and employments of the M15; all left to the interpretation and eventual understanding of the ?discerning installer? :->.  Endlessly fascinating.

 

Hopefully this note will help the next guy get started :->.

 

From: hwhall at compuserve.com [mailto:hwhall at compuserve.com] 
Sent: Wednesday, January 27, 2021 6:16 AM
To: pbirkel at gmail.com; greenkeys at mailman.qth.net
Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] M15 with Polar Relay -- Configuration

 

Sounds as though you think you must drive your machine with a polar circuit because your machine is equipped with a polar relay. Is that right? 

 

My previous Model 15 which I ran for years had a polar relay installed but I simply never used it & drove the machine via a 60ma local loop to the selector magnets.  If I recall correctly, the terminal block has enough connections there to allow one to reconfigure the machine to use or not use the polar relay (and other features).


Wayne

WB4OGM

-----Original Message-----
From: Paul Birkel <pbirkel at gmail.com>
To: greenkeys at mailman.qth.net
Sent: Wed, Jan 27, 2021 3:54 am
Subject: [GreenKeys] M15 with Polar Relay -- Configuration

Good morning all;

 

I seek some guidance/experience with setting up an M15 that came equipped with a polar relay and otherwise essentially  ?factory fresh? wiring harness.  My basic question is whether I can swap the relay for a non-polar one and then use the M15 ?conventionally? ? and if so, what would be the substitute relay?  And then ? does anyone have such a substitute available for employment in this endeavor :->?

 

Alternatively, I do have another polar relay and definitely have more than a ?passing interest? in leaving the M15 as received and instead setting up a local polar circuit to drive it that would in turn be patched into a normal local loop.  There?s not been much discussion of practical setup/employment of polar circuits here AFAIK; I enjoyed reading the AT&T Long Lines book on ?Principles of Electricity? back in 2019 and intend to refer to it again before I proceed.

 

I originally received the M15 from an ex-MARS guy who eventually used it as an office printer with an early microcomputer system before putting it into storage a few decades ago.  He kept it well lubricated, thank goodness.  It appears to be configured using a standard 60 mA pulling magnet (no S/P switch nor a 3-position terminal block; the rangefinder does NOT have an HM marking; and the magnet definitely has round windings).  I haven?t yet checked the resistance on the loop to be triply sure.

 

My main terminal block appears to be physically different from that shown at http://www.baudot.net/gil/tty-machines/pics/M15-KSR-Gil-Iface-Terminals.jpg  I don?t know whether that?s significant.  It appears to be configured to separate the KBD from the PTR circuits.  The M15 wiring appears to be entirely original excepting one modification at the polar relay ? which is a coaxial-cable stub (clipped off after ~2? and left hanging) attached to the rearmost pair of polar relay terminals that appear to have been otherwise unused (but can?t quite be sure of that, although there are no telltale snips that I can spot).  Possibly that?s a remnant of the earlier MARS use, and the separated KBD/PTR circuits reflect the later office-printer use.

 

Possibly the use a M15-polar configuration is documented in some RTTY publication?  At the moment I?m using the ?New RTTY Handbook? as my starting point, but I imagine that there are other specific how-to articles ?

 

Your various and sundry thoughts and observations will be much appreciated, thank you.

 

Good Health to You and Yours,

paul

 

 

 

______________________________________________________________
GreenKeys mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net

>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net <http://www.qsl.net/> 
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to hwhall at compuserve.com

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From w9ddd at tapr.org  Thu Jan 28 08:49:53 2021
From: w9ddd at tapr.org (w9ddd at tapr.org)
Date: Thu, 28 Jan 2021 07:49:53 -0600
Subject: [GreenKeys] M15 with Polar Relay -- Configuration
In-Reply-To: <0c3701d6f572$a5ed5680$f1c80380$@gmail.com>
References: <09ec01d6f49a$cc00be30$64023a90$@gmail.com>
	<410631575.468016.1611746146535@mail.yahoo.com>
	<0c3701d6f572$a5ed5680$f1c80380$@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <21BC80DE-591B-45B8-9421-0F597B88A61F@tapr.org>

A side observation, if this machine came through MARS channels, you may find Army or Navy manuals useful.  I think TM11-2xxx numbers would be where you'd find Army versions.  TG7 was one of the designation for the M15.  Some of the Teletype bulletins do address military variants.

John, W9DDD


> On Jan 28, 2021, at 6:39 AM, Paul Birkel <pbirkel at gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> I see that http://www.k7tty.com/development/teletype/model-15/index.html has useful material, including the following claim:
>  
> ?If a polar relay has been installed, it is necessary to connect one of the coil lead from the selector magnet which was connected to terminal 65 and move it to terminal 66. This lead goes to terminal 42. Next remove the lead which goes to the polar relay socket from terminal 61, and tape up. Then move the other selector magnet lead which was on terminal 62 and connect it to terminal 61 which goes to terminal 41.?
>  
> However that page also includes a labelled photo indicating a big-button switch front-n-center identified as ?POLAR NEUTRAL KEY?, which I do have.  Perhaps The Teletype Corporation has ?already thought of everything? :->.  Note that it?s located on the Keyboard subunit, not the Base ? which seems like an odd placement to me in terms of functional allocation.  It?s more clearly visible in Figures 19 and 22 of tm11-2215-teletypewriter-tt5-model-15-20pct-of600dpi-main.pdf.
>  
> I think that I have either a Base A or Base B, but haven?t yet confirmed which.  Those directions appear to apply in either case, but presumably only when one is operating a printer-only unit.
>  
> Nick England and Jim Haynes both point out that I could simply bias the existing polar relay properly.  Figure 45 (page 41) of tm11-2215-teletypewriter-tt5-model-15-20pct-of600dpi-main.pdf documents exactly this implementation in the lower-left along with Note 1 ?Polar Neutral Key in Neutral Position?.  The bias winding is fed in series with a pair of 2K ohm resistors from the nominal 110 VDC line.  If I understand the wiring of the table correctly then the same supply can be used to bias the polar relay *and* supply the loop.  While I do have the table and a REC-11 I?m missing this intermediate wiring (?Electrical Service Assembly?).  Having the pair of ?Test Jacks? to establish a local loop would be quite handy.
>  
> Figure 56 (page 51) illustrates a pair of interconnected teletypewriters, making clear the role of this key/switch in the end-to-end circuit.
>  
> The Polar-Neutral Key is described in Section 111 (pp 141-143).
>  
> Like all Teletype equipment there are a bevy of possible configurations and employments of the M15; all left to the interpretation and eventual understanding of the ?discerning installer? :->.  Endlessly fascinating.
>  
> Hopefully this note will help the next guy get started :->.
>  
> From: hwhall at compuserve.com [mailto:hwhall at compuserve.com] 
> Sent: Wednesday, January 27, 2021 6:16 AM
> To: pbirkel at gmail.com; greenkeys at mailman.qth.net
> Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] M15 with Polar Relay -- Configuration
>  
> Sounds as though you think you must drive your machine with a polar circuit because your machine is equipped with a polar relay. Is that right?
>  
> My previous Model 15 which I ran for years had a polar relay installed but I simply never used it & drove the machine via a 60ma local loop to the selector magnets.  If I recall correctly, the terminal block has enough connections there to allow one to reconfigure the machine to use or not use the polar relay (and other features).
> 
> Wayne
> WB4OGM
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Paul Birkel <pbirkel at gmail.com>
> To: greenkeys at mailman.qth.net
> Sent: Wed, Jan 27, 2021 3:54 am
> Subject: [GreenKeys] M15 with Polar Relay -- Configuration
> 
> Good morning all;
>  
> I seek some guidance/experience with setting up an M15 that came equipped with a polar relay and otherwise essentially  ?factory fresh? wiring harness.  My basic question is whether I can swap the relay for a non-polar one and then use the M15 ?conventionally? ? and if so, what would be the substitute relay?  And then ? does anyone have such a substitute available for employment in this endeavor :->?
>  
> Alternatively, I do have another polar relay and definitely have more than a ?passing interest? in leaving the M15 as received and instead setting up a local polar circuit to drive it that would in turn be patched into a normal local loop.  There?s not been much discussion of practical setup/employment of polar circuits here AFAIK; I enjoyed reading the AT&T Long Lines book on ?Principles of Electricity? back in 2019 and intend to refer to it again before I proceed.
>  
> I originally received the M15 from an ex-MARS guy who eventually used it as an office printer with an early microcomputer system before putting it into storage a few decades ago.  He kept it well lubricated, thank goodness.  It appears to be configured using a standard 60 mA pulling magnet (no S/P switch nor a 3-position terminal block; the rangefinder does NOT have an HM marking; and the magnet definitely has round windings).  I haven?t yet checked the resistance on the loop to be triply sure.
>  
> My main terminal block appears to be physically different from that shown at http://www.baudot.net/gil/tty-machines/pics/M15-KSR-Gil-Iface-Terminals.jpg  I don?t know whether that?s significant.  It appears to be configured to separate the KBD from the PTR circuits.  The M15 wiring appears to be entirely original excepting one modification at the polar relay ? which is a coaxial-cable stub (clipped off after ~2? and left hanging) attached to the rearmost pair of polar relay terminals that appear to have been otherwise unused (but can?t quite be sure of that, although there are no telltale snips that I can spot).  Possibly that?s a remnant of the earlier MARS use, and the separated KBD/PTR circuits reflect the later office-printer use.
>  
> Possibly the use a M15-polar configuration is documented in some RTTY publication?  At the moment I?m using the ?New RTTY Handbook? as my starting point, but I imagine that there are other specific how-to articles ?
>  
> Your various and sundry thoughts and observations will be much appreciated, thank you.
>  
> Good Health to You and Yours,
> paul
>  
>  
>  
> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
> 
> >>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
> >>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
> >>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
> >>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
> 
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to hwhall at compuserve.com
> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
> 
>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
> 
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to w9ddd at tapr.org
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From pdwills at cedarknolltelephone.com  Thu Jan 28 08:56:10 2021
From: pdwills at cedarknolltelephone.com (Paul Wills (CKT&T))
Date: Thu, 28 Jan 2021 08:56:10 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] Bell System Practices P31.402
In-Reply-To: <0be501d6f55e$94256d20$bc704760$@gmail.com>
References: <0be501d6f55e$94256d20$bc704760$@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <57f48c4c-3de8-416e-5333-491bb781d0a9@cedarknolltelephone.com>

If nobody comes up with an existing scan, I can do one tonight.? Let me 
know.

PDW

On 1/28/2021 5:16 AM, Paul Birkel wrote:
>
> 100A TTY Test Distributor - Description, Use, Maintenance, Wiring Diagram
>
> I see that this is listed at 
> http://www.navy-radio.com/tty/tty-wd-list.htm 
> <http://www.navy-radio.com/tty/tty-wd-list.htm> (an amazing 
> resource!)? as ?to be scanned?.
>
> Does anyone else have it available?
>
> I did find 108-804-100-5806.pdf at that site; light but readable.? Is 
> that the same thing as BSP P31.402?
>
> Thanks.
>
> -----
>
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
>
>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to pdwills at cedarknolltelephone.com



From pbirkel at gmail.com  Thu Jan 28 10:33:03 2021
From: pbirkel at gmail.com (Paul Birkel)
Date: Thu, 28 Jan 2021 10:33:03 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] Bell System Practices P31.402
In-Reply-To: <57f48c4c-3de8-416e-5333-491bb781d0a9@cedarknolltelephone.com>
References: <0be501d6f55e$94256d20$bc704760$@gmail.com>
	<57f48c4c-3de8-416e-5333-491bb781d0a9@cedarknolltelephone.com>
Message-ID: <0cb001d6f58a$de556a40$9b003ec0$@gmail.com>

Thanks for the offer Paul.  Jim Haynes sent me one and I believe that Nick
England is now working on adding the missing link on his site.

-----Original Message-----
From: greenkeys-bounces at mailman.qth.net
[mailto:greenkeys-bounces at mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Paul Wills (CKT&T)
Sent: Thursday, January 28, 2021 8:56 AM
To: greenkeys at mailman.qth.net
Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] Bell System Practices P31.402

If nobody comes up with an existing scan, I can do one tonight.? Let me 
know.

PDW

On 1/28/2021 5:16 AM, Paul Birkel wrote:
>
> 100A TTY Test Distributor - Description, Use, Maintenance, Wiring Diagram
>
> I see that this is listed at 
> http://www.navy-radio.com/tty/tty-wd-list.htm 
> <http://www.navy-radio.com/tty/tty-wd-list.htm> (an amazing 
> resource!)? as ?to be scanned?.
>
> Does anyone else have it available?
>
> I did find 108-804-100-5806.pdf at that site; light but readable.? Is 
> that the same thing as BSP P31.402?
>
> Thanks.
>
> -----
>
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
>
>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool:
https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive:
http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive:
http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool:
http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to pdwills at cedarknolltelephone.com


______________________________________________________________
GreenKeys mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net

>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool:
https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive:
http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive:
http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool:
http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to pbirkel at gmail.com


From John at tubetestingpros.com  Thu Jan 28 13:14:49 2021
From: John at tubetestingpros.com (John)
Date: Thu, 28 Jan 2021 10:14:49 -0800
Subject: [GreenKeys] Raspberry Pi system 4 Sale
Message-ID: <f425cc58-9ac0-c0a4-65f1-98cde8d73c02@tubetestingpros.com>


 ? Greetings GreenKeyers!

I have a new(ish) Cannakit 4GB Raspberry Pi system for sale - built, 
running, includes a separate 7" HDMI touch-screen, power supply, USB 
audio interface, a few adapters and cables, etc.

Its about 1 year old, but it doesn't have 10 hours on it, if that. 
Purchased primarily for a control-automation project that went a 
different way later.

Has added RTTY software (FLDigi + FLARQ) that works and copies ITTY - 
never used it to send. Firefox is loaded also. Has many built-in 
programming languages + IDEs, including Python. Has full office-suite 
software - the whole Debian distribution. All working and ready to go.

This is a running, plug-and-play system; you add an HDMI monitor, USB 
keyboard, and USB mouse of your choice. (I used the touch-screen a bit; 
too small for my old eyes!)

All of the above: $75 /including/ shipping to, and payment from, CONUS 
only. PayPal is muchly greatly preferred...

First "I'll take it" response gets the Machine.


Annnnd counting.....


;}


Cheerz

John KB6SCO

Carson City NV


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From highpwr at bellsouth.net  Thu Jan 28 13:19:59 2021
From: highpwr at bellsouth.net (highpwr at bellsouth.net)
Date: Thu, 28 Jan 2021 13:19:59 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] Raspberry Pi system 4 Sale
In-Reply-To: <f425cc58-9ac0-c0a4-65f1-98cde8d73c02@tubetestingpros.com>
References: <f425cc58-9ac0-c0a4-65f1-98cde8d73c02@tubetestingpros.com>
Message-ID: <000001d6f5a2$31061e80$93125b80$@bellsouth.net>

I?ll Take it.

 

Steve

KM4V

 

From: greenkeys-bounces at mailman.qth.net <greenkeys-bounces at mailman.qth.net> On Behalf Of John
Sent: Thursday, January 28, 2021 1:15 PM
To: Greenkeys <greenkeys at mailman.qth.net>
Subject: [GreenKeys] Raspberry Pi system 4 Sale

 

 

  Greetings GreenKeyers!

I have a new(ish) Cannakit 4GB Raspberry Pi system for sale - built, running, includes a separate 7" HDMI touch-screen, power supply, USB audio interface, a few adapters and cables, etc. 

Its about 1 year old, but it doesn't have 10 hours on it, if that. Purchased primarily for a control-automation project that went a different way later.

Has added RTTY software (FLDigi + FLARQ) that works and copies ITTY - never used it to send. Firefox is loaded also. Has many built-in programming languages + IDEs, including Python. Has full office-suite software - the whole Debian distribution. All working and ready to go.

This is a running, plug-and-play system; you add an HDMI monitor, USB keyboard, and USB mouse of your choice. (I used the touch-screen a bit; too small for my old eyes!) 

All of the above: $75 including shipping to, and payment from, CONUS only. PayPal is muchly greatly preferred...

First "I'll take it" response gets the Machine.

 

Annnnd counting.....

 

;}

 

Cheerz

John KB6SCO

Carson City NV

 

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From John at tubetestingpros.com  Thu Jan 28 13:22:02 2021
From: John at tubetestingpros.com (John)
Date: Thu, 28 Jan 2021 10:22:02 -0800
Subject: [GreenKeys] Raspberry PI sold
Message-ID: <7901abac-2b4e-5ea7-f81f-f1c47844386d@tubetestingpros.com>

 ?Every last slice.

Took <2 minutes.


Gotta luv da Internet!


Cheers

John KB6SCO

Carson City NV


From navy.radio at gmail.com  Thu Jan 28 15:24:39 2021
From: navy.radio at gmail.com (Nick England)
Date: Thu, 28 Jan 2021 15:24:39 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] Bell System Practices P31.402
In-Reply-To: <0be501d6f55e$94256d20$bc704760$@gmail.com>
References: <0be501d6f55e$94256d20$bc704760$@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAB55hNfcSzMKdvB9fxw8pCbkRv44vGETYkvXoHu=a3X+2=JHbQ@mail.gmail.com>

Thanks to Jim Haynes, this file is now posted at
http://www.navy-radio.com/manuals/tty/P31-402-iss2-5801.pdf

Note - the Bell 100A is the same as Teletype ED51DT and US Navy TS-658/UG
Description and Adjustments
http://www.navy-radio.com/manuals/tty/184B-test-1402.pdf
Parts
http://www.navy-radio.com/manuals/tty/jh/ttyman8/TeletypeManuals/other/1113B-Chg1.pdf
Wiring Diagram
http://www.navy-radio.com/manuals/tty/jh/ttyman9/drawings/1954wd-h.pdf

Note - The Bell 100C is Teletype ED51EH for 50 Hz power

Cheers,
Nick England K4NYW
www.navy-radio.com


On Thu, Jan 28, 2021 at 5:17 AM Paul Birkel <pbirkel at gmail.com> wrote:

> 100A TTY Test Distributor - Description, Use, Maintenance, Wiring Diagram
>
>
>
> I see that this is listed at http://www.navy-radio.com/tty/tty-wd-list.htm
> (an amazing resource!)  as ?to be scanned?.
>
>
>
> Does anyone else have it available?
>
>
>
> I did find 108-804-100-5806.pdf at that site; light but readable.  Is that
> the same thing as BSP P31.402?
>
>
>
> Thanks.
>
>
>
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From jim.w2jc at gmail.com  Thu Jan 28 17:01:52 2021
From: jim.w2jc at gmail.com (Jim Cooper)
Date: Thu, 28 Jan 2021 17:01:52 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] Bell System Practices P31.402
In-Reply-To: <CAB55hNfcSzMKdvB9fxw8pCbkRv44vGETYkvXoHu=a3X+2=JHbQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <0be501d6f55e$94256d20$bc704760$@gmail.com>,
	<CAB55hNfcSzMKdvB9fxw8pCbkRv44vGETYkvXoHu=a3X+2=JHbQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <60133450.25810.339F824@jim.w2jc.gmail.com>

On 28 Jan 2021 at 15:24, Nick England wrote:

> Note - the Bell 100A is the same as Teletype ED51DT and US Navy
> TS-658/UG

I just happen to have a real live TS-659/UG that 
looks just the same ...  it's  115vAC, 60Hz     :))



From pbirkel at gmail.com  Fri Jan 29 09:20:46 2021
From: pbirkel at gmail.com (Paul Birkel)
Date: Fri, 29 Jan 2021 09:20:46 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] M15 Margin-Bell Pawl Spring (82999?)
Message-ID: <0e9b01d6f649$eff7faa0$cfe7efe0$@gmail.com>

Well, mine has gone AWOL.  There's a twisted stub still attached to the pawl
itself, but that's it.

 

In TM11-2215 (tm11-2215-teletypewriter-tt5-model-15-20pct-of600dpi-main.pdf)
the Margin-Bell Pawl Spring is clearly specified in Section 236 and Figure
203 (pp. 231-232) however it does not appear to be listed in the section on
Parts Identification.  So I'm stumped as to the proper part #.

 

It should be a pretty stiff spring; a pull of 1/2 to 1 1/2 ounces is
recommended, so not an especially critical tension.

 

In 1110B_Model15_Parts_Dec43_ArmyVer.pdf on page 10 it appears to be part #
82999 "Spring", listed immediately above  # 74378 "Margin Bell Pawl" on the
left-hand side of the illustration.  Only the "Margin Bell Pawl" is listed
in the index, but I'm pretty sure that I've correctly identified the missing
spring in that illustration.

 

My confusion arises when I search for that part # back in TM11-2215 where it
appears (only) in the illustration for the RIBBON OSCILLATOR (Figure 323,
page 354).  There is a corresponding identification entry for "4T82999" on
page 336 (the spring section of Miscellaneous Parts) described as "SPRING:
extension; .010" dia music wire; 17/32" lg x 9/32" dia overall".  The
function of the part is left unspecified, although many other springs listed
there do include this information.  There are no springs listed there
corresponding to figure 203.  But at least the stated dimensions seem about
right.

 

Should I expect to see these sorts of inconsistencies/incompletenesses
between these two documents?  Am I looking in the wrong documents?  Is thus
an example of a "generic" spring with multiple uses?  Is the correct part 3
"82999" or "4T82999" or something else entirely :->?

 

Does anyone have one of these?  Or should I go directly to Mr RTTY and throw
myself on his good graces :->?

 

Thank you for your advice.  I'm still learning-the-ropes, yes.  So many
questions!

 

paul

 

 

 

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From pbirkel at gmail.com  Fri Jan 29 09:41:00 2021
From: pbirkel at gmail.com (Paul Birkel)
Date: Fri, 29 Jan 2021 09:41:00 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] M15 Synchronous (AC) Motor Lubrication - Ball Oilers
Message-ID: <0ea001d6f64c$c354a4a0$49fdede0$@gmail.com>

All;

 

The motor on my M15 uses the "ball oiler" style of lubrication ports.
Technically they seem to be "70771 FITTING, PRESSURE".

 

Should I just depress them with an appropriately tipped tool and then try to
drip a few drops of either light machine oil or SAE 5W synthetic motor oil
(that I've seen recommended here in the past) around the depressed ball?

 

I realize (from long ago mechanics shop) that there must be a special grease
gun whose nozzle is pressed over these ports to inject grease, but I
certainly don't have one.  The armature appears to be free turning (haven't
yet applied power) so it's not clear that I actually _need_ to lubricate the
motor at the moment.  Still, one wonders!

 

In TM11-2215 (tm11-2215-teletypewriter-tt5-model-15-20pct-of600dpi-main.pdf)
Section II starting on page 69 covers the topic of lubrication.  At the
bottom of page 71 in the table it states "Apply grease with gun or 4 or 5
drops in each." with lubricant "KS-7471 or KS-7470".  The former is a grease
and the latter is "Oil lubricating, Teletype Part No. 88970.*" with the
footnote indicating that at "high temperatures" SAE 10 engine oil may be
substituted.

 

Is KS-7470 (Teletype Part No. 88970) substitutable by light machine (e.g.,
sewing machine) oil?  Unless either KS-7471 grease or OE 10 engine oil is
specified, KS-7470 seems to be the go-to lubricant for the M15.  I'm
thinking that light machine oil is appropriate in this application.

 

What method are folks using lubricate motors equipped with this style of
lubrication port?  What lubricant?

 

Thank you for your advice,

paul

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From pdwills at cedarknolltelephone.com  Fri Jan 29 09:54:44 2021
From: pdwills at cedarknolltelephone.com (Paul Wills (CKT&T))
Date: Fri, 29 Jan 2021 09:54:44 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] M15 Margin-Bell Pawl Spring (82999?)
In-Reply-To: <0e9b01d6f649$eff7faa0$cfe7efe0$@gmail.com>
References: <0e9b01d6f649$eff7faa0$cfe7efe0$@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <9d79d874-d35f-aa2a-f070-5b316a915a11@cedarknolltelephone.com>

According to Teletype Bulletin 1037B, 82999 should be the part.? I have 
one here if you need it.

PDW

On 1/29/2021 9:20 AM, Paul Birkel wrote:
>
> Well, mine has gone AWOL.? There?s a twisted stub still attached to 
> the pawl itself, but that?s it.
>
> In TM11-2215 
> (tm11-2215-teletypewriter-tt5-model-15-20pct-of600dpi-main.pdf) the 
> Margin-Bell Pawl Spring is clearly specified in Section 236 and Figure 
> 203 (pp. 231-232) however it does not appear to be listed in the 
> section on Parts Identification.? So I?m stumped as to the proper part #.
>
> It should be a pretty stiff spring; a pull of 1/2 to 1 1/2 ounces is 
> recommended, so not an especially critical tension.
>
> In 1110B_Model15_Parts_Dec43_ArmyVer.pdf on page 10 it appears to be 
> part # 82999 ?Spring?, listed immediately above ?# 74378 ?Margin Bell 
> Pawl? on the left-hand side of the illustration.? Only the ?Margin 
> Bell Pawl? is listed in the index, but I?m pretty sure that I?ve 
> correctly identified the missing spring in that illustration.
>
> My confusion arises when I search for that part # back in TM11-2215 
> where it appears (only) in the illustration for the RIBBON OSCILLATOR 
> (Figure 323, page 354).? There is a corresponding identification entry 
> for ?4T82999? on page 336 (the spring section of Miscellaneous Parts) 
> described as ?SPRING: extension; .010" dia music wire; 17/32" lg x 
> 9/32? dia overall?.? The function of the part is left unspecified, 
> although many other springs listed there do include this information.? 
> There are no springs listed there corresponding to figure 203.? But at 
> least the stated dimensions seem about right.
>
> Should I expect to see these sorts of inconsistencies/incompletenesses 
> between these two documents?? Am I looking in the wrong documents?? Is 
> thus an example of a ?generic? spring with multiple uses?? Is the 
> correct part 3 ?82999? or ?4T82999? or something else entirely :->?
>
> Does anyone have one of these?? Or should I go directly to Mr RTTY and 
> throw myself on his good graces :->?
>
> Thank you for your advice.? I?m still learning-the-ropes, yes.? So 
> many questions!
>
> paul
>


From pbirkel at gmail.com  Fri Jan 29 10:03:15 2021
From: pbirkel at gmail.com (Paul Birkel)
Date: Fri, 29 Jan 2021 10:03:15 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] M15 Margin-Bell Pawl Spring (82999?)
Message-ID: <0ec401d6f64f$df3cc780$9db65680$@gmail.com>

Tom Tillson pointed me to Bulletin 1037B issue 6.  I've stared further at
the illustration of the RIBBON OSCILLATOR (I-22) and realized that it's just
in a different projection than I was expecting (I need to work on my
expectations, more).  And not a name that I recognized (or had some useful
intuition regarding).

 

# 82999 SPRING (aka "4T82999" apparently) is indeed that which I seek.  And
attaches to # 74378 PAWL, MARGIN BELL.

 

Anyone have one?

 

From: Paul Birkel [mailto:pbirkel at gmail.com] 
Sent: Friday, January 29, 2021 9:21 AM
To: greenkeys at mailman.qth.net
Subject: M15 Margin-Bell Pawl Spring (82999?)

 

Well, mine has gone AWOL.  There's a twisted stub still attached to the pawl
itself, but that's it.

 

In TM11-2215 (tm11-2215-teletypewriter-tt5-model-15-20pct-of600dpi-main.pdf)
the Margin-Bell Pawl Spring is clearly specified in Section 236 and Figure
203 (pp. 231-232) however it does not appear to be listed in the section on
Parts Identification.  So I'm stumped as to the proper part #.

 

It should be a pretty stiff spring; a pull of 1/2 to 1 1/2 ounces is
recommended, so not an especially critical tension.

 

In 1110B_Model15_Parts_Dec43_ArmyVer.pdf on page 10 it appears to be part #
82999 "Spring", listed immediately above  # 74378 "Margin Bell Pawl" on the
left-hand side of the illustration.  Only the "Margin Bell Pawl" is listed
in the index, but I'm pretty sure that I've correctly identified the missing
spring in that illustration.

 

My confusion arises when I search for that part # back in TM11-2215 where it
appears (only) in the illustration for the RIBBON OSCILLATOR (Figure 323,
page 354).  There is a corresponding identification entry for "4T82999" on
page 336 (the spring section of Miscellaneous Parts) described as "SPRING:
extension; .010" dia music wire; 17/32" lg x 9/32" dia overall".  The
function of the part is left unspecified, although many other springs listed
there do include this information.  There are no springs listed there
corresponding to figure 203.  But at least the stated dimensions seem about
right.

 

Should I expect to see these sorts of inconsistencies/incompletenesses
between these two documents?  Am I looking in the wrong documents?  Is thus
an example of a "generic" spring with multiple uses?  Is the correct part 3
"82999" or "4T82999" or something else entirely :->?

 

Does anyone have one of these?  Or should I go directly to Mr RTTY and throw
myself on his good graces :->?

 

Thank you for your advice.  I'm still learning-the-ropes, yes.  So many
questions!

 

paul

 

 

 

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From highpwr at bellsouth.net  Fri Jan 29 10:19:59 2021
From: highpwr at bellsouth.net (highpwr at bellsouth.net)
Date: Fri, 29 Jan 2021 10:19:59 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] ITTY down ???
References: <008301d6f652$36d79ea0$a486dbe0$.ref@bellsouth.net>
Message-ID: <008301d6f652$36d79ea0$a486dbe0$@bellsouth.net>

Been using ITTY here for the past week running a test, it appears to be down
or no tty signals on it here, anybody else seeing a failure with itty?


Steve
KM4V


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From pbirkel at gmail.com  Fri Jan 29 10:21:07 2021
From: pbirkel at gmail.com (Paul Birkel)
Date: Fri, 29 Jan 2021 10:21:07 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] M15 Margin-Bell Pawl Spring (82999?)
In-Reply-To: <9d79d874-d35f-aa2a-f070-5b316a915a11@cedarknolltelephone.com>
References: <0e9b01d6f649$eff7faa0$cfe7efe0$@gmail.com>
	<9d79d874-d35f-aa2a-f070-5b316a915a11@cedarknolltelephone.com>
Message-ID: <0ed801d6f652$5e3a0460$1aae0d20$@gmail.com>

Yes please!  Thank you.  I'm located in Maryland.  Somewhere at the end of
the currently slow-as-molasses USPS.  At least here in the north-east
throughput hasn't improved much since Christmas.  But then nothing has been
lost, either.

Contact me directly to work out the details.

-----Original Message-----
From: greenkeys-bounces at mailman.qth.net
[mailto:greenkeys-bounces at mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Paul Wills (CKT&T)
Sent: Friday, January 29, 2021 9:55 AM
To: greenkeys at mailman.qth.net
Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] M15 Margin-Bell Pawl Spring (82999?)

According to Teletype Bulletin 1037B, 82999 should be the part.? I have 
one here if you need it.

PDW

On 1/29/2021 9:20 AM, Paul Birkel wrote:
>
> Well, mine has gone AWOL.? There?s a twisted stub still attached to 
> the pawl itself, but that?s it.
>
> In TM11-2215 
> (tm11-2215-teletypewriter-tt5-model-15-20pct-of600dpi-main.pdf) the 
> Margin-Bell Pawl Spring is clearly specified in Section 236 and Figure 
> 203 (pp. 231-232) however it does not appear to be listed in the 
> section on Parts Identification.? So I?m stumped as to the proper part #.
>
> It should be a pretty stiff spring; a pull of 1/2 to 1 1/2 ounces is 
> recommended, so not an especially critical tension.
>
> In 1110B_Model15_Parts_Dec43_ArmyVer.pdf on page 10 it appears to be 
> part # 82999 ?Spring?, listed immediately above ?# 74378 ?Margin Bell 
> Pawl? on the left-hand side of the illustration.? Only the ?Margin 
> Bell Pawl? is listed in the index, but I?m pretty sure that I?ve 
> correctly identified the missing spring in that illustration.
>
> My confusion arises when I search for that part # back in TM11-2215 
> where it appears (only) in the illustration for the RIBBON OSCILLATOR 
> (Figure 323, page 354).? There is a corresponding identification entry 
> for ?4T82999? on page 336 (the spring section of Miscellaneous Parts) 
> described as ?SPRING: extension; .010" dia music wire; 17/32" lg x 
> 9/32? dia overall?.? The function of the part is left unspecified, 
> although many other springs listed there do include this information.? 
> There are no springs listed there corresponding to figure 203.? But at 
> least the stated dimensions seem about right.
>
> Should I expect to see these sorts of inconsistencies/incompletenesses 
> between these two documents?? Am I looking in the wrong documents?? Is 
> thus an example of a ?generic? spring with multiple uses?? Is the 
> correct part 3 ?82999? or ?4T82999? or something else entirely :->?
>
> Does anyone have one of these?? Or should I go directly to Mr RTTY and 
> throw myself on his good graces :->?
>
> Thank you for your advice.? I?m still learning-the-ropes, yes.? So 
> many questions!
>
> paul
>

______________________________________________________________
GreenKeys mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net

>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool:
https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive:
http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive:
http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool:
http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to pbirkel at gmail.com


From til128 at juno.com  Fri Jan 29 10:23:47 2021
From: til128 at juno.com (til128 at juno.com)
Date: Fri, 29 Jan 2021 15:23:47 GMT
Subject: [GreenKeys] ITTY down ???
Message-ID: <20210129.102347.28652.1@webmail11.dca.untd.com>

ITTY is now up and running.
Thank you for the heads-up!

Tom

Please note: message attached

From: <highpwr at bellsouth.net>
To: "'Greenkeys'" <greenkeys at mailman.qth.net>
Subject: [GreenKeys] ITTY down ???
Date: Fri, 29 Jan 2021 10:19:59 -0500


____________________________________________________________
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-------------- next part --------------
Been using ITTY here for the past week running a test, it appears to be down
or no tty signals on it here, anybody else seeing a failure with itty?


Steve
KM4V


-------------- next part --------------
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From highpwr at bellsouth.net  Fri Jan 29 10:25:52 2021
From: highpwr at bellsouth.net (highpwr at bellsouth.net)
Date: Fri, 29 Jan 2021 10:25:52 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] ITTY down ???
In-Reply-To: <008301d6f652$36d79ea0$a486dbe0$@bellsouth.net>
References: <008301d6f652$36d79ea0$a486dbe0$.ref@bellsouth.net>
	<008301d6f652$36d79ea0$a486dbe0$@bellsouth.net>
Message-ID: <009501d6f653$08fdd660$1af98320$@bellsouth.net>

Back up, Disregard.

 

Steve

KM4V

 

From: greenkeys-bounces at mailman.qth.net <greenkeys-bounces at mailman.qth.net>
On Behalf Of highpwr at bellsouth.net
Sent: Friday, January 29, 2021 10:20 AM
To: 'Greenkeys' <greenkeys at mailman.qth.net>
Subject: [GreenKeys] ITTY down ???

 

Been using ITTY here for the past week running a test, it appears to be down
or no tty signals on it here, anybody else seeing a failure with itty?

 

Steve

KM4V

 

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From pbirkel at gmail.com  Fri Jan 29 11:07:36 2021
From: pbirkel at gmail.com (Paul Birkel)
Date: Fri, 29 Jan 2021 11:07:36 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] Bell System Practices P31.402
In-Reply-To: <CAB55hNfcSzMKdvB9fxw8pCbkRv44vGETYkvXoHu=a3X+2=JHbQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <0be501d6f55e$94256d20$bc704760$@gmail.com>
	<CAB55hNfcSzMKdvB9fxw8pCbkRv44vGETYkvXoHu=a3X+2=JHbQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <0f1001d6f658$dc6dd9f0$95498dd0$@gmail.com>

Thank you Nick and Jim :-}.

 

From: greenkeys-bounces at mailman.qth.net [mailto:greenkeys-bounces at mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Nick England
Sent: Thursday, January 28, 2021 3:25 PM
To: Greenkeys
Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] Bell System Practices P31.402

 

Thanks to Jim Haynes, this file is now posted at

http://www.navy-radio.com/manuals/tty/P31-402-iss2-5801.pdf

 

Note - the Bell 100A is the same as Teletype ED51DT and US Navy TS-658/UG

Description and Adjustments

http://www.navy-radio.com/manuals/tty/184B-test-1402.pdf

Parts

http://www.navy-radio.com/manuals/tty/jh/ttyman8/TeletypeManuals/other/1113B-Chg1.pdf

Wiring Diagram

http://www.navy-radio.com/manuals/tty/jh/ttyman9/drawings/1954wd-h.pdf

 

Note - The Bell 100C is Teletype ED51EH for 50 Hz power

 

Cheers,

Nick England K4NYW
www.navy-radio.com

 

 

On Thu, Jan 28, 2021 at 5:17 AM Paul Birkel <pbirkel at gmail.com> wrote:

100A TTY Test Distributor - Description, Use, Maintenance, Wiring Diagram

 

I see that this is listed at http://www.navy-radio.com/tty/tty-wd-list.htm (an amazing resource!)  as ?to be scanned?.

 

Does anyone else have it available?

 

I did find 108-804-100-5806.pdf at that site; light but readable.  Is that the same thing as BSP P31.402?

 

Thanks.

 

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From djones at k6yic.com  Fri Jan 29 11:15:40 2021
From: djones at k6yic.com (Daniel Jones)
Date: Fri, 29 Jan 2021 08:15:40 -0800
Subject: [GreenKeys] M15 Synchronous (AC) Motor Lubrication - Ball Oilers
In-Reply-To: <0ea001d6f64c$c354a4a0$49fdede0$@gmail.com>
References: <0ea001d6f64c$c354a4a0$49fdede0$@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <91C4C4BF-C907-456F-8979-E1B9A519520F@k6yic.com>

I usually refer to this page.  It?s based on the scientific properties of the lubricants and gives you current alternatives based on those properties.  

http://homepage.cs.uiowa.edu/~jones/pdp8/UI-8/ks7470oil.shtml

Daniel

K6YIC 
http://K6YIC.com

> On Jan 29, 2021, at 06:42, Paul Birkel <pbirkel at gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> ?
> All;
>  
> The motor on my M15 uses the ?ball oiler? style of lubrication ports.  Technically they seem to be ?70771 FITTING, PRESSURE?.
>  
> Should I just depress them with an appropriately tipped tool and then try to drip a few drops of either light machine oil or SAE 5W synthetic motor oil (that I?ve seen recommended here in the past) around the depressed ball?
>  
> I realize (from long ago mechanics shop) that there must be a special grease gun whose nozzle is pressed over these ports to inject grease, but I certainly don?t have one.  The armature appears to be free turning (haven?t yet applied power) so it?s not clear that I actually _need_ to lubricate the motor at the moment.  Still, one wonders!
>  
> In TM11-2215 (tm11-2215-teletypewriter-tt5-model-15-20pct-of600dpi-main.pdf) Section II starting on page 69 covers the topic of lubrication.  At the bottom of page 71 in the table it states ?Apply grease with gun or 4 or 5 drops in each.? with lubricant ?KS-7471 or KS-7470?.  The former is a grease and the latter is ?Oil lubricating, Teletype Part No. 88970.*? with the footnote indicating that at ?high temperatures? SAE 10 engine oil may be substituted.
>  
> Is KS-7470 (Teletype Part No. 88970) substitutable by light machine (e.g., sewing machine) oil?  Unless either KS-7471 grease or OE 10 engine oil is specified, KS-7470 seems to be the go-to lubricant for the M15.  I?m thinking that light machine oil is appropriate in this application.
>  
> What method are folks using lubricate motors equipped with this style of lubrication port?  What lubricant?
>  
> Thank you for your advice,
> paul
> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
> 
>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
> 
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to djones at k6yic.com
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From w2hx at w2hx.com  Fri Jan 29 15:18:56 2021
From: w2hx at w2hx.com (W2HX)
Date: Fri, 29 Jan 2021 20:18:56 +0000
Subject: [GreenKeys] FW: [Milsurplus] Last call Teletype machines
In-Reply-To: <8d0c2997-b539-08da-cf75-3426e86bf838@att.net>
References: <8d0c2997-b539-08da-cf75-3426e86bf838.ref@att.net>
	<8d0c2997-b539-08da-cf75-3426e86bf838@att.net>
Message-ID: <cc8e65f15ed840afbd861c2804e07599@EXBE015SV3.NA02.MSEXCHANGEOUTLOOK.COM>

Not mine, just passing on

-----Original Message-----
From: milsurplus-bounces at mailman.qth.net <milsurplus-bounces at mailman.qth.net> On Behalf Of Jack Antonio
Sent: Friday, January 29, 2021 3:18 PM
To: milsurplus at mailman.qth.net
Subject: [Milsurplus] Last call Teletype machines

Last year I came across some Teletype gear, a Model 14, 15, tape reader and/or punch, and a Western Union model 102.

And I have been trying to find a home for them.
With no luck. I had one nibble that wanted them at the end of November, then the end of December, then when the virus thing died down, and now no replies at all.

But, I am no longer able to store these things, and they are going to have to go somewhere. I would hate to see these going to landfill, but I'm running out of options.

Can't ship them, so they are pickup in middle Georgia, although I would be able to deliver within about a 100 mile radius of Macon, Georgia.

At this point, they are free, I simply just need the space.

Description and photos on request.

Any takers?

Thanks

Jack Antonio
WA7DIA

PS. Don't tell me to try the greenkeys
list, all I got there was crickets and
the one nibble I mentioned.
______________________________________________________________
Milsurplus mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/milsurplus
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:Milsurplus at mailman.qth.net

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html

From hanyou at xsmail.com  Fri Jan 29 16:07:54 2021
From: hanyou at xsmail.com (E.)
Date: Fri, 29 Jan 2021 15:07:54 -0600
Subject: [GreenKeys] FW: [Milsurplus] Last call Teletype machines
In-Reply-To: <cc8e65f15ed840afbd861c2804e07599@EXBE015SV3.NA02.MSEXCHANGEOUTLOOK.COM>
References: <8d0c2997-b539-08da-cf75-3426e86bf838.ref@att.net>
	<8d0c2997-b539-08da-cf75-3426e86bf838@att.net>
	<cc8e65f15ed840afbd861c2804e07599@EXBE015SV3.NA02.MSEXCHANGEOUTLOOK.COM>
Message-ID: <36EED92B-944E-4A53-8DE1-D947C4A1EF6E@xsmail.com>


I would love the 14, but I?m in Nebraska, so ;o ?..


> On Jan 29, 2021, at 2:18 pm, W2HX <w2hx at w2hx.com> wrote:
> 
> Not mine, just passing on
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: milsurplus-bounces at mailman.qth.net <milsurplus-bounces at mailman.qth.net> On Behalf Of Jack Antonio
> Sent: Friday, January 29, 2021 3:18 PM
> To: milsurplus at mailman.qth.net
> Subject: [Milsurplus] Last call Teletype machines
> 
> Last year I came across some Teletype gear, a Model 14, 15, tape reader and/or punch, and a Western Union model 102.
> 
> And I have been trying to find a home for them.
> With no luck. I had one nibble that wanted them at the end of November, then the end of December, then when the virus thing died down, and now no replies at all.
> 
> But, I am no longer able to store these things, and they are going to have to go somewhere. I would hate to see these going to landfill, but I'm running out of options.
> 
> Can't ship them, so they are pickup in middle Georgia, although I would be able to deliver within about a 100 mile radius of Macon, Georgia.
> 
> At this point, they are free, I simply just need the space.
> 
> Description and photos on request.
> 
> Any takers?
> 
> Thanks
> 
> Jack Antonio
> WA7DIA
> 
> PS. Don't tell me to try the greenkeys
> list, all I got there was crickets and
> the one nibble I mentioned.
> ______________________________________________________________
> Milsurplus mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/milsurplus
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:Milsurplus at mailman.qth.net
> 
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
> 
>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
> 
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to hanyou at xsmail.com


From ranickels at gmail.com  Sat Jan 30 00:27:49 2021
From: ranickels at gmail.com (Robert Nickels)
Date: Fri, 29 Jan 2021 23:27:49 -0600
Subject: [GreenKeys] RTTY station pic
Message-ID: <e0c12223-8274-ed2f-ab59-b0bf8e2d9b90@gmail.com>

This neat old shack pic is said to have been from 1982 - Eldico twins 
operating SSB and RTTY:

https://i.imgur.com/W73wbrw.png

73, Bob W9RAN


From pbirkel at gmail.com  Sat Jan 30 06:12:08 2021
From: pbirkel at gmail.com (Paul Birkel)
Date: Sat, 30 Jan 2021 06:12:08 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] M15 Synchronous (AC) Motor Lubrication - Ball Oilers
In-Reply-To: <91C4C4BF-C907-456F-8979-E1B9A519520F@k6yic.com>
References: <0ea001d6f64c$c354a4a0$49fdede0$@gmail.com>
	<91C4C4BF-C907-456F-8979-E1B9A519520F@k6yic.com>
Message-ID: <10d501d6f6f8$c05e82f0$411b88d0$@gmail.com>

A great page, thank you.  Since I don?t have a grease gun the KS-7471 alternatives aren?t going to work for me ? lacking experience/observations from others regarding ball oilers it seems to be that the ?depress-and-drip? method is my logical choice here for applying a lubricant.

 

Given that this is a ?heavy-duty? motor, a surrogate for OE 10 engine oil seems like a good choice, although there are no high temperatures around here warranting an SAE 10 (which I interpret to mean ?10W-10?).  Hence a SAE 5W-20 synthetic oil seems reasonable to me, and has been mentioned in earlier GK threads (example: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/2018-May/043091.html; also earlier: http://www.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/2011-August/020439.html).  But I could certainly be wrong, hence my seeking practical experience for the M15 :->.

 

For the gearing where there are centrifugal forces involved I was thinking of using the red-n-tacky grease that has previously been recommended.

 

For sliding surfaces (e.g., rails) I was thinking of using white lithium grease.

 

From: Daniel Jones [mailto:djones at k6yic.com] 
Sent: Friday, January 29, 2021 11:16 AM
To: Paul Birkel
Cc: greenkeys at mailman.qth.net
Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] M15 Synchronous (AC) Motor Lubrication - Ball Oilers

 

I usually refer to this page.  It?s based on the scientific properties of the lubricants and gives you current alternatives based on those properties.  

 

http://homepage.cs.uiowa.edu/~jones/pdp8/UI-8/ks7470oil.shtml

 

Daniel

K6YIC 

http://K6YIC.com





On Jan 29, 2021, at 06:42, Paul Birkel <pbirkel at gmail.com> wrote:

?All;

 

The motor on my M15 uses the ?ball oiler? style of lubrication ports.  Technically they seem to be ?70771 FITTING, PRESSURE?.

 

Should I just depress them with an appropriately tipped tool and then try to drip a few drops of either light machine oil or SAE 5W synthetic motor oil (that I?ve seen recommended here in the past) around the depressed ball?

 

I realize (from long ago mechanics shop) that there must be a special grease gun whose nozzle is pressed over these ports to inject grease, but I certainly don?t have one.  The armature appears to be free turning (haven?t yet applied power) so it?s not clear that I actually _need_ to lubricate the motor at the moment.  Still, one wonders!

 

In TM11-2215 (tm11-2215-teletypewriter-tt5-model-15-20pct-of600dpi-main.pdf) Section II starting on page 69 covers the topic of lubrication.  At the bottom of page 71 in the table it states ?Apply grease with gun or 4 or 5 drops in each.? with lubricant ?KS-7471 or KS-7470?.  The former is a grease and the latter is ?Oil lubricating, Teletype Part No. 88970.*? with the footnote indicating that at ?high temperatures? SAE 10 engine oil may be substituted.

 

Is KS-7470 (Teletype Part No. 88970) substitutable by light machine (e.g., sewing machine) oil?  Unless either KS-7471 grease or OE 10 engine oil is specified, KS-7470 seems to be the go-to lubricant for the M15.  I?m thinking that light machine oil is appropriate in this application.

 

What method are folks using lubricate motors equipped with this style of lubrication port?  What lubricant?

 

Thank you for your advice,

paul

 

-----



 

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From w9ddd at tapr.org  Sat Jan 30 12:34:19 2021
From: w9ddd at tapr.org (John, W9DDD)
Date: Sat, 30 Jan 2021 11:34:19 -0600
Subject: [GreenKeys] FAA panel
Message-ID: <4f1f1a4d-6688-fea0-8d5c-5affc1c3f1f7@tapr.org>

I have a copy of these.  They seem to have been used for FAA machines, 
but may be used elsewhere.  I think it involved XD control and 
additional status lamps.

The two I have aren't exactly alike, but they resemble this drawing.
http://www.navy-radio.com/manuals/tty/28KSR-FAA-IMD-D-361.pdf

Does anyone know of a use for these?  Otherwise I plan to strip one of 
them to use as a mounting plate for things like a Raspberry Pi and a 
DT500 in the knee hole of a 28 console.  If it works out, the other may 
suffer the same fate.

-- 
John, W9DDD
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From pbirkel at gmail.com  Sun Jan 31 05:43:28 2021
From: pbirkel at gmail.com (Paul Birkel)
Date: Sun, 31 Jan 2021 05:43:28 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] Bell System Practices P31.402
In-Reply-To: <CAB55hNfcSzMKdvB9fxw8pCbkRv44vGETYkvXoHu=a3X+2=JHbQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <0be501d6f55e$94256d20$bc704760$@gmail.com>
	<CAB55hNfcSzMKdvB9fxw8pCbkRv44vGETYkvXoHu=a3X+2=JHbQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <127b01d6f7bd$e9c28f90$bd47aeb0$@gmail.com>

I finally figured out where I stowed my device.  The identification plate states that it?s a TS-659/UG TELETYPEWRITER TEST SET (SUPPLY: 115 VOLTS   1 PHASE   25-65 CYCLE) ?Manufactured for NAVY DEPARTMENT ? BUREAU OF SHIPS?.

 

There is also a secondary plate attached stating ?SHIP YARD NUMBER:   129USN  006965?.  Can anyone decipher that for me?

 

Inside the lid there are markings that it?s been Fungus Treated.  The wiring diagram is identified as: WD-2403 A (10-4-45).  There is no NOTE 6 as seen in 2403wd-c.pdf; it?s not immediately clear what are the differences between Rev. A and C.

 

According to http://www.navy-radio.com/rtty-misc.htm the TS-659/UG includes 75 & 100 wpm gears in addition to the 60 wpm gear.

 

My device does indeed include all three sets of gears :->.  Courtesy of the anti-fungal coating (looks like a nice layer of varnish, everywhere).   it?s evident that the original gear set for 368 O.P.M. (60 wpm) has never been changed.

 

From: greenkeys-bounces at mailman.qth.net [mailto:greenkeys-bounces at mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Nick England
Sent: Thursday, January 28, 2021 3:25 PM
To: Greenkeys
Subject: Re: [GreenKeys] Bell System Practices P31.402

 

Thanks to Jim Haynes, this file is now posted at

http://www.navy-radio.com/manuals/tty/P31-402-iss2-5801.pdf

 

Note - the Bell 100A is the same as Teletype ED51DT and US Navy TS-658/UG

Description and Adjustments

http://www.navy-radio.com/manuals/tty/184B-test-1402.pdf

Parts

http://www.navy-radio.com/manuals/tty/jh/ttyman8/TeletypeManuals/other/1113B-Chg1.pdf

Wiring Diagram

http://www.navy-radio.com/manuals/tty/jh/ttyman9/drawings/1954wd-h.pdf

 

Note - The Bell 100C is Teletype ED51EH for 50 Hz power

 

Cheers,

Nick England K4NYW
www.navy-radio.com

 

 

On Thu, Jan 28, 2021 at 5:17 AM Paul Birkel <pbirkel at gmail.com> wrote:

100A TTY Test Distributor - Description, Use, Maintenance, Wiring Diagram

 

I see that this is listed at http://www.navy-radio.com/tty/tty-wd-list.htm (an amazing resource!)  as ?to be scanned?.

 

Does anyone else have it available?

 

I did find 108-804-100-5806.pdf at that site; light but readable.  Is that the same thing as BSP P31.402?

 

Thanks.

 

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From navy.radio at gmail.com  Sun Jan 31 06:58:07 2021
From: navy.radio at gmail.com (Nick England)
Date: Sun, 31 Jan 2021 06:58:07 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] Bell System Practices P31.402
In-Reply-To: <127b01d6f7bd$e9c28f90$bd47aeb0$@gmail.com>
References: <0be501d6f55e$94256d20$bc704760$@gmail.com>
	<CAB55hNfcSzMKdvB9fxw8pCbkRv44vGETYkvXoHu=a3X+2=JHbQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<127b01d6f7bd$e9c28f90$bd47aeb0$@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAB55hNcZRgoJVpmfr7cWU3f9XHHzjDqw5S3OBq6No_uNtPSVAg@mail.gmail.com>

FWIW, TS-659 is Teletype ED58HE. Almost the same as ED51DT (Bell 100A) but
with governed motor.

On Sun, Jan 31, 2021 at 5:43 AM Paul Birkel <pbirkel at gmail.com> wrote:

> I finally figured out where I stowed my device.  The identification plate
> states that it?s a TS-659/UG TELETYPEWRITER TEST SET (SUPPLY: 115 VOLTS   1
> PHASE   25-65 CYCLE) ?Manufactured for NAVY DEPARTMENT ? BUREAU OF SHIPS?.
>
>
>
> There is also a secondary plate attached stating ?SHIP YARD NUMBER:
> 129USN  006965?.  Can anyone decipher that for me?
>
>
>
> Inside the lid there are markings that it?s been Fungus Treated.  The
> wiring diagram is identified as: WD-2403 A (10-4-45).  There is no NOTE 6
> as seen in 2403wd-c.pdf; it?s not immediately clear what are the
> differences between Rev. A and C.
>
>
>
> According to http://www.navy-radio.com/rtty-misc.htm the TS-659/UG
> includes 75 & 100 wpm gears in addition to the 60 wpm gear.
>
>
>
> My device does indeed include all three sets of gears :->.  Courtesy of
> the anti-fungal coating (looks like a nice layer of varnish, everywhere).
>  it?s evident that the original gear set for 368 O.P.M. (60 wpm) has never
> been changed.
>
>
>
> *From:* greenkeys-bounces at mailman.qth.net [mailto:
> greenkeys-bounces at mailman.qth.net] *On Behalf Of *Nick England
> *Sent:* Thursday, January 28, 2021 3:25 PM
> *To:* Greenkeys
> *Subject:* Re: [GreenKeys] Bell System Practices P31.402
>
>
>
> Thanks to Jim Haynes, this file is now posted at
>
> http://www.navy-radio.com/manuals/tty/P31-402-iss2-5801.pdf
>
>
>
> Note - the Bell 100A is the same as Teletype ED51DT and US Navy TS-658/UG
>
> Description and Adjustments
>
> http://www.navy-radio.com/manuals/tty/184B-test-1402.pdf
>
> Parts
>
>
> http://www.navy-radio.com/manuals/tty/jh/ttyman8/TeletypeManuals/other/1113B-Chg1.pdf
>
> Wiring Diagram
>
> http://www.navy-radio.com/manuals/tty/jh/ttyman9/drawings/1954wd-h.pdf
>
>
>
> Note - The Bell 100C is Teletype ED51EH for 50 Hz power
>
>
>
> Cheers,
>
> Nick England K4NYW
> www.navy-radio.com
>
>
>
>
>
> On Thu, Jan 28, 2021 at 5:17 AM Paul Birkel <pbirkel at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> 100A TTY Test Distributor - Description, Use, Maintenance, Wiring Diagram
>
>
>
> I see that this is listed at http://www.navy-radio.com/tty/tty-wd-list.htm
> (an amazing resource!)  as ?to be scanned?.
>
>
>
> Does anyone else have it available?
>
>
>
> I did find 108-804-100-5806.pdf at that site; light but readable.  Is that
> the same thing as BSP P31.402?
>
>
>
> Thanks.
>
>
>
> --
Nick England K4NYW
www.navy-radio.com
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From pbirkel at gmail.com  Sun Jan 31 07:23:54 2021
From: pbirkel at gmail.com (Paul Birkel)
Date: Sun, 31 Jan 2021 07:23:54 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] M15 with Frozen Dashpot
Message-ID: <129e01d6f7cb$f0f10f40$d2d32dc0$@gmail.com>

And it's frozen _solid_.  Which surprises me immensely since all of the
other mechanicals on this machine are in pretty good shape.  The worst other
problem is that the rails on the carriage are "tight" in the middle and very
tight nearing the right-margin.  I am presuming that cleaning and
lubricating the rails will relatively easily cure that problem.

 

Does anyone have any experience with this particular frozen-pot condition?

 

AFAICS the remedy is to carefully disassemble it, apply penetrating oil (no,
not WD40), "work" it back into motion, clean, relubricate, and reinstall.
Probably followed by some adjustment once the carriage is operating
properly.  At the moment, of course, it goes "bang" :-<.

 

paul

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From jhhaynes at earthlink.net  Sun Jan 31 10:26:01 2021
From: jhhaynes at earthlink.net (Jim Haynes)
Date: Sun, 31 Jan 2021 09:26:01 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [GreenKeys] RTTY station pic
In-Reply-To: <e0c12223-8274-ed2f-ab59-b0bf8e2d9b90@gmail.com>
References: <e0c12223-8274-ed2f-ab59-b0bf8e2d9b90@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <alpine.DEB.2.20.2101310923030.4190@Frances>

Looks like a Western Union 100-series teleprinter, Electrocom FSC-250
converter, home made linear amplifier.

 	---

 	"Ya can argue all ya wanna, but it's dif'rent than it was."
 	"No it ain't! No it ain't!  But ya gotta know the territory."
 		Meredith Willson, The Music Man

From djones at k6yic.com  Sun Jan 31 14:46:51 2021
From: djones at k6yic.com (Daniel Jones)
Date: Sun, 31 Jan 2021 11:46:51 -0800
Subject: [GreenKeys] 2m/70cm repeater net
Message-ID: <FAB3C394-EA11-4CEB-A385-8151257435BE@k6yic.com>

A bunch of us down here in SoCal are experimenting with using 2m/70cm repeaters to start a local RTTY net.  

I was wondering if anyone else has tried this lately and if you have had any issues.  

One common issue I have been running into is after about 10 seconds of transmitting the repeater audio drops and picks back up (this happens to everyone) Could this be an issue with tones on modern CTCSS repeaters?  

Dan

K6YIC 
http://K6YIC.com

From kn4ucl at gmail.com  Sun Jan 31 15:09:55 2021
From: kn4ucl at gmail.com (Andy KN4UCL)
Date: Sun, 31 Jan 2021 15:09:55 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] shockingly basic question - Teletype Model 33 ASR
Message-ID: <CA+H6KCn50T-Q8SNFuBf+WkWSrWbHN6w2EnHrVLhW5S3dMPeouw@mail.gmail.com>

Hello folks, I use the excellent Mike Douglas (deramp) RS232-Model 33
converter on both my two 33s for a good while now. Typically connecting to
Linux using some old Keyspan Serial-USB hubs, with my set up being 7E2/110.

I've been tinkering around with some old Equinox ELS-16 Terminal servers
(which are nice because they support 110 baud), but they seem to prefer 8N1
despite sporadic "spelling errors" (for example, Es sometimes become As,
etc.)

Anyway my question is - are the Teletype 33s physically "configurable" in
terms of stop bits and parity? Is there a simple way for me to check?

Searching the interwebs I've found people talking about their Teletypes
configured to run at the host end as 7E2, and some at 8N1.

Thanks for any help!
Andy
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From wcwuttke at att.net  Sun Jan 31 15:16:19 2021
From: wcwuttke at att.net (William Wuttke)
Date: Sun, 31 Jan 2021 12:16:19 -0800
Subject: [GreenKeys] shockingly basic question - Teletype Model 33 ASR
In-Reply-To: <CA+H6KCn50T-Q8SNFuBf+WkWSrWbHN6w2EnHrVLhW5S3dMPeouw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CA+H6KCn50T-Q8SNFuBf+WkWSrWbHN6w2EnHrVLhW5S3dMPeouw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AA0437FA-8C02-4284-BAF5-0AD516284A5C@att.net>

Hi Andy,

If I remember correctly, there are wires on the left side of the keyboard that can be reconfigured for 8N1. I think the
wiring diagrams give the strapping options.

Bill

> On Jan 31, 2021, at 12:09 PM, Andy KN4UCL <kn4ucl at gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> Hello folks, I use the excellent Mike Douglas (deramp) RS232-Model 33 converter on both my two 33s for a good while now. Typically connecting to Linux using some old Keyspan Serial-USB hubs, with my set up being 7E2/110.
> 
> I've been tinkering around with some old Equinox ELS-16 Terminal servers (which are nice because they support 110 baud), but they seem to prefer 8N1 despite sporadic "spelling errors" (for example, Es sometimes become As, etc.)
> 
> Anyway my question is - are the Teletype 33s physically "configurable" in terms of stop bits and parity? Is there a simple way for me to check?
> 
> Searching the interwebs I've found people talking about their Teletypes configured to run at the host end as 7E2, and some at 8N1.  
> 
> Thanks for any help!
> Andy
> 
> 
> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
> 
>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
> 
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to wcwuttke at att.net


From hanyou at xsmail.com  Sun Jan 31 15:27:05 2021
From: hanyou at xsmail.com (E.)
Date: Sun, 31 Jan 2021 14:27:05 -0600
Subject: [GreenKeys] Volpe v2 boards...
Message-ID: <0EB0E7D0-B518-4F6E-9E47-8CEEE0DE8531@xsmail.com>


Hey all,

You know that Volpe v2 project that I started a couple of years ago?  The boards have been sitting at a Greenkeyer?s house part way across the country since late last year and I haven?t heard back from him in a while ;o (MIA).  With Covid, I know everything is nutty right now (including at my place)... but if anyone who ordered from me when I first started the project, would like a refund due to it all taking so long (programmed/assembled - the board shop that soldered on the components took months as well, since they had to lay off a good chunk of their staff and were overwhelmed), please shoot me an email and I?ll do so - totally understandable :) .  Sorry this has dragged on like it has - such is life ;o ... what times we do live in ~o~; ?..

From teletypeparts at comcast.net  Sun Jan 31 16:23:19 2021
From: teletypeparts at comcast.net (WAYNE)
Date: Sun, 31 Jan 2021 16:23:19 -0500 (EST)
Subject: [GreenKeys] shockingly basic question - Teletype Model 33 ASR
In-Reply-To: <CA+H6KCn50T-Q8SNFuBf+WkWSrWbHN6w2EnHrVLhW5S3dMPeouw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CA+H6KCn50T-Q8SNFuBf+WkWSrWbHN6w2EnHrVLhW5S3dMPeouw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <415193568.31757.1612128200168@connect.xfinity.com>

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From deramp5113 at yahoo.com  Sun Jan 31 16:24:53 2021
From: deramp5113 at yahoo.com (Mike Douglas)
Date: Sun, 31 Jan 2021 21:24:53 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [GreenKeys] shockingly basic question - Teletype Model 33 ASR
In-Reply-To: <CA+H6KCn50T-Q8SNFuBf+WkWSrWbHN6w2EnHrVLhW5S3dMPeouw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CA+H6KCn50T-Q8SNFuBf+WkWSrWbHN6w2EnHrVLhW5S3dMPeouw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <1400979368.847279.1612128293516@mail.yahoo.com>

 The 33 print requires two stop bits to provide time to print the character and cycle the function pawls after the 8th bit is received. The printer receives 8 data bits and has no concept of parity. The 8th bit is ignored for all print operations, however, the 8th bit does punch on the paper tape.

For the keyboard, there is a parity version and no-parity version. The no-parity keyboard is 8N2, the parity version is 7E2 by default, but can be set for 8N2 where the 8th bit can be forced to space or to mark.

Mike

     On Sunday, January 31, 2021, 02:13:29 PM CST, Andy KN4UCL <kn4ucl at gmail.com> wrote:  
 
 Hello folks, I use the excellent Mike Douglas (deramp) RS232-Model 33 converter on both my two 33s for a good while now. Typically connecting to Linux using some old Keyspan Serial-USB hubs, with my set up being 7E2/110.
I've been tinkering around with some old Equinox ELS-16 Terminal servers (which are nice because they support 110 baud), but they seem to prefer 8N1 despite sporadic "spelling errors" (for example, Es sometimes become As, etc.)
Anyway my question is - are the Teletype 33s physically "configurable" in terms of stop bits and parity? Is there a simple way for me to check?

Searching the interwebs I've found people talking about their Teletypes configured to run at the host end as 7E2, and some at 8N1.? 

Thanks for any help! Andy


______________________________________________________________
GreenKeys mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net

>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to deramp5113 at yahoo.com  
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From jhhaynes at earthlink.net  Sun Jan 31 16:32:14 2021
From: jhhaynes at earthlink.net (Jim Haynes)
Date: Sun, 31 Jan 2021 15:32:14 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [GreenKeys] shockingly basic question - Teletype Model 33 ASR
In-Reply-To: <CA+H6KCn50T-Q8SNFuBf+WkWSrWbHN6w2EnHrVLhW5S3dMPeouw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CA+H6KCn50T-Q8SNFuBf+WkWSrWbHN6w2EnHrVLhW5S3dMPeouw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <alpine.DEB.2.20.2101311524370.8092@Frances>

All the 33s and 35s generate 11 unit code.  1 start bit, 7 data bits, one
bit which may be even parity or may be marking, and two stop bits.  That's
where 110 baud comes from. 100 wpm = 10 chars/sec and each char contains 
11 bits.  The reason for two stop bits is the difficulty of making a
mechanical selector that is reliable at 100 wpm.

 	---

 	"Ya can argue all ya wanna, but it's dif'rent than it was."
 	"No it ain't! No it ain't!  But ya gotta know the territory."
 		Meredith Willson, The Music Man

From jim at k6ccc.org  Sun Jan 31 16:44:24 2021
From: jim at k6ccc.org (Jim Walls)
Date: Sun, 31 Jan 2021 13:44:24 -0800
Subject: [GreenKeys] 2m/70cm repeater net
In-Reply-To: <FAB3C394-EA11-4CEB-A385-8151257435BE@k6yic.com>
References: <FAB3C394-EA11-4CEB-A385-8151257435BE@k6yic.com>
Message-ID: <126e8880-a63c-22d5-4009-b84dc368573b@k6ccc.org>

On 01/31/2021 11:46, Daniel Jones wrote:
> A bunch of us down here in SoCal are experimenting with using 2m/70cm repeaters to start a local RTTY net.
>
> I was wondering if anyone else has tried this lately and if you have had any issues.
>
> One common issue I have been running into is after about 10 seconds of transmitting the repeater audio drops and picks back up (this happens to everyone) Could this be an issue with tones on modern CTCSS repeaters?
>

Hams have run RTTY on repeaters for decades and I have never heard of 
the audio dropping.? However, at least the 2M repeaters of old here in 
SoCal did not use PL for repeater access, they depended on Mark tone.? 
They were RTTY ONLY!? 146.70 was the frequency I remember.

BTW, I would love to see a RTTY repeater again.? I am in Glendora (just 
SW of the I-210 and 57 freeways).? What repeater locations / frequency 
are you trying to use?? Might give me good excuse to get the M28 back on 
the air.

-- 
73
-------------------------------------
Jim Walls - K6CCC
jim at k6ccc.org
Ofc:  818-548-4804
http://members.dslextreme.com/users/k6ccc/
AMSAT Member 32537 - WSWSS Member 395


From dave at horsfall.org  Sun Jan 31 16:57:50 2021
From: dave at horsfall.org (Dave Horsfall)
Date: Mon, 1 Feb 2021 08:57:50 +1100 (EST)
Subject: [GreenKeys] Telex reference in a rock song
Message-ID: <alpine.BSF.2.21.9999.2102010837540.70858@aneurin.horsfall.org>

Somewhat off-topic I guess, but I was watching a video of one of my 
favourite rock bands (Cold Chisel, with Jimmy Barnes as front man), "Khe 
Sanh" complete with the lyrics, when I saw a reference to Telex machines 
that I'd never twigged to before.

So, I dug up the lyrics from http://genius.com/Cold-chisel-khe-sanh-lyrics

     And the legal pads were yellow
     Hours long, pay-packets lean
     And the telex writers clattered
     Where the gunships once had been

Now, if only I could find a song reference to Teletypes...  Hmmm, a couple
of obscure ones, but nothing well-known.

-- Dave VK2KFU

From kwlueck at swbell.net  Sun Jan 31 17:43:11 2021
From: kwlueck at swbell.net (Keith Lueck)
Date: Sun, 31 Jan 2021 22:43:11 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [GreenKeys] shockingly basic question - Teletype Model 33 ASR
In-Reply-To: <alpine.DEB.2.20.2101311524370.8092@Frances>
References: <CA+H6KCn50T-Q8SNFuBf+WkWSrWbHN6w2EnHrVLhW5S3dMPeouw@mail.gmail.com>
	<alpine.DEB.2.20.2101311524370.8092@Frances>
Message-ID: <411324073.672409.1612132992014@mail.yahoo.com>

 Jim & Wayne are spot-on, of course.? I learned the hard way that you best include the parity bit - even though the 33 doesn't give a whit about parity...??My machine was occasionally producing errors when I was feeding it 7 N 2.? Wayne Durkee set me straight, and, viola, when I sent it 7 M 2, everything was 100% ducky.??
    On Sunday, January 31, 2021, 03:32:30 PM CST, Jim Haynes <jhhaynes at earthlink.net> wrote:  
 
 All the 33s and 35s generate 11 unit code.? 1 start bit, 7 data bits, one
bit which may be even parity or may be marking, and two stop bits.? That's
where 110 baud comes from. 100 wpm = 10 chars/sec and each char contains 
11 bits.? The reason for two stop bits is the difficulty of making a
mechanical selector that is reliable at 100 wpm.

 ??? ---

 ??? "Ya can argue all ya wanna, but it's dif'rent than it was."
 ??? "No it ain't! No it ain't!? But ya gotta know the territory."
 ??? ??? Meredith Willson, The Music Man
______________________________________________________________
GreenKeys mailing list
Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net

>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html

This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
Message delivered to kwlueck at swbell.net
  
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From kn4ucl at gmail.com  Sun Jan 31 20:09:57 2021
From: kn4ucl at gmail.com (Andy KN4UCL)
Date: Sun, 31 Jan 2021 20:09:57 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] shockingly basic question - Teletype Model 33 ASR
In-Reply-To: <411324073.672409.1612132992014@mail.yahoo.com>
References: <CA+H6KCn50T-Q8SNFuBf+WkWSrWbHN6w2EnHrVLhW5S3dMPeouw@mail.gmail.com>
	<alpine.DEB.2.20.2101311524370.8092@Frances>
	<411324073.672409.1612132992014@mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <CA+H6KCmi0+sUnPETC6VxhQKMhwcjopw3n3VX1i6QUibbqECvVQ@mail.gmail.com>

Thanks guys for the responses - a lot of great info for me to digest!

My terminal server (Equinox ELS-16) allows me to define character size as 7
or 8 bits, and to set parity as NONE, ODD, EVEN, MARK or SPACE.

I don't seem to have the ability to specifically state the number of stop
bits, however.

Anyway.. I'm going to crack my Teletype open and confirm exactly what's
going on.
cheers!
Andy

On Sun, Jan 31, 2021 at 5:43 PM Keith Lueck <kwlueck at swbell.net> wrote:

> Jim & Wayne are spot-on, of course.  I learned the hard way that you best
> include the parity bit - even though the 33 doesn't give a whit about
> parity...
> My machine was occasionally producing errors when I was feeding it 7 N 2.
> Wayne Durkee set me straight, and, viola, when I sent it 7 M 2, everything
> was 100% ducky.
>
> On Sunday, January 31, 2021, 03:32:30 PM CST, Jim Haynes <
> jhhaynes at earthlink.net> wrote:
>
>
> All the 33s and 35s generate 11 unit code.  1 start bit, 7 data bits, one
> bit which may be even parity or may be marking, and two stop bits.  That's
> where 110 baud comes from. 100 wpm = 10 chars/sec and each char contains
> 11 bits.  The reason for two stop bits is the difficulty of making a
> mechanical selector that is reliable at 100 wpm.
>
>     ---
>
>     "Ya can argue all ya wanna, but it's dif'rent than it was."
>     "No it ain't! No it ain't!  But ya gotta know the territory."
>         Meredith Willson, The Music Man
>
> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
>
> >>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool:
> https://teletype.net/gksearch
> >>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive:
> http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
> >>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive:
> http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
> >>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool:
> http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
>
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to kwlueck at swbell.net
>
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From deramp5113 at yahoo.com  Sun Jan 31 20:18:25 2021
From: deramp5113 at yahoo.com (Mike Douglas)
Date: Sun, 31 Jan 2021 19:18:25 -0600
Subject: [GreenKeys] shockingly basic question - Teletype Model 33 ASR
In-Reply-To: <CA+H6KCmi0+sUnPETC6VxhQKMhwcjopw3n3VX1i6QUibbqECvVQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CA+H6KCmi0+sUnPETC6VxhQKMhwcjopw3n3VX1i6QUibbqECvVQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <88DB3FAA-9EDF-43B4-871A-89DCD2BC4DCC@yahoo.com>

If you select 8 bit with mark parity on your terminal server, you?ll probably get the 8N2 timing the Teletype requires (the mark parity bit serves as the first stop bit).

Mike

> On Jan 31, 2021, at 7:11 PM, Andy KN4UCL <kn4ucl at gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> ?
> Thanks guys for the responses - a lot of great info for me to digest!  
> 
> My terminal server (Equinox ELS-16) allows me to define character size as 7 or 8 bits, and to set parity as NONE, ODD, EVEN, MARK or SPACE. 
> 
> I don't seem to have the ability to specifically state the number of stop bits, however.
> 
> Anyway.. I'm going to crack my Teletype open and confirm exactly what's going on.
> cheers!
> Andy 
> 
>> On Sun, Jan 31, 2021 at 5:43 PM Keith Lueck <kwlueck at swbell.net> wrote:
>> Jim & Wayne are spot-on, of course.  I learned the hard way that you best include the parity bit - even though the 33 doesn't give a whit about parity...  
>> My machine was occasionally producing errors when I was feeding it 7 N 2.  Wayne Durkee set me straight, and, viola, when I sent it 7 M 2, everything was 100% ducky.  
>> 
>> On Sunday, January 31, 2021, 03:32:30 PM CST, Jim Haynes <jhhaynes at earthlink.net> wrote:
>> 
>> 
>> All the 33s and 35s generate 11 unit code.  1 start bit, 7 data bits, one
>> bit which may be even parity or may be marking, and two stop bits.  That's
>> where 110 baud comes from. 100 wpm = 10 chars/sec and each char contains 
>> 11 bits.  The reason for two stop bits is the difficulty of making a
>> mechanical selector that is reliable at 100 wpm.
>> 
>>     ---
>> 
>>     "Ya can argue all ya wanna, but it's dif'rent than it was."
>>     "No it ain't! No it ain't!  But ya gotta know the territory."
>>         Meredith Willson, The Music Man
>> 
>> ______________________________________________________________
>> GreenKeys mailing list
>> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
>> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
>> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
>> 
>> >>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
>> >>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>> >>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>> >>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
>> 
>> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
>> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
>> Message delivered to kwlueck at swbell.net
> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
> 
>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
> 
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to deramp5113 at yahoo.com
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From ka2ivy at verizon.net  Sun Jan 31 20:23:32 2021
From: ka2ivy at verizon.net (Bruce Gentry)
Date: Sun, 31 Jan 2021 20:23:32 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] Fwd: Re:  2m/70cm repeater net
In-Reply-To: <df640c96-fe28-c464-5d33-f8c58c83c9ce@verizon.net>
References: <df640c96-fe28-c464-5d33-f8c58c83c9ce@verizon.net>
Message-ID: <6256b121-745a-4d2b-96b9-3844ea446680@verizon.net>

I have a complaint about all repeaters on all frequencies today that 
could well be your problem. I think the need and application of tone 
squelch or Channel Guard as we call it here in Syracuse General Electric 
land is over done.  It severely reduces the chances to use older 
equipment, especially military surplus, and is likely interfering with 
your AFSK  RTTY.  The solution I propose is convincing repeater trustees 
to provide  a means to shut off the tone squelch- both transmit and 
receive-  for a set period, pehaps an hour, when a net is going to be 
held. It would turn itself back on after that time, unless commanded 
once again to remain off.  If coverage overlap or atmospherics require, 
it could be turned back on before that time is up. The use of older 
equipment and modes must not be restricted needlessly,  amatuer radio 
does not need any more internally generated obstacles.  I fully 
understand there are times when tone squelch is needed and I have 
experienced them, but I have serious doubts it is needed all the time,  
especially when a net or group is on the air and able to monitor the 
repeater and turn it back on if need be.

         Bruce Gentry, KA2IVY








On 1/31/21 14:46, Daniel Jones wrote:
> A bunch of us down here in SoCal are experimenting with using 2m/70cm repeaters to start a local RTTY net.
>
> I was wondering if anyone else has tried this lately and if you have had any issues.
>
> One common issue I have been running into is after about 10 seconds of transmitting the repeater audio drops and picks back up (this happens to everyone) Could this be an issue with tones on modern CTCSS repeaters?
>
> Dan
>
> K6YIC
> http://K6YIC.com
> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home:http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help:http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post:mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
>
>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool:https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive:http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive:http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool:http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
> This list hosted by:http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list:http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered toka2ivy at verizon.net
>

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From nagle at animats.com  Sun Jan 31 16:48:07 2021
From: nagle at animats.com (John Nagle)
Date: Sun, 31 Jan 2021 13:48:07 -0800
Subject: [GreenKeys] M15 with Frozen Dashpot
In-Reply-To: <mailman.592.1612128219.10339.greenkeys@mailman.qth.net>
References: <mailman.592.1612128219.10339.greenkeys@mailman.qth.net>
Message-ID: <c641af8b-45b2-d3f3-3f73-00bb60eb535a@animats.com>

I've had that happen. Someone used a lubricant
with heavy fractions, and the light components evaporated leaving
the asphalt component behind. This is why I lubricate machines
with 0-20W synthetic motor oil, which has no heavy fractions.

It's reasonably easy to get the entire dashpot out. Then
remove the top, so you can get the piston out. The shaft
is probably stuck where it goes through the top.
That's metal to metal, so you can use Locktite freeze
and release spray. That shrinks the metal and opens
up enough space for its penetrating oil component to get in.

Once you get the piston moving, take it out and clean
the inside and outside of the piston shaft and hole of
whatever gunk was jamming the piston.

While you have the piston out, check the leather
seal on the dashpot. That's the only leather part
in a Teletype. I suggest lubricating that with
Hydrophane leather dressing, which is a silicone oil
used on horse tack. It won't evaporate and dry out.
(Incidentally, if you just paint that stuff on a
cheap leather jacket with a paintbrush,  in
a day or two the oil will disappear, the leather
will become nice and soft, and it will stay that
way for decades. Doesn't change the color, either.)

			John Nagle

From gclistr at garychatters.com  Sun Jan 31 21:28:36 2021
From: gclistr at garychatters.com (Gary Chatters WA9ZZZ)
Date: Sun, 31 Jan 2021 21:28:36 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] 2m/70cm repeater net
In-Reply-To: <FAB3C394-EA11-4CEB-A385-8151257435BE@k6yic.com>
References: <FAB3C394-EA11-4CEB-A385-8151257435BE@k6yic.com>
Message-ID: <37dddd1d-2b5f-82ce-b33a-9758b476889c@garychatters.com>

See below

On 1/31/21 2:46 PM, Daniel Jones wrote:
> A bunch of us down here in SoCal are experimenting with using 2m/70cm repeaters to start a local RTTY net.
> 
> I was wondering if anyone else has tried this lately and if you have had any issues.
> 
> One common issue I have been running into is after about 10 seconds of transmitting the repeater audio drops and picks back up (this happens to everyone) Could this be an issue with tones on modern CTCSS repeaters?

I have been pondering this problem and can not think of any way that the 
CTCSS could cause this.

Some repeaters block DTMF signals.  They would be closer to your AFSK 
tones than the CTCSS, but still different.  That is assuming you are 
using 2125/2295.  Highest DTMF tone is 1633 Hz.

Repeaters also use other tones for remote control, but those should not 
affect on air operations.

Just ask the repeater operator.  They might have a simple explanation.

73,
Gary


> 
> Dan
> 
> K6YIC
> http://K6YIC.com

From dean at tilthorpe.com.au  Sun Jan 31 22:04:57 2021
From: dean at tilthorpe.com.au (Dean Davidson)
Date: Mon, 1 Feb 2021 14:04:57 +1100
Subject: [GreenKeys] Telex reference in a rock song
In-Reply-To: <alpine.BSF.2.21.9999.2102010837540.70858@aneurin.horsfall.org>
References: <alpine.BSF.2.21.9999.2102010837540.70858@aneurin.horsfall.org>
Message-ID: <e26d1419-384b-0992-4fd6-0a65086987f6@tilthorpe.com.au>



On 1/02/2021 08:57, Dave Horsfall wrote:
> Somewhat off-topic I guess, but I was watching a video of one of my 
> favourite rock bands (Cold Chisel, with Jimmy Barnes as front man), "Khe 
> Sanh" complete with the lyrics, when I saw a reference to Telex machines 
> that I'd never twigged to before.
> 
> So, I dug up the lyrics from http://genius.com/Cold-chisel-khe-sanh-lyrics
> 
>  ??? And the legal pads were yellow
>  ??? Hours long, pay-packets lean
>  ??? And the telex writers clattered
>  ??? Where the gunships once had been
> 
Probably missed by many as Jimmy Barnes is not noted for
his diction in singing.
What makes it harder is that he was born in England and
has been living in Australia for many years.
So his singing could be described as an
English/Australian mumble!!!
Dean
VK2DJD


From ac8y at thetower.us  Sun Jan 31 20:46:44 2021
From: ac8y at thetower.us (ac8y at thetower.us)
Date: Sun, 31 Jan 2021 20:46:44 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] Chadless tape and a M14 Transmitter-Distributor
Message-ID: <2e46726b4d9fc15d36f7e27a96cf3135@thetower.us>

I have a model 14 typing reperforator that produces chadless perforated
tape. It all appears to be working normally but when the tape is read by
the 14 XD on my son's model 19 it produces totally garbled data. The 14
XD works properly with the perforated tape punched by the 19. It also
reads the chadless tape flawlessly upside down and backwards--even
though that isn't useful. 

Apparently different shims are required on the XD retaining lid plate
for chadless tape. I messed with lots of different spacings--regular
tape always works and chadless tape never works. 

Any tricks, ideas, or suggestions? 

Thanks, Mike
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From jeffg at junknet.net  Sun Jan 31 22:17:13 2021
From: jeffg at junknet.net (Jeffrey Golas)
Date: Sun, 31 Jan 2021 22:17:13 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] OT: Western Electric Power supply
Message-ID: <1A57BE2D-5EF4-4FA1-A07C-D684378BE426@junknet.net>

I figured this may be the place to ask. I was cleaning up my garage and came across what appears to be a power supply, listed as 1000vac and 500vac. Any ideas as what it could have been for? It has a model plate, naturally model rs-2000, and serial number ?5?. Its very old, likely 30s-40s, its just a small box about 8? wide and 6? deep with transformers and a single tube inside. 

It has two plugs...one on the front im assuming thats the main output, and a small twist-lock plug on the side labeled ?break down test?.

The crazier part is that it also has a bell inside. I hear it ?ding? every time I put it down.

Im not even sure where I got this, but Im not sure Ill ever need a 1000 volt power supply. Im assuming its for running the plates in high powered tube gear?

From w9ddd at tapr.org  Sun Jan 31 23:16:21 2021
From: w9ddd at tapr.org (w9ddd at tapr.org)
Date: Sun, 31 Jan 2021 22:16:21 -0600
Subject: [GreenKeys] Chadless tape and a M14 Transmitter-Distributor
In-Reply-To: <2e46726b4d9fc15d36f7e27a96cf3135@thetower.us>
References: <2e46726b4d9fc15d36f7e27a96cf3135@thetower.us>
Message-ID: <82D38D00-C18D-4232-995C-0343E2581860@tapr.org>

Check out the parts bulletin about 13 or 14 pages in.

http://navy-radio.com/manuals/tty/jh/ttyman4/TeletypeManuals/model14/1095B-Chg1.pdf

John, W9DDD


> On Jan 31, 2021, at 7:46 PM, ac8y at thetower.us wrote:
> 
> I have a model 14 typing reperforator that produces chadless perforated tape. It all appears to be working normally but when the tape is read by the 14 XD on my son's model 19 it produces totally garbled data. The 14 XD works properly with the perforated tape punched by the 19. It also reads the chadless tape flawlessly upside down and backwards?even though that isn't useful.
> Apparently different shims are required on the XD retaining lid plate for chadless tape. I messed with lots of different spacings?regular tape always works and chadless tape never works.
> Any tricks, ideas, or suggestions?
> Thanks, Mike
> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
> 
>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
> 
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to w9ddd at tapr.org
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From pdwills at cedarknolltelephone.com  Sun Jan 31 23:17:07 2021
From: pdwills at cedarknolltelephone.com (Paul Wills)
Date: Sun, 31 Jan 2021 23:17:07 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] OT: Western Electric Power supply
In-Reply-To: <1A57BE2D-5EF4-4FA1-A07C-D684378BE426@junknet.net>
References: <1A57BE2D-5EF4-4FA1-A07C-D684378BE426@junknet.net>
Message-ID: <8364ac2b-3c4d-1095-001e-04e759518e9c@cedarknolltelephone.com>

It's for checking paper insulated telephone cable.? If the cable is wet 
and has a high resistance fault, the 1000V will break down the 
insulation and produce a dead short which makes it easier to find the 
exact location of the fault.? The bell indicates that the breakdown took 
place.

I have one here but really haven't had much occasion to use it. Nor 
would I want to.? ;-)

PDW

On 1/31/2021 10:17 PM, Jeffrey Golas wrote:
> I figured this may be the place to ask. I was cleaning up my garage and came across what appears to be a power supply, listed as 1000vac and 500vac. Any ideas as what it could have been for? It has a model plate, naturally model rs-2000, and serial number ?5?. Its very old, likely 30s-40s, its just a small box about 8? wide and 6? deep with transformers and a single tube inside.
>
> It has two plugs...one on the front im assuming thats the main output, and a small twist-lock plug on the side labeled ?break down test?.
>
> The crazier part is that it also has a bell inside. I hear it ?ding? every time I put it down.
>
> Im not even sure where I got this, but Im not sure Ill ever need a 1000 volt power supply. Im assuming its for running the plates in high powered tube gear?
> ______________________________________________________________
> GreenKeys mailing list
> Home: http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/greenkeys
> Help: http://mailman.qth.net/mmfaq.htm
> Post: mailto:GreenKeys at mailman.qth.net
>
>>>> Jordan Spencer Cunningham's GreenKeys Search Tool: https://teletype.net/gksearch
>>>> 2002-to-present greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/pipermail/greenkeys/
>>>> 1998-to-2001 greenkeys archive: http://mailman.qth.net/archive/greenkeys/greenkeys.html
>>>> Randy Guttery's 2001-to-2009 GreenKeys Search Tool: http://comcents.com/tty/greenkeyssearch.html
> This list hosted by: http://www.qsl.net
> Please help support this email list: http://www.qsl.net/donate.html
> Message delivered to pdwills at cedarknolltelephone.com

From jim.w2jc at gmail.com  Sun Jan 31 23:35:24 2021
From: jim.w2jc at gmail.com (Jim Cooper)
Date: Sun, 31 Jan 2021 23:35:24 -0500
Subject: [GreenKeys] Chadless tape and a M14 Transmitter-Distributor
In-Reply-To: <2e46726b4d9fc15d36f7e27a96cf3135@thetower.us>
References: <2e46726b4d9fc15d36f7e27a96cf3135@thetower.us>
Message-ID: <6017850C.7941.558B3A1@jim.w2jc.gmail.com>

On 31 Jan 2021 at 20:46, ac8y at thetower.us wrote:

> Apparently different shims are
> required on the XD retaining lid
> plate for chadless tape. I messed
> with lots of different
> spacings--regular tape always works
> and chadless tape never works. 
> 
> Any tricks, ideas, or suggestions? 

The first step I would suggest is to turn 
off the TD motor, put the chadless tape 
in the reader head, and turn the motor 
BY HAND, slowly in the direction the motor 
normally runs ...  as the pins come up, look 
through the slots and see where the pins are 
relative to the chads.  It might be that the 
advancing pawl that steps the tape ahead 
one character might be a bit out of alignment. 

Jim  W2JC 



